2008: an Election There for the Stealing....Again (Reposted)

It's dead, at least in it's public incarnation. There was an article a while back I read in the LA Times that quoted the instigator of it where he announced it's death.

Yes you really are crazy. The software going out too early just puts it over the edge. Reality escapes you once again

People better WAKE up !!!!!!!!!

You're right, Don. You should too. Wacky Conspiracy theories get us no where.

Publicless,
The truth is, the biggest conspiracy theory is that you have a brain to evaluate reality. Even I don't believe that one.

That is because you are one of the authors of said wacky conspiracy theory. Time and time again you do not care about working to find real solutions just spreading hate and conspiracy theories.

Ain't no theory pubic , people went to jail here , not the ones that should have but some did.

If they do it in 2008 , we should burn Washington to the ground and start over .

Who went to jail for rigging an election Don, Come on give us a list and what they did

Jacqueline Maiden, elections coordinator of the Cuyahoga County Elections Board, and ballot manager Kathleen Dreamer each were convicted of a felony count of negligent misconduct by an elections employee.

They also were convicted of one misdemeanor count each of failure to perform their duty as elections employees.

Many more are pending, Publicless. 56 out of 88 counties ordered to preserve the ballots from 2004 by a district court judge, destroyed them. Others are still being investigated in the recount scandal.

Yes two people in one county and guess what the third was acquitted. Why were they tried..a dispute over the procedures of the sample. I think a few bueracrats made some mistakes in procedures intresting to not one of the convicted was a democrat.

Yes and when they recounted the ballots in Florida the election was not stolen. Lets move on. The best is your computer sofware conspiracy which is such BS that it is funny.

The Florida Election, as we just recently learned, was effected by the choice of a Republican owned (by a hard core Bush supporter) company to supply non standard card stock and misalign the chads on their machines, creating the chad scandal in the first place,

And a COMPLETE recount of all Florida ballots would have shown Gore the victor.

In half of the scenarios the media consortium considered, gore won, as well. Ironically, the one he lost was the one he was sueing for, but then, the scenario Bush's campaign wanted would have had Gore the winner. But as I said above, a recount of all of Florida would have revealed Gore won the state, period.

Plus Katherine Harris ordered, against Florida law, that thousands of ballots that should have been counted, be thrown out.

Then there was the infamous felons list from Texas, which should never have been employed in Florida in the first place, that disenfranchised thousands of voters, mostly hispanic and black, that had never committed any crime.

It depends on which standard you use in Florida. Your argumen about the card stock in crazy because the card stock would have effected all votes not just one party.

But Gore fought against counting the whole state. The fact is the election is over and we have our President. It was not a conspiracy theory it was a close election and no election is perfect. JFK became President with massive cheating and we survied. The hatred gets up nowhere.

Card stock was only sent to one county. Guess which one, Publius? So your argument there is BS.

Those votes thrown out by Harris illegally would have made all the rest unneccesary and Gore would have been that president, Publicless.

The hatred, is for you and yours, so I fully understand the "move along, there's nothing to see here" attitude, but it's bS, just like all your arguments.

Harris was never proven to do anything illegal even with all the extra scruitany. And the designer of the ballot that cost gore the election was a democrat and gore supporter (remember the butterfly ballot) we could do this all night but it does not change the fact we have a President. Where is your outrage over Kennedy?

Conspiracy Theory is those that refuse to accept reality. Like the 9/11 truthers

She was never prosecuted (imagine that), but she was found to have violated Florida law in the tossing of thousands of ballots where voter intent was easily determined.

There's no theory to it Publicless, it's a proven fact, get over it.

Ron there is not proof of that actually just claims. It is a theory because it is all accusation and hersey. Where is the outrage for Kennedy?

My outrage over Kenndy that was elected when i was seven or eight? Come on, Publicless, why would I have outrage over something from my father's generation, and done by men long dead. I will say, if there was fraud, I would think we would have seen prosecutions. That's what you folks always say, isn't it?

There is proof, it's public knowledge, and your denials mean nothing, because you are lying, but that's ok Publius, just keep on saying there's no place like home, and clicking your heels together, and maybe you'll be transported back to 2000, your heydays, when no one opposed your thievery.

Its not thievery. Its funny when Republicans win something is wrong when Democrats commit fraud it is justice. This is just hate lets address real issues.

Nixon, in an uncharacteristic moment of graciousness, conceded Illinois to Kennedy. There were a lot of relatively objective people who feel that the presidential vote that year was manipulated according to time honored Illinois custom. They used voting machines. Talk about the touch screen terminals being vulnerable to tampering. Geez.

I was in high school living 20 miles north of Chicago at the time. It was fairly big in the local news. It was only fairly big because election fraud was considered normal in Illinois at the time.

Kind of like Florida today, eh?

Interestingly enough, most thieves don't look at it as stealing.

And this isn't just hate, it's an attempt to prevent further thievery by exposing the extent of the crime to the light of day.

Strangely enough, thieves seem to prefer the darkness.

"JFK became President with massive cheating and we survied. The hatred gets up nowhere."

Apparently, Publius, when it's your side that is disenfranchised, it leads to assassinations, not conspiracy theory. Now that IS a conspiracy theory, but I always figured Nixon had a hand in that one. He wasn't known for ever being a good loser.

I will not waste my time to show pubic I am telling the truth.

Pubis the truth is out there look it up yourself .(try Google):-)


Unless you are AFRAID of the TRUTH .

or YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH

So now you will stoop to thinking that republicans killed kennedy. You are funny. The fact is that in the end democracy works because big people like Nixon and Gore move on and live to fight another day. Apparently Ron and Don dont see that. They will excuse a president that pardons people who give money to his brother and law, perjures himself, and defrauds the nation. But, you will expose your hatred to another president just because he is a Republican.

Stoop to? Vas iss Stooped to? The man in these United States that had the most burning hatred of Kennedy after being beaten, and as you say, probably illegally, for the position of President, and later displayed the almost pathological ability to hate his political enemies, and mounted complex campaigns to extract revenge on them, was Richard Nixon. If you follow the advice of most homicide investigators, you look at those that had the best reason to kill the victim, and for Kennedy, that came down to a short list, and almost no one includes Nixon, why is that, you think?

Hey Publicless, it isn't like we're moving and shaking the whole US here, give the paranoia a rest, and just discuss the issue without all the phony posturing.

Nixon was kinda whacked out, you know? He had severe paranoia issues, and thought the whole world was out to get him, which prompted him to do a lot of stupid things.

And Publius, I WAS a Republican back then.

Nixon had a LOT of issues. The fact is that your hatred of Bush just shield you from actually having to deal with the complexities of issues that face that nation

I great article is out today from the wall street journal addressing it.

http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110010861

Well, Ill have to go see what Rupert has to say.

And Publicless, the major issues that need addressed by that nation, for the most part, are those caused by Bush, I'm sorry to be the one that told you, but it's true. He's set us up to fail, and there's little that can be done about a lot of it, but the guilty should be prosecuted, or it will happen again.

Publicless, that article, after just two paragraphs, is more of the drivel the conservatives find themselves putting out, because they see their ass in a sling, and getting worse. It seems funny that those who had no mercy for progressives the last decade or so, are upset because those people now hate them. I wonder how that happened? Hating Bush is neither unjustified, or even unusual. People throughout history have hated despots that oppressed them. This is no different. That you find yourself supporting this little tin dictator says much about you, but virtually nothing about progressives that reasonably hate a highly deserving recipient.

So is Clinton hating okay??

Does it matter if I think it is or not, Publius? That's the point.

Sorry...but....saying it in a nice way..."Bull".

MDP -

I loved the article, and quite predictably, Ron hated it. But not because it was untruthful. No, it's because he's a hater. He hates Mr. Bush. He hates Mr. Cheney. He hates the war in Iraq. He hates the troops. He hates this guy, he hates that guy.

Like Peter Berkowitz's story enumerates, Ron, and those like him, have an irrational hatred. It has grown far larger than is justified. Only Mr. Bush or Mr. Cheney's blood will satisfy their lust.

Carol, which part?

Bret,
It's fully justified. not their blood, just a little stroll down impeachment lane, and maybe a nice jail cell for just a few of the laws of our land they have broken with impunity. Maybe waterboarding, and some of the treatment they've prescribed for others, I don't know, blood isn't necessary, a bloodless regime change would be ok, I guess.

Ron -

You'll need witchcraft to make impeachment happen.

Regime change will happen, about a year from now.............just like the Constitution guarantees. The blood-lust you Lefties have is highly entertaining, mainly because it will never be satisfied. It's based on irrationality, and fantasy-land thinking - something you guys have perfected in the 7+ years of whining and complaining since your first really horrible defeat.

Gee Bret, would that be you speaking from your own experience with Bill? LOL Just because you say something, doesn't keep the universe from biting you in the butt, and that's why you're a thirty percent loser right now. The universe may just bite you in the butt again, you never know.

Ron -

Based on Left Wing losses since the 2006 midterm elections, I think it's pretty safe to say Impeachment is highly improbable. Every road to it's continued appeal to the Left has been blocked............usually by other Lefties. And THAT is the funniest part!

I just noticed the DOJ probe into the illegal wiretapping is now reopened, Bret.......

Ron -

Good. Now that the laws have been rewritten to account for all previous NSA wiretapping activities, do you really think this will uncover anything new? Its a show for all you naybob Lefties screaming for investigations. One will be done, just for you guys. Nothing will be found, and another Conspiracy Theory will be born. You'll howl like a stuck pig for 7+ years, and life will go on..............for everyone except your type.

I could care less, I just wanted to see another tick in the corner of your pathetic thirty percenter eye. I'm already past all that and planning for the Democratic ascendancy. lol

Ron -

What is this thirty percent you keep babbling on about? The Center/Right has been identified as far more than a mere thirty percent. Even 36% like President Bush, so in that sense that would be your zero-barrier. Not sure of the number, but I would guess that you could add in about 20 percent or more as "swing voters". These folks are classic Centrists who don't particularly love or hate Mr. Bush, but they like at least some of his policies. They definitely are not Liberals.

So from that simple, non-scientific math, your "30 percent" figure is clearly wrong.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/political_updates/
president_bush_job_approval

And Ron, you're not past anything. You're still yelping about Mr. Bush "stealing" the 2000 election. That was 7 years ago. So be truthful...........at least with yourself : you'll still do or say whatever it takes to kick perceived mud up on anyone without a Socialist agenda.

Just what America doesn't need - bigger government that eats up more of your income, and gives away larger and larger percentages of that revenue to those that don't pay for the services.

You haven't seen the center since you went down the center of your mothers chute, Bretboy, your ideology is right wingnut all the way. Thirty percent loser, that's you. I'm past many things, but not the idea you idiots aren't going to try to steal another election, that's true. It isn't in you to run on issues, you'd lose every time. As for bigger government, could you be funnier. Check the growth the last six years under Dush bag.

Ron -

30%? Of what?

You still think the 2000 and 2004 elections were stolen..........don't you?

I don't agree with bigger government under any President. Not Washington, not Lincoln, not Kennedy, not Clinton, not Bush. And no, not even Reagan.

However, with over 50% of all Federal Revenue going towards Entitlements and interest payments on those Entitlements, I see almost no way to pare back future governments. It's almost as if there is a C.O.L.A. on the size of government.
Read George Will's statistics. They'll stun you :

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A33569-2005Feb17.html

Bretboy,
Any way you cut it, a full recount of Florida would have had Gore the winner, so that means, if all the cheating, lying, hanging chad intentional chit hadn't gone on, if the Republicans hadn't put obstacle after obstacle in the way of the will of the people, even if it would have been accidental, which it was not, Gore had the election stolen from him. HE got more votes, period. In Ohio, in 2004, we know for a fact there were many obstacles placed in the way of Democratic voters, Bretboy. Average wait to vote in Republican precincts, 10 minutes, in Democratic ones, 10 hours. That's not stolen, no, that was just really unfortunate planning on the distribution of voting machines, and a few other things, right. You' guys are pathetic. We wont even talk about the precincts that brought in way more votes for Bush than there were voters in the precinct, and unbelievable vote totals that were just BS for Bush in areas that no one thought he could get one vote in , let alone the majority. Never mind skanker, we'll just say you're full of it, and leave it at that.

Applying interest to entitlement funds just means one thing Bretboy, you all stole the money, and it's now part of the deficit, isn't it? Cleaning out our treasury and distributing it to corporate interests and the elite was the whole purpose of this administration. Feed the beast, and they've done a good job, but you try taking away social security, and there'll be blood in the streets, and it won't be poor people's, mark those words.

Ron -

If what you're saying is true, then why did Gore give up so quickly?

In 2004, the election wasn't even close. The normal 1/100 of a percent of voter irregularities made no difference, even if all of them went to Kerry. He lost by 5%. That's too huge to overcome. All 50 Secretaries of State validated their elections as legitimate. Some were Democrats, some were Republicans.

Average wait in a Democratic precinct, 10 hours? Ummm, were did you pull that statistic from, Ron? Let's see your sources on that one.
I voted in downtown Chicago, in one of the most heavily populated Democratic precincts in all of America, and it took no longer than 30 minutes total.

And Ron, I'm not sure you understand how government finance works, so I'll give you a crash course : when the government borrows money to pay for already-approved and "funded" entitlement programs (think : Welfare, Social Security, ADC, Medicaid, etc.) and the IRS revenue that year was inadequate to cover those programs, the government borrows money. Both Democrat and Republican do it. Well, that money needs to be paid back, otherwise no more money can be borrowed in the future. So the interest that these entitlements accrue are paid back first. Over years and years of government borrowing, these 'Interest On Entitlement' payments have accumulated. There is no way around them.

Ron, when Social Security goes completely and utterly bankrupt in a few years, there will be no blood in the streets. People will simply put their former SSID $ into a private account, as Mr. Bush has suggested on many occasions. By then, we'll all be forced by economic realities beyond our control to implement this excellent alternative to a very wasteful and costly program.

I'm already ready for that day............are you?

"If what you're saying is true, then why did Gore give up so quickly?"

Were you in a box underground somewhere? Gore didn't "give up" The SCOTUS Stole the election for Bush. One and only time the SCOTUS ruled on state elections, and then they quickly issued an edict that the case could not be used for precedent. Hmmm...I wonder how those Bush I appointed justices carried the day and did that?

"In 2004, the election wasn't even close. The normal 1/100 of a percent of voter irregularities made no difference, even if all of them went to Kerry. He lost by 5%. That's too huge to overcome. All 50 Secretaries of State validated their elections as legitimate. Some were Democrats, some were Republicans."

Except that there were a lot more than you claim, of course, except proving it's a little hard when 56 out of 88 counties ordered by the court to preserve the ballots destroy them. Courts move slowly, many cases are pending, or yet to be filed, after investigations are completed, but it's pretty hard to believe that they lost their homework, or their dog ate it, innocently. .

"Average wait in a Democratic precinct, 10 hours? Ummm, were did you pull that statistic from, Ron? Let's see your sources on that one. I voted in downtown Chicago, in one of the most heavily populated Democratic precincts in all of America, and it took no longer than 30 minutes total."


Not talking national you boob, Ohio, where Blackwell made sure the democratic precincts either didn't have enough machines, or they were sent malfunctioning ones, and then waited all day for someone to fix them. Many democrats went home without voting, obviously.

"And Ron, I'm not sure you understand how government finance works, so I'll give you a crash course : when the government borrows money to pay for already-approved and "funded" entitlement programs (think : Welfare, Social Security, ADC, Medicaid, etc.) and the IRS revenue that year was inadequate to cover those programs, the government borrows money." No, let's think this illegal war, and all Bush's greedy feed at the trough cronies in corporatville. The entitlements aren't and weren't the problem, this dickhead and his war are.

" Both Democrat and Republican do it. Well, that money needs to be paid back, otherwise no more money can be borrowed in the future. So the interest that these entitlements accrue are paid back first. Over years and years of government borrowing, these 'Interest On Entitlement' payments have accumulated. There is no way around them."

Nice line of crap, but we know where we were before Bush and the Republican congress, and we know where we are now, and you're not selling that load to any thinking person. It's the war and republican corruption, stupid, to paraphrase an idea that finally DID sink in with you idiots, once.

"Ron, when Social Security goes completely and utterly bankrupt in a few years, there will be no blood in the streets. People will simply put their former SSID $ into a private account, as Mr. Bush has suggested on many occasions. By then, we'll all be forced by economic realities beyond our control to implement this excellent alternative to a very wasteful and costly program.

I'm already ready for that day............are you?"

You better hang on to your ass if that happens, bucko, because there will be more than just me out looking for somebody's hide, on that day. What's your address?, I might just look you up first, lol. They don't call it the third rail for nothing.

Bretboy- "Silly liberals, politics are for kids" lol

Ron -

Gore conceded. After that, there just wasn't anything more to be said. That should have been the end of the story. Only you Conspiracy Theorists have kept this nonsense alive all these years.

Now you're just being ridiculous, Bret Boy, he did because Bush's cousin called the race for Bush at Faux, and when he found out the lie of it, he retracted. That's not binding, idiot, it's merely etiquette.

Silly Ron, no Lib watches Fox News, and no Lib believes anything on Fox News. Once you quit, that's it. And that's what Gore did. He was a serious guy in a serious race who knew he'd lost. Etiquette or not, he quit.

Ron -

Ohio is hardly the whole country, even if absolutely EVERYTHING you say is true............which is highly unlikely. Only you crackpots are still hanging on to this after 7+ years.

Why aren't you nutjobs pushing this as a reason for impeachment? Or are you? Its as absurd as all the other "charges".

Bretboy,
This is just a really silly conversation we've had a hundred times already, yawn.......

Ron -

I'm just categorically picking apart your arguments with logic. Because when you examine your whining point by point, you really don't have an argument............that's why you get frustrated. You Libs start to chafe when anyone doesn't immediately see and agree with your point. A factual challenge brings about name-calling and more whining. I'd rather just stick to the facts, and answer each of your points, item by item. I don't think you want to do something like that, because at the end your arguments just don't hold any water. Complaining is like that..............it sounds good to the whiner, but when studied it turns out to have no (or little) basis in fact.

Like your Ohio argument. If this had affected 30% of the vote count, I'd be right there with you saying this vote was a travesty. But it wasn't. Not even close.
You're yowling over a few hundred votes, that may actually have mostly gone to Mr. Bush anyways.

Yes Bretboy,
The world is the lie you see it as, I was soo wrong, there's absolutely no indication that 2000 and 2004 were stolen, it's all conspiracy theories, now go away, and bore someone else to tears, OK?

Good, at least you see that these Conspiracy Theories are nothing more than adult fairy tales.