Reverend Wright - GO HOME!
It's beginning to look as if next year we may have the first woman in the White House. Although the polls and the numbers show it will be next to impossible for Hillary Clinton to secure the Democratic candidacy for the November election, if there is a way to do it, she has proven she has the intelligence, ability, spunk and fortitude that is needed.
I favor Barack Obama who would be the first black man in the White House. He was taking a strong lead over Clinton until remarks in a sermon given by Obama's pastor, Reverend Wright of the Trinity United Church of Christ were brought into the spotlight recently. That one sound bite, that seems to incriminate Wright as an unforgivably unpatriotic, screaming, angry man, may dash all hope for Barack Obama to win the Democratic presidential candidacy.
It was shortly after 9/11 that Wright gave a sermon in which he referred to remarks of former Ambassador to Iraq, Edward Peck, on Fox Network. No matter what Peck said, Wright's reaction was severe criticism of the United States Government. In the loud and angry tones used by some preachers, part of what Wright said was as follows:
"We nuked thousands of people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki without batting an eye! Now we are indignant that the stuff we have done overseas is brought back into our own back yard! Violence begets violence! Hatred begets hatred! Terrorism begets terrorism!"
He also said in another context:
"God bless America? NO! God damn America!"
Those words are hard to forgive or forget, no matter what the context. As the pastor of the church where the Obama's were married, their children were baptized, and the family attended since the 1980s, it is hard separate Wright's views from Obama's. In his own defense, Obama condemned Wright's words, but not the man. And just as we thought the issue had been put to bed, here comes the Reverend back into the limelight to stir it all up again.
Who is this man? He was the pastor of Trinity United Church of Christ for 40 years, and when he started, there were just 87 members. When he left he had increased membership to over 10,000 in Church of Christ that is predominately white.
A little research tells us he was born in 1941, joined the U.S Marines in 1959, and transferred to the U.S. Navy in 1961. There he became a corpsman, graduating at the top of the class. He specialized as a cardio -pulmonary technician, and was eventually assigned to a team that cared for President Johnson. When he left military service, the White House awarded him three letters of commendation.
Wright entered Howard University in 1967 where he received a degree in English and Divinity. Later in 1990 he earned a Master's Degree at the Chicago University School of Divinity. He holds a Doctorate in Divinity from United Theological School in Dayton Ohio where he studied under a mentor of Martin Luther King. He holds many other awards and honorary degrees, as well as being honored for creating a program in his church for the advancement of beginning Black seminarians.
On the other hand, he has had associations with unsavory people like Farrakhan and Libya's Guddafi that are sure to be exploited by the Republican campaign to the detriment of Barrack Obama.
All in all, except for that terrible sound bite that makes him sound like a terrorist himself, Reverend Wright seems to be a very intelligent and admirable man. Now it seems that in every other sentence he utters he sticks his foot in his mouth giving fuel to Obama's opponents. At least nothing I have heard him say so far seems to be helping his friend Oback Obama. As they say, "With friends like that, who needs enemies?"


Comments: 52
Did anyone actually watch the Rev. Wright speech on CNN last night? I watched the whole thing and found him to be funny, intelligent, and right --just like his name -- on many, many issues. As an aside, he did a terrific John F. Kennedy impersonation, speaking with a Boston accent (sorry my Boston friends) to demonstrate that in America we often tell black children they're not speaking perfect English, when it is just as difficult to understand a Boston accent.
His whole message was that each of us is different. We come from different cultures. But we all share a common humanity.
The reality is that when he speaks, the media turns it into sound bites. I heard him this morning talk about reconciliation and gave really good biblical, historical, and scholastic references of his preaching framework. But guess what will be played out tonight on TV? They will play the part where he talked about the Christian wearing the black suit on Sunday morning and a white robe on Sunday evening. When you play something like that totally out of context, it can't help. It hurts, POLITICALLY speaking.
If you would take the time to listen to or read the entire sermons, you might see what the context was for the sound bites you quoted. In the first case, he was referring to the deflection of our anger - from those who actually organized the attack to others. Our continued bombing of Iraq kill children who had nothing whatever to do with 9/11,''
Here is the second remark, IN CONTEXT:
And the United States of America government, when it came to treating her citizens of Indian descent fairly, she failed. She put them on reservations. When it came to treating her citizens of Japanese descent fairly, she failed. She put them in internment prison camps. When it came to treating citizens of African descent fairly, America failed. She put them in chains. The government put them on slave quarters, put them on auction blocks, put them in cotton fields, put them in inferior schools, put them in substandard housing, put them in scientific experiments, put them in the lowest paying jobs, put them outside the equal protection of the law, kept them out of their racist bastions of higher education and locked them into position of hopelessness and helplessness. The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law, and then wants us to sing God bless America? No, no, no. Not God bless America; God damn America! That's in the Bible, for killing innocent people. God damn America for treating her citizen as less than human. God damn America as long as she keeps trying to act like she is God and she is supreme!
Would you bless someone who treated you like that?
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/04252008/transcript1.html
So keep right on preaching preacher!! It seems like America hasn't been all that bad for him. He lives in a mansion and has plenty of money. I doubt he'd have had it so good in Africa. And I only say that because his church has a commitment to Africa. You can read it on the website.
Big difference between JUST a something and being something. He never said Obama was JUST a politician.
Here is the quote in question
"He had to distance himself because he is a politician from what the media was saying I had said because it was anti-American."
Where is the word JUST in that sentence? Please quote or paraphrase accurately. Misquoting people has only one purpose: to lie about what they say in order to galvanize support or oppostion for or against the person being misquoted. That is dishonest.
Well, according to him, he was talking about the government. Not the country.
On Khadaffi, a little more research and you would have learned that he went there with Farakhan to negotiate the liberation of United States Navy pilot Lt. Robert Goodman. There were dozens of ministers/Revs on the trip of all ethncities. You telling me the republicans will use a trip to liberate a U.S. Navy pilot against a decorated former US marine? Who will they send on Meet The Press to make the Claim? Vice President "I use 5 school deferements to escape being sent to Vietnam?" Do you see the hypocrisy here?
Obama didn't plan far enough ahead. His associates are not what you might call savory characters. Birds of a feather...well you know the rest.
I think it's time for...
Obama - GO HOME!
Hillary badmouths Hugo Chavez also just because it is the 'establishment" thing to do ... anybody that is for the disenfranchised is an enemy of the right ... Reverend Wright speaks for the left, the little people that suffer in society because of the actions of the super rich right ... Chavez helps the little people also and took back some of his nations industries that the rich had stolen and raped the people of their value ...
It is so easy to see here on Gather the nature of the commenters, right VS left, the haters vs the peace seekers ... on and on ... what a country ... geesh.
Oh, I almost forgot, check out what the Clintons are really like :
Would the Clinton folks ever tell a lie ? check this and see what you think:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xq8aopATYyw&feature=related
then part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMfUajhL24I
These are the choices that the people have made...guided by the media, of course. So we're left to pick from three not very good candidates. There were better choices...John Edwards, for one, a solid, likable, experienced candidate for the Democrats, but, this was the season of 'firsts' for the change-for-change sake liberal wing of the Democrats. The Republican could have had the finest candidate in decades in the person of Chuck Hagel...but, he never even got off the launching pad when he saw the overflowing coffers of Romney and Giuliani.
How did we come down to these three...for the Democrats it's clearer...if you had a midget Estonian in the running he'd probably level worthier candidates just because he's different and would be a 'first'...which all progressives love. How the Republicans ended up with McCain is a mystery to them...now all you have to do is add Lieberman to his ticket and the Conservatives will be jumping off of barn' haylofts and church steeples.
Something is wrong with the process and I believe it's the media manipulation. They don't report facts and occurences...they editorialize...they pick who 'they' want to win and campaign for that candidate. They use polls and expert commentary to guide the electorate.
So here we are 3 little indians left...the Republicans have their' pick for the big race...the Democrats have two...it's down to who has a better shot at outpacing McCain.
As for the American people...it's a lose...lose...lose proposition.
I don't know that Obama really has a faith in God or not; but he is acting more the man of God than Rev. Wright. Obama is following his calling; whether or God or his own design. He is being true to himself.
Rev. Wright on the other hand, if he was called; is not doing what a man of God in my opinion should be doing; ministering to his flock and trying to reconcile others to Christ.
The country will respect him more for honest dialog in this issue and others than the crap the three of them are feeding us now. I thought with Obama we were getting chocalate to choose from in addition to the Vanilla crap that we have been handed the last 8 years. Instead we are getting another variety of vanilla with Obama so far.
I don't know if I will vote for Obama; but he at least seemed different earlier on. Wright is right about one thing really; he may be a sell out; not just to his people but to the American people. Maybe Wright will be the catalyst to get Obama in the fight again, telling us really what he thinks and is going to do.
You are so "correct" (I didn't want to use the word "right" there) ... :-) It it is ever the same old game of divide and conquer for control ... and those who "control" our "leaders" have perfected it well over the eons. Sadly, we all keep falling for it and playing "their" game ...
That is what true leadership means; That one leads themselves to do what they believe is right. That one responds to the reality of harm being done in one's presence, not producing clever rhetoric about how others ought to. Had the man simply said he felt regret, for not having taken responsibility, and spending his "personal capital" with Mr. Wright, rather than hoarding it for his own use at some later point . . . I would respect him more.
I may end up voting for him, but not because I think he ought to be the President of our nation. Several better choices were "killed" I think, by those who controlled the major media, as Felix has proposed.
Obama is a phony and a liar...the fact that he is also a whooz and can't deal with a strong woman like Hillary means nothing to me. Why does everyone feel the need to play mother hen to this lightweight. The Democrats want to hand over the White House to Bush policies for another four years...fine...but, don't start crying about it afterwards.
This guy is so transparent and such an affected actor...hammy...how can people not see through him. Totally plastic. Word is out the Republicans want this guy bad...and they want him now...so hurry up and finish burying Hillary. Ironic isn't it...the Republicans were deathly afraid of Hillary...the Democrats played their' hitman.
Well, Anderson Cooper and company over at CNN, also, must be given some credit along with the Democrats' good old Men's Club...Ted and Kerry and Joe and Bill Richardson and oh, but the list is sooo long and even the Hermit Princess Caroline who deigned to descend from her' ivory tower to greet the messiah. The Beatlemania of the 21st century...it's scary. The Bush brown-nosers all over again...only with a different...
Reverend Wright is not after his' 15 minutes of fame...he has been ridiculed and turned on by one of his' star disciples...who refered to him analogously as 'a crazy old uncle' such condescending from this snot of a man was too much too keep Jeremiah's mouth shut.
You shouldn't be judging the sincerity of this pastor's commitment to God or whether God approves or disapproves of his' conduct as a man of God. That's something between him and his' maker. That is unless you're running the personnel office up in Paradise.
Obama lied and dissembled about his' awareness of Reverend Wright's religious and political views. That is decidedly not credible...the guy's full of crap...he not only knew...he approved. Louis Farrakhan was given an award November of last year by the whatchamacallit church that Obama has been a member of for 20 years...Obama was not aware of this? Jeremiah and Louis took a trip to Libya in 1994 to consort with Qadafi...was Obama out of the loop on this one, too.
This is not about 'race' in general...this is about one issue in particular...why did Obama wait 20 years to repudiate the views of Reverend Wright when he just happend to be running for President? There is one specific issue...so don't obfuscate it with this talk about race relations...conciliation and the other stuff. This is about Wright's racism and possibly Obama's.
As for getting dirty...Obama has been playing the racist' victim card from day one along with the people that support him...not for the content of his' character but for the color of his' skin. What We, the Other People, that are not dumb struck by the glorious presence of the junior senator from Illinois are focused on is the content of his' character...the color of his' skin is irrelevent.
To, Obama, stop lieing and answer the question truthfully without the dressing and pitiful dog face looks.
Wright needs to respond to Obama's statements yesterday and I'd like to ask the Reverend how long exactly has he been preaching what he's been preaching that has brought us to this point. According to Obama...this is all new stuff...the Reverend Wright never preached like this before.
My belief is that Reverend Wright has been preaching this message for a long, long time. This is easily found out, but, don't count on it. Investigative journalism with integrity does not live in the corporate media...especially when is comes to their' favored candidates.
I have walked out of churches in mid-service with my whole family in tow for much less than what Jeremiah spews out. Obama is lieing and I don't care that he does it eloquently and is a great orator in the process of delivering his' politically expedient lies.
I wonder if this is the first time the Reverend Wright has been escorted by the Nation of Islam to deliver one of his' hominies. Obama, of course, wouldn't know...and his' devotees must certainly wouldn't care.
Felix, you confuse me here? On the one hand you say I should not judge the sincerity of ones commitment to God and on the other hand you talk about this probably being a consistent message of Rev. Wright and your walking out of a church for less than what the Rev. Wright is saying?
I said that a minister of the Gospel should not be divisive but one that preaches a message of reconcilement to God through Jesus Christ. And I said a true man of God will walk in his calling; that being if he is called to be a business man, lawyer, street cleaner or minister of the Gospel. And my point is that between Rev. Wright and Obama; I think Obama is more properly following his calling; that of a politician than the Rev. Wright is of being a minister of the Gospel of Christ.
I don't judge the man but the message he is espousing. The same as you would if you walk out in the middle of church because you know that the minister is not speaking God's truth.
There are always at least two ways of seeing things because no two people can physically occupy the very same space at the very same time ... thus (+/-) is always a differentiation of our given objective physicality.
Christ (spiritually) tells you though, "that when two or more gather in my "name" I will be there" ...
So in this/that regard, the Reverend Jeremiah Wright is every bit as much a "Christian" as any other man or preacher ... he just has a different view about it all than maybe you would. Not every Christian (which I am also one from "my" own perspective) has the very same view of what Christ means, or is all about ... the Nicene Creed is only a bunch of words that are but a world meaning that nowhere near represents the REAL meaning of that name !
Anyway, the Reverend speaks from a different perspective that tells his followers the view of that perspective, a very valuable one for them because it gives them the alternative truth that is so abhorrent to the mainline conservative white message that most people in this country buy into ... the one held by those so critical of the Reverend, the one that would take his words out of context and endlessly loop them in all of media forever to make "their" specific point of judgementalisms.
The Truth is the Truth and it most often has two sides (+/-) and NOT always does that stand for valuation of good/bad or right/wrong, usually, in truth, it is just about equals BUT opposites ... (+=-)
Now as you might guess, here comes your "Christian" lesson ... it is the REAL Christ, the Spiritual One, that is there when two or more Gather in his name ... the Equalizer (the moderator of any "argument") the Trinity member (=) that BRIDGES the void (/) of duality ... (+=-)>(+/-) ... !!!
Think about it ...
Truth on earth IS relative, there ARE two sides to every story ... and in highest Truth (that ofGod/Spirit) there is the only ONE that can really know the whole story and rightly judge.
That is the Truth of our Universe ! So, at least, quit taking the Reverends words OUT OF TEXT ... just try for a change to understand the ENTIRE meaning ... it would BE the Christian thing to do ... you do not even have to agree with it ... but allow the others to have their truth ... and let God work it out for them ... He truly IS anyway, whether you know it or not ... :-)
Amen. This hits at the entire Wright involvement in a nutshell.
But I did want to say, I do not judge Rev. Wright; as far as his being a believer of Christ or even a true minister; I don't know all the facts and I don't know his heart. I will leave that for God to discern. But we are all called to use common sense and judgement of facts and actions to somewhat discern what may be going on in a heart. "For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks. "(last part of Luke 6.45)
And as you so clearly stated; in or out of context; what the Rev. Wright is saying is not Godly or helpful to any of the issues we face.
This is garbage. If truth is relative then I believe that the moon is made of green cheese and the earth is flat. If that is my truth; then don't judge me to be foolish and ignorant because I choose this to be my truth.
Truth is truth whether we agree or not and whether we believe or not and whether we even know or not.
Now getting at the truth in a philosophical or religious discussion may not be conclusive; but just because we don't know what the truth is does not make the truth that is there relative.
I know this, and if others do not, that is their problem not mine.
As for the "defense" of my views ... it MUST be taken into consideration that they are based upon transcendent subjectivity of what I call the "larger picture", the spiritual reality where all truths can come together appreciating their relativity rather than conflicting about them ...
I always must try and bridge the "apparent" reality of the objective prioritized folks with the subjective related to the "greater whole" ... where I may be seen as divisive, it is NOT because I am, it is because the ego of the seer is divisive, NOT understanding nor allowing that there are more than one, valid, view involving the very same subjects ... did I not already say that ? ... maybe it was on another thread. It is all about perspective.
The Reverend Wright tells it like he sees it ... I give him the benefit of the doubt that his purpose is to wake up his people to the truth of their history from his perspective RATHER THAN that of the historic "leaders" that have imposed their versions upon us all ... which has BEEN, and STILL IS EXTREMELY DIVISIVE !!!
Divisive in so many ways that "they" have kept absolutely as secret as they can from ALL of us "normal" people, those of us that believe just what they/we have been told, most perniciously through a closed and controlled media in all of it's forms ... FOX being the very best example of that. Spinning and twisting everything for effect and claiming otherwise.
I will not go into it all here because I have written extensively on the subject, but there is extreme wealth in the actual hierarchy of world control and domination that is doing all of the dividing and keeping us folks in the mass of humanity fighting with each other about almost everything ... that keeps us busy enough eye-balling each other so that we never look towards those "above" who started it all and keep it rolling for their own greater selfish and greedy "betterment" ... as "they" see things ...
Divide and Conquer (control) is "their" modus operandi ... IF there is evil in this world, "that" is where it resides and operates from ... and I believe "that" is the case ... and there is no amount of feel good coming together for the sake of political correctness that will last in the long run as long as "those" folks are being ignored ...
In my view it is those kind of things that the good Reverend has been trying to expose to those that would listen ... if you are not aware of what I am trying to point out here and will not look into the more than ample evidence that does exist on the Internet and in books outside of our controlled media, then you are a serious part of the problem ... IMnsHO.
The Rev. Wright said, "I am a pastor, not a politician." The historical narrative of black Americans is as valid an account of American history as is the white account. They are different. The black church has played a chief role . Liberation, Transformation and Reconciliation are powerful ideas that are rooted in the black experience. The Rev. Wright's ministry has expressed them in word and deed.
His interview on PBS with Bill Moyers was sober as was his speech to the National Press Club. His personal anger and hurt were evident in the question period following the speech.* It was unfortunate . The Rev. Wright took attacks on him as attacks on his church.
I can't help feeling Obama hurt his pastor's pride some months ago by cancelling a public prayer and changing it to a private one. Perhaps he could have repaired that before the media made an issue of Obama's relationship with his pastor, which, after all, Obama had written of at length in his best-selling books, years before. The Audacity of Hope , the title of one, was a credited quote from Wright.
The Hebrew prophets were not shy about criticizing their people. The pastor's rhetoric is not unpatriotic or rascist if understood and heard in context. I heard Andrew Young , who served as our UN Amassador , remark recently he had used some of the same extreme statements that one hears at times from Wright when he needed to win the cooperation of outraged blacks at times in Atlanta and elsewhere in order to prevent violence. Jimmy Carter knows the sermons in black churches: he has heard them many times. He has said he has heard the same narrative that Wright preaches and is not offended by it.
_______________________
* Right after 9-11-2001 , the former US Ambassador to Iraq, Mr. Peck said "The chickens have come to roost " on Fox News The next day the Rev.Wright referred to Peck in his Sunday sermon. Many of the questions from the media were from people who hadn't read or heard his sermons, which have been available for years on CD and DVD.
My argument has nothing at all to do with racial problems, it has to do with the ultra wealthy being able to control everyone else ... and sadly, when I make that argument I get flack back from those defending them when they are not even known of by most people doing that defending ... they are not in the habit of making themselves the topic of such conversations but they surely exist ... the evidence of it is everywhere for those willing to open their eyes to it and consider it ...
Yes, it is a conspiracy of sorts, probably the greatest ever perpetrated on mankind and because of that wealth generated power and control they have brainwashed everybody into believing that anyone that would even consider such theory as valid, is a fringe kook ... the righteous conservatives on the farther right, that act as apologists for these folks in their ignorance, are the first to yell out with their peer pressure tactics of derogatory name calling if anyone suggests the possibility ... that too often works well against the unsure person with an ego that hates criticism ... that does NOT fit me ... therefore it is up to the likes of myself to speak up about these things.
Of course there are always the theories that are the most ridiculous and naturally unbelievable to use as "typical" of them all ...some of them mentioned above may well be a part of that ... those meant to divert attention from the real ones and make the whole thing appear foolish.
But, what the hell, there is something for everybody and if we make our own realities (as I believe we do) based upon our beliefs as we think them, I sure as hell do not want to sugar coat mine into some "pretty picture" that is not true ... if I cannot have the highest truth I want nothing, neither life nor anything thereafter.
And it is the truth that I claim we all need to base true peace and cooperative brotherhood upon ... if we cannot get such from our religions ... and we do NOT ... why would you think it would come from those whose whole situation depends upon their lying about it ???
Some people see it as a weakness that he tries very hard to take the high road. That says something less than flattering about those people. If and when he has to get down and dirty, he may be good at it after all. It is better if he saves that part of campaigning for the Republicans whether it is he or Hillary who gets the Democrat candidacy
When I walk out on a message being delivered it's because I disagree with the message...I am not passing judgment on whether the person is a commited Cristian or not or if he is approved by God. I have to follow my conscience and my beliefs. I'm a Lutheran for a reason, instead of say an Episcopalian or a Catholic...my theological world-view is more in congruence with that of the Lutherans. That, however does not mean that I think of the other mainline denominations as not being equally orthodox and God approved. My getting up and leaving a hominy that I don't agree with reflects on me and my beliefs not on the minister or priest delivering the message.
There are, however, fringe radical churches...Congregationist in form that do preach a more political and theologically extreme message. In no way is this group headed by Jeremiah Wright the norm in black churches...not the Baptist or Pentecostals or Lutherans or Presbyterians or Mission Board, etc. There references to ethnic experience is no different than it would be in any ethnic church. Extremism is not a component or hate speech.
This is a gross calumny against our' black brethren who preach the message of love as told by Jesus Christ.
I don't know of any church of any ethnicity that would even consider honoring Louis Farrakhan...this is beyond the pall.
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