• Home
  • Friends
  • Groups
  • Share

SIGN IN | HELP
newamericanstory.gather.com
  • group home|
  • featured|
  • posts|
  • photos|
  • videos|
  • members
by Reza Aslan
Member since:
March 23, 2007

The Face of America to the Muslim World

April 02, 2007 02:45 PM EDT (Updated: April 03, 2007 04:06 PM EDT)
views: 595 | rating: 8.8/10 (46 votes) | comments: 254

As an American, a writer, a scholar, and a Muslim I take seriously Senator Bradley's exhortation for all Americans to accept the "creative responsibility inherent in citizenship" and strive to rebuild the international image of this country in the wake of President Bush's disastrous leadership. Everyone knows that the last six and half years of arrogant unilateralism and unconsidered belligerence has totally shattered America's image, especially in large parts of the Arab and Muslim world. At no other time in American history has there been a more urgent need for all of us to work together to communicate American values and traditions to all nations. So, in the spirit of taking up Senator Bradley's challenge, and in light of our dwindling image in the Middle East, I think it is time for American Muslims to become the face of America to the Muslim world.

Muslims are now the largest religious minority in the United States. And yet the American Muslim community, while infinitely diverse in its faith, practice, ethnicity, and political persuasion, has for the most part managed to avoid many of the problems of identity and integration that are currently plaguing Muslim communities throughout Europe. This is partly due to the fact that the majority of European Muslims come from impoverished immigrant families who have formed insulated ethnic communities cut off from the rest of European society, while the majority of Muslims in the United States are either middle class converts (primarily African-Americans) or educated immigrants from a wide array of ethnic backgrounds. America's long and storied history of assimilation and multiculturalism tends to prohibit the formation of insulated communities, meaning American Muslims are united less by their individual ethnic identities, than by a shared political and cultural ideal (one that we could simply call "Americanism"). It is precisely this shared sense of national identity, coupled with the socio-economic advantages of living in the United States, that has made American Muslims far more resistant to the pull of jihadism than their European counterparts. As such, American Muslims are ideally suited to become the public face of the United States to the Muslim world.

From my discussions with American Muslim organizations and individuals, I can say with confidence that Muslims in the U.S. are indeed eager to play an active role in counteracting the influence of bigotry and extremism in their faith. Unfortunately, thus far there has been little attempt by this Administration to seriously harness the creative energies of the American Muslim community. This is too bad. Because while American Muslims would have no way of reaching, let alone converting hard-core jihadists who view us all as apostates, we can still represent the freedoms of faith and conscience for which America is revered in all parts of the world.

That's because the majority of Muslims, while enraged at American foreign policy, nevertheless accept the fundamental principle for which America stands: constitutionalism, popular sovereignty, government accountability, pluralism, and human rights. By engaging moderate Muslim groups, foundations, parties, and individuals to promote shared values like human rights, pluralism, rule of law, and democracy, American Muslims can play an active part in facilitating the development of an effective ideological counterweight to jihadism. After all, the war on terrorism is, as the President repeatedly reminds us, a war of ideology. But one cannot win an ideological battle solely with guns and bombs. On the contrary, the only way to defeat an ideology of hatred and fanaticism as defined and spread by Muslim terrorists and extremists is with an ideology of hope and tolerance as defined and spread by Muslim moderates and reformers. Unfortunately, while the jihadists have at their disposal the absolute attention of the worldwide media and a nearly endless supply of funds from wealthy Saudi backers (many of whom remain unaccountable to the Saudi government), moderate Muslims, who have little money or media attention, have thus far been unable to make themselves heard. That's why we need the full backing of the government. The U.S. must do whatever it can to give moderate Muslims the tools to develop and foster their own ideologies of peace, tolerance, democracy, and pluralism. Then maybe the New American Story, which now includes some 6-8 million American Muslims, might have chance of reaching the Muslim world.

 

Reza Aslan is the author of No God But God, published by Random House.

view all photos
You need the latest Adobe Flash Player.
Install the player now
Expand Tags: islam, religion, foreign policy, americas role in the world, muslims, the new american story, politics
Expand To Groups: The New American Story, Gather Politics Essential
rate

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

8

9

10
email
print
link to this page
Paste this link into an email or IM
Bookmark this post:
Facebook
Twitter
Delicious
Buzz
More

Comments: 254

Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 3:09pm EDT
How about Muslims strive to rebuild their image in the world? Not nearly enough of you have stood up against the fundamentalists. Your silence is deafening.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Paul G. Apr 2, 2007, 3:18pm EDT
Reza:
Welcome. I commend and congratulate you for your enlightened and ambitious proposal. American Muslims should, indeed, be provided with more opportunities to speak out, both to their fellow Americans and their fellow Muslims world-wide.
Our Muslim brothers and sisters have suffered unjustly at the hands of bigots and hate-mongers far too long now. Having travelled in the Middle East I know full well that like other peoples all over the world, the vast majority of Muslims are kind, compassionate, and have to the same kinds of hopes and aspirations that non-Muslim Americans and other Westerners do. I wish you success in your efforts to counteract some of the perverse stereotypical thinking that is abroad about America and its Muslim minority.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 3:40pm EDT
Paul - that's just a nice way of saying your silence is deafening.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Reza Aslan Apr 2, 2007, 3:54pm EDT
Don. I would suggest that if you are not hearing the overwhelming chorus of condemnations of violence coming from Muslims around the world, then you're not listening hard enough.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Josh J. Apr 2, 2007, 3:59pm EDT
I look and listen frequently, but find little of this overwhelming chorus you speak of. I would like nothing more than the American Muslims to stand and speak out, but I get a sense that they either dont believe that they should, or, they are afraid to do so.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Reza Aslan Apr 2, 2007, 4:05pm EDT
Josh. Have you tried reading the announcements or monitoring the activities of say... the Muslim Public Affairs Council, the Fiqh Council of North America, the Council on American Islamic Relations, the Muslim Council of Britain, the Islamic Commission of Spain, the Canadian Society of Muslims, the Grand Muftis of Russia and Saudi Arabia, the Grand Imam of Al-Azhar University in Cairo, the Grand Ayatollahs of Germany and Iraq, the Muslim Brotherhoods in Egypt and Jordan, or the Supreme Court of Afghanistan? Have you read the joint fatwas against violence issued by Sunni and Shiite clerical leaders in Iraq, the Amman Declaration (issued by 170 imams representing every sect and schism in Islam), or the Mecca Declaration signed by the world's leading Wahhabist clerics? Have you tried a simple google search?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 4:28pm EDT
I do find what they say scary...

This is from Canadian Society of Muslims

Muslim Brotherhoods is where Al Qaeda comes from and the DO support the Palestinian efforts against Israel.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Josh J. Apr 2, 2007, 4:43pm EDT
That is scarier than not finding anything. Alot of the groups that you mention claim peace but preach Jihad.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Reza Aslan Apr 2, 2007, 5:00pm EDT
You couldn't be more wrong, Josh. Open your mind. And Don, to state that al-Qaeda came from the Muslim Brothers is like saying the Republicans came from the Whigs. It is just absurd. Al-Qaeda is actively fighting against the Muslim Brothers. Please gentlemen, eschew these simplistic dichotomoies and delve into the complex religio-political structures of the Muslim world.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 5:33pm EDT
Well, at the very least, Muslim Brotherhoods do support violence against Israel, and their mission is to rule over the 'Muslim World'. Dedicated to the credo: "God is our objective, the Quran is our Constitution, the Prophet is our leader, struggle is our way ..." They seek to install in stages an Islamic Caliphate across the Muslim world.

It's just antithetical to American thinking, and this is precisely the reason why we don't hear the "overwhelming chorus of condemnations of violence coming from Muslims around the world."
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Paul G. Apr 2, 2007, 6:36pm EDT
Yo, Don:
I wonder. When are you good conservatives going to stand up against the radical neo-con, hate- and fear-mongering evangelo-fascisst.
YOUR silence is deafening.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Steve Y do I even bother Apr 2, 2007, 6:48pm EDT
Reza, while I do not profess to be an expert on Islam or Islamic fundamentalists I have to disagree with your comparison involving the Muslim Brotherhood and Al Qaeda. Zawahiri was directly associated with the original movement in Egypt, and has never changed his 'direction' since that time, only expanded his means. For all intensive purposes, Al Qaeda spawned from that movement.

While you, and many others would like to blame the Middle East anger on Bush and the past six years, the underlying disdain by the fundamentalists has been present for many year prior to even his father taking the office of VP. Not that I am faulting you and Senator Bradley for jumping the 'blame Dubya' bandwagon, but it is a bit disingenuous when you look at the past 30+ years of history as far as terrorism is concerned.

2 cents deposited
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 7:06pm EDT
Paul - when was the last time they drove planes into buildings, or strapped bombs to themselves and blew up in the middle of a crowd of innocents?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Ben O. Apr 2, 2007, 8:15pm EDT
Being a devout but fairly informed agnostic, I believe that the Quran is being corrupted and misinterpreted by the radical imams who incite terrorism in any of its abhorrent forms, much as the Christian religion has by the radicals in the Midwest (dare I say the White House). I find it odd that people who profess a belief in God (the Judeo/Christian/Moslem one) want to kill each other. My sense is that God wouldn't be very happy. I find hope in the stories and comments of Hassan Butt and Irshad Manji. I have to believe that these two could have a major impact on the outsider's perception of Moslems around the world.

As for what all of us outside the Middle East do about it? I think that you, Reza, Mr. Butt and Ms. Manji are on the right track from your side of the issue. I think that the rest of us have to examine our behavior. Why is it that we can't seem to remember Abraham Maslow and his hierarchy of needs: physiological, security, belonging and esteem. The Judeo/Christian politic has been one of oppression for the Palestinians in particular. We can no longer control populations by starvation and brutality. It is a sad state of affairs when one has to admit that imperialism is alive and well in the West.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 8:48pm EDT
Ben D Over I presume.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Paul G. Apr 2, 2007, 9:36pm EDT
Touche, Don! I'm afraid methods like those aren't quite subtle enough for your ilk. They prefer to turn entire countries into hotbeds of murder, mayhem and chaos, and they do it surprisingly well too, considering their clearly demonstrated ineptitude at managing anything more complex than rolling Easter eggs on the White House lawn.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 2, 2007, 11:49pm EDT
Paul, what are you talking about? Oh.. .you mean all of congress and America in general, which I suppose includes you and I. Collectively, we made the decisions.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Maya R. Apr 3, 2007, 12:23am EDT
Reza,

This is an incredibly well-written article and I enjoyed it. I appreciate your insight and also would like to commend you on your responses in these comments.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Eddy G. Apr 3, 2007, 12:39am EDT
Well isn't this fun, we have our first attempt by Liberal apologist united with Muslim intellect to convince us that pigs indeed do fly! Gentleman nobody gives a rats ass what what the Imans say its what they do that matters and frankly they aren't saying or doing anything other than in support of their brethern.
The problem with this whole discourse is that we fail to notice the one fundemental truth where Raza or any other devoutly religious person is involved, when they describe themselves their faith always precedes their nationality!
Muslim American, Black American, save us from the excuses, If you are not American first then gentlemen we have a problem and that's exactly our founding fathers gave us seperation of church and state.
Muslim Americans are Muslim first and therein lies our problem, the very basis of the Koran is Jihad and the road to Heaven lies along that self same road, to say we must seek to understand and accept this tenet is abhorrant to our very nature.
The last time we heard similar stupidity was when Herr Gobbels was trying to explain the nazi invasion of warsaw, it didn't work then and it won't work now.
I submit that if the Muslims who now live in America were truly Americans their brothers and sisters in the faith would have had and would continue to have an impossible time organizing their attacks on our soil.But in reality the Muslim community is a closed and restrictive community that supports religion first,family second,and nationality last.
This is the beginning, the power of the internet has been discovered and a new face is being presented to all of us but guess what its just a costume, if we are to judge a man we as Americans must judge him by his actions not his words.
Raza you may be a wonderful person but I can only judge your Muslim brothers by their actions or inaction as it were and dear sir since 9/11 the stench of those actions are sickening.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 3, 2007, 1:44am EDT
Eddy G - I read every word and it was well stated, and obviously I agree.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Paul G. Apr 3, 2007, 7:10am EDT
You got THAT right, Don (about the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld cabal having made accomplices out of all of us, complicit in their insane, fraudulent and bloodthirsty war). The difference between us is, I actually feel MY share of guilt and contrition over it. The question now is, what are those of us who do have a fully functional conscience going to do to put the brakes on this misadventure, before the maniacs in the West Wing drag us any further into their wading pool of blood and gore.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 3, 2007, 12:56pm EDT
"what are those of us who do have a fully functional conscience going to do"

You must be talking about people like me. Um, we are going to do what is right and finish the job. We are not going to just cut and run. Withdrawal would be the worst thing we could do at this point.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Nick S. Apr 3, 2007, 1:39pm EDT
"I submit that if the Muslims who now live in America were truly Americans their brothers and sisters in the faith would have had and would continue to have an impossible time organizing their attacks on our soil."

So then what about Oklahoma City? Was the white community shut off from the rest of America? Shouldn't they have had an awfully hard time to commit their terrorism?

Committing terrorist actions does not require a community, but only an individual or a small group of individuals.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 3, 2007, 6:20pm EDT
gwow... you found the exception to the rule.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Nick S. Apr 3, 2007, 8:14pm EDT
" gwow... you found the exception to the rule."

No. The Unabomber, Tokyo, '96 Olympic bombings, etc are all generated by largely isolated individuals who have been influenced very little by their community and the communities generally have no knowledge. I can't find anything about the 9/11 hijackers, but I believe they isolated themselves from the public community.

I've never done a complete study of terrorism, but there are many instances of single actions. It appears as though when single actions are involved they are done by small groups with limited knowledge from the outside community. Only when there are much more attacks that occur regularly, like in Ireland or Iraq, are the communities aware and actively involved. That is, afterall, the reason they have the ability to carry out frequent attacks.

Given that we've only had a handful of attempts by Al-Qa'ida in the past 15 years shows how little influence that the Muslim community has on helping Al-Qa'ida. Ireland, Iraq, etc have taught us, if anything about our own Muslim community, it's that they are deterring additional attacks.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 3, 2007, 8:17pm EDT
Self hating ignoramus... go away.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Nick S. Apr 3, 2007, 8:38pm EDT
" Self hating ignoramus... go away."

What's with people that have to attack individuals rather than their ideas, thoughts and arguments? I'll always be here. Why don't you leave and come back when you can stop acting like a child and actually debate with real arguments rather than attacking me?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 3, 2007, 9:26pm EDT
Your ideas are ignorant. You can't even see Islamic terrorism for what it is. You'll make excuses and point to rare instances and ignore the obvious. As Bob Grant used to say "Get off my phoneeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!". lol
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Nick P. Apr 3, 2007, 10:18pm EDT
"You can't even see Islamic terrorism for what it is. "

That's not the issue at hand. Quit trying to change the subject.

" Your ideas are ignorant."

How so? You can't just say it's wrong and then it's so. Care to argue against what I've said rather than just bash it?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Eddy G. Apr 3, 2007, 10:34pm EDT
Nick if you see no difference between Oklahoma City and 9/11 you have travelled far beyond anyplace logic can reach, if you believe Reza and his brothers were then and are now unknowing of what was and is to come in their Jihad then perhaps I can recommend a good book to read? How about What is Sex by former president Billy "Big Stoogie" Clinton with a foreward by Hillary " Dominatrix in Chief ".
When a Muslim defies Jihad heads roll, thus the deafening silence from all those fine organizations mentioned by the author.
How many Muslim Clerics or Imans have you seen on the evening news or in your paper railing against the Ayatollas or Al Quida ? The answer is nada, its easy to Baffle with Bullshit, But to Dazzle with Brillance takes a bit of guts.
And for Reza isn't it wonderful to be able to extol the anger and outrage of your brothers in regards to the foreign policies of your nation, if you did that in Iran you'd wake up to a grinning wild eyed moron spouting Allah is good while he beheaded you and your well educated family or did you forget thats what you came here to avoid?
Ain't life here with the infidels grand? But then not to worry why would a snake pluck out its own eyes.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Nick S. Apr 4, 2007, 2:08am EDT
" Nick if you see no difference between Oklahoma City and 9/11 you have travelled far beyond anyplace logic can reach"

I was drawing parallels about the surroundings of those attacks, not the attacks themselves.

"if you believe Reza and his brothers were then and are now unknowing of what was and is to come in their Jihad"

Reza and his brothers are not part of a Jihad (not the one you're thinking of anyway) so quit trying to label it their jihad unless you feel like presenting proof that they are all terrorists.

I'm saying they are unknowing, largely, of the details of threats that OTHERS in the community possess to the American public. Again, how public were the lives of the 9/11 hijackers? How could the Muslim community be aware of their intentions if they didn't even know the persons existed?

"How many Muslim Clerics or Imans have you seen on the evening news or in your paper railing against the Ayatollas or Al Quida ?"

I've seen plenty of clerics and Islamic scholars bash al-Qa'ida. Hell, even Nasrallah has condemned al-Qa'ida and the like.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3059365.stm
https://www.islamfortoday.com/khan09.htm
https://www.islamfortoday.com/shaheen01.htm
https://www.islamfortoday.com/adi03.htm

It goes on and on. Just because they aren't on Fox, doesn't mean they aren't happening.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Don (is it 2010 yet?) H. Apr 4, 2007, 2:25am EDT
nick - the truth comes out.. you think we're all Fox hounds.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
a g. Apr 4, 2007, 11:05am EDT
hey welcome to gather.i have heard ur views on CNN many times..u are regular there..anyway i look forward to reading more of ur articles..
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Greg Schiller Apr 4, 2007, 1:15pm EDT
Blaming "Bush" makes ignoring the problems of the world, so easy.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
zeinab m. Apr 4, 2007, 1:15pm EDT
hey
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
zeinab m. Apr 4, 2007, 1:23pm EDT
your essay is great.but how did you know that Muslim Americans want to play an active role to clarify the image of Islam?On the contrary ,most of them forget about their religion and attack Islam ,some others are passive ,they don't attack Islam ,they don't defend it.Most American Muslims are proud because of being American rather than of being Muslim.Am I pessimistic?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Diana Raabe Apr 4, 2007, 1:31pm EDT
After reading some of these uneducated comments, I can understand why moderate Muslims may hesitate to speak up. It is exactly this kind of narrow-minded, exclusive thinking that stills the voice of the minority.

Globalization is not going away. Our melting pot is already melted. Wake up and listen to your brothers.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Diana Raabe Apr 4, 2007, 1:33pm EDT
Excellent piece.

Two pennies hitting the bottom of the jar...
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
LA R. Apr 4, 2007, 1:54pm EDT
Mr. Aslan -

First, let me say this is a great opinion piece. Second, let me point out that America's face in the extremist Muslim world (those who were a danger to us on 09/11/01 and continue to be a danger) has been scarred for many years before Bush came into office. We cannot forget the USS Cole, though the scars were there before Clinton as well.

I think an important piece of this puzzle is what caused the scars in the first place. From my understanding, it is because we are Christian and, put very simplistically, free. It is religion that is the root of this problem, not politics. That being said, I am not ignoring the fact that placing troops in the Mideast has caused a decline in the view of America. I am just not sure how much of a decline has resulted - are you more aware of that sentiment? If so, please do share it.

Third, you write, "I think it is time for American Muslims to become the face of America to the Muslim world... thus far there has been little attempt by this Administration to seriously harness the creative energies of the American Muslim community. " I understand that the "moderate Muslims" of whom you speak may not have the media platform or the money to state their supportive case for America, but I do have to believe that, if even a small group were to call CNN or another news outlet, they could have their platform without cost. Are there enough people that fit this description to make it happen? I believe you are correct - there are.

What is the reason they are not reaching out? The announcements and activities you mentioned are certainly admirable, but I think you also know that those are not what is going to catch the spotlight. In addition, what are those groups doing to reach out to the media in the Mideastern countries... where it really matters?

Thanks again for this piece - it is certainly an issue that is ripe for discussion.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 1:56pm EDT
I was in Indonesia (The largest population of Muslims in any country) and they were telling me about how they are having more problems with Muslims turning to radical Islam because of Bush.

The leaders there supporting the War against terrorists and working with the US to fight them at home, then we gave up support for their efforts to engage Iraq instead. Not only were they (being the people of the country) offended we stopped working with them seriously, but they were offended by our disregard for the differences in religious stances and cultures of Islam around the world. The leaders still support Bush, but the people are protesting and actively against them now. It didn't help that Bush's visit cost them (not us) 700,000 USD in a impoverished country for him to land. He didn't end up using the landing pad they made, he landed in a field I believe.

The disregard for Islam in our propaganda and our actions has only stirred the pot, not cooled down the rough edges. Our Christian Fundamentalists (who are just as crazy as the Mulsim version) are regarded as a serious voter base and not as a threat to freedom (here and abroad), as they should be.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 1:57pm EDT
What is your opinion of the CAIR Mr. Alsan?

How do you justify Sharia Law and treatment of women Mr. Alsan?

My largest problem is......

How do you explain Al-takeyya Mr. Alsan.
For any who don't know it's an Islamic principal that justifies and encourages Muslims to lie.

They can use Al-takeyya in certain circumstances:
To Spread Islam
To Protect one welfare
To Reconcile Quarrels
To appease ones spouse

Think of all the little tiny white lies you have told and got caught in them? If I or anyone else get caught in a lie I/you confess the truth. I Don't know anyone who would stand by an obvious lie.

How many would fit into one of these circumstances where you wished it would be ok to lie to win a qurral, to promote you own agenda, to protect yourself.

Mr. Alsan, is Al-takeyya still ok if someone else gets hurt if you lie to protect yourself?

In most western culture a business deal, transactions, bets, even greetings are sealed with a hand shake.Honsety is above all things and is part of the very fabric of society.

A tiny white lie can destroy a honest mans entire professional reputation giving the man a questionable character.


Or how about Mr. Alsan Zawag Al-Mutaa.........Do you support that?
Once again for any who don't know it means "marraige fro pleasure."

It can last for an hour or a month or whatever.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Diana Raabe Apr 4, 2007, 1:59pm EDT
Lauren,

Do you really think it's that easy to get on CNN? (Just wondering!)
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Jennifer M. Apr 4, 2007, 2:02pm EDT
Great article! I also think that people of *all* religions need to counteract the influence of "bigotry and extremism in their faith."
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
LA R. Apr 4, 2007, 2:02pm EDT
Diana -

I probably did make it sound too simple the way I crafted that sentence. Thanks for calling me on that.

To answer you question, though, I do think a small group who wanted to get out a message that would be so powerful could find a twenty second spot on a major broadcast. I guess my main point is that if there are people who want to get their word out about a message so important to Americans, there are ways to do it. Newspapers, local news, etc.

All of that aside, it is amazing what gets on cable news on a slow news day!
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:23pm EDT
Did the radical Muslims in Munich(1972 Olympics murder Israeli athletes because of GW? Was the 1979 Iranin US Embassy take over because of GW?
Was the kidnapping of US citizens in Lebanon in the '80's because of GW?
What about the bombing of other embassies, Marine Barracks, the USS Cole, the poor old jewish man on a cruise who was thrown overboard, IN HIS WHEELCHAIR, by radical Muslims, was that because of GW? TWA flight 847 and Pan Am flight 103, those folks were killed by Muslim extremists because of GW?

GW was in office LESS THAN A YEAR when the parasitic muslim extremists massacred 3,000 people on 9/11. And for WHAT reason? Because they hated GW?

I don't think so. The liberal left is so willing to hate GW and will believe anything to skew the truths of radical Islam/Muslims.

When Muslims protest with signs in London saying DEATH to ALL who don't FOLLOW
and BEHEAD the Infidels....and I DON'T SEE ANY from the Muslim community rallying AGAINST such vile verbage.

When Imams SUE an airline and the passengers for not being allowed to fly....because of THEIR BEHAVIOUR (not who they were) it was their BEHAVIOUR that got them kicked off, what the hell do you THINK a normal person is to think?

Riza, why don't you go and live in Afghanistan or Iran or Iraq or some other crappy third world Muslim hell hole. Bring your wife and daughters (in you have them) see what happens in the REAL Muslim world.

And all you liberals that support the Muslims and their faith, keep in mind, Gays get STONED and or beheaded. Women are a commodity and treated as such.

And Mr. Aslan, when the Muslim community can start to LOVE their children MORE than they hate their enemy, maybe, just MAYBE things will turn around for the better. But as long as they continue to strap bombs on their children and teach hate to their children, the Islam/Muslim community will get NO respect from me.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:28pm EDT
BRAVO CINDY!!!!
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Ian M. Apr 4, 2007, 2:29pm EDT
A muslim and I kissed. That's all I know of muslims.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:30pm EDT
http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.jsp?articleId=281474976950039
I just published an article...

"Mr. Radical Was The Icing On The Cake, The United American Committe Rally Against Islamofascism Was A Great Success"
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Mariana T. Apr 4, 2007, 2:30pm EDT
Welcome to Gather, Riza. Salud.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Diana Raabe Apr 4, 2007, 2:31pm EDT
Lauren,

I will say that when Mr. Aslan spoke in Minneapolis he received a standing ovation, and I look forward to hearing more from him and others like him.

P.S. (You're SO right about the cable thing!!)
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
guy arneson Apr 4, 2007, 2:31pm EDT
Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Jew

Cosmic Father in the sky.
Does Mother earth have to die?

This pseudo war on terror.
They propagate such fear.
Peace on earth with a bomb.
The evidence is clear.

Profiteers, puppeteers,
their articles of sin.
The planets slowly dieing,
from a cancer deep within.

The innocent they murder,
in the name of war.
Will turn the world against them,
until democracy's no more.

People crying, people dieing,
Muslim, Christian, Jew.
Peace on earth with a bomb
and only just for who?

And there are those, although a few.
Who kill with alibi.
Carnal man has sold his soul,
In the twinkle of an eye.

Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Jew.
A Holy Jihad, so say the few.
They're lost in a world of nothing but sin.
Their life is a lie, their trapped from within.

They are Architects of evil ...
And Dictators of death ...
And when every one is gone,
they'll be no puppets left.

This Dark Democracy
that stands at the door.
Is for world domination
and the suppression of poor.

The Garden of Eden
was the intended dominion.
Mankind knows nothing.
It's just his opinion.

Money and greed,
his carnal desire,
He's destroying the planet,
the poor things on fire.

You gave them life,
your creation a gift.
They want to destroy it,
not give it a lift.

And this decree is for those who see,
Your demise is just ahead.
The final act is World War III
That's all that need be said.

© Copyright 2006 guyarneson
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Ian M. Apr 4, 2007, 2:31pm EDT
It was a peck on the lips. Real unity there.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 2:31pm EDT
Cindy you are way off mark. The point is that GW was supposed to protect us from terrorists, right? He has made it worse, not better.

Our, American, foriegn policy has been bad for decades because some people don't care about other people in the world ("parasitic").
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:36pm EDT
There's alot more to Know than that Ian.

Just google Islamofascism on the web and on images.

See for your self what the religion of peace does for their god BECAUSE heir god says to do thoes things. SEEING IS BELIEVING if you would, and if you have time, just go to Youtube.com and simply type in UK Undercover/ Dispatches (undercover Mosques).

once you watch the first clip you won't be able to NOT watch the rest of them. People pose as muslims then record the radical speeches.

Same thing with-
I, a muslim (Undercover as a Muslim in Europe - Part 1)-Full title

If you dont hav the time and just want to see a few clips of the state Europe is in right now....type in -Islam in Europe

You'll get such titles, by Europeans themselves, as....

Islam in Europe- Theo Van Go was beheaded for reveiling these FACTS

Radical Islam in Europe- Police in London, France, Netherland and more give their accounts of everyday life in countries being over run by Muslims who set cars on fire then ambush the Firemen and Cops when they get there.

Full Titles Below-Not one of these are from the U.S.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fruit Of Islam In Europe. Awake Europe2

Qadhafi - Islam Victory in Europe (Scandinavian women are?)

Sweden - Islams victory in Europe - muslims

The Hidden Army Of Radical Islam

Muslims in London threatening death to Denmark and UK

SOS from Europe- (A former Nazi Youth tells about how the same thing is happening and the rest of the wrold need to wake up)

Muslim Terrorists coming soon in Europe

Kosovo , Serbia: church set in flames by muslim Albanians 04

SHARIA LAW 101 Seeking forward in the England & Europe

Chilling Islamic Demonstration of Cartoons. London.

Islam is culture of death awake up UK.

Wake-Up, Europe !

Libyan President Says West Should Convert to Islam

wake up Euroupe Islam is coming

ANd the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on and on

These were made by people conserned with their own culture and nation. In America the CAIR is leading the charge.
Go to http://www.americansagainsthate.org/cw/profiles_cw.php and see what the members of the CAIR have said. and How many have been convicted since 9/11 for funding terrorism.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:39pm EDT
What is your opinion of the CAIR Mr. Alsan?

How do you justify Sharia Law and treatment of women Mr. Alsan?

My largest problem is......

How do you explain Al-takeyya Mr. Alsan.
For any who don't know it's an Islamic principal that justifies and encourages Muslims to lie.

They can use Al-takeyya in certain circumstances:
To Spread Islam
To Protect one welfare
To Reconcile Quarrels
To appease ones spouse

Think of all the little tiny white lies you have told and got caught in them? If I or anyone else get caught in a lie I/you confess the truth. I Don't know anyone who would stand by an obvious lie.

How many would fit into one of these circumstances where you wished it would be ok to lie to win a qurral, to promote you own agenda, to protect yourself.

Mr. Alsan, is Al-takeyya still ok if someone else gets hurt if you lie to protect yourself?

In most western culture a business deal, transactions, bets, even greetings are sealed with a hand shake.Honsety is above all things and is part of the very fabric of society.

A tiny white lie can destroy a honest mans entire professional reputation giving the man a questionable character.


Or how about Mr. Alsan Zawag Al-Mutaa.........Do you support that?
Once again for any who don't know it means "marraige fro pleasure."

It can last for an hour or a month or whatever.

Since you are such an expert Mr. Alsan.

I really want an answer to these questions. There are other Muslim here. PLEASE SOMEONE , ANSWER MY QUESTIONS.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 2:41pm EDT
Seperate Fundametalists from the religion and you might understand the difference between Muslims and terrorists, but that might take some thinking. It goes for Christans too.

Sharia Law, is supposed to be a last resort and only for Muslims, so you (theoretically) chose to be subject to it, from my understanding of it. But that differs from Asia to the Middle East, and I know less about the Middle East version than the Asian version.

Islam is just as "________" in almost anything as Christianity you want to consider, so lets take a mirror out before throwing stones.

Wars are always dragging God into them, as if he wants us to kill each other.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:44pm EDT
Tyler, HOW am I way off mark? Please explain. Has there BEEN another attack on our soil? YOU KNOW the radical parasitic Muslims want to annhiliate us. Wipe us out, eradicate us like the Nazis tried to the Jews, Roman Catholics, Gays, teachers, etc.... do you understand that? Or is your hatred of GW so strong and biased you can't see clearly.

I think that women and children being able to go to school in Afghanistan without the fear of being beheaded or worse is a GOOD thing. And that is just ONE example. What are YOU doing to keep America safe from radicals who want to kill you and your family?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 2:45pm EDT
Tom, since when has honesty been the "fabric" of a capitalist society. Money is the only God here.

Do you watch TV? Advertising is all about truth, right? Give me a break. A hand shake and knife in the back, thats American business.

Hey, but its "just business" right? Not our lives or anything.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:47pm EDT
Ok so what about Islamic Republics where Shaira Law IS the LAW?

Last resort? So you agree with Muslims trying to institute Shaira Law in Toronto?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:49pm EDT
Tom, thank you BRAVO to you as well, good luck on getting a straight answer to your straight foward question.

Tyler, btw, you do realize that the USA is the LARGEST and most GENEROUS of all nations when it comes to charity and relief for 3rd world countries. We feed them, clothe them, work to get clean drinking water to them, medical care, edcucation etc..we are usually the FIRST on scene for any diasaster, remember the Tsunami in Phukat? We, the USA gives more than any other country in the world and we get our people slaughtered in return.

And by parasites, I mean the radical islamic/muslim terrorists, they ARE parasites in the earth, then again, that is an insult to all parasites......
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Lisa Gensheimer Apr 4, 2007, 2:51pm EDT
Reza,

Thank you for bringing this much-needed perspective to us on gather.

Unfortunately, for most of us, and most Americans, the answer to your question would be "no," we haven't read:

"the Muslim Public Affairs Council, the Fiqh Council of North America, the Council on American Islamic Relations, the Muslim Council of Britain, the Islamic Commission of Spain, the Canadian Society of Muslims, the Grand Muftis of Russia and Saudi Arabia, the Grand Imam of Al-Azhar University in Cairo, the Grand Ayatollahs of Germany and Iraq, the Muslim Brotherhoods in Egypt and Jordan, or the Supreme Court of Afghanistan? Have you read the joint fatwas against violence issued by Sunni and Shiite clerical leaders in Iraq, the Amman Declaration (issued by 170 imams representing every sect and schism in Islam), or the Mecca Declaration signed by the world's leading Wahhabist clerics?"

Whether we are simply caught up in our everyday lives, or only have time to read one or two newspapers each day, we are making judgments without the full benefit of the information you have outlined.

It is critical that we find common ground, and focus on our shared humanity, if we are to keep our world from disintegrating. I would like to read your book. Does it offer a shred of hope?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 2:52pm EDT
Did you read the entire Comment?

You really want me to believe you don't sake hands with the intent to abide by whatever guidelines are agreed upon no matter what the case?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 2:53pm EDT
A lesson in Logic:

If you believe this : There hasn't been another attack on our soil, so Bush must be working for our security.

Then you must also believe this: Attacks on our soil are the faults of the lack of security with our President, which means the two WORST presidents in history were (1) Roosevelt and (2) Bush Jr. because they are the only two that had suprise attacks happen on their watch.

You must also believe Clinton was better then because there was no attacks on our soil, so who is the security President?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 2:57pm EDT
Remember the Tsunami in Sumatra (Indonesia) , yeah. The "we" you speak of is usually American people, rather than the government. Do you remember how much Bush wanted to give? He gave more because the people were upset the number was so low, I'm sure you spaced on that one.

55,000 died on Phuket
130,000+ died on Sumatra

Most of our money went to Phuket.
Do you remember Katrina? Earthquake in Pakistan?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Brian S Apr 4, 2007, 3:01pm EDT
Tom L., I was wondering about CAIR as well.
More specifically, I was wondering about the Flying Imams.
For those of you who don't know who the Flying Imams are,
let me inform you.

While they were waiting for a plane out of Minneapolis,
they caused a disturbance by making controversial remarks
and asking for seat belt extenders.

Seat belt extenders are usually used for overweight people.

However, none of these imams were overweight enough
to need seat belt extenders.

Seat belt extenders can also be used to prevent someone
from rushing up the aisle to try to prevent a terrorist from
taking control of a plane.

Because of their actions, the Flying Imams were ejected
from the plane.

Now they are suing the airline company.

One or more of these imams have associations with CAIR,
who has associations with Hezbollah, a terrorist organization.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:02pm EDT
For the record, I am not defending Islam, I am pointing out we are no saints either. We are tacitly consenting where they are actively consenting, that is the difference.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Paula K. Apr 4, 2007, 3:07pm EDT
I appreciate your article. Please don't get discouraged, by the nay sayers above. It is hard to believe the really hard core Muslim haters above can't recognize how very much they resemble the hard core Christian haters they are judging. If everyone treated everyone with respect life would be very peaceful.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:09pm EDT
Tyler, you just explained everything by posting your view on capitalism. Ok, so, move to a communist....oh wait, there are very few communist countries....wonder why......well, you could move to Cuba, Venezuala, China....

I see by your profile you work for large corporations, that are capitalistic companies, they PAY your paycheck don't they. If you don't LIKE capitalism, MOVE. The US was built by capitalists and it WORKS.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:16pm EDT
There are NO communist countries. There has NEVER been a communist country, that is the big trick of believing everything the government tells you. You get lied to, oh wait, wasn't that my point anyway, that we lie here too, there is no honesty in politics. You are gullible if you think they are honest, and that would explain a lot too.

What corporation do I work for, enlighten me on MY life?

Holes to shit in work too, do you want one?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:19pm EDT
"Then you must also believe this: Attacks on our soil are the faults of the lack of security with our President"

I really do. Lets ask Sandy Berger who stole TOP SECRET docs. to cover for Billy Boy Clinton.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:23pm EDT
Tyler, it was the US NAVY that showed up in Phuket. And WE WERE attacked under Clinton's watch. Remember the FIRST attack on the WTC? That was on our soil, Clinton did NOTHING. NOT on our soil BUT OUR people....dragged through the streets in Somalia, Clinton did NOTHING, OUR NAVY, USS COLE BOMBED, Clinton did NOTHING, I could go on. For 8 years, Clinton did nothing for security of the US He did nothing to the KNOWN terrorists who bombed and massacred US citizens and military people.

Katrina, yes, what a quagmire, I' suffered a worse fate in the Ice Storm of '97. We had NO heat, water, electricity IN the WINTER. We were housed in shelters, NO ONE ruined them. No one got looted, killed, raped, murdered. No one got a $2000 debit card from the Gvt. BTW, if you listened to other news sources besides MSNBC and the NYT, you would know that the Governer and the Mayor were responsible for the delay in evacuations. Do NOT blame GW for the mess of Katrina. That shows an incredible amount of ignorance.

Yes Tyler, it is ON your Profile....and the GREAT thing about this country AND a capitalist country is you have the opportunity to be what you want to be! If you want to be a mook and whine and complain about what you do, CHANGE YOUR LIFE.

And if you don't think there have ever been communist countries......whoooo boy.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:23pm EDT
I used Clinton becuse people that love Bush usually hate Clinton, and having to concede he is better would be tough, though I don't hold Clinton up on some pedestal.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Racheline Maltese Apr 4, 2007, 3:24pm EDT
One of the things I find missing from a lot of the discussion this article has engendered is the role of the media in the situation of public perception of the Islamic world in general and American Muslims' stance on political issues and terrorism in particular. As a trained journalist, I am deeply wary of blaming anything on "the media" -- it's a phrase that easily turns into a deeply amorphous, imprecise and paranoid sounding "them" -- however, I think it's worth remembering that no matter how loudly you speak on an issue if you don't have access to mass media, you will ultimately be seen as, and effectively be, silent. Muslims seeking to speak out on political issues have got to get media savvy, engage PR agencies and make the stories they have to tell attractive not just to journalists, but to the business people that run media companies. And in many ways, I regret to say the skill required here isn't complex reasoning but the production of sound-bites. Until that happens, the sad and rather revolting fact is most Americans are going to find more use for stereotypes of its Muslim citizens and Mulims around the around, than for anything resembling an informed truth.

I also want to caution many of the people posting here about the burdens you somehow feel it is acceptable to place on minorities (religious, racial, etc.) both as individuals and as groups. It is not the job of any community or individual to have to reassure you about your bigotry. We often have no choice, but it is a burden. And it's absolutely infuriating when people demand we walk 99.98% of the way towards them and are then told we're simply not doing enough to make them feel comfortable.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:31pm EDT
Tyler, this is from YOUR profile....Frito-Lay, Safeway, Excel Telecommunications, and TR3O.

Actually, re: Clinton, I actually voted for him the first time, that was when I was young and foolish and believed the main stream media....I learned from my mistake, I did NOT vote for him the 2nd time and in fact, it was Clinton that confirmed my conservative beliefs. So actually I admire him for showing me the "right". But that's another article.

You've swayed from the point of this article.

YOU GO TOM!
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:35pm EDT
And Again you are way off target Cindy, you are now adding things to my words and then arguing with them. I said nothing about America not being a place of opportunity, find that on my profile.

And WHAT is on my profile, I help my girlfriends sister at her shop, where is that on there? I can change my life by voting, that is democracy, you should look it up, you might like it.

And downplaying Katrina is ridiculous; heavans, my heat went out in the winter too, during Bush's reign, I guess we are even, wait, who am I supporting again? Is it on my profile??

What was that you responded to about Sumatra, oh nothing, thats right because that might include something in the way of thinking again, I know how much you like to just latch on to something someone esle said and repeat it.

AS far as you communist countries, I know ths would burn your hands and make yo ublind, but you should READ the Cummunist Manifesto. Communism, as described by its inventor, has NEVER existed ever, ever, ever.... Got it. What you have been convinced as communist is really a Dictatorship. Communism has elections (democracy) and is a choice against Capitalism, not Democracy. What we have seen is Dictatorships, with a Communist leaning Capitalist society.

Oklahoma was a terrorist attack by a US citizen, where would we bomb, Oklahoma?
Clinton realized there was no borders to attack, we were doing secret operations under Clinton (where do you think the reports for Osama that Bush got before 9/11 came from?). Bush's father dealt with Osama too, so w can go to him for not stopping him also.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
LA R. Apr 4, 2007, 3:35pm EDT
Racheline - I cannot think of a better soundbite for the nightly news that a group of Muslims announcing that they are against the bigotry and extremism in their faith, that they are Americans, through and through, and that they want the radical Muslims who wish Americans harm to recognize that Muslims in America do not support their jihad. Who needs a PR agency to get that on the air?!? (see my above comments/questions)
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
George Corneliussen Apr 4, 2007, 3:42pm EDT
All religions and political movements on earth have a radical element associated with them. It is the perpetual game of "King Of The Mountain" that these radical elements play against each other that is the source of turmoil.
These radical elements , be they Muslim, Christian,Democratic, Communistic, male, or female all bank on turmoil. They all rely on the confusion produced by relentless turmoil to weaken the attention span/wills of those they wish to control.
Therefore, the only way to eliminate the radical elements in any group is to not allow them to destroy the moderate views that keep this world spinning. I reject the views of any radical group whether they come from the other side of the planet or if they live down the street from me .
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:44pm EDT
I DID (past tense) work for corporate America, and that is why I don't anymore. And you should do even more research because I OWN TR3O myself, it is a shirt making business out of my friends basement, that is SO corporate America, right?

When we go public I will let you know, haha.

I said "I don't hold Clinton up on some pedestal." So you can stop assuming he is my idol.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:46pm EDT
History Test

All true events.

1. In 1972, at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by:

a. Sgt, Schultz
b. Col. Klink
c. Gen. Hochstetter
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40


2. In 1979, the US Embassy in Iran was taken over by:

a. Elvis Presley
b. Elvis Costello
c. Abbott & Costello
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

3. During the 1980's, a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:

a. Prince
b. Cher
c. Wacko Jacko
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

4. In 1983, US Marine barracks was blown up by:

a. Pee Wee Reese
b. Pee Wee Herman
c. Popeye's Pee Wee
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

5. In 1985, the cruise ship the Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchair by:

a. Jack Daniels
b. Jim Beam
c. Johnny Walker
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

6. In 1985, TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a US Navy diver trying to rescue passengers was murdered by:

a. Captain Blye
b. Captain Kidd
c. Captain Kangaroo
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

7. In 1988 Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed over Scotland by:

a. Fred Flintstone
b. Barney Rubble
c. Barney the Dinosaur
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

8. In 1993, the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:

a. Leona Helmsey
b. Donald Trump
c. Triumph, the Insult Dog
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

9. In 1996, the Khobar Towers in South Africa were bombed by:

a. Tarzan
b. Jane
c. Cheetah
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

10. In 1998, the US Embassies in Kenya & Tanzania were bombed by:

a. Hulk Hogan
b. The Green Hulk
c. The Green Hornet
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

11. In October, 2000, The US Cole, a USN Destroyer, was bombed by:

a. Nemo and Dory
b. Charlie Tuna
c. Gilligan, Mary Ann, Ginger and the Professor
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

12. On September 11th, 2001, 4 airliners were hijacked. Two were flown into the World Trade Towers, one into the Pentagon and one, after the passengers apparently overtook the hijackers, crashed into a field in Pennsylvania. The hijackers were:

a. Wiley E. Coyote
b. Elmer Fudd
c. Foghorn Leghorn
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

13. In 2002 the USA fought a war in Afghanistan against:

a. Halliburton
b. Enron
c. Microsoft
d. Muslim extremists males between the ages of 12-85

14. In 2002 unarmed reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and decapitated while alive by:

a. Bonnie and Clyde
b. Al Capone
c. Hannibal Lechter
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

15. In 2004, 4 innocents were kidnapped, burned alive and dragged through the streets in Iraq by:

a. David Cassidy
b. Ted Cassidy
c. Butch Cassidy
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

16. In 2004, Nick Berg, a civilian truck driver, was kidnapped and beheaded while alive by:

a. Homer Simpson
b. Bart Simpson
c. O.J. Simpson
d. Muslim male extremists between the ages of 17-40

Now, to ensure we Americans NEVER offend anyone, particularly fanatics intent on killing us all, TSA will no longer be allowed to profile certain people. The must conduct random searches of old folks, little kids, pilots, Secret Service agents, 85 yo men with metal hips, and Medal of Honor former Governors and leave the Muslim males between the ages of 17 – 40 alone because of racial profiling.

Who are these dunder-heads that are against racial profiling? Would THEY get on a plane with a Muslim male between the ages of 17-40? I know I would not. Does that make me a racist? Maybe so, but I don't care.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Nick S. Apr 4, 2007, 3:48pm EDT
Lauren,

Apparently they need a very good PR agency. http://www.islamfortoday.com/terrorism.htm
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Dan (open minded conservative) K. Apr 4, 2007, 3:48pm EDT
Reza ... talk to me after you or any other Muslim condemn acts of terror and violence by Muslims against innocent people in the name of one's faith.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:48pm EDT
George Islam is the only one who promotes, advocates, encourages violence against others.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:49pm EDT
And it comes out "Does that make me a racist? Maybe so, but I don't care."

and the police drama music plays, dun dun dun.

Isn't that what I claimed before, its because people don't care. You should care, its YOUR attitude that is heating the fire.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:50pm EDT
And you should do even more research because I OWN TR3O myself, it is a shirt making business out of my friends basement, that is SO corporate America, right?

THATS CAPITALISM!!!! I feel bad for your business partner.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:51pm EDT
When did I say "death to capitalism?"
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tom L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:52pm EDT
Nick.......Will you answer my questions.

What is your opinion of the CAIR Mr. Alsan?

How do you justify Sharia Law and treatment of women Mr. Alsan?

My largest problem is......

How do you explain Al-takeyya Nick.
For any who don't know it's an Islamic principal that justifies and encourages Muslims to lie.

They can use Al-takeyya in certain circumstances:
To Spread Islam
To Protect one welfare
To Reconcile Quarrels
To appease ones spouse

Think of all the little tiny white lies you have told and got caught in them? If I or anyone else get caught in a lie I/you confess the truth. I Don't know anyone who would stand by an obvious lie.

How many would fit into one of these circumstances where you wished it would be ok to lie to win a qurral, to promote you own agenda, to protect yourself.

Nick, is Al-takeyya still ok if someone else gets hurt if you lie to protect yourself?

In most western culture a business deal, transactions, bets, even greetings are sealed with a hand shake.Honsety is above all things and is part of the very fabric of society.

A tiny white lie can destroy a honest mans entire professional reputation giving the man a questionable character.


Or how about Zawag Al-Mutaa.........Do you support that?
Once again for any who don't know it means "marraige fro pleasure."

It can last for an hour or a month or whatever.

Since you are such an expert Nick......

I really want an answer to these questions. There are other Muslim here. PLEASE SOMEONE , ANSWER MY QUESTIONS.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
LA R. Apr 4, 2007, 3:53pm EDT
Nick P. -

A website cannot speak on the news and I don't expect that there are interns scanning the web for sites like these.

I cannot believe if any one of the people quoted on that site were to call their local news or get into touch, along with a small group of people who have similar beliefs, with a national news channel, that they would be told their message is not news.

As for your link, however, it is exactly those messages I believe Mr. Aslan is saying need to get out there!
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Tyler W. Apr 4, 2007, 3:58pm EDT
Tom said "Islam is the only one who promotes, advocates, encourages violence against others."

Incorrect, Radical Islam is, much like Pat Robertson and those wackjob Radical Christians are, they were calling for an assassination of Chavez, and that the Hurricanes were aimed at the Gays in New Orleans and Orlando, etc...

Might I remind you of a little thing called the Crusades, or any other Christian powered war. They are the ONLY ones? Maybe right now they ('they' being radical Islam, not Islam) are, but not ever, thats for sure.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Cindy L. Apr 4, 2007, 3:59pm EDT
Tyler, I DON'T care if I am labled as a racist because MY OPINION. I would NOT get on a plane, bus, train, cab etc...if a person of Mid East origin or a Muslim Imam or a person who acted "funny" were a co-passenger.

You did NOT read my post.......I DO care, that is WHY I am here and saying what As I asked you before,,,,,WHAT ARE YOU DOING for the SECURITY of this country? What are YOU doing?
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in
Susan *. Apr 4, 2007, 4:05pm EDT
Reza, as a parent and an educator I have always taught both in my home and in my classrooms, tolerance and acceptance of ALL people. Though our family is Christian we have no problem with the Muslim religion what so ever. As we have made our religious choice, so have Muslims and to say one religion is superior over another is to consider oneself to be the ultimate "judge" and I am most definitely not that by any stretch of the imagination.

Both of my sons have been taught to respect and care for people of all races creeds and colors to the point that they see only the person on the inside and not the shell on the outside.

One of my oldest son's best friends is Muslim and I consider his family to be one of integrity, honest and high morals. Both families trust each other explicitly and religious differences have never been brought into the mix nor will they ever. Should my son want to visit their place of worship or should their son want to visit ours, I have no doubt in mind that both families would embrace this as a learning experience and one where both boys could grow as young men and as citizens as well through the experience.

I guess what I am saying is they do not judge our family because some so called "Christians" have enacted some horrendous crimes and we do not judge them for similar reasons. We care for each other as people, friends and family and to me, that is enough. Perhaps the world should take note of Mookie and my son's friendship and learn from the respect these young men have for each other....for in doing so, I think a great number of our problems would pale in the light of their true friendship.
reply to this comment
Chime in! Become a Gather member to comment.
Join Gather »
Already a member? Sign in