Part two of my holy crusade against people posting photos that are not theirs begins here.
The following are direct quotes, with names removed of course (to protect me from the oh so vauge 'harassment' flag), of real gather members feelings towards meanie poo heads like me who feel it is entirely wrong to post work that you yourself did not create.
"Uh, , I'm pretty sure THEY took it. You should ask before sayingsomething like that - that's not cool.
, that pic is absolutely unbelievable. "
"I believe that once something is in one's possession one can dowhatever one wants to do with said possession. "
"Whether they took it or not, are they not sharing it with the rest of us?"
"if they do state in their profile a valid reason asto why they cannot and they need the money i don't get overly upset. Ifmy photos could bring someone else money they need I am more than happyto share or give them to them. I am not greedy, I like to help peoplewho haven't been as blessed. "
Please please please for the love of all that is good and holy in this world tell me you people do not ACTUALLY believe these things?!
I'm not writing where I found the above quotes because if I did the people could get me flagged for harassment. I hardly see how pointing out llogical fallacies can be regarded as harassment, but apparently on here it is and in such, I can't tell you who or where. But if you're a smart cookie you could figure it out in under 10 minutes lol.
I really really don't get how people can see taking the hard earned money away from photographers just because "someone needs the cash" do you know how many times I have heard a shop lifter say "well. . . i didn't have any money. . and I really needed this" and how many times they STILL go to jail?
Heads up people, stealing is stealing, and theft is theft I don't care how you justify it.
I'm just glad that the majority of people on here (that have replied to my article and Angela M's) are smarter than the above quoted individuals.
It's been a long day at work and I come home to find more idiocy online.
I just don't get it. I wish it was okay for me to walk into Lowes, get a few dozen loads of stuff and walk out withouit paying. Because I really need to fix some things around the house. And since I need it, stealing it is fine right? and since it would be in my possession I could do whatever I wanted with it right? Maybe if i throw a party and share my new household stuff with some people it would be okay?
ahhh *pulls out hair*
I won't give up. . . I wish I knew of a good way to bring this to the Gather HQ's headquarters, and actually get them to care.
rate
email
print
link to this page
Comments: 112
This is currently a hot issue because of Cassie Edwards. She's lifted passages from research books for her romance novels. I tried to hold judgement until everything got sorted out, but the more I leaned the more guilty she looked. Didn't we learn this in kindergarten? If it's not yours, don't take it. Ask permission. My friend Rox found some really neat photos online that she posted here, but she emailed the photographer and asked permission and gave credit. In the end she gets a few points, but the photographer gets some valuable exposure because she's documented where the photos originated.
There's a right way to do this. Maybe we should all start flagging things for copyright violation.
Keep the fight, Heather! Not everyone on Gather has blinkers on.....
And speaking of Gather, the only way THEY are going to care is if someone whose work is posted here illegally contacts them - and threatens to sue. THEN they'd wake up. But at that point, they'd probably also come down TOO hard, and those of us posting legitimately would probably have extra hoops to jump just to get a picture posted.
I post only my own photos, the cartoons I write (drawn by my wife; we own the copyright jointly), and occasionally photos that a friend took, in which case I gave gotten permission and the photographer is credited.
Misty I am not sure about photobucket, i have two accounts there but that was back in the day before they were searchable, i just recently learned you could search people's accounts. I would say it's probably best to ask the owners of such pictures before hand in case they are unaware they are searchable.
A good rule: If it isnt yours then name your source...if you are not sure whether you should post it or whether its copyrighted then dont post.
Technically you do receive payment in the form of gather points so what Heather says could be very true. Continuing to do this could bring legal ramifications.
This way my butt is covered if said cheaters get all in a hissy
or maybe their mamma didn't learn them right (to put a shameless Appalachian phrase in LOL)
they are poems that two of my kids wrote and one that I gave my son when he
graduated from high school ( 2003 ) please check them out and let me know if this is the kind of thing thst your talking about... I thought that i was just sharing heart touched moments / not just copying others work... let me no please, thanks.
hope to see some of you on my comment page.
Gather adheres to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), and follows the same policy as LiveJournal, YouTube, etc. What this amounts to is that you can publish the work of others (writers, photographers and videographers) without penalty, and without the ability of the community to report said content. Unless you are the copyright holder, or their agent, Gather will take no action.
So, asking Gather to do something would be a lost cause. :-(
Kevin that is just crappy. You probably remember the person posting the copyrighted music that caused me grief last summer. I thought they went away but I noticed they were featured on the homepage a week or so ago. You would think gather as it claims to be a community of adults would hold itself to higher standards. I noticed the copyright violation flag has been removed from the report feature too, is that why?
Theresa I am not sure how that would work, but i know if i was an artist and saw that my work had been used to create something else without my permission I would be pretty upset, especially if i was trying to make a buck off the original. If someone read your book and formulated an idea from it, they should cite you as a source. In my classes at college we have to cite EVERYTHING (and since I have two majors and a minor all with different citation methods, I am fluent in MLA, APA, and Chicago style of citations) paraphrased, direct quoted, and so forth.
Use of another's work without citation / permission is wrong even if it is for a 'good cause'
Keep the original content coming! It is truly what makes Gather a special place!
Yes, that is why. However, to be fair, as Gather grows they probably wouldn't be able to handle the number of copyright complaints they would receive each day. When they allowed this type of reporting they struggled to keep up, and from what I understand many of these reports were erroneous...so I can see both sides of this argument.
to be fair???....WTF,Kevin?......there is NO FAIRNESS involved with members blatantly posting work belonging to others.....period ! There is no 2 sides to integrity,Kevin...sheesh!.....
so you are essentially telling all reading this BS that we have carte blanche to steal the work of others,post it and reap the pts. !....oh goodie....don't be surprised to see my latest Picasso on your freakin' site.....oh, and be sure to go to paypal to purchase it from me.....(gayle leaving stage left shaking her head and rolling her eyes yet again)
hey, members!....get to postin' your fave stolen images asap!....the official word so says Kevin is that it is A-OK to do so.....yippee!
cheers,gayle
Gather does tell you that you cannot post work that belongs to someone else without proper attribution and they do state that you must follow all copyright laws when publishing or using Gather services. The situation becomes rather murky though when violations exist and there is no means of addressing this except through the notification of the copyright holder.
regards,gayle
If the member reporting the content has clear evidence to support the removal of the content, then that would certainly pave the way for Gather to take some action. Although Gather would still need to validate the information provided, and work with the suspected violator to determine if they have the permission of the copyright holder (which they may). This takes time and effort that Gather cannot sustain (or chooses not to), especially when they are not required by law to do so. Thus the change in policy.
If you contact Gather and get a different response, please let me know.
cheers,gayle
If someone received information from Gather in December or November stating that members can report copyright violations with evidence, then Gather needs to provide clarification to the community on this subject. MaryAnne informed me last week that only the copyright holder or their agent can report violations. Hence, there is a wire crossed somewhere.
I'm not defending Gather. I am just trying to be objective, which sometimes is looked upon in the same way. I know exactly what you are talking about and I agree with you. If things get too far out of hand Gather will pay a steep price, but taking proactive measures to curb certain behaviors can be a very slippery slope that Gather doesn't want to start traversing at this point (evidently).
Suddenly I realise that my present icon is also not my work--took it fro FunOnTheNet where it did not mention the photographer but allows you to e mail the images to anyone.
I did mention where I got the image from, under it. Gayle, It seems someone is stealing your pictures?? I would hate to see you go!! I love all your work! Long time back I had planned to use one of your images, with your permission in a poem ..but it just did not get written and your image is still there , in my computer....not being posted anywhere, ever--as my work ;) Nor being sold!
Good Luck on this issue--hope Gather wakes up to the fact that it will lose very talented members if it cannot help them.
but what we are addressing here is Gather's new policy regarding CR violation of posting work not our own...they state a strong policy in their TOS and yet cancel that out saying what Kevin states above in the comments as being new policy....
essentially what is being said by Kevin in regards to his comprehension of this new policy is that any of us can steal away and post any work belonging to others without any ill consequences cause there is no policing in effect....
any attorney familiar with CR laws will tell you in a nano sec that you have grounds for not only a legal action against the offending poster,but to the site Inc. who took no action such as deleting the stolen work once reported....any site like this worth their salt have policies in place which help the community at large,not the reverse....
regards,gayle
So sad that Gather can't police their own site. Stealing is stealing, no matter how you deal the cards.
I get sick and tired of people who publish "stuff" just for the sake of a few measly points. For example: Those who take recipes out of a book and publish them.
Now I have a question. If I heard a joke while conversing with a bunch of my buddies, is it wrong to publish that joke? Many jokes have been floating around for years and years and if it is wrong to publish a joke, is it not wrong to tell the joke to a friend?
If this sounds a little sarcastic, I certainly don't mean it that way. I seriously would like an answer for I just published a joke without giving thought to this.
Tell us what you think.
We love getting feedback about your Gather experience. In fact, some great ideas for site enhancement have come from Gather members. If you have a suggestion, send it to feedback@gather.com. We're listening.
Have a question?
If none of our FAQs answers your question, we'll help you one-on-one. Just send us a detailed description of the problem you're having. We can help you faster if you provide the following information:
• What kind of computer do you use: Mac or PC?
• Which web browser do you use: Internet Explorer, Firefox, Netscape, etc.?
• What operating system is on your computer: Windows XP, Mac OS X, etc.?
Send your question and computer information to support@gather.com. We'll get back to you soon.
The paragraphs above have been cut and pasted from the gather "help" pages. A complaint or inquiry should be directed there.
Let's all try to be part of the solution, not part of the problem.
One of the first things we teach our children is NOT to steal. To blatantly post someone else's photograph and claim it as your own is wrong, TOS or no TOS. There are times within our lives when we must choose "to do the right thing" and in my opinion, posting known copyright protected images/photographs is one of those.
That said, I will say this. Some people have posted images early on in their participation here on gather, simply wanting to "share" said images and perhaps had no idea about copyright. heck, I've spoken to many individuals, publishers, and artists about it and am still learning though I certainly know more than I did say, 6 months ago.
Back to illustrations....many onsite (myself included) have used images found on the internet as illustrations for articles. This is one instance I have been told by authorities that it is OK to use them.....shaky OK but OK none the less. If you are asked about the illustration or you KNOW where it came from...(some have been sent to me in emails and such or are in an "image" file on my computer) then by all means, do the right thing and remove it.
To reiterate again....posting an image that someone used their God given talent to achieve and claiming it as your own is wrong no matter how you word it...PC or not. I would and have flag it for copyright violation and let the chips fall where they may.
~Elsie~i use to post on photo bucket until people started stealing my images you are not allowed to take images from photo bucket its in their tos. read it!
~Misty D the photos are public for you to enjoy not for you to take and do with as you wish.
I think there should be a copyright guide LOL someone who checks these reports and removes content
what is a member says in their profile the images are not theirs they are posting. should that member not be removed from gather they are clearly stating that they are stealing.
"Back to illustrations....many onsite (myself included) have used images found on the internet as illustrations for articles. This is one instance I have been told by authorities that it is OK to use them.."
This is incorrect. As a matter of law an illustration or graphic is treated the same as any other image or original/copyrighted work. As one example, using a licensed cartoon character in your article is a violation of copyright/fair use law...unless your article directly involves that character in some way (news report, review, etc.) Someone created that illustration in the same way that a photographer captured a specific image, and therefore maintains the rights to that creative work.
Unless YOU created the illustration you are using, you have received permission/rights to it, the site you pulled it from transfers the usage rights to you, or you are using it in accordance with "Fair Use" practices, you cannot include them in your article.
Some illustrations are like old jokes on the internet however...no clear copyright holder is evident, and therefore determination would be problematic at best.
Regardless though of the law, the issue is not what is right and what isn't (most of us know that stealing or using the work of others is wrong), but what members can do about it when it is encountered in the community. At the moment you can only report the person to the original copyright holder in the hope that they will then contact Gather. There is no longer the ability to report or 'flag' any content on Gather for copyright violations.
here on gather are both frauds. I flagged one because the image is on a web site now what will gather do turn their backs and a blind eye to this person who is clearly stealing. I bet the flag it removed soon but at least i did my part. I cant believe some people left those insane comments.
FYI....the source who gave me the information is in publishing and stated "artists do not have the time or inclination to bother those who use their minor work as illustrations on minor websites...." so does that pertain to gather? in your opinion of course, is this considered a minor website?
Whether some artists do not have the time to pursue violations on Gather is irrelevant. That's like saying it is ok to steal from someone as long as they are too old or infirmed to do anything about it...or ok to just steal 'a little'.
However, what you are being told is correct. It is highly unlikely that many would pursue the unauthorized use of their work here on Gather...until Gather establishes a much larger presence on the internet, or members begin profiting from their content in a more substantial way. All of which is also unlikely. :-(
Hate speech is a term for speech intended to degrade, intimidate, or incite violence or prejudicial action against a person or group of people based on their race, gender, age, ethnicity, nationality, religion, sexual orientation, gender identity, disability, language ability, moral or political views, socioeconomic class, occupation or appearance (such as height, weight, and hair color), mental capacity and any other distinction-liability. The term covers written as well as oral communication and some forms of behaviors in a public setting.
bahahahhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahhaa
guess this hit too close to homies home,eh?
And Kevin....MY official position is those who claim images as their own and accept accolades are in fact stealing someone's personal artistry...pure and simple. and you didn't answer my question either......care to weigh in?
I answered all questions relevant to this discussion/topic. Whether Gather is considered a 'minor' website or not has NO bearing on the subject at hand.
Hate speech is a term for speech intended to degrade, intimidate, or incite violence or prejudicial action against a person or group of people based on their race, gender, age,STUPIDITY, ethnicity, nationality, religion,lack of INTEGRITY, sexual orientation, gender identity,FABRICATED PERSONA, disability, language ability, moral or political views, socioeconomic class, occupation or appearance (such as height, weight, and hair color), mental capacity,LACK OF ETHICS, and any other distinction-liability. The term covers written as well as oral communication and some forms of behaviors in a public setting...
ya'll are just a bunch of haters who think INTEGRITY actually means sumptin'....see how you R ?.....hehehee
At least before, one could attempt to keep the place on the up & up but now we can't even flag copyright violation . . . and Gather need not slowly plod through them. If you're such a 'small' presence on the internet . . . why not have a couple of serious volunteers sift through the images . . . ? Hmmmm? It need not be a paid position, right?
And yet THIS article gets flag for . . . . ummmmm . . . harassment? LoL! Exquisite irony . . . harassing thieves is not permitted . . . just theft. Are you FRICKEN' KIDDING me???
Regards,
Doyle I <~~~~~
I'll be thinking on whether I want to continue posting my work here.
Regards,
Doyle I <~~~~~
By publishing something to Gather (anywhere) it has a basic level of copyright protection. We'll have to - on our own - be more vigilant about its usage. Flagging known violations is a good way to start.
I know a man who wrote a very funny cartoon, copyrighted it, and posted it on the web. Then he tracked it (he is very smart like that) and sent a bill to everyone who used it for their own purposes. He said it gave him a lot of satisfaction and a very nice income.
Thanks for letting us know about this Heather.
It is illegal to use other's work. Period.
I won't post any more of my photos that I consider "marketable" if they are not going to be protected here.
Don't think that artists, musicians, etc. won't sue you for copyright infringement. Yes, they will. Have you ever looked at the amount of money you would be liable to pay? It is in the thousands of dollars. I know someone who posted a video on youtube that got fined $30000. Most celebrities give you a warning first to remove the content and if you ever are requested to stop or remove something, you really should do so immediately or you'll end up in the same shape as that person did.
A few months ago, I had one of my connections publish one of my poems as his own. I discovered it quite by accident, for he was foolish enough to post it to a group that I own. I was reading the new material posted, and when I started to read this particular poem, my first thought was..."Wow...this sounds very familiar." By the time I had read a few lines I knew it was mine. I can't tell you how livid I was that he would have the gall to do this. I did report this to Gather and it was easy to prove I was the original writer, since I had posted the exact poem only a few months before on Gather. I also wrote him and told him what I had discovered. He apologized and removed it...saying he only did that because he liked it so much. (NOT an excuse for plagerism).
Anyway, I do know it would be nearly impossible for Gather to keep up with all copyright violations on the site, but it would be nice if they could.
It'd be nice if they'd only TRY.
Regards,
Doyle I <~~~~~
To whomever flagged this: Guess what buddy, you didn't achieve anything. This article is staying, I'm going to figure out who to talk to about getting the flag removed and I am still going to flag, down rate and report any stolen images I find on here. You've just added fuel to my fire.
I'm sorry, but I will not post anything else on gather. I don't know all the details of the DMCA, which sounds a lot like a corporate cover your ass, but I do know copyright law. I was a recording engineer and producer in a home studio that produced some award winning song writing competitions. I used to help artists copyright material everyday.
If it says " Copyright 2008 - Chip Davis - All rights reserved" that means what it means. You are NOT allowed to do anything with my work be it written, photographic, video or recordings without my permission. IF you DO, I have the right to sue the hell out of you and I will. Count on it.
This applies to everyone here on gather. If you post your work as Copyrighted by you, it IS. If someone else steals it, Hire a lawyer, sue Gather, have them subpoena the person who store your work, sue them and let them both pay you mega bucks plus court costs. It's your work, fight for it. PERIOD.
I suggest anyone who makes a living taking photographs, writing, video or anything else, take it off Gather NOW. Protect your work if GATHER will not stand behind you.
Screw Gather, protect yourself. It's YOUR work. (I've been here before with gather and I will fight them again with all my being if I have to, bet your ass on that.
I have over 40 DVDs and another hundred or so CDs of my photos and art that no one else has ever seen and from what I have seen written here no one will probably ever see...I will burn them before I let a thief have them or use them for their own gain...I spent many hours of my time working on them...if any one should profit from them it should be me not some slacker who can't open his own fly without guidance from another person...if you don't have the ability to create then stealing isn't creative work...
Removing my work as it is not protected by anything around here...not going to post any more of my stuff for others to steal...
:O\
I am not a writer nor aspiring photographer so this doesn't have a direct effect on me, however many of my friends/connections who post here are and in fact some have left the site in the past several months because of the shenanigans that are routinely carried out on this site by other members.
Hmm, let me amend that, I guess it does directly affect me because I have lost some good connections to this issue.
It is hard to be the one yelling it from the roof tops..and usually the one pointing out the wrong doing gets the most crap for it.
BUT there is only so much you can do before it ruins your time here on gather. Plus there really is no real sure fire way to stop people from using others work. You can only say and do so much.
Way to go so far though, Heather!
Regards,
Doyle I <~~~~~