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by Collins Nonfiction
Member since:
July 12, 2007

Live Chat for Animal Lovers, TODAY @ 4PM ET - "SUPERDOVE" w/ Author Courtney Humphries

August 27, 2008 02:54 PM EDT (Updated: August 28, 2008 02:49 PM EDT)
views: 340 | comments: 102
Why do we see pigeons as lowly urban pests and how did they become such common city dwellers? In her new book, Superdove, Courtney Humphries traces the natural history of the pigeon, recounting how these shy birds that once made their homes on the sparse cliffs of sea coasts came to dominate our urban public spaces. While detailing this evolution, Humphries introduces us to synanthropy: The concept that animals can become dependent on humans without ceasing to be wild; they can adapt to the cityscape as if it were a field or a forest.

Whether you feed the pigeons, detest them, or just find them to be a fascinating bird, join us for a live chat TODAY, August 28th @ 4PM ET within the comment field of this article. If you can't make the chat, leave a question now. (It's recommended you bookmark the chat to easily find it.)


Learn more about this book throughout August in the Bright Ideas from Bestselling Authors group on Gather. Click here to join.

Click here to buy the book.


You could be a points winner for joining the chat. One member who submits a question between 4-5PM ET on August 28th will be selected to receive 300 Gather points for participating.



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Expand Tags: collins, bright ideas from bestselling authors, harper collins, books, chat, superdove, pigeons, history, city
Expand To Groups: .....The Book Review....., .....The Writers Review....., Animal Lovers Everywhere!!, Animals Animals everywhere!, Animals: Wild and Tame (Birds & Insects, too.)-(moderated), Book Lovers Club, Book Review Central, Booklovers, Bright Ideas from Bestselling Authors, Gather Books Essential, Minnesota Readers
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Comments: 102

Elizabeth Madrigal Aug 27, 2008, 3:45pm EDT
My son wrote an article for wired.com about pigeons as food... could this be the next evolutionary step? I look at the doves in my yard, and the banded pigeon who occassionallly visits, and I cannot help but think about squab. Here's the link: http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2008/07/does-pigeon-mea.html
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Connie C. Aug 27, 2008, 3:48pm EDT
I love pigeons. I will try my best to be at this chat. I just finished reading the book and will be posting my review soon.
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seƱoritafish (oxyjulis californica) Aug 27, 2008, 5:44pm EDT
Elizabeth, I think one of major points of the book was that pigeons are in our cities because they had been domesticated for food in the first place. Pigeons as food may be more of a fall-back. ;)

The book was a great read, and I am definitely looking at them with a slightly different eye. Hope to have my review done by the end of the week (eyeing all my other deadlines as well). Unfortunately, I'm at work during the chat time (being on the west coast), so I'll try to think of some questions to ask beforehand.
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Ms. Meacham: Money Maven Aug 27, 2008, 6:30pm EDT
I've heard great things about this book! My understanding is that it speaks to societal elements so often overlooked in our observation of nature's nature.

We have a pair of pigeons that originally nested in our attic (we closed up their entry one day while they were out and about). Now they live under the eaves of the home next door. They make a mess, but it's lovely to hear them coo and see them cuddle and watch their individualistic lives from my porch next door.
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April H. Aug 27, 2008, 6:50pm EDT
I judt finished reading this book. I am excited anout the live chat, I hope I remember to make it tomorrow.
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Doc, in the middle, holding on... Curmudgeon esq. Aug 27, 2008, 7:33pm EDT
I am just about finished! I learned SO much about Chrales DARWIN!

Wonderful reading, stays fresh, which many do not!
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EM JAY (Gather Director of Chaos & Uprisings) W. Aug 27, 2008, 9:42pm EDT
I'll be at work tomorrow at 4, but I enjoyed Superdove so much. Here's the link to my review-
http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.jsp?memberId=128483&articleId=281474977423108&nav=MyGather
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Laura Cushing Aug 27, 2008, 9:44pm EDT
I loved the book- will try to make it to the chat!
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Mary M. Aug 27, 2008, 10:46pm EDT
Sounds interesting. I had heard of this book before, either here or in a book lover's e-mail newsletter. I doubt I'll make the chat, though.
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Elizabeth V. Aug 28, 2008, 10:53am EDT
I hope to be here at 4 but may be too busy at work.
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member 1234 Aug 28, 2008, 2:20pm EDT
will try and make it later.
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Sharon B. Aug 28, 2008, 2:51pm EDT
I will try to make it
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:00pm EDT
Welcome to today's live chat with author Courtney Humphries. She'll join us for the next hour to discuss her new book Superdove. For those of you who are not yet familiar with this book, Superdove is a non-fiction title about the natural history of pigeons.
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:01pm EDT
Courtney, there seems to be some confusion between pigeons and doves. Can you explain to us the similarities and differences between the two?
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:02pm EDT
I really enjoyed the book, though I haven't had a chance to post my review yet.

I want to know if the author plans on continuing her research into pigeons now that the book is over- is it an ongoing process, or is she going to study another animal next?
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:03pm EDT
Hello, I remembered to come to the chat!
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:04pm EDT
I am almost done with the book and will have my review in by Saturday
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Heather ~of the Whippets~ M. Aug 28, 2008, 4:04pm EDT
Courtney, good afternoon. I loved your book.
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:05pm EDT
It really is an interesting read, and I too was surprised about Charles Darwin...never would have known of all his studies on pigeons without the book.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:05pm EDT
Hi everyone! It is confusing. The term "pigeon" and "dove" were often used interchangeably (in other languages it's the same word, like "paloma" in Spanish). So when we see iconography of doves in Christianity and other traditions, it is often referring to the same species of pigeons that we see in our street, Columba livia. They belong to a larger family of pigeon and dove species, Columbidae, and until recently were known as rock doves. Now their "official" common name is the rock pigeon. If that's still confusing I can go into more detail!
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:07pm EDT
My 17 yr old is going to read the book once I am done, although along my reading I have read some of it out loud to her.
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:07pm EDT
Courtney,

Is the pigeon native to the U.S., or can the species be found in other countries?
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♠~Dnbuster~♠ ~. Aug 28, 2008, 4:08pm EDT
Hi, everyone!!
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:09pm EDT
Thanks Laura. Researching pigeons got me interested in larger issues of urban ecology and our relationship with wildlife. But I'm not sure I will be pursuing that in the near future; I am interested in lots of different topics in science and culture. Writing pigeons got me interested in shedding light on things that are common but often go unnoticed. So that's something I'd like to keep doing.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:10pm EDT
The pigeons that I'm talking about, Columba livia, are not native to the U.S. They were domesticated thousands of years ago in Egypt and the Middle East and carried throughout the world.
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:10pm EDT
I can tell you one thing....our state fair is starting the end of next week...I've never paid too much attention to the pigeons in the building before but will make a point to check them all out this year LOL
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:11pm EDT
What inspired you to research this bird and to write Superdove?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:11pm EDT
Thanks for your comments Marsha. Everyone should check out a pigeon show! The fancy pigeons are a real trip.
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Princess Spanky Pants ~ The Real, Original, Heather T Aug 28, 2008, 4:12pm EDT
Living in Michigan,w e don't have many pigeons- we're a Sea Gull state. ;) How much work went into researching for your book?
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:13pm EDT
One thing I liked about the book is that it talked about the pigeon's place in history and how important they were at various times during our history as food, messengers, and research tools.

Do you think the perspective we have on pigeons today as urban pests will someday change?

Will pigeons become useful to humanity again in the future?
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:13pm EDT
Sorry I am late.
I have finished the book and I enjoyed it very much. I have always had a love for pigeons even as a child
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Christine Mailey Aug 28, 2008, 4:13pm EDT
Courtney - where did your admiration for pigeons come from? It's fascinating.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:14pm EDT
I have to say that I have never had the opinion of pigeons as being pests. I has a pet one when I was a child
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:15pm EDT
I'm enjoying the pictures in your book showing the different breeds
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:15pm EDT
I didn't know much about pigeons or birds in general when I began this. I was more interested in how they got to be everywhere -- how does a bird become a globalized species? That led me to look into their history and I uncovered so many fascinating stories, such as Darwin's use of pigeons and the history of homing pigeons. I realized that these funny birds actually had a pretty complicated past and an interesting relationship with people. I liked the idea of bringing attention to something people didn't give much thought to.
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:16pm EDT
we don't see the pigeons around here like we used to, in fact, the only place I know I have even seen them recently is up on my church, but a member has now boarded up the areas where they were nesting.....and pooping
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:16pm EDT
When I was a child, it was quite common for pigeons to be rasied for food. My brother and I had one each for pets. One day his came up missing and a few days later mine came up missing. We were told that they probably flew away and I accepted that blindly. Now I realize that we probably ate our own pigeons.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:16pm EDT
Princes SpankyPants (nice name!),
All told I put about 4 years into researching and then writing the book, but it was while I was doing other work as well.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:18pm EDT
There are many flocks of pigeons in our area today but I do not know of any of them that are tame. They seem to just be wild and roost in attics and lofts in the area.
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:18pm EDT
Unfortunately some find pigeons to be a nuisance, which is surprising considering how many people proclaim to be animal lovers. Where do you think this dislike for pigeons came from?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:19pm EDT
Laura,
That's a fascinating question, and I haven't thought much about whether pigeons will be useful again. There's an artist in California who has a project using pigeons to measure air quality -- perhaps that could catch on?
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Princess Spanky Pants ~ The Real, Original, Heather T Aug 28, 2008, 4:19pm EDT
Wow, that is a lot of work, but when it's a topic you love, it probably didn't always seem like work, did it? (Thanks for the name comment ;P)
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:19pm EDT
Courtney,
Has your opinion of pigeons changed as a result of your research?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:21pm EDT
Hi Christine,
Honestly I did not begin this process with an admiration for pigeons, it was more like an intellectual interest. But I really do like them now, and I appreciate them much more after learning so much about them.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:21pm EDT
Marsha,
I have heard of people trying to poison them because they poop on everything. However I know many old timers who do still eat them.
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:23pm EDT
Out of all the fancy pigeons you saw at shows and such, which breed do you think is the most attractive or interesting?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:24pm EDT
You know, I can understand why some people dislike pigeons or find them annoying because they DO poop a lot! And if a pigeon couple is camped out on your balcony, it can be annoying to clean up. But I think a lot of the dislike of pigeons is rooted in the fact that we expect to have complete control over the things and spaces we build and don't always want to share them with wildlife. Pigeons don't fit into what we think a "wild" bird should be like.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:25pm EDT
I wonder if the views of the people when it comes to pigeons have anything to do with the area they live in? For instance, in the city where they care concerned with the poop verses the country where they are considered beautiful and used for food as well.
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Liz Gellar Aug 28, 2008, 4:26pm EDT
Courtney,
I've observed a lot of pigeons with mangled feet. So many I see throughout the city have toes missing! Is it common for pigeons to have some sort of genetic defect? Or do they lose them in accidents?
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:27pm EDT
courtney, I hate to cut out on this chat early, but I need to take my mom to a dr appt.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:27pm EDT
Connie,
That would be sad if you ate your own pigeons! Oddly, I've heard similar stories from other people. I guess that's what you get when you have such an edible pet!

I don't know if my opinion about them changed exactly -- I never disliked pigeons. It's more like I appreciate and notice them much more now.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:27pm EDT
Thanks for coming, Marsha!
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:28pm EDT
Connie I would think the only annoyance people really have with pigeons is the poop thing
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Marsha S. Aug 28, 2008, 4:28pm EDT
I love to sit and listen to them cooing
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:29pm EDT
Liz,
Yes, I see pigeons with mangled feet all the time. Some of it certainly could be genetic, but I think often it's probably an injury. Pigeons can sometimes get their feet caught in string or something like that and eventually lose a toe or two.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:30pm EDT
I think a pigeon is a beautiful bird. I love to watch them swoop as they play among each other. They seem to always travel in flocks these days. I don't remember them traveling in flocks like that when I was a child.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:31pm EDT
Marsha,
They do sound so nice when they coo
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:31pm EDT
Connie,
Yes part of the difference in opinion is that when pigeons are used for food they're considered domesticated animals so they belong to us. Whereas people don't see the ones on the street as being useful, so they're considered a nuisance if they hang around us.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:32pm EDT
Our county court house always has lots of pigeons on the roof. It seems to attract them more than other buildings around here.
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:32pm EDT
Aww, poor toeless pigeons! I hope they can still get around like that.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:33pm EDT
Laura,
As far as fancy pigeon breeds, I really like the Capuchine, which I included a photo of in the book. So elegant! There are others, like the Fantails, which I just find kind of sad because they are so distorted.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:34pm EDT
It constantly amazes me how people think they have total control over animals and their habits. Not just pigeons but all wild animals. We think we can set boundaries and the animals will abide by them. Sometimes I think we are the stupid species not the animals
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:35pm EDT
Why do we always see the signs "Don't Feed the Pigeons" in cities? What harm could it cause?
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:35pm EDT
Are there any estimates of what the world's pigeon population is? Do they outnumber humans?
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Heather ~of the Whippets~ M. Aug 28, 2008, 4:35pm EDT
In addition to the project using pigeons to measure air quality, do you foresee other ways that pigeons may again be seen as useful? Especially since a lot of people are going "green"?
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David Woodrow Aug 28, 2008, 4:39pm EDT
Are you currently researching any other books?
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:40pm EDT
Courtney,
Are you an animal lover?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:40pm EDT
A single act of feeding pigeons isn't a big deal (in my opinion) but when people regularly feed the same flock of pigeons everyday, it allows their numbers to grow, which makes them more of a nuisance. So I sometimes feel like these pigeon-lovers are undermining their own cause by making pigeons more unpopular. Plus, when their are really dense flocks of pigeons living in one place I wonder whether their quality of life is very good.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:42pm EDT
Laura,
I have never seen an estimate of the worldwide pigeon population but I would love to! It must be incredibly difficult to estimate. No, I wouldn't expect pigeons to outnumber people but I'd expect them to outnumber lots of other bird species.
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♠~Dnbuster~♠ ~. Aug 28, 2008, 4:43pm EDT
sorry gang it has been fun but i need to get the monsters from school:)
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:44pm EDT
Hi David,
Yes I'm researching a new book but it's so new I don't know if I'm ready to talk about it yet! But I'll just say that it's a medical topic so it's a departure from pigeons.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:44pm EDT
Pigeons seem to be territorial birds, meaning they stay within a certain area. Did you find that to be the case with your research?
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:45pm EDT
Would you recommend pigeon raising as a hobby, or pigeons as a pet?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:46pm EDT
Heather,
It depends on if you mean putting street pigeons "to work" for us, like the environmental monitoring, or if you mean using pigeons as domesticated animals again. I heard from someone recently who is involved in the localvore movement and is interested in setting up a dovecote of his own. Pigeons used to be a very practical way to have meat available in one's own backyard, and I could see that catching on again.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:47pm EDT
When we had pigeons as pets, we did not keep them in cages. We let them fly freely but we fed them so they continued to return
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David Woodrow Aug 28, 2008, 4:47pm EDT
Thanks Courtney. And thanks for joining us on Gather.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:48pm EDT
Connie,
Yes I would probably consider myself an animal lover in that I've always had a lot of empathy for animals.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:50pm EDT
Laura,
I've never kept a pet pigeon but the people I've talked to say they are a great bird to keep as a hobby or a pet. Very gentle but pretty interactive for such a small-brained bird!
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:51pm EDT
Courtney,
I have read and really enjoyed your book Superdove. I have a love for pigeons and always have. I will be doing my revew of your book probably tomorrow. My husband is reading it now as well
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:51pm EDT
Everyone, we have a little less than 10 minutes left to the chat.
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:52pm EDT
Courtney,
Since you've written this book, have you heard of any interesting or bizarre pigeon encounters from your readers?
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:53pm EDT
Hi Connie,
Pigeons do like to pick a home and return to it. So they can be territorial with each other over nests. But that's also part of the reason why domestic pigeons can be set free and will keep returning.
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member 1234 Aug 28, 2008, 4:54pm EDT
been nice hanging out but i have to go.thank you for chatting with us
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Heather ~of the Whippets~ M. Aug 28, 2008, 4:54pm EDT
Courtney, I am actually studying food. I think that I will have to take a closer look at a possible revival of pigeon as food within the localvore movement.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:55pm EDT
I was on NPR's On Point a couple of weeks ago when the book came out and there were some interesting stories about pigeons, mostly the pets that people kept. A couple people, unfortunately, had tales of accidentally eating a pet pigeon! I've also heard a lot about how persistent the birds are when they want to nest in a certain place, which makes them hard to get rid of.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:56pm EDT
Heather,
They do have a very delicate flavor
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seƱoritafish (oxyjulis californica) Aug 28, 2008, 4:56pm EDT
Hi Courtney, I noticed the book jacket says you are a science writer and you mention a little about the MIT graduate program in science writing. Can you tell us a little more about your background?

(Curious because I work as a biologist for a goverment agency, but have always liked writing about the critters I get to see for others)
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:56pm EDT
Thanks for coming, Johnny!
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 4:57pm EDT
I must say, until this chat I've never known how many people have eaten pigeons before!
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 4:57pm EDT
Thanks for answering my questions and writing such a great book on pigeons, Courtney!
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:57pm EDT
senoritafish,
I was in the MIT program when I came up with the idea for this book. Before then, I had mostly written about medicine and biology, working at Harvard Medical School and writing for different publications. I am not a scientist myself by training, however.
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:58pm EDT
Thanks Laura, I'm glad you enjoyed it!
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 4:58pm EDT
Pigeon, or "squab" is a delicacy in many cuisines. It's worth checking out.
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Connie C. Aug 28, 2008, 4:59pm EDT
Thanks for the wonderful chat Courtney. I enjoyed it
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Courtney Humphries Aug 28, 2008, 5:00pm EDT
Well, I know we are running out of time so I'd like to thank everyone for coming to the chat, it's been really fun!
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Laura Cushing Aug 28, 2008, 5:01pm EDT
Thanks for coming to Gather and chatting with us! This was a really good one- I learned a lot.
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Collins Nonfiction Aug 28, 2008, 5:01pm EDT
Unfortunately we are out of time.

Courtney, thank you for sharing your expertise and sharing so much fascinating information on pigeons. Best of luck to you on your next research venture.

I encourage everyone to pick up a copy of Superdove. Thanks to everyone who joined us today. Have a great afternoon and holiday weekend!
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Ms. Meacham: Money Maven Aug 28, 2008, 5:03pm EDT
Thanks for the chat. Very interesting!
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Heather ~of the Whippets~ M. Aug 28, 2008, 5:06pm EDT
Thank you for a very informative chat, Courtney.
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Mary M. Aug 28, 2008, 5:56pm EDT
Couldn't make the chat. Sorry! Had a fussy baby and homework x 4 bigger kids. :)
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