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by sophie m M.
Member since:
January 2, 2008

Why are voters so resistant to totally embrace Obama, or why can't Obama seal the deal(SECOND THREAD)

October 27, 2008 11:43 PM EDT
views: 458 | comments: 147

After almost two years of campaigning, Obama  still remains an enigma.  Voters still apparently don't know who Obama is and are still not altogether sure that Obama is the proper antidote to George Bush.  This candidate appeared from out of nowhere, had 143 days in the Senate then set his sights on being president, skipping and bypassing every standard rung up the ladder.  He is acknowledged as having a resume which is the most far left, most unknown, least experienced presidential candidate in American history. 

Also, the infatuation with Obama has faded, and people are giving him a second look, and simply are not seeing him as having the qualifications necessary to be Commander in Chief.   This means a couple of things.

  First ---McCain can still win this.  

Second, ---Obama is a deeply flawed candidate that Americans have deep-down grave reservations about, and they will be weighing this all in during the remaining days, pior to voting.   Why can't the charasmatic and eloquent speaker named Obama close the deal? 

 In the back of the minds of some voters is the memory of Obama sitting in the militant, racist Jeremiah Wrights's church for 20 years.  When asked about it back then, Obama boasted, "Yep.  Every week.  11 0'clock service."   Briefly, there's Wright, Pfleger , Ayers, Rezko, Farakhan, and other shady characters that Obama has called his friends.   These associations return to the mind of some  voters, time and time again.  They reflect on Obama, and whether or not voter's can trust him.

  Equally troubling is the fact that he didn't disassociate himself with them until he became a candidate, and was forced to, by public concern.   Added to that,  some voters recall when legal doubts were raised about the sloppy voter registration practices of ACORN - an organization that Obama himself has both helped and praised.   

This unrest and doubt about Obama account for a large number of Democratic defections.  Obama and his supporters are ignoring the large number of Clinton Democrats who are not buying in to his "change" campaign.  People want a familiar face who they've seen handle crisis, as opposed to someone who only tells  you how he will handle a crisis.  There were several lawsuits requiring Obama to provide a copy of his birth certificate, which he has refused to do.  This casts another shadow of doubt.     

 It's unclear exactly what Obama's message of "hope" and "change" means.  Because they both change.  Hope turned a little weird when Americans, and the world  saw Obama put up Greek-temple backdrops for his speech  at the Democratic convention.  That was viewed with a jaundiced eye by many and lingers in the memory.   

And change?  Obama himself has changed positions on FISA, NAFTA, campaign public financing, town-hall meetings with McCain, offshore drilling, nuclear and coal power, capital punishment and gun control, his characterization of Iran, the surge in Iraq, and the future of Jerusalem.  So change from what to what?   Obama's tax plan is one that he has problems outlining the same way, each time.   Some voters see a redistribution of wealth in search of forced equality.  Obama himself refers to this as spreading the wealth around, and it is viewed by some as walking down the path toward socialism.  

 Some voters also remember the recent economic meltdown, which Obama called the worst economic disaster since the great depression.  Yet Obama announced, "I have a phone, call me if you need me."      Obama's health care plan  is also troubling to those for whom this is a great concern.  Problem with it is, as they see it, government can't simply force insurance companies to lower premiums and then demand they insure people with pre-existing medical care and, while they're at it, offer them more "preventative" care - whatever that means.  It spells bankruptcy for health insurers.  

 These are all huge in the heart and mind of  some voters on the way to vote within the next few days.  A collapsing economy, an unpopular war, a 72-year-old Republican candidate  - and Obama is only ahead by a few points just days before Election Day!  Obama has come up short with many voters who form the traditional base in this country.  They learned he had more than 130 votes of   "Present."  which testifies to his performance in the Senate.  

 Why can't Obama close the deal? Why are some voters so resistant to embrace Obama ? Not only is Obama not pulling ahead of McCain at the pace he should,  even as he continues to outspend him, three or four to one in advertising, but is outright losing, when compared to where he should be.

So the question here is why can't Obama seal the deal and end the race? 

Expand Tags: campaign, election, voters, mccain, obama, politics
Expand To Groups: Big Time Points, Gather it All and Share it with Your Friends, Public Radio Forum, The Shameless Self-Promoters Group, ~pinky finger friends~
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Comments: 147

sophie m M. Oct 27, 2008, 11:46pm EDT
This is Part II of this post. Same subject Title

Part I had more than 300 comments and was very slow to load
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Richard Owl Mirror Oct 28, 2008, 1:05am EDT
sophie m M., do you live in a bubble ?
Have you seen any Polls ?

http://www.usaelectionpolls.com/2008/national-polls.html
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John Knight Oct 28, 2008, 1:50am EDT
Well, for me, as one fairly "liberal" in the traditional American political sense, the problem started fairly early in regard to Mr, Obama. I believe the "uh oh" moment came when he responded to the "Rev. Wright" turmoil. There he had been, all those years, extremely close to the man he was calling some rather harsh things, yet he said he NEVER spoke to him about the matters he was supposedly so vehemently opposed to.

Well, I thought, there was a clear prolonged opportunity to show some insight, courage, and leadership ability, but he did nothing. He did not say he was wrong for doing nothing, but rather appealed for people's understanding of how difficult it would be to approach a racist relative about such things . . .

Overnight, just as I feared, racism became a big issue, which it simply had not been. The need to justify Mr. Obama's double talk, which excused him for doing nothing about it when he had such a clear opportunity, essentially "forced" his supporters to hype racism far beyond any rational level. The tremendous victories won by people like Mr. King, which we all have so greatly benefited by, here in this country and around the world, were "thrown under the bus" of the Obama campaign, in my eyes.

The man is a coward, I think. A clever talkin' egocentric coward.
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Bruce K. Oct 28, 2008, 2:36am EDT
It is clear that Obama participated in Wright's church for the polical connections in Chicago. What else would someone do? Do you know anything about the alternatives. Every President has to go to church.

I was impressed with what Obama did in this case. He tried to stand up for Wright until Wright blew himself up in public.

It's double talk with Obama does it ... but McCain made a career of flip-flopping.
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John Knight Oct 28, 2008, 2:48am EDT
Bruce,

"What else would someone do?"

Well . . . how 'bout trying to change what was going on there?
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Bruce K. Oct 28, 2008, 2:51am EDT
John, that's just silly. If he got involved in petty local squabbles like that he would not be Barack Obama. He is not the church, and why should Wright not have the right to say what he wants to. His opinions have never offended me, I think he has every right to this opinions, he served this country more than 90% of have.
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John Knight Oct 28, 2008, 3:04am EDT
Bruce,

Silly? To think the man might actually attempt to change things for the better at some risk to his personal status? . . . If you say so.
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Bruce K. Oct 28, 2008, 3:26am EDT
John,
It's not silly to think that the man might actually attempt to change things for the better at some risk to his personal status? What do you think he is doing running for President? If one is going to take a risk, better take one as President that to try and fight a preacher in his own church.
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John Knight Oct 28, 2008, 3:43am EDT
Bruce,

I see, he was savin' up his changin', for us . . . how thoughtful of him.
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John Knight Oct 28, 2008, 3:50am EDT
I'm curious though . . . how would an egocentric coward handle that situation he was in? You figure he'd have selfishly attempted to set his friend and mentor Mr. Wright, right?
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 4:55am EDT
Just do like the Democrats and ACORN advocate:

"Vote early and Vote often" LOL
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 7:26am EDT
Charlie! You're so bad!
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Mark-John K. Oct 28, 2008, 9:11am EDT
A virtual BLOODBATH!

Sophie, I'm ALMOST beginning to feel sorry for them...

SOPHIE.....333
FOOLS.......0
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Marsha S. Oct 28, 2008, 9:26am EDT
the only thing that makes sense to me is the spending 3 or 4 to 1 on the advertising...seems that is all I see both online and on the tv are ads that says "I am am Barack Obama and I approve this ad"
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Capt Seaweed Oct 28, 2008, 10:05am EDT
Marxism and now a close associate of the PLO comes to light and you wonder why Obama can't seal the deal? Americans may be emotional but they are not stupid. Even the 4th estate can't hide the truth for ever!
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جيرسي جو Oct 28, 2008, 10:12am EDT
This again?

McCain = 4 more years of failure

Obama = Replacement of failure with success


There, simplistic enough for McCain/Palin supporters to understand.
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Jose' R. Oct 28, 2008, 10:24am EDT
CJ-
I have no doubt the country will "CHANGE' under Barrack Obama. Judging from his friendships with

William Ayers
Rezko
Wright
Rashid Khalidi

I don't think that's change I can believe in!
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:26pm EDT
Richard OM

I live in a bubble, of sorts, I suppose it could be called; however, I am reasonably sure, not the type you're referring to.

You see, I place little to no value in polls. Remember that at this same point in time Michael Dukakis was ahead of Vice President George H. W. Bush by 17% and in 2000 Al Gore was ahead of Governor George W. Bush by 11%. And...oh yes... I could take a poll in my house and it would be 100% for McCain, and Bush 0%. Furthermore, not one person I know, or myself, have ever been polled by anyone!!!
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:45pm EDT
John Knight and Bruce K,


May I say? I enjoyed that exchange !! Nice.

Bruce,

You said, " If one is going to take a risk, better take one as President that to try and fight a preacher in his own church. "

Couldn't Obama just have changed churches... in the big city with a multitude of churches....as opposed to sitting under Wright for 20 years, listening to and condoning his militant, racial rhetoric? It seems there was "something" that kept him there.

John,

Obama has always spoken with "forked tongue."
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:48pm EDT
Charlie,

:) :) :)

What Cathi said.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:49pm EDT
ooohhh Mark John,

I do love the way you keep score.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:51pm EDT
Marsha,

That same ole' stuff is on my TV, too !!! Should we change providers?
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:53pm EDT
Capt Seaweed,

It is just incredibly amazing that "everyone" doesn't see it.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:54pm EDT
C J

Yeah, that was "simple" enough. AND... I do mean, "Simple."
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 12:55pm EDT
Jose,

Nor can I.
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Bill's Spirit Oct 28, 2008, 2:39pm EDT
John McCain is a decorated, Vietnam era, POW veteran, who has served in government circles for over thirty years; whereas Obama is a relative new-comer.

How come McCain is having an even harder time closing the deal with Americans, whereas the new upstart with seemingly questionable baggage is doing so much better?

It's simple: Obama seems to be the more able, more talented, more knowledgeable, more articulate, and smarter candidate.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 3:07pm EDT
Bill,

McCain has not been in the lead nor close to closing the deal. Obama has been close but can never close the deal.

I believe many of us are really having the home-stretch questions about his past associations with terrorists, militant racists, crooks who he as been in shady deals with, and those who are now in prison. We're looking closely into his ACORN association, and the physcial and financial support he threw behind that. We're looking into his Karl Marx communist/socialist ideologies, and where he might be intending to take this country.
He only called off his association with those people (named above) after the public was made aware of them. Is this just temporary? Will he resume those activities after Nov 4th? Just those nagging little questions that give me pause.
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Bruce K. Oct 28, 2008, 3:24pm EDT
It is as simple as the Trinity church in Chicago was the place to be to make political contacts and influence people.

You Republicans are just a one-trick-pony, can't you come up with anything more than guilt by association?

Why don't you at least open your eyes and see the large and growing number of long-time Republicans who are supporting Obama? Do you think Colin Powel, Warren Buffet, Scott McClellan, most of the Eisenhower/Nixon family and many many others have suddenly been taken over by the Russians or what? You guys are hilarious to take a few people from his past and keep repeating it over and over.

If Repubicans want to do something useful they should figure out how they got to be so despised and try to fix that before the next election instead of running their total reputation into the ground for longer and longer.
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 3:47pm EDT
The Obama plan calls for a tax increase so large that economists will be focusing on the harm to the overall economy rather than just the isolated effects on labor and on capital. Perhaps a larger worry than the damage to the economy is the long-run budget problem of the United States. While Senator Obama raises taxes a great deal on upper income individuals, the overall tax plan increases the national deficit. As a result, the country will be even less prepared to pay for current and future Social Security and Medicare obligations. When money is needed to pay for those programs, it will be hard to tax the rich even more, given that the top rate will already be so high. Instead, in order to pay the government's spending and entitlement shortfalls, taxes would fall most heavily on middle-income Americans. After all, even successful taxpayers are not an infinite source of revenue.

Rea S. Hederman, Jr., is a Senior Policy Analyst and the Assistant Director, and Patrick Tyrrell is a Research Assistant, in the Center for Data Analysis at The Heritage Foundation.


I came across this the other day. Anybody know about The Heritage Foundation? This says Obama's tax plan is not only bad, it will be devestating to our already bad economy.
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 4:01pm EDT
Well, I agree with Sophie on at least one point. The polls are not accurate. Two words: cell phones. None, I repeat none, of the young people I know have a home phone. College students use cell phones from their home state, and young mothers who can't afford both a home phone and a cell phone, chose the cell phone, especially if they are working mothers.

I've had at least six calls from the Obama camp, and zero from the McCain camp. I am assuming Obama is the better community organizer, and with a nation this divided, that's what we need.

But the BIG question for me is:

If the Republicans love McCain so much, why did they chose Bush over McCain in the other election? And why does McCain's own mother say, "They'll 'have to' hold their noses and vote for him?"

I'm not electing Wright. I'm electing Obama.
I'm not electing Ayers, I'm electing Obama.
I'm not electing Rezco, I'm electing Obama.

I also don't believe any of the afore mentioned men will be in Obama's cabinet. Obama surrounds himself with people other than the afore mentioned men. I actually like Warren Buffet, and trust his judgment. I actually like Senator Lewis, and believe McCain misunderstood his long time friend. The truth of the matter is, no one should be judged by their acquaintances. And the other truth is: one man's trash is another man's treasure.

Ayers has done good things and bad things...... so who hasn't?
Wright has done good things and bad things..... so who hasn't?
Rezco has done good things and bad things..... so who hasn't?

If you believe yourself without fault, you are a liar and the truth is not within you.... Not my words, but words of God.

He who hath no sin, go ye ahead and cast the first stone.....
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:01pm EDT
Wow, Cathi, very interesting. Definitely speaks to Obama's tax plan. Thanks....again !!
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:27pm EDT
Bruce,

Now...come on....there must have been other "large" churches there where Obama could have made political contacts and influenced people. It's clear and simple...he was joined at the hip with Wright, probably secretly still is, and will be moreso after Nov. 4th.

Republican party so despised? By whom? That's a big broad brush that takes in a huge percentage of the American population. You need to be a little more specific.

We could go on forever about endorsements for each party. But I am so glad you mentioned Colin Powell. His endorsement alone, on anything, would drive me away. I remember him well. He's a liar and a hypocrit, and I can elaborate on that:

Colin Powell ~~~ Who can have any regard for what that guy might say, at this point, when we remember him before the United Nations so honestly and sincerely supporting the war effort? Showing strong and unshakeable support for something he now says he really didn't believe in.

He hasn't had much credibility since the last time he lied to us, and helped start a war that now, he says, was against his own principles.

He is one of the biggest enablers , he didn't get duped, he went along with it, and sold out a lot of people who believed in him then. Is there any bigger malfeasance, especially from a military man?

He's the one who went before the United Nations, presented support for the war in all honesty and with his most sincere endorsement of an issue he has since stated he didn't believe in. How could anyone now place any faith in what he might say, realizing that he may later say he really didn't mean it.

Why wasn't he outspoken then, if he disagreed? Does he show the same poor judgement on everything, including endorsements, that he speaks publicly about ... making sure he has an exit strategy by not endorsing sooner? Why didn't he resign ... at that time .... from the administration if he truly had objections to what he was presenting so forcefully? All politicians lie...granted. Just don't expect that a liar of this magnitude will be swaying any votes.

There are many questions about Powell's behavior then...and now. Even he has never fully explained, to everyone's satisfaction, why he boldy went against, what he claims now, were his principles.

For me, He has long since lost any credibility he once had.
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 4:33pm EDT
I note in the news today a sound bite of Senator Biden stating "if you make less than $150,000 your taxes won't go up..." First it was 250,000, then the figure mentioned was 200,000, now this. Any body else smell a rat?
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 4:37pm EDT
according to the fundamental faith, if you believe a brother is sinning you approach him, counsel with him, if he (or she) does not change his/her ways, you are to bring one of the church elders with you to counsel him again, if after this he STILL continues in his ways you are supposed to call him on his behavior in the presence of the church family. Obviously this was not done or we would have heard of it.

Reminds me of what my mother used to say: "It is by our silence that we give our consent."
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:47pm EDT
Rosa,

You made some valid points...I just don't agree with them.

There are reasons I can't vote for Obama, here are a couple:

Some months back, Joe Biden said Obama was NOT ready to be president. He said we don't need a president who will need On The-Job-Training. I believe that, and that he made those statements because of Obama's lack of experience and bad judgements about past associations. Biden saw that then, and probably still does.

Obama has never managed anything but his 2-year vacuous campaign for president.
America may desperately desire to close the book on the Bush presidency, but there is no evidence it has completely embraced Obama, his ideology, or agenda. His campaign testifies, by its policy shifts, that it is fully aware the nation is still resisting the idea of an Obama presidency. I think people are running FROM: Bush, the Economy, Wall Street, the Bail Out...etc....more than TO Obama. Unfortunately, many connect those events with McCain. Obama has run his campaign AGAINST Bush, who is not on the ticket.

I rejected Obama, in large part, because of his past associations with the terrorist, racist, militant type, which he clung to desperately until he became a candidate and saw the scurrilous way they were viewed. Only then did he disassociate.




Some months back, Joe Biden said Obama was NOT ready to be president. He said we don't need a president who will need On The-Job-Training. I believe that, and that he made those statements because of Obama's lack of experience and bad judgements about past associations. Biden saw that then, and probably still does.

Obama has never managed anything but his 2-year vacuous campaign for president.
America may desperately desire to close the book on the Bush presidency, but there is no evidence it has completely embraced Obama, his ideology, or agenda. His campaign testifies, by its policy shifts, that it is fully aware the nation is still resisting the idea of an Obama presidency. I think people are running FROM: Bush, the Economy, Wall Street, the Bail Out...etc....more than TO Obama. Unfortunately, many connect those events with McCain. Obama has run his campaign AGAINST Bush, who is not on the ticket.

I rejected Obama, in large part, because of his past associations with the terrorist, racist, militant type, which he clung to desperately until he became a candidate and saw the scurrilous way they were viewed. Only then did he disassociate.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:48pm EDT
Melinda,

You are wrong ... I disagree with Socialism ... all the time. In fact, I can't think of one way it would ever "benefit" me.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:52pm EDT
Wow ! Don't know how they repeated paragraphs in the post 2 up from here.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:53pm EDT
Melinda,

I never used the word, "Outspoken," in my post. Please re-read it.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 4:56pm EDT
Charlie,

Now you know Obama gets to "flip-flop" on everything he says!

Also, you have a very smart Mother.
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Bruce K. Oct 28, 2008, 5:15pm EDT
Cathi, how big is the deficit supposed to get? You're so smart you can make comments about the economy, who is going to pay the taxes when the whole federal budget is interest paid to the rich on the national debt. Is that what you are advcocating?
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 5:38pm EDT
Sophie, Mitt Romney didn't think McCain was the best candidate either, but now he supports him. They too had issues in the Primary. They all dis each other in the primaries on both sides of the fence. Besides, it's been a while since the primaries, and we've all learned a few things since then. Heck, according to the press, we STILL have undecideds.

As to the management thing, everyone knows the President has advisors. Obama will have a great cabinet, I have no doubts about that. But even so, he's done one heck of a job managing this campaign, and that takes skill nobody really wants to give him credit for. Community organizing takes management skill, too, and that's what he's really good at.

I haven't seen one single radical outburst from Obama. Just because he knows these folks doesn't mean he agrees with everything about them, or even participates in those mindsets.

Look, I know nothing I can say will change your mind, you're probably a die hard Republican. I left the party because I saw too much hypocracy from the leaders and their pundits on FOXNEWS. I voted for Bush twice, and I am just not going there again. I like that Obama has gathered people together, and I think that's what we need, because division is bad for any nation.

And you didn't answer my questions. Two easy questions, Sophie........
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Devin Barber Oct 28, 2008, 5:44pm EDT
"Obama Can't close the deal." Is about as nothing a statement as any. No one closes the deal until the election is over.

But I must say Patti your article is quite fanciful. Your conclusions that "Voters still apparently don't know who Obama is and are still not altogether sure that Obama is the proper antidote to George Bush." And "Obama is a deeply flawed candidate that Americans have deep-down grave reservations about" is pretty "out there." Especially when you consider how badly he's beating McCain in the polls. Oh I forgot, you don't believe in polls... how convenient. Perhaps you believe in how the McCain campaign is becoming unhinged and even his fellow "REPUBLICAN" Senator from Arizona John Kyl said "Unfortunately, I think John McCain might be added to that long list of Arizonans who ran for president but were never elected,"

In Fact a lot of Republican heavyweights have written McCain off. But I want you to know is that I do feel sorry for folks who feel they have to stick with Grandpa til the end. How sad, how very sad...
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 5:47pm EDT
Rosa, you said:

"If the Republicans love McCain so much, why did they chose Bush over McCain in the other election? And why does McCain's own mother say, "They'll 'have to' hold their noses and vote for him?"

Can't answer that second question without a leetle more context, but the first one IS easy, the right man at the right time.
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 5:49pm EDT
And Sophie, McCain has never convinced me he wants to part ways with Bush. Why didn't he spend his time telling me, the voter, how he is different from Bush, rather than following FOXNEWS on the terrorist bandwagon. I just don't like those folks trying to play on people's fears. I want to live whatever life I have left, and if terrorists take me out, then oh well, we all gotta go sometime. But McCain never convinced me, and still hasn't. He still wants tax breaks for the wealthy, He wants to stay in Iraq even though the Iraqi government doesn't want us. My nephew is over there now, and tell me, what will happen to him if Bush leaves him there, and come DEC we are there illegally??????
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 5:54pm EDT
Charlie, I believe the discussion with Mama McCain was about pleasing the base. And surely you can come up with a better answer than that: right time? Bush seemed good to the Republican. They were wrong, period. End of story. His legacy is pitiful. So........ tell me why you guys are right this time??????? Cause you were wrong about Nixon as well. Twenty of last 28 years you've been wrong, the party I mean... nothing personal.
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 5:56pm EDT
Heck, I was a Republican. I was wrong, but at least I admit it.
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 6:00pm EDT
Devin, you left out the Goldwaters, who now support Obama.
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Peter Joseph Swanson Oct 28, 2008, 6:03pm EDT
Pleeeease no no NO more Republican years in the White House ... Pleeease ... pleeeeeeeeease !!!!!
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Rosa See Ya Oct 28, 2008, 6:30pm EDT
20 out of 28, PJ, I sooooo agree with you!!!!
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Joe T. Oct 28, 2008, 6:46pm EDT
For many people, Obama, has already sealed the deal. I think the point of this article is to see if some of the unfounded smears against him can be entertained. The fact is that Obama is the better candidate. Vote for Obama on November 4th (or before, if you can).
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 7:20pm EDT
And Charlie says - Vote early! Vote often!
(this message has been approved by ACORN and the Obama for Pres. Foundation
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Mark-John K. Oct 28, 2008, 7:31pm EDT
Melinda, wake up and inquire ...NO-ONE was for the Socialist bailout. And FEW are "in Deep" for McCain. It becomes merely a matter of choice.for most..for the America we Love, or NOT.
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 7:33pm EDT
Yes Cathi, I know they're an extremely conservative, openly right wing "research" organization. Nice try. Perhaps some real unbiased research next time.

Nice try? They have all of their figures displayed on their website. But because they claim they are a conservative group (not verified) then their research is automatically discounted? What the hey? Only left wing groups do unbiased research? What's unbiased, Obama's website? CNBC?
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michael k. Oct 28, 2008, 9:26pm EDT
people are such idiots.. they lose their common sense in all the effort to seem intelligent.
Sarah Palin and The Alaskan Independence Party do your research and know your true enemy.


Obama/Biden 08
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Mariana T. Oct 28, 2008, 10:46pm EDT
Sophie - I am voting for Obama - I have done my own research - he's the best candidate. Salud
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Mariana T. Oct 28, 2008, 10:46pm EDT
I urge everyone to vote for Obama - thank you . Salud
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Mariana T. Oct 28, 2008, 10:49pm EDT
Obama is leading and it appears that there is nothing deeply flawed about Him - you need to do more research:

---Obama is a deeply flawed candidate that Americans have deep-down grave reservations about, and they will be weighing this all in during the remaining days, pior to voting. Why can't the charasmatic and eloquent speaker named Obama close the deal?

I have no deep down grave reservations about him but I do know many folks who are very racist and that is the primary reason they will not vote for him. He has closed the deal with his intelligence - He is not a miracle worker but at least he's intelligent and understands economics... Salud
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Mariana T. Oct 28, 2008, 10:51pm EDT
I have ALREADY VOTED FOR OBAMA - I HAVE RESEARCHED EVERYTHING I CAN ABOUT HIM - PLEASE NO MORE MCSAMES...AND FOR SURE NO PALINS - OMG - PULEEEEEEZE. SALUD
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 11:06pm EDT
people are such idiots.. they lose their common sense in all the effort to seem intelligent.
Obama and ACORN - do your research and know your true enemy.

McCain/Palin 08
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:33pm EDT
Rosa and Melinda,

Some good points ! You want Obama for president and his professed socialistic form of government. I don't. Just a few more days and we will know.

In case you think Obama will not be trying to take this country into Socialism, then I would ask you: What was Barack Obama doing seeking out Marxist professors in college? Why did Obama choose a Communist Party USA member as his socio- political counselor in high school? Why was he spending his time studying neocolonialism and the writings of Frantz Fanon, the pro-violence author of “the Communist Manifesto of neocolonialsm”, in college? Why did he take time out from his studies at Columbia to attend socialist conferences at Cooper Union?

He has openly admitted that he is going to “share the wealth” destroying tht very fabric of our nation and those who paid the ultimate sacrifice in order to protect our republic from such an idea.

Taking from others to give to many who don’t want to achieve anything destroys character. What happens when moral decay and apathy lead us to the point that the percentage of hard workers can no longer support those who want to take from them? What happens when human ingenuity and the human will to work, to get ahead, to get a college degree, to own a business, or to reap the benefits from your own labor is no longer a viable alternative? When that is killed, then we are all robots taking our meager share of what the government will dole out to us. It will be a society where everyone does as little as possible, because the pay is the same for all. Socialism always brings a society to a bad ending, and it's not just another political party, it's the death knell to freedom.

If you doubt this, read his book, "Dreams For My Father," a story of race and inheritance, then for Kenya, but are these his dreams for the US?

On P.29, he advocates the communal ownership of land and the forced confiscation of privately controlled land.
On P.32, he advocated the nationalization of “European” and “Asian” owned enterprises, including hotels.
On P.31, he advocates dramatically increasing taxation on “the rich” even up to the 100% level.
On P.29, he advocates an “active” rather than a “passive” program to achieve a classless society.

This is his basic belief system. At any rate, it's scary, with his hints of it till this day when he told Joe the plumber, " I don't want to punish you for your success, but we need to spread the wealth so those below you can have your same success." Any way you slice it, that's Socialism.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:41pm EDT
Devin,

On your post here, see upthread, in your text, you addressed your comment to "Patti." I'm going to assume you meant that for me, I'm Sophie. Might this kind of confusion be present in other chambers of your brain? Perhaps that explains all the nonsense you write in support of Obama.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:46pm EDT
Peter,

Stop begging. We're not putting Obama in the White House. I'll repeat...that would be like sending an arsonist to put out a fire.
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 11:47pm EDT
It will be interesting to find out, after the dust settles next week, of those whom the ACORN workers fraudulently registered what number were registered to the Democratic party and what number were assigned to the Republican party. Any body want to venture a guess at this point?

A side note did anybody else hear the news report that it has been discovered in Alabama, there are six counties where the number of registered voters exceeds the number of people who are of voting age? Now one county has roughly 8500 registered voters with approximately 7700 of voting age (I may be off on the numbers, but those stick in my memory) 100% sign up is unbelievable, but 110% is fantastic don't you agree? Any body want to comment on that?
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:47pm EDT
Joe,

NO! I won't vote for Obama. Nor will millions of other informed Americans. In fact, I got a ballot from ACORN, addressed to my dog. He's not voting for Obama, either.
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 11:49pm EDT
I'm really going to look at the poll results from those counties, aren't you?

Or, do you not care that this is voter fraud?
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:50pm EDT
Charlie,

LOL. Did you just see where I said I got a ballot from ACORN for my dog. I guess it's because he has a 'REAL' birth certificate. But that lazy little bum never did get a social security number. He practices Socialism.
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 11:51pm EDT
You know Sophie, my parakeet actually thought about it and I said to him, "Agent Smith! No more hand outs from me if you are going to plan on getting them from the government!" That shut him up right away. He's voting McCain now.
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 11:52pm EDT
Every time I check back, your rating is getting closer to Number 1! Congrats!
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 11:53pm EDT
Oh, and no problem with Pippin, the other parakeet, nor Sierra or Samirah, the two goldens. They've always been McCain supporters.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:53pm EDT
Charlie,

I wonder how many other counties in the USA have more registered voters than there are people of voting age?
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 11:54pm EDT
I think they sent their ACORN certified mail-ins yesterday.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:55pm EDT
LOL Cathi,

Now, if we can just get all our animals to vote..... wheeeeee!

No problem when ACORN is on the job.
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 28, 2008, 11:55pm EDT
Melinda, when the patient sues the nurse for malpractice, there is NO defense for "the doctor told me to do it." As a nurse, and I am one, I am required by my license to question an order that I know to be incorrect, and if the doctor insists that his erroneous order be carried out I am obligated to refuse, even if it costs me my job. I must notify the supervisor and if he/she says the MD's order is valid, I can still decline to carry out the order, and then request the supervisor carry out the order. I may be disciplined but I will not have harmed the patient. The lawyer for the plaintiff will ask why, if I knew the order was wrong, did I carry out the order. If I do it, follow the order, I have no defense.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:56pm EDT
Cathi,

Where do you check for that rating? I didn't know about it.
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sophie m M. Oct 28, 2008, 11:57pm EDT
Charlie,

Great analogy.
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Cathi L. Oct 28, 2008, 11:58pm EDT
Right under your article title. Views: 239 Rating 2.8/10 Comments: 82 (now 83)
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 12:02am EDT
OHHHH. OK. I had a "1" on my other article for awhile. Made me so happy. I know the libs are lurking.
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 29, 2008, 12:08am EDT
Sophie,

We will have no idea and will never find out.

Another news tidbit: 26 states DO NOT require any form of identification in order to vote. Just show up at the polling place, state your name which is checked against the precinct's registrations and vote. If ACORN has deliberately falsified registrations, under my name in different precincts, then I can vote all day all over the place. Only it wouldn't be "me," would it?

Only six states require photo ID, which has been bitterly fought against by the Democrats as their reasoning is that to require photo ID unfairly discriminates against the poor. They can't afford to get a state ID card is the followup argument, but by God they can sure drive with or without a driver's license, which, correct me if I am wrong, IS a form of photo ID. So either you HAVE photo ID, or you are driving illegally. If you can afford a car costing anywhere from a couple of hundred bucks to tens of thousands then surely you can afford the 30 or 40 bucks to get a Photo license.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 12:15am EDT
UNBELIEVABLE !!!

Some time back, I read an article about, if the American people are being foolish if they believe they elect their president. With the Electoral College, and ACORN., etc ... I have to wonder just how much our votes really count.
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Bruce K. Oct 29, 2008, 5:08am EDT
ACORN has nothing to do with counting votes Sophie ... try and keep up.
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Charlie Dierkes Oct 29, 2008, 9:42am EDT
Bruce, No they do not actually count the votes, but if they have over registered people (see my comment re: the six counties in Alabama) then there is the potential of having someone from ACORN voting their agenda with the extra "voters" Follow my logic, if there are ten voting precincts in a county and I am registered in mine, and fraudulent registrations are filed in the other nine, how many times do you think "Charlie Dierkes" could vote that day? And who do you think those fraudulent voters will be voting for? Why the candidate of ACORN's choice which we already know isn't Mr Barr or Senator McCain.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 10:59am EDT
Charlie and Bruce

Thank you for explaining that to Bruce, Charlie. It just swooshed right over his head. Sometimes Bruce gets a little lost, confused and says really silly things. The bad news is that he votes.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 1:32pm EDT
Clyde,

What a great response....thank you.

Good observation on Social Security. There has been talk for years of privatizing Social Security, Medicare...etc, etc.etc.

There is an excellent example of how government takes your money, money you have paid in, use it how they wish, to fight a war you didn't want, amongst other things you didn't want, then tell you ... "Sorry, we spent all your money without asking you but it was for your own good." There's Socialism in action for you.

Thanks again, Clyde.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 1:35pm EDT
Melinda,

Just to add to Clyde's great response: Once all the power is invested in the state, it takes on a life of it's own, and the cold,hard fact is that the state has no conscience, or care for an individual. You're a commodity that they will dole out to you what they think you need.

Regardless of what Obama's touted "good intentions," the fact is he is a proponent of Socialism. It is proven, over and over, through his past, even some of his present statements.

Socialism will always bring society to a bad end. Remember the Nazi's official and frequently forgotten name was the, "National Socialist German Workers Party." See that trick? We all know what life was like in that Nazi Socialist state. Or, another socialist state, "The People's Republic of China," where individuals were instantly subordinated to the needs of the state.

Both history and current events demonstrate that the socialist reality is always bad for the individual. It takes away any individuality, and commits you to a life of being a government pawn. The state incrementally destroys individual freedom. And that is why Obama's socialism leanings matter.

But remember...Obama, like those leaders who gradually took their people deeper and deeper into socialism, think they are doing what is best. They get to decide what is best for you. It begins slowly, with a charismatic guy like Obama who is a rare and eloquent speaker. Look at the throngs of people today, mesmerized by Obama. Hitler was one of those, also, in the beginning.

Melinda, you ask, "Do you firmly believe that will occur?" I believe the risks of that occurring are so high that I refuse to take the chance with a vote for Obama.

McCain wants to change DC...Obama wants to change America...to Socialism. He has told us so, through Joe the plumber.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 1:37pm EDT
Melinda,

We learned last week that our local public education system's budget has been cut by 1.4 million.
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Aniko   Oct 29, 2008, 4:42pm EDT
Sophie, can you give me an example of a candidate that was "totally embraced" by the voters? Outside of communist and fascist countries, I mean, where the "official" results would show such 100% support (while in reality everyone wants the Great Leader to die a very painful death). That situation is real communism, you know. (At least, the "actually existing" kind.) Western style social democracy (welfare, national health care, public education) is about as close to that kind of "socialism"/communism as your neighborhood Unitarian church is to Jonestown.

(I won't even address the conflation of fascism with socialism--it's too far removed from reality and too ironic, given which side any fascist would support in this election.)
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Michael D. Oct 29, 2008, 8:13pm EDT
McCain and Palin are the best choice. Obama has a long and dangerous history. He plans to meet unconditionally with dangerous leaders (Chavez etc....), that's the last thing this country needs, potentiall terrorist attacks from those countries. Obama has no executive experience or foreign policy experience. He's just not ready to be commander-in-chief and his policies are messed up!

McCain/Palin '08
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 9:45pm EDT
Melinda,

I've enjoyed it, as well. We all bring something new to the table. Neither of us will change the other's mind, at this point, but when we broaden our knowledge and scope, we are the better for it. Thanks for your thoughts.



Clyde,

You, too, and thanks again.

If you ever find out what happened to the money, may I be one of the first to know?
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 9:53pm EDT
Aniko,

I think I know where you're going with this!!! The fact that I used the word "Total," would more than likely disqualify anyone if we buy into the authoritarian view of the language, and proper word meaning. I used it as a loose term, feeling confident that everyone would "get it." (Example: When my son says something is "bad," that really means good.)

I have some friends who are linguists and lexicographers and even they have succumbed to the laxness of the language today and have ceased being linguistic pooper scoopers.

I don't believe the U.S. is a purely capitalistic society, nor do I believe it is possible for any type of government to exist in it's "Pure" or "Real " form.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 9:54pm EDT
Mariah,

Congratulations !!
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 10:02pm EDT
Michael,

Even Joe Biden said, a few months back, that Obama was not ready to be president and that we didn't need an on-the-job-trainee.

Don't know what happened in a matter of months to make him qualified, but I do know that politics makes strange bed fellows. Biden reminded us again, just recently, that Obama could be tested early on...because of his inexperience.
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Dan R. Oct 29, 2008, 10:05pm EDT
Clyde; The problem with the moneys the public school system uses, is that they often spend it on programs and prodjects that have little to do with the education they are supposed to be teaching the kids. I mean where is it necessary for schools to teach anout gay relationships, sexual education, and the moslem religion? Most of this could be taught inside of other classes in a chapter or two instead of drawn out programs. Sexual education should be taught at home by the parents, or family doctors, not the school system which needs to work more on what the child needs to get anywhere in life.
I hear how many schools are reducing art programs, when art teaches creative thinking, which we are seeing more and more kids lacking today.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 10:12pm EDT
Colin,

The question was because Obama has had the lead in this race, for a significant period of time, Yet, he has never been able to go all the way, or put him over the top, according to the media, polls, etc., or in the minds of those people, prior to Nov 4th. McCain has never had that kind of lead, for that length of time.
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sophie m M. Oct 29, 2008, 10:17pm EDT
Dan,

Exactly !!

Kids graduate who can't read or write, in varying degrees, yet well versed in other extra cirricular subjects.

Whatever happened to sticking to the basic cirriculum and teaching the 3 R's first?
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Aniko   Oct 30, 2008, 12:50am EDT
I think I know where you're going with this!!! The fact that I used the word "Total," would more than likely disqualify anyone if we buy into the authoritarian view of the language, and proper word meaning. I used it as a loose term, feeling confident that everyone would "get it." (Example: When my son says something is "bad," that really means good.)

All right, that's fair enough. You used "totally" in the teenage sense of "to some important extent". (Though the "bad" example is unhelpful, since it that case, the word means its exact opposite, and I don't think your "totally" meant "not at all".) You have also explained that what you mean is that the poll results are not as good for Obama as you think they should be. So I'll rephrase my question: what would be the "lead" that you would consider "putting him over the top"?

(Of course, there's this one too: Why are some voters so resistant to embrace Obama? I suppose "some" means "a larger than expected number" here, since, again, in a democracy one would hardly expect all the voters to embrace the same candidate...)


This is an aside, but a topic of significant interest to me:

I have some friends who are linguists and lexicographers and even they have succumbed to the laxness of the language today and have ceased being linguistic pooper scoopers.

As your linguist friends would also tell you, modern linguists are not "authoritarian" at all, let alone "linguistic pooper scoopers". All of modern scientific linguistics is descriptivist, in other words, describes language rather than tries to prescribe it. "Language mavens" who write newspaper columns fulminating about the corruption of language are prescriptivists--they want to prescribe how people should talk (a completely futile endeavor in the long run). Their concerns include superstitions like "don't end a sentence with a preposition", or etymological fallacies like