You are in Missouri. For some reason, although a friend of mine thinks it is weak when natives are offended, I really hate it when entertainers come to Kansas City and don't know on which side of the state line they are performing. It either demonstrates they are lazy (as in they don't give a damn either way because tomorrow they will be in St. Louis) or they have very poor geographical skills. Bill, you might have some justified rancor about Kansas farmers growing corn and you might be right that some people in the audience last night either are, or know, Kansas farmers who grow corn, but the Midland Theater (built in 1927 and notable because it was the first theater in the nation to have air conditioning) is in Missouri. Oh, and I also have in on pretty good authority that the woman who got up as you were mentioning religion wasn't getting up in protest but had to go to the bathroom. Some of my friends were sitting close enough to hear her tell her husband that she was afraid to get up because it might look like a protest, but she didn't think she could hold it. I would imagine since you did imply that was the reason she left, she might not have returned for fear that you might question her reemergence and then she would have to fess up to the whole audience the truth behind the matter, which may have been more embarrassing after everyone assumed her delicate ears could take no more of your religious criticizing ways.
Although the Midland is spectacular (one of those theaters built to rival European opulence) Maher had no other stage props besides a stand for his notes and a small table for his water. His performance was what I expected it to be sort of a cheerleading session about the leaving behind of the Bush Era and the embracement of the beginning of the Obama Era. If you watch his show 'Real Time with Bill Maher' filmed lived on HBO on Fridays, obviously it wasn't on yesterday, you may have heard some of the jokes before. In fact, there was a set up for a joke in which Maher comments how the rightwing is complaining about Obama using a teleprompter when giving his speeches (I know, WTF, hasn't everyone used teleprompters since teleprompters have been available? Hello, time to crawl out of the Stone Age) and he said that the real reason they were complaining was because...then some woman in the audience yelled, "Because he can read!" which was the punch line.
I thought a lot of Maher's philosophy was on target when he talked about how America started to first lose its mojo during the Reagan Administration which was the end of the time where parents could rightfully expect their children to do better than themselves financially. During Reagan government agencies assigned oversight and regulation of sundry industries had huge budget cuts, tax rates for the rich were cut (you know, that whole trickle down thing that never trickles) and somehow the people most affected by these changes were persuaded to praise and almost worship the folks whose ultimate goal was leech the power, wealth, and status of one group and give it to another (all because Reagan, and later Bush, confided that they loved Jesus). Don't worry, I was clapping and cheering and woo-hoo-hooing and representing all of you who wished you were there.
The whole evening took on that 'event' feel from the time we butted into line to park the car (I later explained to the butted-in-front-of driver that I was celebrating my year anniversary out of chemo and my friend had been laid off from her job "So please don't hate us") to when we walked out of the parking garage and were greeted by...The Lemon Sisters? No. The Osmond clan? No. Fred Phelps Family Singers and Protesters? SPOT ON!
Fred himself wasn't there, but alas the family had two young children to hold up hate mongering signs about how 'God Hates Fags' and 'Obama is the Antichrist' and Bill Maher is something (I forgot what their signs were saying). One of the women protesters was wearing the American flag like a beach towel and another had what looked like the flag made into pants except there were some rainbow colors inserted into the inseam as if she didn't quite get that the rainbow motif is associated with a certain group that she thinks have fallen out of favor with her lord...or at least her father (who I surmise must have locked all of his offspring into a basement and fed them on a steady diet of bread, water, and hate - self and otherwise).
It was interesting to see the Phelps folks at a protest. The whole crazy whacked out family is based in Topeka which is easy driving distance to Kansas City, but I have never encountered them before last night. People of course were flipping them the middle digit and others were calling them names, but I and a few others took our cues from the Phelps and had a sing off. You have to give us Midlanders some props in that a impromptu choir of Maher ticket holders started to belt out such classics as 'Amazing Grace' and 'Jesus Loves All the Little Children of the World' (or whatever that title is) with no mind as to any describable key those songs should be sung in. If you are interested in when the Phelps plan to protest next I found this nifty site with their upcoming tour schedule http://www.godhatesfags.com/schedule.html. Be sure to get there early because they bring the kids and if it's a school night they have to get to bed early.
My friend, who is a Republican (cue dant-da-da music) said that she enjoyed the show but she thought Maher was a liberal Rush Limbaugh which I don't necessarily think he is - he is much too thin for one. For another, I don't think that Limbaugh would have half the guts Maher has in doing standup. Further, Maher appears to be pro education and pro educated which I perceive isn't the bulk of Limbaugh's audience. She also thought Maher demonstrated some misogynist attitudes. I can see why she would think that, yet I remain sort of on the fence about it. He is very much a Hugh Hefner type of libertarian. He appears supportive of equality for women while making statements on a perceived feminine ideology that women oppress men's sex drives through commitment - forced monogamy if you will. Without dwelling on it too much, I understand that men might be programmed differently than women when it comes to sex, yet I don't think that women are running in the streets demanding that their men be implanted with tracking devices in order for them to curtail their cheating ways. Commitment is a two way street and there is a very good argument that the institution of marriage is traditionally much more beneficial to men than it is to women.
I did think that there was some stereotyping on Maher's part about Midwesterners. Sure, there are a lot of us wearing trucker hats while supporting said hats with red necks, but even so that doesn't mean that someone with a sunburned neck and trashy hat is a Jesus freak who loves NASCAR. (Maher did have some great NASCAR jokes BTW.) This part of the nation during early part of the last century was known for its radical notions. On an average day if you meet the average Midwestern you see a good person who has solid ideals (meaning that they aren't going to join a cult at the drop of a hat) and who, if you give them a listen, tend to be as opened minded as anyone from the coasts.
I'm glad that Maher addressed the fear mongering that the right has done to persuade people to generally vote against their interests. He had several good points including that Obama has never mentioned anything about gun control yet, apparently due to some e-mail campaign sponsored by the NRA (a friend has a gun nut work buddy who testified that was where he gets his heads up) the gun nuts are buying guns before Obama takes them away. SINCE I HATE GUNS ALL I CAN SAY IS ABOUT THIS IS THAT I WISH IT WAS TRUE! You see, that is the big difference between Limbaugh and Maher, where Limbaugh attracts the fearful in society, Maher tends to wake up the complicit.
Overall, I'm glad I went to the show. It was the sort of performance which provokes discussion not only directly afterwards, but for some time to come. He wasn't necessarily the best standup performer I have ever seen, that mantle is still taken by David Sedaris, but there were a lot of laughs. Although I found some of his outlook on America and Americans a tad depressing, I still thought that it was great to be sitting in an audience which was celebrating that a change has happened and that we always have room for hope.
Westerfield © 2009


Comments: 49
EM, I think that is probably because Bush is no longer around. The one thing you can say that was positive about Bush was that he was a boom to the comedy industry. Maher made a great case about the Republicans having a failing message. My friend has backed away from calling herself a Republican because she feels that there is a lot lacking in the party that she once supported.
You're so right about the lack of comedic fodder now that Bush has left the White House. The man was a walking malapropism. But, I'm more than happy to give up the laughs in exchange for a President with a triple digit IQ.
Anyway...I don't remember exactly what Maher piece(s) I read that I didn't like.
Maybe I got the wrong impression.
Really great review. Excellent writing and I'm with you on the Maher not being the same as Rush. The key difference being, level-headed lefties aren't ashamed of Maher. Level-headed righties are ashamed of Rush.
Thank you for posting to this group whose only purpose is to thank you for posting to this group.
I'm so glad Phelps lives somewhere far away from me. If he was local, I'd have had a heart attack by now. The Bob Jones brainwashing brigade raises my blood pressure as much as I can handle -- I had to wade through a knot of them to see Elton John once, and I could feel the hive mind trying to re-form itself around me, and failing.
He recently produced the film Religulous which lambastes traditional religion for a "legacy of war and ignorance". It concludes with Maher preaching an odd brand of eco-progressive-atheism.
What bothers me most about all things Maher is the way he demands we pump up our prejudices and check our intellect at the door to enjoy his humor. Sitting through Maher's film is like spending an evening at a diner party trying not to discuss the elephant trumpeting in the living room.
You have to wonder how Maher manages to spend two hours blasting religion without mention of the most salient events of the 20th Century, the murder of 160 million people by anti-deists Clue: Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot were not Islamics, Buddhists, Hindus or Catholics.
It is sad.....that someone who purports to be as bright as Maher can be so dim-witted as to fail to realize it is weltanschauung (world view), not religion, that drives people to slaughter each other. It is sadder still that Maher and his audience need to reinforce their own rather bigoted weltanschauung by attacking others.
If I am not mistaken, Maher is an Athiest.
And I believe religion does have a huge role in the causing wars and differences between people. It may not be the only reason, but it is a big one.
As my LoveMate Donna F. said, we watch "Real Time" every week. Personally, I've always found Maher to be a bit caustic. I find some of his judgments to be too harsh and his condescensions far too Elitist; but I totally love his thought provoking panel discussions.
If Donna and I had a chance to go and see him live, we would; even though I could take it or leave it.
Thanks again. It's always interesting to hear a first person report.
Peace --
EM JAY, he made it clear by ignoring the facts.
The Soviets were atheists, here is just one item in a long, long, long, long list of enviromental disasters by atheists..So why do you think Mr. Maher failed to mention such things in his television program and movies?
So why do you think his audience failed to demand that he mention them?
Inquiring minds want to know.
I just don't make a religion out of it.
elaine d.
Bert, he is probably worth checking out again. You might decide not to like him, but I think he is someone who deserves a second chance at your favor. I used to read a lot of P. J. O’Rourke until I simply wrote him off as a drunk who was past him prime.
John, unfortunately I thought I had good seats, but they weren’t that good. A couple of my friends were seated on the second roll so I will ask them what they thought about his nose. They said that they could see him sweat.
Cathy, he was good. He didn’t necessarily have me in stitches, but he was funny.
Vicky, usually the people I hang with, even if they aren’t from this part of the country, are usually smart enough to already know that. I think that this is an issue for any community that breaches across two made up lines of existence.
Dusty, great point! Oh, and thank you for the compliment.
Ron, you are preaching to the choir here figuratively and truly. I started to read a book called something like, ‘What is Wrong with Kansas’ which talked about how Kansas started to attract all of these nut cases. Not to harp on my illness again, but I started to read it during that time and I just didn’t have the brain juice to complete it. I’m sure it is somewhere around here and when I spy it, I’ll finish it, and then review it.
Donna, I’m sorry, it was my fault. I do wonder if he goes to these places that he thinks are heartland conservative, which in many ways Kansas City is not, to try and pick up material for his show.
Dame Ruth, always a pleasure to post to your group. I did know that you lived in Kansas City at one time. Yes, I know that he comes off as smug, but then again it is comedy and you have to have some confidence or you end up with ‘take my wife…please’ jokes or you become Jay Leno.
Dorothy, I have never noticed that before although I have seen him take control of a conversation on his show when people are talking over each other.
Kris, I know you southerners get worse than we do. We’re just stereotyped as farmer’s daughters who’ll give you a toss in a haystack.
My friend said the Phelps family were protesting at an Elton John concert in Kansas City a few years ago. I still think that they might just be a big joke in that they are maybe paid to be professional a-holes. Their signs looked very professionally done. I just have my suspicions.
Greg, good point. I haven’t seen his film yet, although I imagine that it will show up on HBO soon. Let’s face it communism was a religion without the whole life after death thing. Any time you act irrational because of an ideology, I think you have to step back and ask yourself why. My parents saw the film and both of them were struck by how Maher didn’t seem to understand why people are religious except that perhaps they are stupid. Believe me, I have seen my fair share of stupid people who can spew religious scripture at a drop of a hat, yet I know that religion in the form of churches offers people very tangible things that they might not have without it. There is a sense of community of people who prescribe to certain faiths that goes beyond their particular self contained community of worship. There is also the benefits of belonging to a community. For me, I hate that sort of community worship thing, but I understand that others enjoy it. I understand too that there is some relief in a belief system which prescribes a certain A + B = C element to it. I think that Maher really misses the point that anthropologists have yet to uncover any sort of community that does not have some sort of spiritual/religious belief system.
Donna, he is an atheist. He did have a funny bit about how he wasn’t molested by a priest when he was young and that he took offense to it because now he feels as if he was an ugly child.
EM, I totally agree with you there. The thing I found so nauseating about Bush was all of his Jesus talk as he started a war – quite frankly, and grant you I’m not a Christian, but I would think that would be something someone would do if he was all red and had pointy horns…now, who could I be thinking of? Could it be Saaaaatan?
One of the greatest things about America was that we had freedom of religion which also meant by default that we had freedom from religion as well. I think any belief system is flawed when it tries to persuade people to join by saying that if you don’t you will burn in hell and not live in heaven. I think life, spirit, and our souls are much more complicated than we can comprehend. Thus I out myself as someone who has strong spiritual beliefs but thinks all religious writing is allegorical at best and at worst stupid.
Ky, I don’t think he says too many things that are outrageous on my radar. He isn’t Ann Coulter or drug addled Rush Limbaugh.
Bill, beyond all else, I think it would be a blast to be part of his panel. The next best thing would be to watch ‘Real Time’ in the studio (although you probably have to wait forever and go through a lot of security). I think you would have fun because it was such an event like atmosphere, something you usually don’t get for a standup comedian.
Greg, but don’t you think any belief system can be dangerous if carried to extremes? I stand by my point that communism was a religion. There are individuals that are worshiped in that they are seen as not having fault. Stalin’s purges were done because a certain class of peasant farmers didn’t fit into the ideology. Mass murder is never based on sanity, but sometimes it is justified by expediency.
Jeff, who has the larger fan base? I’m guessing Limbaugh with the lowest common denominator.
Elaine, that’s great. You know what else is great? You don’t have to sign your name after a comment because the way the Gather comment program is laid out it does it for you. Just FYI.
Lee.
It's the mixing of these terms that clouds people's minds and makes for some very silly yet damaging assumptions.
Religion, in any form, has potential for great good and great harm. In the last sixty years, we have seen Chritianity on both the forefront and rear-guard of the civil rights struggle.
So what does that say about religion? It says religion reflects human nature.
But let's talk about humor and Bill Maher. The noted psychologist Patricia Keith-Spiegel identified two primary reasons why people laugh:
- We laugh out of surprise.
- We laugh when we feel superior.
In my personal view, the worst humor depends on putting other people down. All ethnic, racist and sexist humor is built upon this need to feel superior to someone else. Yet surprisingly, so is the best of humor. Nothing is better for the human spirit than to find the person we are laughing at, is ourself.
Maher spends way to much time confirming the biases of his fans rather than challenging his audience to laugh at the myriad of ways they resemble the very people who they look down on..
The one time I was financially able to fork over some big bucks for a ticket, the show was mysteriously canceled.
I also love his sister Amy.
They are delightfully twisted.
BTW, I just put in a 'reserve' request at the library for "Survival of the Sickest".
Darren, I know, that poor woman, I heard about her plight after the show. Bill, that’s what happens when you make assumptions!
Greg, thank you for your compliment. I agree that some of Maher’s humor is based on the feeling of superiority but most of it isn’t. I do have to disagree with Keith-Spiegel’s analysis on humor. As someone who laughs a lot I know that there are several things that I find humorous that have nothing to do with surprise or feelings of superiority…after all, if I laugh at myself, which I have been known to do on more than one occasion, am I doing it because I have surprised myself or because I am feeling superior to myself? Personally I think humor is one of those grandest gifts that humans have and it has saved me from despair more than once in my life. Probably the best thing that has happened to this country lately is that politics have been so humor provoking that shows such as ‘The Daily Show,’ ‘The Colbert Report,’ and ‘Real Time with Bill Maher’ have flourished. In many ways these shows are responsible for politics being cool again and have served the newest and most energetic of generations to participate.
Mugg, you are really going to hate me, but the last time I saw David Sedaris he was giving a free reading of his latest book. I started an article about it, now you have inspired me to finish it.
Marti, so I take it that he can’t expect you to pay forty dollars for a ticket any time soon.
Elaine, anything to help a fellow Gatherer.
A big part of laughing at ourselves is poking fun at the part of ourselves that we feel foolish about. It's taking the fun path toward improvement.
I am not too much a fan of Steward, Colbert and Maher because of their smug partisanship. I find something like South Park wickly funny because EVERY ox is gored.
Here is an excellent take on the state of American political humor by the British Magazine Spiked So, when will it be OK to mock Obama?
Now there is something to think about.
Speaking of Phelps-- there are several interesting "God Hates Figs" sites...
I LOVE JESUS (it's his fan club that drives me crazy).
Michael, he is an odd one. Although he preaches hate he often inspires love and understanding.
Greg, how true, how true.
Stalinism, Maoism, etc, are indeed dogmatic ideologies that are power-oriented and repress dissent like some religions at some points in history. It's those elements that cause the mess, not particular weltanschauungen, whether they're religious or otherwise.
I also immediately missed self-deprecating humor, as well as a sense of the absurd from Patricia Keith-Spiegel's "list". (Perhaps we should recommend Sedaris to her?)
I didn't suggest that weltanschauungen causes a mess, though it can. What I was getting at is too many intellectuals who lambast religion fail to realize their weltanschauungen is little more than proto-religion.
Self-deprecating humor appeals to the sense of superiority in others and the sense of absurdity speaks directly to "surprise".
Lisa, there is no frigging way on earth that I could hate you, but damn you got to see him for free?
I just saw a notice that he's gonna be somewhere around my neck of the woods, but the tix start at $30, so I am S.O.L.
I am eagerly awaiting your article.
Greg, I still think that there is more to humor than just that – it’s like saying only two things really encompass anger or being sad. In fact, the article I referred to in the above comment was inspired by this debate. I will also add that I think humor is a more complex, in the form of laughing, is a more complex emotion than anger, sadness, or fear.
Mugg, I’ll try to post it some time this week. FYI, it’s called, ‘How Much is that David Sedaris in the Window.’
It's important to keep in mind that Maher is a comedian, who also happens to be both smart and politically aware. So his schtick is to merge his political activist views into his routine. He thinks, which means some of his stuff is too cerebral for some, and some of it is too liberal for some (I doubt any of it is too conservative for any). But again, he is a comedian, so we really should look to him more as an entertainer than as a source of policy-making.
The suggestion that he is the liberal version of Rush Limbaugh is correct in one way, and absolutely incorrect in another. Like Limbaugh he makes his money off his political commentary with enough humor to make it palatable. But whereas Maher tries to get people to think with his political humor, Limbaugh tries to keep people from thinking. I know some will think this sounds partisan, but think about it (pun intended). Maher's humor forces people to look at the logic of the situation, and even if you totally disagree with his position, you have to see the logic in the thought process. Limbaugh just rants - try following a logical thought process in the vast majority of what he says. You can't. This has nothing to do with whether you are liberal or conservative or somewhere in between; this has everything to do with critical thinking.
We need more critical thinkers. They can be conservative or liberal or independent, but they must think critically.