edited and unedited "news" clip of Mike Wallace interview - note Wallace actually editorializes right over Ahmadinejad's translated reply. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onNzrNEFs1E
I suggest everyone view this and the one that follows it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mScWWtRfGQ&NR=1
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Comments: 151
It sounds like a good book.
The point of this post is to show that the propaganda that he is going to wipe Israel off the map is pure BS. It is a Bushism. He may be the nastiest SOB on the face of the earth but he suggested some very good ideas in that intrview.
That would return the area back the status quo pre WWII when Jews were a persecuted minority in their own land. The book I pointed to previously tells about the pograms where Muslims would attack Jewish settlements whenever they thought the Jews were getting to powerful or uppity. When you see how Islam interacts with minorities in its lands, and how that is institutuionalized by Islam itself, it is not hard to believe that Jews and anyone else had it bad in pre WWII Palestine.
Ahmadinejad, and others, it is not only him as the crazy President, of Iran, other key power elite in Iran make the statement that why should the Palestinians have to pay for what Germany did during WWII ... if Germany really did anything at all. This is an odd thing for a reasonable world leader to say ... what on Earth do you think it means?
He has had years to modify what he has said about wiping Israel off the map. He will re-phrase, or mumble about, but he never quite says clearly, I did not mean I would destroy Israel. Why would you be for ignoring this kind of thing?
He/Iran is funding both Hezbollah and Hamas as well as terrorists in Iraq.
I just do not get your respect for this man and what he is doing to the state of Iran and plans to do to the whole Middle East if he can get the chance.
In the second place there was no pre WW2 Palestine. There has never before in history been a Contry named Palestine. Palestine was a regeon such as the great plains here is a region.
He meant to say the present leadership in Israel is trying to cause problems and he thinks the people woud rather not be killed.
He said very clearly that this regime in Israel needs to be gone, not Israel itself.
I have no respect for him but I don't think we should missinterpret what he says and make him evil either.
Bruce you know Iran is funding Hezbollah and Hamas, how? The pain stream media?
If the land were to return to pre WW 2 status neither the Israelies nor the palestinians would have a land. That land belonged to a couple of other nations then.
The Zion movement after WW2 caused a re-drawing of the map and there was no Palestine figured into it at the time. Plastine came along later. Aarafat and the PLO put the movement and claimed they once had a nation there.
Exactly when did he ever say he would wipe Israel off the map? You say he has had years to modify the statement. how many?
How can I ignore it. Maybe because I am tired of babysitting Israel. They have been a nation for 60 years.
I guess what I am trying to say is that Israel can fight their own fights. They want to play with the big boys let them handle their own problems. They are not a lilly white as the press and politicians claim and the Palestinians are not as evil as what they are painted.
The people are just people, it is the politicians that need to get their act together.
In its move toward Zionism, Israel delivers more casualties than it receives.
As for my point of view, I'm with you, Col. George. That region hasn't had peace in thousands of years. We were stupid to stick our noses in there to create Israel, it was not our business and not our place. Then we compounded the problem by continuing to ally with and closely support them. And then we interfered in the democratic evolution of most of the rest of the Muslim world over the last 60+ years, and then have the nerve to wonder why they hate us so much? Our schizophrenic foreign policy over the last several decades is finally starting to bear it's poisoned fruit, and we all have to take a big bite.
I should add the disclaimer that I am NOT anti-semitic. I don't have a problem with Jewish people. I really don't. My position would be exactly the same if the situation were reversed. It simply is not an issue the American government should involve itself with. I feel the same about Bosnia, Darfur, Tibet, Rwanda, Zimbabwe, or any of the other places like them.
While we're recommending books, I'd like to highly recommend Benazir Bhutto's last book "Reconciliation". I'm still in it, but so far it's an excellent read.
The most logical thing would have been to carve a piece of Germany & make it into Israel... but the Europeans didn't want the Jews there to begin with so they pushed them off to Middle East. And u expect them to accept it gladly. Not really gonna happen... whether we like it or not.
For the life of me, I cannot bring myself to understand why this VERY REAL, VERY DANGEROUS threat is being entirely ignored in this country.
Those who are tring to launch armageddon should try reading the Book that predicts it. I once had an "end times" chart that showed the events leading up to Armageddon. There are things that must happen before that battle. One is the Great Tribulation and the Rapture.
When have Christians ever killed Catholics in the US with bombs. When have Christians ever cut the head, arms, fingers, etc or tortured each other as a matter of Christian dogma in the Western world? Going back into history or talking talking about minor crimes of insane individuals does not compare with radical Islam's terrorist strangle hold on their own people or their determination to spread radical Islam by force.
Clark, you say some really right on things, but the reason I usually just gloss over your posts and never respond to you is that you impeach your thinking process by making stupid statements like that fly off the deep end.
Maybe because the radical Islamists have been able to actually pull some of their attacks off, whereas mostly the radical Christians have not? Usually when the radical Christians make the news, THEY are the ones dying, not taking anybody with them...think Waco, Ruby Ridge, Jonestown.
The only exceptions I can think of offhand are the nuts who kill abortion doctors, and I suppose you could make a case for Tim McVeigh, but I would contest his status of "radical Christian".
Reminds me though, I have a funny T-Shirt that says "Radical Muslims" and shows dudes in turbans rollerblading, doing BMX bike tricks, and snowboarding. Just thought I'd throw that in to lighten the mood a bit. :)
Why would it have to be Catholics? How many Muslims have Christians killed thus far? Wouldn't that be the fairer comparison?
"When have Christians ever cut the head, arms, fingers, etc or tortured each other as a matter of Christian dogma in the Western world?"
This "Christian" white house has authorized torture tactics.
Looks like somebody needs to do some reading up on "Dominionism." It's alive, thriving, in this country, and is extremely dangerous, far more so than radical Islam, because it will push us to a third world war.
"Clark, you say some really right on things, but the reason I usually just gloss over your posts and never respond to you is that you impeach your thinking process by making stupid statements like that fly off the deep end."
I couldn't give a rat's ass what you think of me or what I say. If you don't want to read or respond, don't. Trust me, it won't ruin my day.
And, how can someone who makes the idiotic inference that radical Islam is the only thing to fear, while radical Christianity is a cute, snuggly teddy bear possibly consider himself to be NOT off the deep end?
"Maybe because the radical Islamists have been able to actually pull some of their attacks off, whereas mostly the radical Christians have not? "
You think that the dominionists do not see our illegal military aggression in the middle east as the opening phases of armageddon? Somebody else needs to do some reading up on these lunatics, it would appear.
"Usually when the radical Christians make the news, THEY are the ones dying, not taking anybody with them"
This is so ignorant that I cannot even respond.
"Reminds me though, I have a funny T-Shirt that says "Radical Muslims" and shows dudes in turbans rollerblading, doing BMX bike tricks, and snowboarding. Just thought I'd throw that in to lighten the mood a bit. :) "
Don't you know? That's part of their evil plot to attempt to humanize themselves, in order to lull the "Christians" into a false sense of security. It's best we kill them all, immediately.
Tony, you forgot the ones trying to start the war of Armegedon. I can't call them Chrstians myself since they have no idea what their Book says. In the first place it is not a war it is a battle at a place called Armegedon. In the second place there are events that must take place before that battle is fought and those things have not happened.
Our Freedom of Religion has prevented any bad things happening here but if we lost it there could be a State Religion and the oppression that goes with it. That is the precise reason the first amendment exists.
there's a reason OBL and his cronies often refer to us as the "Zionist Crusaders".
Primarily to rally unsophisticated Muslim radicals with few options to their deaths in service to his dreams of political power.
Historically the Islamic peoples have had a much better record of tolerating religious minorities than the Christians.
Of course none of that history matters since those people are not alive today. It is what the people of today do that matters now.
Why do you think it works?
Our Freedom of Religion has prevented any bad things happening here but if we lost it ...
I agree with you - I just think we have not lost it because some overstimulated blogger on a message boards wants me to be afraid of Christians with no rational except the crusades and some unclear motivation.
That doesn't disappoint me in the least, and I do agree with you. I never said otherwise, you're making assumptions about something I never said. My point is simply that we are not helping the situation by painting a huge freaking target on ourselves.
Could be, but in this context "why" do they hate us, is almost
always a form of "apologism" if that is a word for the radical
Muslims, and a finger pointed to blame the West, muddied up
with all sorts of miscalculated logic and disinformation.
That target does not seem to matter one way or the other.
The only thing it does is to attact attention and focus with
the effect of radicalizing sooner those who would be
eventually radicalized already, and perhaps leading to
a shorter confrontation.
Al-Qaida has made few tactical mistakes, but one of
them was coming out of the mountains in Afghanistan
to the flatlands of Iraq where they could be picked off
and more easily targetted.
At the same time, though, this "war against terror" will never end if we refuse to understand the motivation and recruitment techniques of our enemies.
> I couldn't give a rat's ass what you think of me or what I say.
Or anyone else I'm sure, and it shows believe me.
It shows clearly that you care not a wit for making any logical sense at all, for trying to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges, nor do you care if you equate lightyears to micons ... I was trying to be polite, but your ability to perceive, analyze, adjust and then react accordingly ... ie. to think and learn ... is defective.
sorry had to repost this it did not come out the way i meant it earlier.
Is it any wonder that we have so much conflict on earth ? The "good" versus the "bad", the "right" versus the "wrong", the "right" versus the "left", the "Christians" versus "Everyone else" ... what would we expect otherwise from such exoteric misunderstandings of the real truths of the real God that Spiritually interconnects us all even though we will not admit it because it cannot be "proven" to "materialistic" objective standards.
Such "faiths" where they exist, are the fearful faiths of small conservative minds that feel threatened by others and the universe at large, especially the world ... just as they should be with such "limited" thinking. Fear begets fear and that begets hatreds and that begets wars, death and destruction ... like begets like and the blind follow the blind into ever more darkness because none see the true light of a Trinity God using Spirit to INterconnect one and all in peace and love to where natural diversities can be cooperatively used for creative synergy ...
And I never even used an "equation" because so many are not mathematically inclined ... the question then becomes are they intelligent enough to figure this out ? Only those that are will have any hope for wisdom.
IMnsHO.
them was coming out of the mountains in Afghanistan
to the flatlands of Iraq where they could be picked off
and more easily targetted. "
Where do you people get this utter nonsense? The al Qaeda in Iraq has NOTHING to do with the al Qaeda that George Bush let march into Pakistan. They are entirely seperate entities. Please, if you don't know what you're talking about, stop talking. We've had enough mis and disinformation in this country over the past 8 years.
"Or anyone else I'm sure, and it shows believe me."
It should, since I've never attempted to hide it.
"It shows clearly that you care not a wit for making any logical sense at all,"
Only if you're an ignorant fool that's unwilling to accept any logic besides your own. It's you who has the defective, disjointed, convoluted thinking. In one sentence, you're a flaming liberal, and the very next, you're spouting off idiotic, disproven rightwing talking points like some mindless robot.
Perhaps, if you spent more time reading actual facts, instead of blindly accepting whatever somebody else tells you, you wouldn't present yourself in such an incongruent, incoherent manner, and you wouldn't feel the need to display pouting fits whenever somebody points out the error of your thinking.
You are certainly entitled to ignore the VERY real threat posed by the "Christian crusaders" today, but I can assure you, the simply act of ignoring the threat does NOT make it disappear, and it certainly doesn't negate its presence altogether, as you seem to believe.
You've chosen to believe a wicked, twisted view of Islam that is based upon the wicked twisted views of a small segment of a wicked, twisted version of Christianity, and MEANT for a small segment of a wicked, twisted version of Islam, but instead is directed at ALL of Islam.
That is your perogative. If you wish to allow yourself to be manipulated in this manner, so be it. But again, your decision to allow this manipulation does NOT equate to you possessing all truths on this matter. You have willfully chosen to ignore not only the small segment of wicked, twisted "Christians" who espouse hatred and press towards the end of the world, but at the same time have chosen to cast all of Islam as some evil entity, just exactly as the rightwing propagandists have instructed you to do.
Therefore, you should not be surprised nor offended when someone steps in to attempt to set you straight now and then. Instead of lashing out at those who attempt to do so, perhaps you might consider actually learning something about the subject matter, so that you can either A) See that you were off base, or B) at least discuss the matter from an informed point of view, rather that from that of someone who's been manipulated by propaganda.
He has said he would Like to see Israel wiped off the map and that the current Regem in Israel should be gone, and suggested a solution to the problems there. We may not agree with the solution but it amounts to a recognition of Israel which is more than a lot of governments in the reagon will do.
He has had time to clear up all his words and actions and has never done it.
If you think Ahmadinejad is suggesting a solution to the Palestinian/Israeli problem Colonel George W. I don't know how you get to that with any interpretation of any facts unless you start out with the intention of supporting Ahmadinejad as the first step, or in your case trying to fit everything in the world into your "Ron Paul" vision of the world.
It is severe twisting of facts to say Ahmadinejad was suggesting that he was going to recognize Israel or its right to exist.
Well of course they weren't his exact words. He doesn't speak English, so his exact words were probably more like me trying to clear my throat "Achmed Mullah Hech al-Brachthu al Israel" or something. :)
That's partly a joke, but also worth pointing out that it's tough to get into semantics when you're talking about translations from one language to another.
Additionally, Col. George's point is important. There's a difference between me saying "I wish someone would kill Barbra Streisand" and "I'm going to kill Barbra Streisand". One is a statement of intent, and a direct threat, and the other is just something someone would LIKE to see.
> someone would kill Barbra Streisand" and "I'm
> going to kill Barbra Streisand".
See, I don't there's any difference when the the person
saying it is saying it in their role as President of a country,
and after saying it not only keeps saying things like
that, but then holds seminars about holocaust denial,
and what the world will be like without a US and Israel.
Coupled with direct support of terrorists, and repression
in Iran every bit as evil and violent as the Shaw, and
a 1000 miles coastline on the most important oil
shipping route in the world, and it is clear that there is
not only justifed concern but startegic action required.
So does he really want to get rid of Israel? Probably. They all want to, which is really a big part of the historical problem, right. Will he do it? Not unless he's suicidal. As soon as he lobs anything at Israel the entire country of Iran will be lit up by the US and by Israel (who will push the button faster than we can sneeze, and long before anything Iran shoots off reaches the ground). Oh, and half the rest of the middle east will lob whatever they have ready to fire also. And Russia and a few others might get involved too just for fun. Kind of defeats the purpose if everyone is annihilated within 30 minutes or so. So the chances of him doing something that rash unprovoked is miniscule. [The key word here is unprovoked, which admittedly is a hard to define concept.]
So what's the answer? Who the hell knows. If there were an answer we would have found it and implemented it decades ago. The only thing we can do is work real hard to turn the temperature down on the situation so there aren't any "accidents." That takes critical thinking and more than a little finesse on our part. Something the current Administration clearly has no capacity to do. And something John McCain has shown he also has no capacity to do. Ah, but there is one candidate who does see things clearer, does think, does have the ability to communicate.
So scrap the blunt object method of interacting with the world. It doesn't work. It's time for intelligence to step in and try to clean up the mess that has been created over the last 8 years. Will it be easy? Of course not. Will it succeed? Again, who the hell knows. But it's the only path forward that gives us a chance. If we're smart enough to take it.
The "blood in the water" will eventually lead to the the next incremental step for radical Islam that will come into view, that is wearing down Israel, which will happen.
After that, it will be Europe, and the US.
I think Obama is the perfect man to make this case, and lead the world. I think Obama can show the world that the Bush style and behavior was incompetent, but that at the root of the problem this is what needs to get done.
I am not supporter of Bush but he has never talked about
genocide or wiping a nation off the face of the Earth, and
when he has been misunderstood to do so, even he has
been able to clear up the confusion.
This thing of equating something with something else
without deeper analysis is really dangerous.
The long term implication would be that he will do anything to harm those who shamed him. That is in their culture. Our next president would be better off by treating the man with respect instead of inviting him to our country as a speaker and insulting him as they did.
Full transcript of Columbia speech
US Satan that will be wiped off the Earth
More Ahmadinejad
He answered every question and the indictments against Iran with truthfulness and with dignity. That is a lot more than I can say for Columbia.
Tell me something Bruce, do you have any proof that there are gay people in Iran or if there is that Ahmadinejad knows it?
What a novel idea.
The demonizing of Ahmadinejad is the same as demonizing bush.
Look, both are very similar.
> there are gay people in Iran or if there is that
> Ahmadinejad knows it?
Hell, CGW, I have no proof that there are gay people
in the US ... do you think it is likely that there are no
gay people in Iran? I would think that if there are
not it is for two reasons:
1) They are afraid to let it be known.
2) They will be tortured and murdered if they do.
According to this video it is against the law in Iran to be
gay, and the penalty is death by slow hanging in public,
written into their penal code.
Death is also the penalty for being an apostate,
meaning changing religion from Islam, or marrying an
non-Islam, or for women not being modest enough,
or being raped.
You really are taking your admiration for
Ahmadinejad to the mat here CGW ... is that
what you really think?
wanted to encourage?
Apparently I wasn't clear, and I don't think you give me enough credit. I never suggested we ignore the guy or not confront him. In fact, I'm a strong proponent of confronting him. I say only that we should do so intelligently and with all of the tools in our arsenal, not simply "bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb Iran" as McCain so ineloquently and inappropriately quipped.
And I agree that Obama is the man for the job. He is perfectly aware of the real dangers that Iran poses, as well as the posturing of its current leader. He understands that we can apply pressure in many ways. And he understands that a unified stand by our allies and other stakeholders are necessary to apply that pressure in a way that will be effective. And he understands that the people of Iran may just choose to replace Ahmadinejad with someone less of a firebreather.
So I believe we are in agreement.
rofl.. looks like someone has never heard of the inquisition.
Atleast that's what our benevolent religious leaders have to say.
David, "In fact, I'm a strong proponent of confronting him. I say only that we should do so intelligently" That is exactly what HE is suggesting in his Columbia speach. Talk not Tanks is what he was saying.
That makes neither candidate open to free and open debate or negotiations. Neither one would go into conference with the idea of "lets understand each other". Instead they would go into it with demands based on falsehoods.
Ahmadinejad to the mat here CGW ... is that
what you really think? " Largely Yes.
So Their laws are different from ours - they have that right. We do not have to right to dictate their laws.
So their religion is different - so is the religions of people here. I don't look to a guy in the Vatican for guidence and treat him like a god. I do not think some angel name Moroni has a thing to do with anything. I don't believe as a Jehova's Witness, Christian Scientest or a few dozen other religions and all have their dogma.
The man was open and honest. He all but begged the US to come to the table and settle any differences peacefully. What in the hell more do you want? That was completely open, fair, and honest.
> So Their laws are different from ours - they have that right.
> We do not have to right to dictate their laws.
It is here that I think we differ greatly, and I think you ideas
are deeply rooted in a faulty past full of failure. In today's
world - 30 minutes distant from termination with nuclear
weapons - the development of a totalitarian slave state
with enough economic power to threaten the world,
and we have two of them today, China, and then this
emerging terrorist cult the Middle East.
We cannot reallly do anything about China, though
I do think it is especially stupid for Bush to go to
the Olympics to choke down their smog and support
their slave state. The bet thing that could happen
there would be a mass walkout by everyone in
the world.
Because of your one-track politics you have let
dogma push you into a corner of supporting one
of the most evil things in the world, in this case
leading you to equate the actions of Christianity
with radial Islam. Telling me your eyes see a kindly
guy being insulting by America just makes me think
you need to head to the optometrist.
I agree with many of your values as you express
them in your many interesting articles, and agree
with you on many specific issues, but we are so
far away on anything do to with this that I just
could not understand you given a hundred years.
Support their slave state by going to Olympics? Are u serious?
if u don't want to support their "Slave" state then stop taking loans from them everyday & stop importing Chinese goods.
The bet thing that could happen there would be a mass walkout by everyone in the world.
Sorry to disappoint u but that's not goin to happen.. the world really is concerned abt or see it as a threat... do u know whom the world sees as a threat... our good 'ole USA, a country that's waging full fledged war on countries & planning on a third war as we speak and not to forget numerous covert operation around the world. News Flash - the world sees us a threat to them not China, Korea or even Iran.
are deeply rooted in a faulty past full of failure. In today's
world - 30 minutes distant from termination with nuclear
weapons - the development of a totalitarian slave state
with enough economic power to threaten the world,
and we have two of them today, China, and then this
emerging terrorist cult the Middle East."
Yes we differ greatly Bush & Co are the only ones claiming Iran is terrorist. Don't I don't buy it and if you read has speach you would not either. I say again Don't believe the paropaganda from the Media or from Bush & Co.
There may be an "evil terrorist plot" but it is not coming from the government of Iran.
You are flat in error here Col.
You are right if you apply that to Iraq ... but you better try to keep up:
> ... We should not be fooled by Ahmadinejad’s soft talk. Just a few
> days ago Iran rejected proposals put forth by the P5 Plus group
> (UK, France, Germany, Russia, China and the US) led by the EU’s
> top Iran negotiator Javier Solana.
Why are the US, China and Russia working together to ensure
that Iran does not get nuclear weapons? Kind of makes mincemeat
of your whole point of view that?
Iran has to be evil with all the wars it has been waging thru out the world since the last 50 years ;)
Just because Iran has a peaceful modern history as regards it neighbors does not make it utopia or a civilized member of the world community of nations.
What do you think of Iran's laws that demand death to gays and apostates to Islam, and women who are raped; and Iran's belligerent threatening statements and posture towards the world and of Iran's funding Hezbollah and Hamas who murder people?
What do you think of Iran being offered nuclear power under the auspices of the IAEA and its refusal to allow inspections and supervision. What about the almost unprecedented agreement of the US, France, Germany, Russia and China on demanding concessions from Iran after its perceived behavior?
Iran has not waged a war period, ever, not if 50 and not in 100 years.
I answered the question Bruce, you didn't like the answer.
The real question is "Did he say he would destroy Isarael" The answer is No he did not.
I for one am tired of the lies. If Iran strikes the US it is war but not because Israel did it or because Israel or Bush faked it. Iran is not fool enough to attack this nation and will never have enough nukes if they started today to do us any harm for a hundred years.
Bruce, evidently you did not read his comments at all or you would know that they have had numerous inspections and passed all of them. You would also know that those who offered to help them changed their minds and cost Iran Millions.
rofl.. looks like someone has never heard of the inquisition.
You can worry about the inquisition coming to get you if you want, if you take my advice there are better things to do that worry about evil long in the past.
thing, but why are all these country going to up the sanctions
on Iran if Iran passed its inspections and has been open about
what it is doing?
I would support military action against Iran when they
ignore the world and begin to produce enriched bomb
material. I am not sure what kind of action. I supported
action against Iraq, but I was not for war, and the was
the wrong move. Whatever we do about Iran has to be
much smarter, and more multi-lateral, but I think it will
have to be done.
much smarter, and more multi-lateral, but I think it will
have to be done. "
Smarter would be to talk it out and come to an agreement. Not sure that could be done with the political climate that has been created here in the US. I don't know about the politics of Iran.
" why are all these country going to up the sanctions
on Iran if Iran passed its inspections and has been open about
what it is doing?"
Only a few countries are doing that and they are being led and directed by the US out of tradition is no other reason. We were the big dog for so long they do it out of habit.
JMO but I think Iran would be smart to invite a diplomatic mission consisting of scientists from all over the world to inspect for themselves. That is what the UN has but no one listens to them when they say Iran has a clean bill of health.
Bruce FYI: trying to talk sense to Clark is an effort in futility. You see according to Supermans nebbish alter ego, al Qaeda had nothing to do with 9/11 it was Bush and Cheney who did it. You see al Qaeda is the middle east's version of the boy scouts and we have demonized them for cheap oil....................hey wait a minute oil is double what it was three years ago...........well never mind that just put on your tinfoil hat and it will all become clear to you..
Do you mean when Iraq invaded Iran with our backing and blessings? Yep I remember.
that Chris. Guess you were not around or were busy doing something else to remember it correctly. Old Sadam was our good buddy back then.
FYI - It was never proven that Al Qaeda had anything to do with 9/11. Accusations only. OBL has never said he was responsable but always said IF he was he would be proud of it. Funny thing OBL used to be our good buddy too. There is more than ample evidence to disprove the flying into two buildings to knock down three story.
If we have deamonized Al Qaeda they deserved it but not necessarly for 9/11. No one says Al Qaeda is the boy scouts but somehow I don't think even they could pull off the 9/11 attack. Nothing that big has ever been done before or after by them or any other terrorist group.
> Bruce FYI: trying to talk sense to Clark is an effort in futility.
I have a feeling if you and Clark ever accidentally touched you would mutually annihilate each other in a flash of sub-atomic neutralization! ;-)
In this subject you and I happen to agree. However the Iran/Iraq war was started by Iraq supported by the US and the UK.
GOD DAMN IT'S HARD TO WALK A MIDDLE GROUND BETWEEN THE RADICALS ON BOTH SIDES HERE !
Wheph! Now THAT clears up A LOT! I think we, along with Israel, can all rest easy now...don't you?
Ah, but wait, according to our benevolent Ahmadinejad: “Anybody who recognizes Israel will burn in the fire of the Islamic nation's fury”
He's got such a way with words -- a real poet laureate. Really, he and Ludacris should get together and bang out a few singles.
We have death penalty in our country which I am all for.. but go ask Europeans abt it & they think it's barbaric. Do u think we should change our laws to please them? Who's morally right here? Are we barbaric for having the death penalty in our country?
U r mistaken abt Iran laws regarding death penalty for women who r raped... apparently it's only for married women who cannot who prove their case & r charged with adultery. Adultery carries death penalty for both men & women. If the rapist is married & is convicted then he vl faces death penalty. There r two sides of the coin. I think the law is very much different from how we do business here but it's their law.. it's up to Iranian ppl to change the law not us. The number of ppl u vl end up killing in a war vl b 1000 times (or more) than all their death penalty victims.
Centrist, we finally agree on something. Our laws are our laws and their laws are their laws. We do not have the right to change theirs any more than they have the right to change ours.
may b u can refresh my memory on this? But did we not recognize China bcoz it was communist state for the longest time...
Every post I have ever seen you write amounts to a viscious attack on rational thought and truth. Anyone reading your posts would also soon come to the conclusion that it is true of your very name that it is yet another distorted lie.
To say that because the US and much of the world have different beliefs on what is cruel and unusual punishment for a crime, specifically the death penalty, is not the same as applying punishments, that is - execution, to people who want to are innocent, people who just want to exercise their human rights, change their religion, or who are of a given sexual preference.
Centrist Citizen, you are truly despicable and evil in your attempts to argue against for human rights in such a twisted and purposeful way.
> ... We do not have the right to change theirs any more
> than they have the right to change ours.
I am an American, not only do we have the right, we have the obligation. It is just too bad we do not have enough power and enough resolve to do the job and get it over with so that people can be free of the kind of sick thinking and inhuman actions that Centrist Citizen and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad promote.
And then you wonder why the whole world hates us.
We have laws that some other nations find inhumane - capital punishment for one. Now, regardless of how you feel about capital punishment one way or the other, would you have a problem with another country, say France, saying "change this law or face the consequences!"? I know I sure would.
Have a look in the dictionary sometime at the word "sovereignty" or just "sovereign". Iran is a sovereign nation.
Tad, your interpretations of recent history are filled
with Libertarian slogans and are not so rigorous.
First of all, the whole world does not hate us. Get out in the
world and see what people think, it is pretty nuanced, and
they do hate George W. Bush, but they do not hate us, and
it takes more then Bush to make that happen. So quit the
simplistic sloganeering.
Take a look at my post to Centrist Citizen and read it or I
am really going to get steamed about you not understanding
or lying about what is clearly written.
I'll repeat it once again slower and more simply in boldface in cares
you do not have your glasses on:
disagreement between American and Europe over whether
to punish a convicted capital offender with death or life in
prison is not the same as disagreement over killing someone
because they are gay or do not want to be a radical Muslim
anymore.
> Or killing someone because they want an abortion
> . . . .yeah thats SOOO muslim. lol
Tell me now what government has a law that kills demands
execution for for abortion, in Europe or the US?
Can you put 2 and 2 together to imagine what Iran would
think about woman who had been raped or who was unweb
wanting to get an abortion?
> I just dont know what to think about you sometimes.
You just plainly do not know how to think, period.
But, if you don't want to use THAT one, we can skip to another of Ahmadinejad's speeches -- this one surrounding Israel's 60th Birthday. He is quoted as saying:
"Those who think they can revive the stinking corpse of the usurping and fake Israeli regime by throwing a birthday party are seriously mistaken. Today the reason for the Zionist regime's existence is questioned, and this regime is on its way to annihilation."
Later, Ahmadinejad stated: "The Zionist regime is dying," and that "The criminals [Jewish-Zionist State] imagine that by holding celebrations they can save the Zionist regime from death." .... "They should know that regional nations hate this fake and criminal regime [Jewish-Zionist State] and if the smallest and briefest chance is given to regional nations they will destroy it."
There is a laundry list of similar statements made by Ahmadinejad, Colonel. But since you do not live in reality, I doubt that TRUTH or FACT would dissuade you from chasing your pipe-dreams.
As for the bogus source you have cited as "proof" of Ahmadinejad's innocence: I have said this before and I will say it again. People must be mindful of where they get their "news" ... and in this instance, I do not mean CBS. The Youtube clip you provided, Colonel, was posted (and yes, edited) by Tom Murphy, yet another "impeach Bush" 9/11 CONSPIRACY THEORIST. I quite fancied checking out Tom's website "The Representative Press" where he interviews and promotes notorious anti-Semite, Noam Chomsky.
Bruce, thanks!
world and see what people think, it is pretty nuanced, and
they do hate George W. Bush, but they do not hate us, and
it takes more then Bush to make that happen. So quit the
simplistic sloganeering."
OK, I was exxagerating to make the point. You're right, the whole world does not hate us. But there are plenty that do. And not JUST our administration, I've seen plenty of reports of a lot of people who travel abroad as Canadians because they get better treatment than when people know they're American.
"Take a look at my post to Centrist Citizen and read it or I
am really going to get steamed about you not understanding
or lying about what is clearly written."
NONE of this is worth getting "steamed about" - if any of this is really upsetting you maybe you should take some downtime.
I didn't read the entire history of posts, so forgive me. There are quite a few here, and I didn't realize it was necessary to read them all prior to posting. So now, yes, I've gone back and read it, and I still disagree with you. I frankly couldn't care less what the laws are in Iran about anything, that's their business. And I certainly wouldn't support having my tax dollars go to YET ANOTHER adventure in the Middle East, when we have more than enough problems here at home.
Any by the way, I guess I have to say I'm somewhat flattered at your accusation that my opinions are filled with "Libertarian slogans" - I didn't even know we HAD slogans! NEAT! Is there somewhere I can go to read them all? After all, maybe they have a few I haven't come up with yet! I knew I shoulda been an ad guy!