Gather Updates Points Program

"Members who publish content that they do not own (copied from other sources) will lose the ability to earn points on Gather.  Gather reserves the right to reclaim any points earned by that member for copied content posted to the site."

Tom, this is a HUGE step in the right direction. 

Thanks Ann.  We know that a lot of members invest real time and energy to create great experiences for others here.  We heard your feedback on this front and didn't want our quality creators to have to compete with pirated content for earnings.

HOLY CRAP I will believe it when I see it!  Sorry for the skepticism Tom, but there are a lot of cut and pasters out there who need to go to "rehab" if this is ever going to really happen!  I will book mark this post and send them here when I see them.  Hopefully that will help get the message out!

Haha I like that C&P Rehab xD

Thank you, Tom.  This sounds like a positive change to Gather....:)

Glad you think so Cheryl!  Please keep me posted on your thoughts once the changes have been in place for a few days.  And thanks for helping guide us to a better place.

Cool.  Glad to see the emphasis placed on ORIGINAL content.

Of course, there will still be the one line posts, the jokes and blatant plagiarism as before, but it's encouraging to see signs of the old Gather that attracted me here in the first place.

Thanks X Tabber!  I am glad to hear we are moving toward an experience you find valuable.

We will definitely have further learning/adjustment to do here.  Please let me know what you think after the experience is in place for a while.

Sounds like a great step and I'm looking forward to it!

Me too, Courtney.  Please check back in and let me know what you think.

What about articles that we feel are a benefit from other sites that we have posted (on ct health ect...) and put the link to the original article for friends to further find out about the subject.  I am confused.

That is what I am wondering.  Every so often I find a news story that I would like to hear a great debate out.  This site was good for that as there are  so many people here with so many different opinions. 

I am wondering the same.  I rewrite mine but I link to the original work as well.

Hi Katherine-  You are welcome to post "bookmarks" or links to other sites with your own commentary in them.  What we are discouraging is members that copy content wholesale (like articles from the Associated Press or poems from books) and publish them just to earn points.

If you want to cite someone else's work and discuss why it's interesting/important to you, that's fantastic (and valuable).

Katherine, Denise, Renee - did I answer your question fully here?

People have never seemed to have a problem with posts like that, as long as you don't post the entire article or whatever, AND (not or) as long as you share enough original content so that it is more original than copied. 

Yes Tom you answered thank you very much

Thanks Tom I think I do see what you are looking for now and thats great!

Thanks very much, Tom.  Raising the intellectual level by recognizing and supporting original content is a terrific change in a positive direction.

Thanks, Madame Donna.  I am hopeful that it will really enhance the Gather experience.  Please let me know your thoughts on whether it does once members get used to the new system?

Does that mean when I rewrite a story and link to a news article I won't be able to?  For instance in my article Young mother ordered to not have contact with children till adults.

Renee- thanks for the terrific example.  Here, you cite a news item and use it as the basis for sharing your own commentary.  You have created real value here and we would encourage this kind of sharing.

In contrast, if you had just copied and posted the article from NaplesNews.com in its entirety, that would be discouraged.

Thanks Tom just wanted to make sure I was doing okay. 

Sounds good to me. It sounds fair and reasonable...and this is "spoken" by someone (me) who has been too busy to post very much content. I have no problem rewarding people who create. When I have more time, I can get back to posting more.

Thanks, Ellie!  This is a really helpful perspective.  I look forward to reading more of your content when you have time to share more.

"•    Members who publish content that they do not own (copied from other sources) will lose the ability to earn points on Gather.  Gather reserves the right to reclaim any points earned by that member for copied content posted to the site."

I think this deserves all caps: THANK YOU!

How will this be achieved though? Will members be able to flag or report unorigional content in some way?

Agreed.

Very glad to see this.

Thanks for asking, Heather.  Members already do flag content that is copyrighted.  While we follow the Digital Copyright Millenium Act when determining whether to remove content from the site, we will be much more aggressive in turning off points earning from people that publish copied content.  We expect this will remove a lot of the incentive for doing so.

So we should continue to use the "other" flag for reporting said content then?

Tom I think you deserve a batch of cookies or home made home grown zucchini bread (you might have to wait a while on that becuase my plant is being slow to grow haha) for this decision.

Exactly right, Heather. The "other" flag is the right place to go if you see people posting lots of "borrowed" content.

And thanks, I actually love zucchini bread :-)  I'll wait as long as I have to :)

Well you can track the progress of Bob the Zucchini (I name all my plants haha) via my next photo essay on of my container garden.  I'm so giddy with this update/information that I'm finally inspired to do the first one I have been putting off for a while from lack of motivation.

Thank you again :) You've restored my faith in Gather.

I hope it all works out fabulously.  I hope it encourages more original articles, and not so many email jokes that have been around for so long now.  And if I should ever do it (I may find a joke irresistibly hilarious) that's cool that it isn't worth any points. Fair is fair !!!

You could even put a box that we check at publishing time, to save your staff the effort.  We check a box that says, "Tired old joke, not original, no points for this old corn, please ..." - or however it should be put.

I can see starting a new Gather group ... Not Worth a Point.

ha ha ha ha hah ha ha ha

That's a really good idea Peter! 

lol Peter

And quote of the day.  I can LOVE quotes, but is that "original content" ???

Great idea, Peter!  I'll pass this to our product team.  We did consider having a box where members would declare whether an article was original content when publishing.  We'll revisit that in the future if it proves useful.

I've posted quotes I love, before.  From Dolly Parton to Mother Teresa.  I wouldn't mind if I didn't get any points for that kind of thing.  Fair is fair.

Ooo, I love this idea! I occasionally post quotes, too, and it can spark some interesting conversation here or there....or someone will post a similar quote that I fall in love with. I'd be okay not getting points for this, and more than happy to mark that the content isn't my own because I'm still getting something out of it.

Hmmm.... I'm not sure, but it sounds like "publish like crazy" instead of participation in debate by commenting etc. may result?

I guess I'll have to wait and see how this goes... perhaps I should publish more, and read and comment less?

As long as it is quality, original content it can't be TOO bad.  Though it could become overwhelming. 

I still think quality COMMENTS should be rewarded as well...but how would that work.

i hope comments still get points. I read alot and comment on alot of articles, not cuttign and pasting but really comment. takes alot of time.

John and Alex - commenting actually does create real value for the comment author.  Members tend to follow thoughtful comments back to the author's profile and content and often connect with the commentor.

Participation in public debate is a great way to build repupation in a community.  If members see you engaging well in the content they are already reading, they are likely to follow your writing as well.

aka "comment stalking".  I am a big fan of that feature.  I have found a lot of great content that I would have never know about otherwise.  Or I might have skipped out on a post because I thought it was something different, only to find some great discussions going on within.

Tom- don't get me totally wrong, I see some pluses in this, but I spend hours moderating all my groups (10), and reading and commenting on what is published there leaving little time for anything else personally. It takes me a long time to publish and article, and it would seem my past efforts are going to be worth less now is all, and worry that all that participation may be getting a little slighted is all.

This is excellent news and those of us that post our own photography, stories and other content appreciate this change.

I am glad, Katherine.  Let me know what you think after it's been in place for a while!

what about Qoutes when you give credit to the owner?

Why should you get points for simply posting a one line comment created by someone else? Now if you write something about why the quote is releveant and add your own opinion, besides "I like it". . . that's a whole 'nother thing I think.

Agreed Heather. 

If you post a quote, why not ask how it makes the readers feel, share how it made you feel.  Talk about why it's important, what it means to you.  That would make me want to read it.  It also would generate the type of conversation that Gather is aiming for. 

Sandi- quoting someone is fine (and permitted under copyright law) when you use that quote as the basis for some commentary or critique.  If everything a member submits here is simply quoted material, however, without any value-add, we would view this skeptically over time.

Great News - thanks Tom!

Kind of you Richard.  Thanks for helping us figure out what to do here!

Content is key - but you already knew that. Congratulations on the funding! and thanks for the opportunities you create.

Viewing articles, photos, videos no longer gets any points?

Hi Helen- general site use (viewing, searching, etc) does continue to earn points.  We have allocated more of the points to original content creation, however, so earning for these activities will decrease.

I think the changes are definitely an improvement.  I'm glad original content will be the focus.  I was telling my husband the other day that I get so frustrated as I'll spend hours preparing and taking photos of a recipe or fun article, only to get the same credit that a 'post a link with a one sentence article' gets.  This is really uplifiting.

Thanks Katie.  We hope these changes will provide real return for our original contributors on the site.  We realized through this process that members that create experiences on Gather are true community hosts.  They bring in other people that love what they love to do, create a forum for them, and introduce them to others like them.  This is exactly what we wanted to encourage on the site.

Ok I am still lost on this one. Am I right by asuming that from now on anything shared from emails are wrong to do and you loose points? All content is to be made by you no one else. Anf Gather can take points away at anytime they feel is write???

Yes.

Hi Dana- We are reasonable folks.  If we see someone occasionally posting an email joke or posting a quote that dominates an article, we aren't going to freeze points earning for that member or deduct them.  We are going to focus on egregious cases where people use pirated content to spike points earning.

Yes, we do reserve the right to remove points for pirated content.  We want to remove all incentive for members to simply cut-and-paste content from other places in an attempt to earn, so that those creating genuine content earn more.

Yes I totaly understand you guys reserving the right to take points I just don't know and am not sure what is allowed or not I am still lost. But I sapose it really doesn't matter too much I get the jist of it all. And ofcourse there shouldn't be the pirating of articles.

Another part I am not too sure of is were it said: Based on "great content"

How are we to know if we are making great content or not? Is it acording to ratings or acording  to views or comments? I just don't get it lol sorry.

dana, if your confused as to what great content is, just assume that anything that doesn't require a modicum of brain function to create would not be considered great content. 

basically gather would like people to put some effort into their articles such as how a certain news story MADE YOU FEEL  and why, as opposed to just putting a link and saying something like "this is so horrible". 

Fabulous!

Gracias!

Thanks Tom, I'm very happy to hear this and look forward to seeing how it works on a day to day basis. I'm with Heather and curious about how you will know if something is taken from the Interet  or written by the person posting.

Hi Digital Diva- for now, we will rely on member reporting as a way to identify content taken from elsewhere on the internet.  We will consider automated tools that monitor for this if these changes are not successful.

uncapping of earnings is great news.500 000 dollars is a good big sum. me thinks u would get nominated fr the nobel peace prize one of these days:)(not joking) or atleast u deserve accolades fr one of a kind venture online. congrats.

Ashish you are too kind!  We are genuinely excited to be able to reward the creativity of our members in such a meaningful way.  Many thanks for joining us here on Gather.

Tom,

In a prior chat it was stated that compensation for members outside of the U.S. was predicated on moving away from the accrual of points for the publishing of content.

With the change/commitment announced today, it would seem that you are moving further away from compensating international members. What, if any, plan does Gather have for allowing all members to redeem points?

Hi Kevin-  Thanks for the question.  We had hoped to be able to offer participation in the points program for all Gather members.  This requires significant investment by the company, however, since our non-US members are spread throughout the world.  After the United States, the next largest country for Gatherers (Canada) represents 4% of our visitors.  The U.K. is next at 3%.  Australia follows with just over 1%.

To launch in other countries, we needed to change payment systems, support foreign currencies, update accounting and tax filing processes, and extend our auditing procedures.  It would require a major investment by the company for each country.

With the advent of the economic downturn, we have had to focus our resources carefully.  In all candor, we have had to place this project on the back burner to focus on things that bring a greater return. Once the economy (and advertising budgets, in particular) rebound, we hope to offer this opportunity to members around the world

Thanks Tom. Since I understand the resource commitments required to fulfill international redemption, I assumed that this endeavor had been moved aside for now.

I think all members appreciate your candor in this matter.

Thanks, Kevin.  I appreciate your understanding and help in calling out the question.

As an aside, thanks, too, for all of the help Twittering about good Gather experiences and member content.  It's really helpful to have the outreach there!

Thanks, Kevin - you raised my point beautifully!

So, Tom...  perhaps you would find a way of ensuring that us Lesser-Gatherers (as I feel we are viewed!) are not awarded points?  It seems farcical to me that the site awards points to those of us who are unable to use them.

I may be naive and ignorant of the complexities involved, but I don't understand the problem, since PayPal is used the world over. Why couldn't international members use it without any further complications? I understand there are US tax issues involved, but if you capped their earnings at $600, would they come into play?

I'm glad to see Gather is encouraging originality rather than copying and pasting content taken from elsewhere.  It was discouraging to find those who 'borrow' content that wasn't their own, taking meer seconds to do, being rewarded the same as posts members spend much more time and effort on creating.  I've curtailed my contributions greatly because some members were allowd to 'steal' their posts and make much more in rewards than those who spent a greater deal of time in creating original content.  Hopefully, this move will encourage more originality and reward original posts more than 'cut and paste' articles lifted from other sites and other authors.  Now, we need to work on point distribution ratios, whereas, someone who spends time and effort on creating articles of some length (several paragraphs) earns more than those who publish one or two short sentence posts.  It doesn't seem fair that a person who actually thinks and spends an hour or more creating a post be rewarded the same as someone who spends a minute or two posting those one or two sentences articles.  I've cut back my contributions because of the unequal rewards.  For example, if I spend an hour creating a lengthier post with some good content to it...I get awarded 1 point...while someone else shares 20, one sentence posts in that same hour that doesn't take much thought and has little meaning, is awarded 20 points.  It discourages people from sharing when we can earn more points simply by looking at what others have posted, rather than creating our own original content with some substance to it.  I can earn more points by forgetting about writing and simply open posts published by others.

Hi Rob- Thanks for the note.  I am glad this is a step in the right direction and may encourage you to contribute more on the site.

We believe that genuine, original content creation will be rewarded more highly on the site.  Our Earn More Points group is going to teach authors (photographers, vloggers) to grow their personal readership (viewership) over time as well.  We expect that short posts and games will appeal to a significantly smaller audience at scale.  This would mean that people creating significant content would receive the vast majority of earnings here.

But we aren't sure.  Things work differently in the lab than in the real world.  We plan to observe the system carefully and will revisit this if it's not the case.  (At that time, we'll have to tackle the question of how do you balance a perfect sonnet against a blog post...but I leave that for a different day).

I noticed Tom, you mentioned writing, do I need to ask if our photography is included in that original experience creation ?

I am curious about this to Diva.  I post a lot of photos, video and photo essays and would like to think that that is considered original and creative.

i too post a lot of photos video, does this count as orginal???

Hi DD- indeed, images and videos are included in original content creation.

I am pretty new to gather and love the new information.  Thank you Tom.  I am really enjoying being here and I love to read everyone's posts.  I also love being able to write different things and try to be creative.  I have been trying to figure out the point system and this answered my questions ~ thank you.

Welcome to Gather, AdamsMommy!  I am glad that you are enjoying the community and creativity here and that you are already sharing your own inspirations with others.

Please let me know if you have any questions on Gather Points.  You can also visit our help.gather.com group anytime with general Gather questions.

Awesome, and a long time coming, Tom. Thank you. I just wsh it were instituted while Barb C. and I were posting 2k word long stories...lol

Ha!  We will file this in the "better late than never" column, Donna.  I hope we can tempt you and Barb C back into the long form.  It's a dying art in the age of short attention spans.

(now excuse me while I go express myself in 148 characters or less) :-)

You know, I was thinking the same thing :)  But we can always write more!

APPLAUSE~on my footsies~SHOUTING BRAVO~WELL DONE TOM~  WELL DONE =D

ESpecially~

•    The primary focus of the points system will now be on original experience creation. 

Thanks Purrrrrrrrrrr.  I hope the new Gather Points program lives-up to your expectations.  Please keep me posted on what you think.

surely~ =)

I have the same question that Digital Diva has, will we accrue points for original photoss & videos or will it be just for written posts?

Tom just answered me and said yes photography is part of the original experience creation

Hi April.  We do reward as "original content creation" both photos and video.  (Thanks for the citation Digital D)

As a member and contributor since 2006, I am pleased to see the focus is on creating original, compelling content.  This adds much more value to the overall Gather experience with less need to sift through copy-and-paste junk.  Bravo!

Thanks Stacey!  We hope it will improve the overall Gather experience as well.  The goal is to reward original content creators like you and, as we do so, grow the Gather creative community at the same time.

In line with what April is getting at, I'm wondering how you plan to police images.  Eg, there are haters out there who routinely give me drive by 1s on every single photo I post.  What's to stop them from flagging my images and claiming they're stolen?  Every single item I've ever posted has been my own, but why should the burden of proof fall on *me* in the event that someone decides to be mean?

This concern aside, though, I think this is a good move.  Don't get me wrong.

Sherry --- have you thought about putting a copyright mark or some kind of watermark on your images?

Thanks Sherry.  We actually review every claim individually.  Our member services team can ususally recognize false flaggers.  We err on the side of believing people when they say they own content, unless it's clearly taken from another source or the flagger cites the original source so we can check it (which is often the case).

I don't think this will be a problem. When most people (myself included) report stolen images, we include a link to where the image is found on the net, usually multiple times.

But, I can see what you mean people doing it just to stir up trouble for a legetimate poster, but I think HQ can/will easily sort out the actual deliquents from the innocent bystanders so to speak :0)

So, Am I to understand correctly??? We do not make points for viewing other peoples posts, videos and pictures anymore? only for submitting original content? What point is there in submitting content if others by viewing are not going to make points and we are not also?

Hi Mary-

Thanks for asking.  Members earn content in two ways: by creating original content and by using Gather generally.  We have focused most points on original content creation, so fewer will be awarded for just using the site now.

Most people read content because they love the experiences they find here.  Our goal is not to pay people to use the site.  That's not a sustainable business model.  Our goal is to reward people that create exceptional experiences for others that make people want to come to Gather and join our community just for those experiences.

We want Gather points to encourage creativity and allow people more time to create.  It's our hope that those seeking other experiences will then find them here.

Tom said: "Members who publish content that they do not own (copied from other sources) will lose the ability to earn points on Gather.  Gather reserves the right to reclaim any points earned by that member for copied content posted to the site."

YAY!

Hopefully, interesting, original content will return to be the majority of the content found on Gather.

Thanks, Janna!  That's my hope, too.

I joined the group.

I wonder if Quality Over Quantity has been addressed in regards to Photography and if you will address it in relation to points?

My personal example would be my one or two quality photos that are cropped, usually edited  for color and contrast with a creative caption compared to someone who posts 45 photos of a kids party with no captions and half of the photos on their side instead of being upright.

Am I assuming right in guessing QUALITY will Gather more points than QUANTITY?

Digital Diva- we can't easily tell what a quality photograph is in an automated way.  This NYT article shows four professional shots, for example of the famous scene from Tiannanmen Square where someone stands before a tank.  Which is the better shot?  It depends a lot on who is viewing it.

We believe that consistent, growing readership/viewership is the best way to determine whether an author is creating content.  For example, if someone publishes a perfect photo each day, I am a lot more likely to add them to my feed than if someone publishes 500 photos that aren't interesting. We also plan to help educate our community on how to grow that consistent audience here.

This may require further adjustment and we will watch closely to see if that's the case.  Please keep us posted on how you experience things.

I was wondering this myself.  I try to post just a few photos that I think look good and will out captions.  I have noticed some tend to post scores of photos without captions or any sort of tag to let you know what the photo is about.

 Wow!! You just proved a Lot of folk wrong here Tom, and I am loving it!! I saw a few posts where some thought Gather gurus did not Listen. I think this shows that you Did! yay!! Now, to go find my muse, as she went on vacation without me. And I hope this POXES the person that posts 50 videos a day from the net, with no comments allowed.................... :)

Lol. penni.  Comments are allowed, you just have to be approved.  I don't comment as I hate seeing those little yellow boxes on my comment pages.

Thanks Penni!  We hope the new Points program will better meet the goals of the community.  I plan to spend a lot more time listening here, so you guys better get used to me :-)

 It is also important to point out that you are keeping some "point" generating secret, and changing point generation here and there, Tom. There will aways be some who know how to Play the "game" better than most.

 I never learned how to cut/paste... is that a GOOD thing,lol?

I would say so in this case!

Ha!  As long as you can dream and type, you are all set.

Tom, as someone behind the sidelines with the whole copyright theft argument, this bit: •    Members who publish content that they do not own (copied from other sources) will lose the ability to earn points on Gather.  Gather reserves the right to reclaim any points earned by that member for copied content posted to the site.

REALLY overjoys me. Thank you for listening to us and for rewarding those of us who go the extra mile to create ORIGINAL content!

I am glad to hear that, Jennifer!  We hope this will create a virtuous circle here: Good experience creation will bring more people to Gather.  More people will view more advertising.  More advertising viewed increases our points pool.  More points mean increasing incentives for good experience creation.

"virtuous circle" -- Hee hee hee! I love it.

While I appreciate the disclosure associated with these changes, I believe that members should temper their enthusiasm over some aspects of the information provided above.

First, removing the earnings cap will primarily benefit members that are already at the top of the earnings curve. Conversely, members that have a lower participation rate will now earn less for their activity. Thus, like some perceived aspects of the economy, the rich will get richer and the poor will get poorer. I'm not indicating that this is a negative change necessarily, but members should be cognizant of the new dynamic.

Second, The use of the word 'original' above is very misleading. Gather is rewarding content...not just original content. Software cannot accurately distinguish between an original piece of work taking hours to compose and something pulled off of the internet. Unless there has been a commensurate modification to Gather's Terms of Service and reporting policy, or someone is now manually assigning points, this change really isn't a shift away or towards anything different in the community.

Members can still publish 40+ posts a day consisting of nothing but email jokes and they can be rewarded at the same level for each post as an original poem or other work. Thus, I see no substantive change in how content is rewarded, based upon any of the information provided above.

 EEEKKK... I am curious as to how this comment will be answered, Kevin. HMMM....

Hmm ditto. Tom made it sound like there were measures in place to assure those 40 email forwards per day DON'T earn.

Hi Kevin-  we do expect to see a greater concentration of points.  This is by design.  Under the old, capped system, our best content creators were, in effect, subsidizing those that were not creating significant content.  This meant that we were under-rewarding our best contributors and over-rewarding others.  This change is meant to bring rewards in-line with value creation.

We have added technology that makes it easy for us to deactive member earnings with this release.  When we find a member who is simply reposting other peoples's content we will do so quickly.  This additional change will, we suspect, remove the incentive for reposting jokes.

That's not to say that we are anti-joke.  If Jay Leno wants to post original jokes here, I'll give him points.  If aspiring Jay's want to post their original content here (and it creates value for members), I am all for that, too!  Different experiences create different value for members.  We will allow the audience to speak and tune our algorithms over time.

We have updated our FAQs to reflect the new points earning policy.  Gather isn't obligated to pay points under our TOS, so we have not updated TOS.  I just wanted to take the opportunity to spread the word about the new policy here as well.

Thank you Tom.

So, changes have also been made today to the Terms of Service that now prohibit some previously allowed forms of content?

Also, members are now being asked to report content for copyright/fair use violations? (assuming the reporting member is not the original copyright holder)

I hope this demonstrates how our policy related to copied content has changed and how points allocation will, in fact, change meaningfully.  Please let me know if you have additional questions.

So will this not give as many points to the people who post "games"?  I can't stand those - How many words can you make that start with the letter l posts...

April,

From what has been stated above, games can earn just as much as any other content.

Tom,

I don't like berating a specific point (no pun intended). However while your new policy is clear, the procedure for identifying content that violates this policy is not clear at all.

The new verbiage in the FAQ states that you can remove points for content shared that is not owned by you. Thus, how will you be made aware of content that meets this criteria? Has the policy of Member Services now changed to allow members to report this content? ...and is this policy all-inclusive, in that members can now report all unaltered jokes, recipes or other content that violate copyright/fair use?

Thanks!

Wow... so the old Gather points system was essentially a form of socialism!  How interesting.  Totally off-topic, sorry, but interesting.

I for one applaud this change.  The more you contribute, the more you should be rewarded.  No more free Gather lunches!  ;)

I'm happy to see the changes that you're making, it's AWESOME!  And it should get rid of a lot of crap here, YAY for Gather!

Thanks Bridget!  I hope the overall experience will be much improved as a result.  Please keep me posted on your personal experience.

Bridget,

I agree that, in theory, this shift should allow for the removal of some content in the community that doesn't add value (ok...crap). However, no mention has been made of how that content is going to be removed, and what exactly it consists of.

Heather W. told me about this and I had to come by to see for myself. I am SO pleased! It would be awesome if some of the really good writers came back. I've always enjoyed Gather's community feel (well, not some of the people, but you'll get stinkers anywhere you go). I've stuck with Gather for a number of reasons, not the least of which were the wonderful friends I've made here.

I've always said the points were nice, but not the driving factor. I don't have a lot of readership (and don't really understand why), so tips on how to increase that would be most welcome.

Donna and I really did kick out the words when we were collaborating on our story. We did it before, and I believe we can do it again. We didn't have all that many people read, though. More readers would be awesome.

Congratulations on encouraging original content and writing. I'm a happy woman today. I hope it works out well in practice.

Thanks!

Thanks Barb (and thanks, Heather W, for spreading the word)!  I am glad you are still here and really do hope you and Donna will start sharing the big pieces again.  Perhaps we could create a long-form writing/reading group.

In any case, please join the earnmorepoints.gather.com group.  We plan to teach original content creators how to grow their audience there.

You're welcome Tom :0) I had to flutter off like a busy bee and let all those who hold this issue "near and dear" that you guys are (dare I say finally?) listening to us on this issue and to show how much we genuinely appreciate it.

I could care less about the rest of the things up there (okay they're important, but really they're paled by this fantastic addition). . . but you've really turned a 'crappy' day for me unto something to smile about.

I just hope you have your flame proof suit handy Tom, some of the natives are going to be really riled up over this and I'm sure the Bawww'ing articles will be many this evening :0)

I look forward to seeing this new change and hope it works well.  There will always be some people that don't like the change no matter what happens now.  Over the years I have watched Gather make many changes and no question some I liked and others gave me a big headache.

I joined in 2006 and there have been a lot of changes.  I'm looking forward to seeing more articles that are longer and hope to see more well written articles in the future.  I'll go join the group, as many people jump all over me when I use bad sentence structure or spell a word wrong.

I appreciate the feedback, Mary.  We do change things fairly often.  I hope that the Gather experience will grow in good ways from here. Please let me know what you think of the new changes.

so does this include those who post a sentence and then a link to a web site. Oh I sure hope so.

I am so looking forward to this new change. I don't care about the points thing. But to see gather become an original content driven site is amazing!

Hi Angela- We will look on a case-by-case basis.  Some members create real value citing interesting things and providing a short commentary (especially with YouTube videos embedded).

I am glad you are looking forward to the change!

This is absolutely some of the BEST news I've ever read here on Gather---thanks Tom!!! As a writer and novice photographer I constantly try to post new, original work and am thankful for my friends who recognize that. Good the hear Gather is now also ;-)

I am glad, Rose.  Let me know how the new system works for you. Please be sure to join the earnmorepoints.gather.com group if you would like to learn about making your work more widely viewed.

Tom, are you aware that you used the word "experience" in virtually every sentence you wrote (including followup comments) but not once did you define the term?  What the hell is "the Gather Experience"? Does it refer to writing, reading, commenting, looking, evaluating, reacting (i.e. giggling, crying or throwing up), or simply clicking on the site?

Also, I notice you didn't mention "quality" as a component of the point distribution system.  "Originality" is a fine objective, but I've seen some of the most godawful, misspelled, ungrammatical assaults on the language published here which are most certainly "original"... but so are the contents of my cat's litterbox.  Sure, they provide an "experience", but hardly a pleasant or productive one.  Is simply being the offal of some member's uneducated mind enough to warrant the same reward as a piece someone has taken the time to compose, proofread and edit?  Would you address this issue, please?

Thanks from the resident Grumpy Old Lady.

I agree that original and quality are not the same.  We have have six dozen 'original' whines and drama articles posted in no time.  Especially about the points changes.

Just because you don't agree with it doesn't make it comparable to your cat's litterbox.   Some members on site (myself included) have learning disabilities that may not make our writing as fantasic (or grammar or spelling) as yours Dame.   Plus you should consider educational levels and other factors.   I really don't like "uneducated" being used as a negative term.

As long as a member takes the time to create a reasonable length (i.e. one sentence articles need not apply) origional work, I see nothing wrong with them being rewarded as something written by a person who has the life experiences to create a masterpeice so to speak.

Hi Dame Ruth- nice to see you here.  I define experience broadly, mostly so that we can amend it over time as we learn from the process.  Today, we focus on content creation as experience creation.  Over time, we may include things like creating and moderating groups or even developing software that members use to do content sharing from the desktop or devices. Today, though, it refers to content creation.

On quality, we will have some learning and tuning to do.  Initially, we are going to consider factors like consistent readership/audience.  I suspect this will be just a first step.   Over time, we will probably weight other factors either in addition or in place to this one.  Since machines are not good at determining quality creative, we will need to experiment for a while before we get this right.

Just spitballing here, but how about selecting a member jury to vet posts for quality?  They could use a rating system that would correlate to points awarded (which was probably the intent of the original "rating" function, which should really be dismantled at this juncture) on an objective level.  You could reward members of the jury with points for their service, which would be limited to a relatively short term (anything from one day to a couple of weeks, depending on the volume of submissions to be evaluated) and perhaps divide them into specialties (writers, poets, photographers, videographers, fiction, essays, etc.) to lighten the load on the jury as a whole.  I think many members would be glad to volunteer anonymously, making the pool large and diverse enough to rate submissions fairly and equably.

If you like this idea, I'd be among the first to volunteer.  I bet Sandy would, too.

Well. you had to do somthin' I guess!

a change is as good as a vacation!~

Thanks. I hope this means you really are going to reward quality this time. (I'm afraid to get my hopes up. Please reassure me.)

Hi Sandy- we are going to experiment a lot here.  We will need to watch how points distribution works and tune things (see my Dame Ruth comment above).  We also need to consider whether content appeals to an audience of reasonable size.  Someone publishing an exceptional, yet inaccessible piece may not create as much value as someone writing a good, but broadly enjoyed one.

We have lots of thinking and exploring to do.  This is a first step, Sandy, and we'll continue learning with you.

Ok, Tom, I've looked through the comments and haven't found the answer to my question, so forgive me if you've already answered this and I didn't find it.

I have permission to reprint articles from a war venue, independent journalist.  It's one of the main reasons why I am here, to get his view to people.  I reprint, I add a lot of related information, links, maps, photos, and it usually takes me quite a while to put this together, some as much as most of the day.  Does this mean I won't get any points at all?  When I add a map or video, it comes from Google Earth or Google Maps, which, of course, link back to the original content and to the best of my knowledge is in the public domain.  There is no way I would be able to add my own pictures or videos from these areas.  It's important for me to add context to this journalist's stories so people can see what and where he is talking about. Sometimes I'll add a paragraph from a related news item with "continued" written in and a link attacked to view the entire item.  Plus I'll add include any articles on related information from Gather contributors by listing the article name and contributor name and link the information to their article.  Is any of this going to be a problem now?

Hi Cathy- no thats not a problem.  You may share anything on Gather that you own or have rights to share.

if you can prove that you have the permission to use that stuff and are creating a layout that adds to the experience, i don't think you should have a problem as long as you state that the works were used with permission from the original author.

Ok, that's great.  I have the permission, I state what I was asked to state at the bottom of the article, including links to his website.

Good, because this has always been important to me.  Thank you.

HOORAY!

Very happy to hear that the copy & pasters will not be earning points in the way they had been. Hopefully it'll drastically cut down on the 'junk' articles we have to sort through in order to find the good stuff!

Out of curiosity... if someone gets their points 'turned off', will they be alerted?