Beginning with questions on the current economic crisis McCain was just as ambiguous about his position on the issue as his behavior over the past week. He seemed a lot more concerned with how he was going to look once a plan is implemented than he did with what the details of a plan would be. McCain appeared poised to jump on which ever plan seemed to be the one that will be the most palatable to his base. Barack Obama was very detailed about what he understood about the problem and his absolute emphasis was on how the plan would effect working Americans.
When Lerher got around to Iraq the differences between McCain and Obama couldn't be clearer. McCain is cock sure the decision to go into Iraq was the right one. Obama questioned him on statements he had made at the beginning of that war like, we know where the WMDs are, we'll be received as liberators, oil revenues will pay for the effort but McCain sidetracked the question by going into a sentimental story about the mother of a soldier killed in Iraq.
It was clear McCain wanted to make the argument about the Iraq war in regards to how it was executed, the surge, and accusing Obama of "not understanding" the situation and wanting to lose the war or accepting defeat. These are simply the same old charges made by McCain over and over despite knowing full well that it simply a lie. Barack Obama has always promoted a sensible and careful withdrawal of our troops. The issue Obama made was whether Americans trust the judgment of John McCain who believed it was a good idea to go into Iraq or Obama's who did not.
But the overall feeling of the debate was a sense of genuine contempt that McCain has for Obama. I couldn't believe how many times Obama had to correct McCain on statements that have been debunked in the press time and time again. And as the debate went into the final rounds McCain tried to take off the gloves by attacking Obama with his same old "I don't believe Obama has the experience and understanding yadda, yadda, yadda. But Obama was ready with quick and decisive counter punches pointing out McCain's constant switch ups on issues.
All in all the debate was not a slam dunk for either candidate proving you don't get to the United States senate without some debating chops. But I do believe America got to know the candidates a lot better. And as the polls have been showing with more and more certainty, the more they know the more they're moving to Obama and away from McCain.
*************
Devin Barber, Politics Correspondent
Devin's column, "Left Of The Right" published weekly or more to Gather Essentials: Politics is a Blue Collar Democrats take on current political news.
Devin was raised by proud Roosevelt Democrats. Being the son of parents counted among the throng of Americans displaced by the Great Depression has given Devin a deep rooted passion for causes dealing with the poor and the working class.
You can find all of Devin's columns at http://gather.com/leftoftheright
You can keep up with Devin's postings and his Gather activity by joining his Gather network. Just click here: http://kiwina58.gather.com and then select the orange "Connect" button on the left-hand side of the page.You can find Devin and other Political Correspondents, plus celebrity content and plenty of other politics experts at Politics.gather.com.
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Comments: 89
McCain seemed to focus on two things: his history (wide sweeps, no real specifics) and declaring Obama was naive.
Obama seemed to focus on two things: judgement and "big picture".
There are differences between these candidates.
Wow, you really got this one out quick Devin. Obama surprised me and did very well. McCain surprised me and really looked feeble and like he wished he was anywhere else at that moment.
McCain kept resurrecting old brands, he kept waving Ronald Reagan around on many things.
I have to hope that this was a big win for Obama in that he looked more than serious, and was really able to think and talk on his feet much better than McCain did.
The one thing that bothered me a little was Obama's interruptions, and superior laughing. One might hope a Democrat would have learned something by Al Gore's underwhelming performance in 2000 about that.
You make a good point about McCain attacking Obama, but what else can he do. And this is the foreign policy debate. I hope people really do not find some way to ignore, gloss over or get distracted from what has been going in this week, and will continue for however many years it takes to pay off 800 billion dollars, or get out money back from selling deflated real estate assets.
Somalia.
What else did I miss?
I think Obama was very aggressive, and effective as well, Jim, I think aggressive and effective have to be measured by more than just stuttering at a loss for words and saying my opponent does not understand the complicated issues.
"Obama clearly does not understand" "I've been there". Apparently never when it mattered to anything but his own sense of self-importance.
ps, Senator, inability to pronounce a foreign leader's name might just be seen by said leader (or his people) as a dis!
McCain gets to speak the choir, I am the old man, trusted, wise, and I say Obama is unqualified, don't bother listening to him. I think he trotted those lines out way to much in what I saw, I was tired of it by the time he summed up, using the same argument.
CBS poll of ind shows 40% think Obama won, 22% McCain, 38% tie. CNN numbers (voters) are even better. Not talking about online click polls here. These are phone interviews conducted right after the debate.
46% Left with a better opinion of Obama
68% of these voters think Obama would make the right decision
about the economy. 41% think McCain would.
49% of these voters think Obama would make the right decisions about Iraq. 55% think McCain would.
I think that did more to provoke Obama that Obama did to provoke McCain, and that may have been where those smirks came from, a sense of being treated with contempt by McCain.
Yes, Obama smiled. I didn't see any obvious sarcasm in it, possibly because he is so laidback his expressions are somewhat muted. McCain's smile looked more obviously like ill-disguised bad temper since his face became redder, his breathing became shorter and he started shaking at one point--he was shaking his finger at the camera.
I think Obama clearly won.
McCain never looked at the audience or at Obama even after Lehrer prodded him to do so time and again. Psychologically that is a sign that he was being less than truthful.
Ray L., Sep 27, 2008, 12:04am EDT "
Ray L. you keep pushing that pack of lies on gather again and again and again. Are you getting royalty checks off that thing? If you have mad cow disease you might believe what is in that book but otherwise you will recognize what it is, a very large smelly sack of BS.
McCain trounced Obama in this debate... no question about it. Mark my words, the poll bounce will go to McCain, and then you will have to concede.
Thank you.
Is it still lost on you that he's right and that the majority of Americans agree? Ya dummy... go get a job moonbat.
To see some who can't either read or make decisions on their own but have to rely on Republican rhetoric to answer others and resort to calling others names like they are five year olds is disgusting. Does your Mother know you fell out of the play pen?
:O\
Did you notice how McCain saw every question through the lens of military might? And how he once again threw the POW card in the ring at the end. Very sad for the old soldier. I respected him once, not now.
They even pay people to come on gather and spread propaganda...eh eh
Have you read: the evil empire....
The point is, who won, who lost is silly. My impression of Obama went up. My impression of McCain stayed steady. McCain knows his stuff, no doubt. His lower spending lower taxes policy is sound. The reality is the bailout will change things and a spending freeze is almost out of the question, but McCain will adapt.
Obama is stronger on foreign policy than I thought. The guy really improved. 22 Primary debates will do that. Two more debates like that, and McCain has no chance. McCain is the one who needs to take Obama down. Palin, can't do that. Katie Couric and Charlie Gibson have exposed her. She has not completed the network rounds yet and it's hard to see how she can destroy Biden.
McCain thinks he can say any ole junk, as he smiles and waits for an applause. There was no applause (it was a debate) and Obama got to call him on his lies (it was a debate). McCain was a jerk.
McCain also continued to lie brazenly about Obama's positions, as though this debate was just an extension of the campaign ads that every independent factchecker has deemed inaccurate at best, lies at worst. If you dare, look at FactCheck.org, and the various factcheck columns run by several leading papers. They expose McCain, not for what he was, but for what he has become.
Bottom line: Obama supporters, McCain supporters: no change of opinion. We'll have to see about the independents, but I suspect Obama has the edge there.
or "Untruth!" McCain would have been the only one triggering that response. He misprounces leader's names, misquotes Kissinger in a condecending, misleading manner, and talked about him, him, him. This was a big mistake. He sounded way too geriatric, like a glory days boy, who's best acts are behind him. And so he is.
McCain is all about the past. How he can tout having the economic plan in place--and being a part of he "answer" to the Swift Float Scandal, I don't understand that at all. He voted for lack of oversight. Along with his repub friends, He helped create the crash.
I liked two lines from the debate: "John, I have a bracelet too."
And the image in the "Axe vs. the Scalpel" in terms of trimming programs to pay for the richmen's bailout.
Yes, I'm a dem, and I agree with last nights and today's polls. Obama was the class act on the stage last night.
Pleased with the results, and I can't wait for the Biden/Palin debate. THAT one will be fun!
Wilka
Thank you for sharing it.
Wilka
Poll Results
Have you decided who you are going to vote for?
Yes, McCain 52% 60,310
Yes, Obama 41% 47,235
Not yet 5% 5,471
I'm not voting 1% 1,180
Yes, another candidate 1% 815
Note on Poll Results
Total Votes: 115,011
Poll Results
Who appeared more presidential?
John McCain 52% 162,338
Barack Obama 48% 149,278
Note on Poll Results
Total Votes: 311,616
Poll Results
Who do you trust more to handle the economy?
John McCain 54% 149,141
Barack Obama 46% 128,235
Poll Results
Who do you trust more to handle the Iraq war?
John McCain 57% 156,387
Barack Obama 43% 119,520
Poll Results
Which is the most important issue to you in this election?
Economy 73% 82,163
National security 16% 18,007
War in Iraq 6% 6,795
Health care 3% 3,528
Environment 1% 1,224
Education 1% 1,206
Note on Poll Results
Total Votes: 112,923
Poll Results
Who won the debate?
John McCain 46% 146,922
Barack Obama 42% 134,332
It was a tie 7% 21,033
I didn't watch 5% 14,926
Note on Poll Results
Total Votes: 317,213
Were you on the correct channel?
51% Obama
35% McCain
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26906945/
Of course, most GOP argue that MSNBC is a "liberal rag".
Then again, most GOP argue that the only "valid" sources are Fox and Limbaugh.
Thanks, Wilka for noticing the same thing I did. McCain seemed to get lost in some of his anecdotes. He's in danger of sounding like a Walter Brennan character. I'm sure his staff will point that out to him.
I'm very confused by the Obama smirk accusations. It looked to me like Obama had been coached on smiling during McCain's turns to speak. I think the intent was to look approachable and I think it worked. Condescension was an obvious element of McCain's strategy. I think he overused it.
What seemed clear was that we had to focus on one topic at a time to see any worth in McCain's statements. He talked about Iraq and Iran as if we still had all the resources of men and money that have been squandered and lost over the past 7 years. He talked about sanctions and demands as if we still had Allies out there who respected us. He talked about our might and influence as if our economy hasn't tanked.
Obama presented realistic, sensible, possible pathways we can and should follow if we want to survive the next few years as the same USA we were all born into.
You said,
"George Will said of McCain's decision to pick the Alaska Madona "John McCain is unfit to be president." With friends like these, I don't think McCain needs any enemies. "
Need you be reminded that Joe Biden said Obama was "not ready to be president. "
Good grief, and he's Obama's VP candidate!!!!
With friends like these, I don't think Obama needs any "more" enemies.
Obama was still "flip flopping" miserably in the debate last night:
He couldn't decide if he would call McCain... John... or .... Senator McCain..... (Stupidity or arrogance?)
Further, Obama kept interrupting McCain, like a little kid who couldn't wait to talk. The moderator seemed to be admonishing Obama, quietly, at one time, but it was very noticeable. However typical of Obama.
Obama is just the next coming of Jimmy Carter!!! AGHHH-AGHHH.
Democrats started their war to end povert in 1968.The American people had Trillions of their tax money taken and wasted-trillions wasted.Not only did trillions get wasted the net result is that the inner-cities and the families in them are worse off,with billions still being wasted today.Obama is just another community organizer who wants your money.
Thanks for that tip! and...duh! why doesn't that surprise me?
However, I really don't care about interacting with Devin ...
I've read a couple of his articles now, and they are so same-same. Nothing new or objective, so I won't be looking in on any more of them. You know what to expect here: just custom-designed McCain bashing. Nothing more, nothing less.
It's disturbing when he spouts such hyperbole as here...
and that gets my fingers running across the keyboard.
I'll just make my last comment on my last look at a Devin article by saying:
START PRACTICING AND GET USED TO SAYING: PRESIDENT MCCAIN.
Does anyone know how many times Sophie has to post that same useless drivel before it counts as spam?
You're still stalking me? I will post this everytime you spit your venom about me when I make a comment stating my personal opinion on an article.
You should know about the spam ! Everything you have ever written is in a spam (or worse) folder, somewhere.
Repeat Post:
Granny Sandy,
First, I made no comment to you nor do I appreciate your comment to my comment. Ordinarily, I do not respond to your type of bottom dwelling rhetoric, but just this one time, I will, so you may know you need to harrass elsewhere. Get a life, get your own subjects, stop stalking people, just to make your incoherent responses to their commments. No one appreciates that, or gives a hoot what you think. Your opinions are worthless sewer material.
I stand firmly behind every comment I made, but could understand if you chose to delete every comment you have made. I do not expect everyone to agree with what I say.
Now, please know that you are a Gather Stalker and you annoy a lot of intelligent people who resent your continuous stalking.
Poor ole' senile granny, you're stammering, drooling and slobbering all over yourself...and talking in your alzheimer's voice again, or still. As you seem to do on a 24/7 basis on Gather. I am sorry that you have nothing better to do than go from article to article in the same ole'attack mode. I'm sure it is a miserable life.
You need to get a life, Grannie, there is life outside Gather. Won't they ever let you out of the rest home for a walk, some fresh air.... have you no family?
Now... call the nurse, have her change that bib...it stinks.
Then, she will need to increase your fibre intake. Then the home resident Doc needs to check your diarrhea of the mouth.
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English bestealcian; akin to Old English stelan to steal
intransitive verb 1 : to pursue quarry or prey stealthily 2 : to walk stiffly or haughtily
transitive verb 1 : to pursue by stalking 2 : to go through (an area) in search of prey or quarry 3 : to pursue obsessively and to the point of harassment 4 (chiefly Gather): to comment on the same article as oneself, especially if that comment is in disagreement with one's own
(with apologies to Merriam-Webster)
"This article reveals that you are completely biased toward Obama." Don, this comment makes me wonder if you ever took a debate class, were on a debate team, or observed a real debate.
Oops. I'll have to add another definition.
You might have accidentally landed on the articles of people that I have been connected to and followed for years, and you might not have known that I joined their discussions long before you came around. Other people here know that, so your comments to and about me only prove that you are dishonest, you didn't do your homework, and you want attention. No matter how many insults you sling at me, it won't make you attractive.
And I'll have you know that Sandy has been part of my network and a very estute commentator here at Gather long before you showed up.
To be frank, Sophie, I don't think you merit Sandy stalking. But nice try.
Have we run out of silly people thinking McCain "won" the debate? I can't even read the transcript with a straight face.
I'm sick and tired of living with a president that is intellectually below average. Think about it. Clinton was a Rhodes Schollar and we had a vibrant economy and a government that was living within it's own means. Hell we were even looking at a projected surplus. Then we get "below average" Georgy Boy and we get the largest expansion of government in our history. An economy that is in worse shape than its been in 70 years with Federal budget deficit of record proportions.
And now we have a choice between Barack Obama who graduated magna cum laude from Harvard and was elected that historic universities first black president of the Harvard Law Review. And John McCain who graduated from Annapolis 894th out of a class of 899.
Mmmm... I think I'll go with the smart guy...
Not only do all the polls indicate Obama won last Friday's debate, he is enjoying a significant bounce in the national polls as well. And this was the foreign policy debate that was supposed to be McCain's strongest area. The next two debates are on domestic and economic issues. It seems every time McCain opens his mouth or pulls a politcally motivated circus stunt, his numbers go down.
President Barack Obama... I like the sound of that.
Wasn't the US once proud of its intelligence?