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by Laura Cushing
Member since:
August 4, 2006

Ask An Atheist

February 09, 2008 09:36 PM EST (Updated: February 11, 2008 04:43 PM EST)
views: 462 | comments: 128
This is me, Laura Cushing. I'm 37 years old - I'm the mother of three teenagers, the wife of one loveable Austin. I live in the New Jersey Pines with my family.  I write my music column for Gather.  I read lots of good books. I cook a pretty good dinner.  I'm just like most of your friends and neighbors - except (at least according to CNN) I'm also the most hated minority in America. You see, I'm an atheist.

I often get asked by well-meaning folks how I can be an atheist.  I don't mind being asked about it, not in the slightest - but what is bad is when they start making up their own theories.

Some of them are sure it must be something in my formative years. Did some priest touch me as a child? Did I get dropped on my head as a baby?

Or maybe it's because I haven't opened my heart to the wonder of (insert God here). Did I try praying to Jesus? Have I tried Buddhism? Have I been to the Church of ___, 'cause that one's different.

I've even been told that it's the devil at work - that my eyes are clouded by sin, and that's why I can't see the light of God in the world around us.

But if you ask me, I'll tell you why I'm an atheist.  It did, in fact, start in my formative years. As a child, I was raised Roman Catholic. My parents went to church only occasionally, but they sent me to Catholic School. I remember that when I was small, I was awed by religion. I thought of Jesus in that same way that I thought of Santa and the Easter Bunny - a iconic figure that was part of this magical world just beyond our reach.  I went through periods of believing he was real, and periods of believing he was unreal. I also remember sometimes thinking he was our friend, and other times thinking that he was looking down on us and ready to cast us into hell for lying to our parents. Growing up Catholic can be pretty scary.

I remember hearing the nuns talk about the special feelings we should get in God's house, in church. That we should feel like we were in the presence of God - especially at times when we were praying, or getting holy communion. I never felt that, and I began to wonder if there was something wrong with me. Was I doing it wrong? Was there a special magic formula that was required for Jesus to come on down and fill me with the holy spirit? I tried to find it. I went to youth group and Sunday school. I read the bible.  I wore my mother's religious medals so that the saints would see my heart was in the right place. But I never felt it.

In high school, we had a class on world religions - and it was the first time I really thought about the possibility that Catholicism might just be the wrong way to go about it. I went to church with friends who were of differing religions, hoping to feel the presence there. I read religious books from other belief systems - even the book of Mormon. I still felt nothing. It was getting frustrating.

When I was grown and married, I belonged for a while to the Church of Christ. They were some lovely people - helped me out through some rough times when I was in need. I thought maybe I'd feel the presence of God there, especially when they baptized me again. Maybe I needed adult baptism.  But as they dunked me down in the water-  I felt nothing but wet.

 After divorcing my abusive husband, I took refuge for a while in a Buddhist temple. It was beautiful there. And for the first time, I felt something. It wasn't the presence of God, though - or of any higher power. It was my own inner strength. I accepted that I wasn't going to find what I was looking for  - that there was nothing out there, and that it was my decision to be good or bad regardless of that. No man in the sky was looking over my shoulder expecting me to believe in him or else - and it was a very freeing thought.

My happiness and my sadness, my goodness or badness, my future my present and my past - all lie within my hands. I didn't have to feel guilty about anything. Nothing I wanted to do was sinful - if I felt it was bad or wrong, I didn't do it. If I thought it would be fun and it wasn't hurting anybody- I did it and enjoyed.  And I've been so much happier and at peace with myself since I stopped trying to believe in something that I never could believe in.  Maybe I was born an atheist, really - and it just took me that long to accept my ' true faith'.

Another misconception about atheists is that we're out to get God and his followers. We want prayer removed from schools, and God taken out of our Nation! Personally, I couldn't care less what you guys believe in. Really, I'm okay with it. As long as you don't push it on me, you can believe or disbelieve as you please.  I don't belong to any radical groups. I don't sacrifice chickens to Satan in my backyard - and yeah, in case you're wondering, I don't believe in the devil any more than I believe in God. Or heaven. Or Hell. None of that.

I do have beliefs though - I'm not a nihilist. I believe that we should be good to each other - not because some God or religion demands it, but because it's the humane thing to do. I believe in the power of humanity to overcome our baser natures and be kind - to give to charity where we can, to band together to try and bring about peace and end hunger and disease.

Some of the other things I believe in do put me in direct opposition to a lot of religious groups - but understand that I don't believe in these things BECAUSE I'm an atheist. They're entirely separate beliefs.  I think women have the right to get an abortion. I think that gay people have the right to get married - and that love is a beautiful thing irregardless of gender. I believe that stem cell research is vital. I believe that the war in Iraq should end. I believe that we should have universal health care. I believe that we should help our environment.

I also believe that we should communicate - respectfully discuss our differences and learn to understand each other. So I open this article up to you, my Gather friends.


Do you have any questions you'd like to ask me about my atheism? Leave a comment and I'll answer them.
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Expand Tags: atheism, religion, atheist, discussion, beliefs, laura cushing
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Comments: 128

Lynn C. Feb 9, 2008, 9:46pm EST
Wow. I do not know anyone who is an atheist. Is your husband one too? How about your children. Have they been told about god and have they attended church?
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Kayleigh M. Feb 9, 2008, 9:49pm EST
Haha... people act like athiest are devil spawn or if you dont have a specific religon youre an alien or something...

Im right there with ya on some of that!

I guess I believe in God but I wouldnt label myself in any certain religon.

Good for you posting this!
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Lynn C. Feb 9, 2008, 9:51pm EST
I feel bad that you have not felt the grace of god. So you do not pray before you eat or when you are in a bad situation?
Chris W. Nov 5, 2009, 5:50pm EST
Lynn, the answer would be no, she does no pray before she eats or when she is in a bad situation. It would not be consistent to pray to a God that you do not believe in, right?
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Lori F. Feb 9, 2008, 9:51pm EST
Laura atheists think for themselves. They dont need a religious crutch to blame all of their wrong doing on.

Good job girl.
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Peter Joseph Swanson Feb 9, 2008, 9:51pm EST
I'm too lazy to be an atheist so I just call myself an agnostic.
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Lynn C. Feb 9, 2008, 9:52pm EST
I am not a certain religion but I belive in God. Well I look foward to seeing what people write to you.
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 9:54pm EST
Lynn C.,

My husband is also an atheist. Of my kids, one is an atheist, one believes in God but not any particular religion, and one is a Catholic.

When they were growing up, they knew that believing or not believing in God was a choice they could make for themselves when they were old enough to make an informed decision. They also knew that we'd respect whatever decision they made.

They occasionally went to church with relatives. One of my daughters became a Catholic when she was about 13. My son believes in God, but not in organized religion. My other daughter (twin sister of the Catholic) is an atheist.

They're currently ages 17, 17, and 15.
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Amanda C. Feb 9, 2008, 9:55pm EST
Hi Laura, nice to meet you..
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 9:57pm EST
Also Lynn C. (sorry, missed your second question!), we don't pray when in bad situations. We look for ways to solve the problems, and sometimes write about them on Gather and ask other people what they did in those situations. =)

And no, we don't pray when we eat or at any other time either.
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Lynn C. Feb 9, 2008, 9:57pm EST
Wow thy are all so different. Why did the one become an Atheist?
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The Red Headed Witch of Gather G. Feb 9, 2008, 9:58pm EST
I can kind of understand where you are coming from...I don't believe in hell and quite frankly my religious beliefs do not fit anywhere in any of the religions in the world...I guess I have my own religion LOL
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Carol Roach Feb 9, 2008, 9:58pm EST
i take you for how you are not what other people want you to be.

I get annoyed when someone tries to push their religion or political persuasion on me, live and let live is my motto
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Lynn C. Feb 9, 2008, 9:58pm EST
Well thanks for sharing all of this with all of us.
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The Red Headed Witch of Gather G. Feb 9, 2008, 9:59pm EST
I think most religions came about through people who are afraid of death. What do you think happens when we die? Do you think we just cease to exist or our soul goes on to the next phase?
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The Red Headed Witch of Gather G. Feb 9, 2008, 10:00pm EST
Lynn - I don't think there are many people who pray when they eat anymore. Or if there are I have encountered VERY few of them.
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 10:01pm EST
No problem Lynn! Feel free to ask any other questions you have. I'll be here all night =)

I just think that if we talk to each other about our differences instead of fighting, we'd all be much better off.
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Chris W. Feb 9, 2008, 10:02pm EST
Do you atheists eat babies? Just Kidding!

Laura, your article was rather touching, especially since it mirrors my own life. I too was raised Roman Catholic. I too wasn't dropped on my head or fondled by a priest. But when I was 13 years old, I remember that I went through sort of a personal crisis of changing from a child to a teen. And one of the things that i left behind with childhood was the idea of God- it just did not work for me anymore. It is really hard to explain to a religious person how this works, and I have not really tried for the longest time because it is really really awkward. They are always like, I'm sure you can come back to god if you just try... and they do not get the idea that no it won't work because for me there is no God.
and i do not miss him. In fact, I am glad that I do not have that post-existence thing always on my mind, distracting me. Life is all there is, and my choices are so vital as a consequence. Religious people expect that I would rape, steal, or kill, because i have nothing to fear in the afterlife. No, it is the opposite of that. There are ultimately no second chances. So it is very important for me to always do the right thing.
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 10:04pm EST
Melissa G.,

I think that when we die, the spark of life we had- what we generally term as a soul- goes out into the universe. I don't know what happens after that- maybe we become one with the cosmos, or we dream for all eternity in another existence. Or maybe it's just the end.

I'm not afraid of it because it would be pointless to fear something that's unavoidable and that can't be known. Either I'll cease to exist, or something'll happen- then I'll find out what that something is.

Maybe I won't even remember this life, much like we can't remember what happened in our mother's womb. Death could be just changing states - being born into another reality.
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Lynn C. Feb 9, 2008, 10:04pm EST
I know it is awful that people fight on here but so far everyone is being positive towards you.
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 10:07pm EST
Chris W. ,

I think the guy who wrote A Modest Proposal was a Christian ;) - no baby eatin' here!

And yes- that's exactly how I feel. We shouldn't be doing right because of fear of punishment, but because we truly believe it's the right thing to do. Otherwise, what would be the point?
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 10:08pm EST
Lynn,

I know- and I'm really glad everyone is being so respectful and discussing calmly. I was a bit worried when I posted this, but I thought it was something important to do.
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The Red Headed Witch of Gather G. Feb 9, 2008, 10:09pm EST
Laura- I believe we are born into another reality when we die but it's not like a "heaven or hell" thing. I guess I'm semi-religious....I believe there is a higher power out there but not one who is judging me at all times. I believe that our spirits are on earth to learn something and when we die we go back to wherever it was we came from and reflect on what we have learned and then are possibly reborn or go on to do whatever it is we need to do in our spiritual development. I know you didn't ask for all that but it just came out LOL. I'm always interested in what people think happens after death (except religious people, I know what they are going to say and since I don't buy that I like to hear more creative options).
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Chris W. Feb 9, 2008, 10:11pm EST
Laura- nice article! I guess you and me are in the same boat now, no point to ever running for public office anywhere outside of San Francisco. The other candidate would just look up our gather articles and whoops, campaign over.
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Laura Cushing Feb 9, 2008, 10:16pm EST
Melissa - I wouldn't mind being reborn like that - if that happens, I'd be good with it.

Chris - We should start a club ;) Or a Gather group - do we have a Gather atheist group? There have to be more of us out here - right?
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Holly G. Feb 9, 2008, 10:23pm EST
Awesome article Laura! I might be atheist too, but for now I call myself agnostic. I will be 32 in May, and I think that if I don't 'feel' something soon, I will be saying I am atheist!! I did really enjoy your article. I know what you mean about how people think athiest's are the devil, and a lot of other things that simply are not true. I enjoyed reading all the comments too, and I am so glad everyone is playing nice too!
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dianne j. Feb 9, 2008, 10:25pm EST
Wow! This is so well said. I have often contemplated writing something to explain my atheism. Now I don't have to.

It blows me away that people believe I have a choice. That I can just decide to believe in god. I did try that for many years. I too was raised Catholic, then experimented with other religions, before realizing that I couldn't make myself believe.

It also irritates me that people assume that atheist have an agenda. That we are out to convert believers to non-believers. I don't care what anyone else believes or doesn't believe. Just don't try to force your beliefs down my throat.

The word "atheist" really explains it all. It means "absence of belief."
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Connie C. Feb 9, 2008, 10:29pm EST
Laura,
I think people do this about religions also. They just make their own assumptions and run with it.
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Amanda "middle of nowhere" C. Feb 9, 2008, 10:32pm EST
Laura, I'm afraid the loud actions of a few may have mislead you. I'm a Christian and I don't hate atheists. I have friends of all kinds and most Christians I know are in the same boat. Please don't equate Christianity with hate based on the actions of a few. Each of us has to find which way is our way. Thanks for sharing your story.
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*Carol ~Bronx Southern Belle D. Feb 9, 2008, 10:47pm EST
Anyone who hates you because you are an atheist is not a Godly person. I think everyone at some point in their lives is an atheist or agnostic. It's what you believe in the end that matters. People who die without God are brave, but foolish. Atheism is a religion in its passionate disbelief. I have known many. My only issue is the children being indoctrinated into any religion. Allow them the knowledge and let them chose. You decide for yourself. It's your life and soul. I don't hate you in the least.
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Ruthe M. Feb 9, 2008, 10:48pm EST
Thanks for sharing you, and not being afraid to voice who you are, and what you believe or may not believe. It's interesting to know who people really are. Can't fault you for that.
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Chris W. Feb 9, 2008, 10:53pm EST
Amanda & Connie- good points. I have experienced a few arguments here on Gather in which the issue of civility comes up. Where does one draw the line? Here in the USA, we are granted by the Constitution the right to practice our religion, and by implication the right to not have any religion. Both freedoms are critical. As I do not relish receiving backhanded insults of being worthless by virtue of not being religious (Mitt Romney issued one of those in his leaving-the-campaign speech) So is it also critical that I avoid sneering about holy-rollers or bible thumpers or whatever negative phrase might occur. Co-existence is possible, as long as we decline to demonize the Other.

I know plenty of religious people in my everyday life, and I find most of them very kind and likeable. It should be mentioned also that not all atheists are wonderful people either, despite the thing I allude to of stressing moral action because of the lack of an afterlife. Bottom line, perfection is not a thing of human existence. But good intentions do matter.
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Phyllis R. Feb 9, 2008, 10:58pm EST
Laura, I too like Amanda, am a Christian and do not hate atheist. There are extremist in every religion and every belief. I in no way hate anyone for their religious beliefs, my God teaches me to love everybody,- irregardless of race, color, religion or 'whatever'. Thanks for being brave and honest in sharing your story here on gather!
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David D. Feb 9, 2008, 11:11pm EST
Wonderful writing and super-message.

I believe we pretty much make our own reality through choice; whether to follow others, follow ideas, lead, or choose to remain independent. I've never had cause to fear an Atheist, I have however been very much frightened by extremists from various common religions. The one's who claim to want to save you often do just the opposite.

All my best,

David
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Dalal A. Feb 9, 2008, 11:32pm EST
Laura...Your flustration is shared by many others that their childhood traumas and "bad influence'" from so called educational institutions which unfortunately still exist.
I hate to judge anybody especially in your situation, when you are so brave to explain your vulnerable thoughts. However, I feel in a way you were misguided as God should be something touched, sensed and felt. God is people's prosecutor, or as you said "looking down on us and ready to cast us into hell for lying to our parents".
Certainly, it is human way of wanting and needing these kind of afirmation from God.
I can only tell you that no matter what is said or explained in the different school of thoughts and religions, they all unite that there is a greater power. A power that was so genuine, exquisite and real that created this universe. Something beyond us, and no matter how we try too reach it by science, we only try.....This is my God. This belief gives me a sense of wholeness, humbleness and completion. A sense that strengthen my spirituality. A sense that alleviates my conciousness and reason. My God with whom my strength and humanity becomes more alive.
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Quinn (aka Entwife) Blackburn Feb 9, 2008, 11:32pm EST
Gee, sounds just like me only... I'm a Pagan!

..
U
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Kushal Poddar Feb 9, 2008, 11:34pm EST
nice to know you better.
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Debby C. Feb 9, 2008, 11:51pm EST
Wellllllll, ya got me thinking..and on a weekend too. Thank you for your honesty.
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Bonnie L. Feb 10, 2008, 12:07am EST
Very articulate, well-written article Laura and I appreciated your viewpoints. In fact, you sound very much like my ex-husband. He too was raised Catholic, an altar boy, devout parents, etc. but he began to doubt the existence of God for many of the same reasons you do. We had debates about this all the time and he was much more knowledgeable on the subject than I. He didn't like that he was going against everything he grew up with so he did quite a bit of research on the subject, and I respected that.

Well, I'm not quite sure I am an athiest, agnostic, or anything else these days for that matter. I don't like what organized religion has become, and how many lives have been lost for centuries in the name of God, Allah, religion, etc. But I do like the spirituality that it brings. And I do believe in a "higher power", just haven't figured out what that quite means, or what form it's in yet.

I also agree with you when you say, "Personally, I couldn't care less what you guys believe in. Really, I'm okay with it. As long as you don't push it on me, you can believe or disbelieve as you please."

And wholeheartedly believe as well that "we should be good to each other - not because some God or religion demands it, but because it's the humane thing to do." However, that's where I am a bit torn, because I also think that it's from the Ten Commandments and religious teachings that we learned these moral principles. So while I can't stand the radical, fundamental religious nuts either, In some ways I would be afraid to live in a totally God-less society because, for lack of a better term, "all Hell" might break loose!
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Laura Cushing Feb 10, 2008, 12:10am EST
Teresa,

There was a program on CNN that said we are now the most hated minority in America. Atheists supposedly make up %3 of the population and are more feared and despised than any other minority. Or so they say.
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Angela <:3---}~~~~ M. Feb 10, 2008, 12:11am EST
so many people like to judge others due to religion or lack there of. in an article the other day wiccans were actually called "They sound pretty messed up and sick to me." buy a Christina here on gather! to me we are all the same human and that is all that matters!
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Angela <:3---}~~~~ M. Feb 10, 2008, 12:13am EST
buy=by LOL Im typing impaired tonight.
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*Holly *. Feb 10, 2008, 12:58am EST
Giving Laura a pat on the back.
Great article.

I am Wiccan, most don't understand that either!

Thanks for the post!
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Bill D. Feb 10, 2008, 1:14am EST
Well written article. Interesting to read all those things about you.
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Alison H. Feb 10, 2008, 1:27am EST
When it comes down to it, it doesn't matter what we BELIEVE--the way it is is the way it is, lol!
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Jerry Kays Feb 10, 2008, 2:03am EST
An outstanding article and an extremely healthy (body AND soul) outlook plus inlook.

I did not grow up in a "religious" family, we never really discussed it, the choice was open for each of us and I was sent to a Sunday school type children's summer session for a "taste" of it all ... I did not "like" it (but I did not "yet" dislike it either), we were mostly agnostic I would say.

I had countless relatives and family associates all of my life that were religious and many often "promoted" theirs (versions). Because I knew those people well enough to know they did not represent any "God" (or god) that I wanted anything to do with because of their attitudes and often hypocrisy, I opted out of it all and remained agnostic ...

But finally, late in my "mid-life" I became depressed because I thought so much in our world was so shallow and disingenuous, sadly, so often pertaining to our "leaders" who were "supposed" to stand for better ... and of course much of the history of religions pointed out many "problems" there also, it was very discouraging overall and made me feel depressed. I sought more "truth" and "love" in life than I was experiencing, I wanted a sense of "belonging" to something "better" ... but "religion" would NOT be a part of it for sure, as far as I was concerned.

At one point I even went to some mental therapy about it all and found some small amount of relief in that for the very first time in my entire life I could speak my inner thoughts and NOT feel I was being "judged" ... at one point my therapist suggested that she thought I could use some "spirituality" in my life ... she suggested a book to read, I asked what it was about and she indicated that it was along the lines of what back then was just becoming known as "new-age" concepts ... associating that with what I had heard of "California movements" (group hot tub sessions etc), I rejected that completely also ...

But eventually I began to study many things such as psychology and other "philosophic" concepts presented mostly on PBS TV ... they sounded interesting and possibly applicable to my own thinking towards what I was seeking, a sense of acceptance of self, a feeling that I was OK and that I did NOT have to do just what the rest of the world seemed to be demanding of me to "fit in" ...

At one point I decided to try a relaxation technique that was sort of "meditative" in nature, a turning withIN, seeking withIN for whatever showed up ... the very first time I did so, what showed up was a feeling of complete weightlessness and being encased in a cocoon of indescribable love ... more love than I had ever before experienced in life and rewarding beyond words ...

Within a very few days there were other similar and much greater even, experiences that had a "culmination" in a sense of complete acceptance into a "cosmic reality of family", an extremely "spiritual" experience ... all personal between only me and "IT."


Later via much study to find out just what had "happened" to me, I found that it was relatively rare, but also not all that uncommon ... I had made knowing contact with an aspect of a GENERIC GOD ... at least the SPIRIT OF.

The reason that I write all of this here now, is because in those subsequent 13 yrs I have come to understand so much more ... and I have found that many atheists that I have read of like yourself, are folks that are just more discriminating, folks seeking a higher truth than that offered by so many religions. I applaud you ... but respectfully advise that there IS a spiritual relationship available to all, that is based upon ultimate truth and unconditional love ... to deny that by "insisting" upon it's NON-existence would not be wise in the larger picture ... yet to each their own :-)

Thanks for your story and the allowing of us folks telling our own ... Peace ! j.
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Susan Budig Feb 10, 2008, 2:16am EST
Laura, so much of your article are like words out of my mouth. The difference is that I am Christian. Dalal sounded as if s/he was going to say it, but then slipped into a preaching voice and lost me. But s/he did hit on the idea of faith not existing within our senses, but outside of us.

I've heard several people say, "I just didn't feel it" so it must not be true. I'm cool with people coming to the conclusion that there is no G-d or that G-d cannot be known, but to limp off into a camp of "I didn't feel it" misses the essence of faith.

Faith, to me, is a rational decision, based on what we can understand historically, but the very last step is a leap. It's standing on a rocky ledge and looking at the next ledge. With my eyes I measure it to be about six feet wide. The drop is beyond my sight. I know that I've jumped four feet easily and five feet with a running start, but never six feet. Still, I walk back ten paces and start to run, head down, arms pumping.

Hell, I sure as heck don't feel any magical breeze buoying me up. I don't even feel a brisk gust of wind to provide me with a little lift. But I jump anyway.

And that's faith.

I'll let you know when I land on the other side. ;-)

Cheers to you, Laura for sharing your beliefs. That's a gutsy thing to do no matter what one's leanings are.
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Jerry Kays Feb 10, 2008, 2:21am EST
Susan, a very good description of the "faith" of so many ...
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Elizabeth Madrigal Feb 10, 2008, 2:49am EST
I think it is ridiculous to judge other people's beliefs, and that is why I love this country's Constitution, if not its recent practices under this administration. Atheism is as legitimate as any other belief. Man does not need 'god' to be humane, kind, compassionate, tolerant, loving or to sacrifice for the good of others.

Keep standing up for yourself, Laura. The only way to overcome ignorance is through patience and education.
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Jerry Kays Feb 10, 2008, 3:05am EST
Man would NOT be without God ... but man does NOT NEED to know that ... but it sure helps. IMnsHO.
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Angela B (There IS a light at the end of the tunnel) Feb 10, 2008, 3:15am EST
Well said, Laura. Kudos to you for having the guts to stand up for yourself and your chosen beliefs.
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Bethany C. Feb 10, 2008, 4:11am EST
I might as well come out and tell you that I am a Christian. And the first vision God ever gave me was when I was praying for my brother who was an atheist at the time.
I think that if you have never felt the presence of God before, it is very difficult for you to believe in him. But I have felt it and there is no way that anyone could ever persuade me that he isn't real. I have seen him move. You could probably persuade me that there is no breeze shaking the leaves of a tree I see moving, before you could persuade me that God didn't heal my eyes. Or that he really didn't keep me alive and whole when I took almost a whole bottle of aspirin as a teenager attempting suicide.
I understand if you choose to unconnect from me, because as long as I am alive, I will be testifying to the things God has done in my life. That's just the majority of my conversation. But if you are willing to remain friends with me, I am certainly willing to remain friends with you.
My overall experience has been that the minute I mention the fact that I am a staunch Christian to those who do not believe like I do, they go on the attack. Not everybody, but most people. And I can handle that. But what I can't handle is pretending to agree with things I don't agree with, just to keep friends.
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Laura Cushing Feb 10, 2008, 4:20am EST
Bethany, I'd never disconnect from you or anyone because of their beliefs. As I said, you have the right to believe what you want to just like I do. It's all good! =)
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Chris W. Feb 10, 2008, 9:05am EST
Laura- congrats to you on this article's success. -Bet you didn't think you would get 60 responses.
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Ian Thorpe Feb 10, 2008, 11:12am EST
Laura,
I'm not surprised you felt something in a Buddhist temple. Buddhism has no God nor any dogma or creed, but it is about connectedness with everything. I'm a pagan, more for fun than anything else because saying I am winds devout folk up no end. But again, though there are many ways of being a pagan (the nearest I get to worship in taking a walk in the country or sitting in the garden in summer, watching the insects on the flowers) the central philosophy hinges on continuity and renewal.
I find people who need God in their lives are usually short on self worth and need a crutch.
Someone commented that you do not pray before eating. Why would we give thanks to God for the food on our plates, it was low paid agricultural workers who grew it.
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Holly C. Feb 10, 2008, 11:34am EST
Thank you for this touching piece. I was raised in a fundamentalist Baptist household and church. Even as a child I could not bring myself to believe the things they taught in Sunday school and the preacher's sermons. I have always felt that the problem with the world is that people place their faith in supernatural beings instead of their fellow human beings. Your piece has reenforced my faith in my fellow man.
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Bruce B. Feb 10, 2008, 11:36am EST
I am really impressed with how positive the responses have been. A lot of it must be due to the openness of Laura and her positive outlook.

It is a wonder to me how hard it sometimes is to be friends with someone of a different religious belief. The responses here encourage me to keep trying.

I am also an atheist and really relate to what you and Chris W. have said here. I was raised in the Presbyterian church and enjoyed choir, went to youth group, Sunday school, church camp. I remember thinking in Junior High that I might want to be a minister some day. My atheism just happened. It was a gradual development in my early adulthood and I can't point to a particular time when I realized that, for me, God did not exist.

But you can't tell by looking! lol
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Kenna C. Feb 10, 2008, 11:42am EST
Well-written and thought-provoking! I share many of your beliefs, though I label myself an agnostic, not an atheist. It has nothing to not believing that there may be a God out there somewhere - whatever you want to call him; everything to do with not 'believing' in organized religion.

Organized religion is a man-made system, and therefore subject to all the foibles and flaws that all man-made structure are. How many wars over the history of man have been started as a result of religious conflict? And please, don't take this as a slam against Islam - Christians have fought their share of wars over the century in the arrogant assumption that their way is right and the other's way is wrong.

So, while I was raised Methodist, and do sometimes revert to those roots, I do not actively practice any religion. And while I believe in a superior being, and find the stories of Christ inspiring, as well as his eddicts about how to treat your fellow man absolutely correct, I do not claim any formal connection to any particular religious belief systems.

All have their good points and bad points. As you said, in the end it's about treating our fellow earth inhabitants as we would want to be treated!

Thanks so much for sharing!
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Susan Budig Feb 10, 2008, 12:39pm EST
I think much of the credit for this mostly welcoming discussion goes to Laura's accepting way of writing. She spoke without condemnation of others.

It's when folks like Ian, who say things like: I find people who need God in their lives are usually short on self worth and need a crutch put others on the defensive and a breakdown in sharing and respectful conversation begins to occur.

Ian, did you think about how combative your words were? Or was it one of those Talking-Before-Thinking moments?
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Dalal A. Feb 10, 2008, 12:50pm EST
I am reading the comments to understand other ppl point of views and it is strange to read strong judgemental statements such as Ian's comment :"I find people who need God in their lives are usually short on self worth and need a crutch" and Holly's :"I have always felt that the problem with the world is that people place their faith in supernatural beings instead of their fellow human beings".
So it is OK for Atheists or Pagans to judge others but not be judged by others?
Not having a religion makes rediculing other thoughts or faiths easier?
Not believing in a higher power makes one more ego centric and maybe more extremist in ANOTHER direction?

I am raising these questions because I want to be "open" and "understanding" as Kenna explained "to be able at the end treatour fellow earth inhabitants as we would want to be treated" RIGHT?
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Laura Cushing Feb 10, 2008, 12:57pm EST
Dalal,

I try not to be judgmental of anyone, but we all fall into that mentality from time to time. If we've been wronged by people who represent a larger group - we might tend to view others from that group negatively.

Not an excuse, but an understanding.


--L
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Curt L. Feb 10, 2008, 2:36pm EST
Thank you, Laura. 10!
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Baiden F. Feb 10, 2008, 2:42pm EST
there is a book out there called ,' not enough evidence to be an atheist'
I havent read it yet, but i want to.
at my church, my pastor talks about this sometimes and refers to this book.
my wife has read it, she says its very good.
I am glad you put it out here like that.
People that do love God
cannot judge you , because the God I believe in is not a God that judges.
I believe God loves you anyway and he knows your heart best.

For me, when I saw my children being born, I found it hard not to believe after seeing such a miracle.

I respect what you have to say.
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Clifford H Colpitts Jr Feb 10, 2008, 2:45pm EST
Very good, informative article. You sound like a very kind person. I might be an Atheist myself, but I do believe in Karma. Just some days ago a Muslim told my wife in not so disguised code that I am a good sacrifice to be abused etc. Somehow I feel that there is a relationship between what he told my wife and the burning down of a Muslim Temple by those of the White Nazi Faith. As a matter of fact, in a few minutes I am going to go to that gentleman's store here in Inwood by the Lawrence train station and have a cup of coffee and discuss the Koran with him. One of the things I do as an Atheist is such things as Astrology and interpretations of the stars.
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Clifford H Colpitts Jr Feb 10, 2008, 2:52pm EST
I should add that one of the mental disorders I suffer from is taking on the guilt of crimes committed by others. I and my psychiatrist are making progress in that area. Just yesterday, while I was at Umberto's Claim house in Little Italy, New York, I said I was about to commit a crime because some very young camera crew guy actually told me that he that those from the little island of Sicily were a bunch of fagots. That bothered me...So I imagined a fire somewhere that had to do with claims, fish and and a cup of tea. As I said...my psychiatrist is close to getting me a cure. Good thing I'm an atheist because then, perhaps, I would never stop taking credit for the sins of others.
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Dalal A. Feb 10, 2008, 4:13pm EST
Interesting comments. Many are confusing "belief" with "religion", and them with {meditation, Yoga, and relaxation}, which are all important components of balance in spirituality. I understand the rejection to be included in an organised religion or a cult because of what those group of people represent, however, the fundemental existance of God I don't think is questionable.
I sometimes wonder if so called "non-believers" as Marlene named them, choose to be so because of multiple dissapointment in their lives, by parents, priests, Imams, teachers or neighbours? As some of the comments suggest?
Does giving up on such an idea produce a sense of security or loss?
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Chris W. Feb 10, 2008, 6:18pm EST
Marlene- I do consider the effort to get creationism taught in public schools to be a prime example of religion stepping over the line in a free society and throwing its weight aroung in a very inappropriate way. I do not argue for atheism to be taught in schools. Christians need to stop asking that creationism be taught in a public school. I do not relish the idea of creationism being taught in private religious schools, but I will tolerate it because I think fighting that would be an example of me stepping over the same line in breaking the limits of civility.
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Chris W. Feb 10, 2008, 6:24pm EST
Dalal- for me, not having the idea of "God" in my mind is not something that I experience as a loss at this point in my life. But I think it was hard at first when I was a young teen. After all, the "God" concept is sort of like the "parent" concept to a child. It can be difficult at first to do without it.
That may sound prejudicial- but please realize I ONLY SPEAK of my personal experience. If religious conviction is meaningful to you, I am not going to try to talk you out of it. That would be just as futile as you trying to convert me.
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Elizabeth E. Feb 10, 2008, 7:38pm EST
Don't worry...we are who we are...I am Catholic but stayed away from the church for 27 years because one day the main preist came to bless the house and told my mother that my brother and sister could not come back to Catholic school because she did not put enough money in the basket...(All I could see is Jesus in the temple)...I walked away from faith for a long, long, time. Now I do go faithfully...it is so different today. I admire who you are and do not let anyone try to change it!
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Dalal A. Feb 10, 2008, 7:52pm EST
Chris_ believe me I won't even attempt.
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Dalal A. Feb 10, 2008, 7:55pm EST
Chris_ I love your dragon. Dragon is my year in the chinese calender.
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Bruce B. Feb 10, 2008, 10:05pm EST
Dalal, thanks for your interest. Just speaking for myself, I don't feel a sense of loss or security, or non-security. I really don't think there was any particular loss or disappointment either that pushed me away from belief in God. I don't feel pushed. It is more of just a knowing that there is no God. The idea of there being a God seems inconsistent with all the experiences I have had in life. I see no evidence of God in the world. *smile* I know it hard for a believer to understand this. For myself, I feel totally bewildered that so many people do believe. But I agree with Laura, "As long as you don't push it on me, you can believe or disbelieve as you please".
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Dalal A. Feb 10, 2008, 11:48pm EST
The mind is the most challenging miracle created. It processes thoughts, feelings, and desires....the fortunates are those whose minds lead them to the safe shore.

I pray for all guidance and peace...

Good night.
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Marilyn M. Feb 11, 2008, 8:44am EST
Good article and most of the comments have been respectful. Like another above, I believe that's because your article was respectful of others.

It's amazing how differently we've all been made, how unique we really are. I'll have to write aobut some of my experiences. Like how I wandered through a church as a 3 year old kid and "saw Jesus." My mom and aunt went all through that church looking for some strange man, but there was none. (My cousin - a year older - must have seen something too. His mouth was wide open when they found him, as if he'd seen a ghost. He never spoke of what happened, though. I did!)

I have always known there was a God. My son asked me about that when he was a teen struggling to figure out what he believed and didn't. He studied all religions, plus spoke with some agnostics and atheists trying to decide what label he would choose. For me, there has always been a deep down heart, mind and soul knowledge of God. I can't explain it, but it's been there.

I was only 7 when I asked Jesus to be my Lord and Savior, and when I went into the church the next time, I quietly asked, "where are you Jesus." A strong, yet loving voice answered, "I'm right here Marilyn." Ever since, I have had a sense of God every time I visit a new church. I can feel God's presence (or lack thereof) at the fron door.

I wish everyone could experience the love and joy and peace that I have as a Christian, but I would never push my religion on anyone. If someone asks, I am willing and ready to respond.

I think it was Melissa who said she didn't know anyone who prayed at meals anymore. We do, even in restaurants, and I know many who do.

Weighing in on creationism/evolution. I think both should be taught in schools. Evolution is a theory that cannot really be proven. I think a good education would teach what many in America believe.

I find it very sad that schools have taken out any meniton of religion from history books. How in the world can you study history without mentioning religion, when it play such a huge part in history? How do you explain the beheadings in Europe without mentioning that there was such a divide because of religion?
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David S. Feb 11, 2008, 10:25am EST
Very personal, informative and nice post!
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Susan Budig Feb 11, 2008, 11:59am EST
Marilyn, I liked your response. A couple of thoughts, one, my junior in high school reports that historical religion is taught in her World History class. Two, I noted Melissa's comment about no one praying before meals. Most people I know pray before meals. I guess it's part of the flock in which one flies.
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Tristan Russell Feb 11, 2008, 2:49pm EST
Great post, Laura. I support what you're doing here on Gather. We need a larger voice.
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Laura Cushing Feb 11, 2008, 4:00pm EST
Dalal
Does giving up on such an idea produce a sense of security or loss?

For me, it brought a sense of relief - I didn't have to feel guilty about things, or fear punishment by a higher power, or feel 'wrong' that I didn't feel the presence of God.

I also felt stronger as a person - that I could take responsibility for my own actions on this earth.
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~ Zeldapie Feb 11, 2008, 4:19pm EST
Laura, thanks for posting this thought-provoking article!

I don't have anything to do with organized religions, as I believe that they've done much more harm than good over the centuries. Too many wars, too much bloodshed, too much hatred of anyone outside of whatever one believes is the True Religion. Yes, I realize that many people involved in organized religion perform good works, too, but you only have to read history or today's newspaper to see the horrors brought on by people's religious beliefs. The Holocaust. The Spanish Inquisition. Tens of thousands burned at the stake for being a Catholic, a Protestant, a heretic, a witch. The Crusades. Christians vs. Muslims. Shiite vs. Sunni. Everyone vs. Jews. It's ridiculous, absolutely ridiculous.

I have my own beliefs, which I show to the world by my actions - by being kind, good, and generous in spirit - by volunteering and helping others. I can do these things without having a religious belief, and I'm guessing that Laura does, too. I suppose if you have to classify me, I'm agnostic, as I believe that some supreme being created the universe... but beyond that, it's all conjecture.
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Susan Budig Feb 11, 2008, 5:52pm EST
Interesting, Zeldapie, I am Christian, but I don't believe a Supreme Being created the Universe.

Go figure.

Also, I find your first paragraph shockingly shaming. It's very unbalanced. Hate to disagree so strongly with one of my connections.
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Renda B~surviving the storm by dancing in the rain. Feb 11, 2008, 5:56pm EST
I applaud you for writing this article. You said everything so well! Definitely worth this 10 I am leaving.
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Sheryl O. Feb 11, 2008, 6:09pm EST
Beautifully put, Laura. I pretty much feel the same way and have a similar background. I only wish I could have come to this conclusion earlier in life. In many ways, I and my friends who are atheists are much more "christian" in their outlooks and practices than many so-called christians are. We would ALL be much better off if we felt and acted this way.
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Dalal A. Feb 11, 2008, 9:16pm EST
I would like to share with you Laura_and whoever interested with how I see my God. Especially the folks who say there is no "evidence of God" in my life. I feel many comments reflected a sense of anger and fear towards God, when I see God as a more beautiful strength to us. He is not only some entity or power to fear or someone to pray to before a meal. Please take it as if you are reading it from a book or a magazine and spare me the thought of thinking I am "preaching" as it is Not my intention. Just few words out there in the greatness of God.

In my belief God questions man in the holly quran: {You have surely known of the first creation}[Al-Waqiaa, ( the Event) : 62] of course you know who gave you life: {Why then do you not reflect?}[Ayah 62] {Consider the seeds you grow. Is it you that give them growth or We?}[Ayah 63]. Who made the seeds grow into plants, which you think is due to your efforts? You have just planted the seed, watered it, and cared for it. Have you ever asked who made that seed alive and how is the seed transformed into seven spikes, which at the same time include hundreds? Who has made the earth a womb similar to the woman's womb that embraces the semen? Who gave the earth the quality of having a womb that embraces the seed and donates it with the elements of growth, reproduction, and freshness?

Who has given the seed you planted the ability to live and to grow, Is it you?! The answer is no. You have just taken the seed, which is created by God and put it in the earth that is full of secrets; you are just talented in the art of farming, a talent that God granted you with while God created the laws that govern its growing : {If We pleased We could turn your harvest into chaff}[Alwaqia :65]… Which means that God is able to ruin them all {So that, filled with wonderment, (you would exclaim): We are laden with debts! Surely we are deprived,"(Al-Waqiaa: 65), otherwise you would be leading a life filled with hopelessness, poverty, and despair, if it were not to God.

{Consider the water which you drink, was it you that brought it down from the cloud or We?! Have you ever thought of the secrets and the laws that cause rain? If we wished, we could make it salty}[Al-Waqiaa : 64-68]. God has made the sea salty, and he could make all your water salty. {Why then do you not give thanks?} [Al-Waqiaa: 70]. If I think of God it is for the abundance He has granted me with? How about fire. What about the trees that give you the wood which is apt to burning? {Observe the fire which you light. Is it you that create its wood, or We?} Al-Waqiaa:[71-72] Who has created the tree and made its wood combustible?! "We have it a reminder for man, and a comfort for the wayfarer of the desert, praise them the name of your Lord, the Supreme One". [Al-Waqiaa, 74,75]
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Dalal A. Feb 11, 2008, 9:18pm EST
I also dislike comments such as "we are much more christians? what is that suppose to mean? People in general, as long as they are away from experiences and sufferings, They don't steal because they don't need to; they are not deviated because they had no chance to; however, once they are tested, they immediately fall and stumble. shallow or empty (believers or non-believers equally) are shaken by the wind of temptations . Anybody with no depth and moral stability especially. So everyone is challenged and ultimately need a strong sense of who they are to be able to be advocates of humanity.
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T Cheri P. Feb 11, 2008, 9:20pm EST
Laura
THANK YOU!
I am so glad you posted this.
It was very intelligently written and very thought out!

Props to you!
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Nakita Caruso Feb 11, 2008, 10:24pm EST
I'm not an atheist, but I don't consider my self to belong to any particular religion. I think that there is a god, but it doesn't care what people are doing. We got a planet to live on, and if we destroy ourselves... well, it's our fault. I think that some people need the structure of religion.

It's hard for me to explain my beliefs to people, so I usually keep them to myself.
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Alison H. Feb 12, 2008, 2:00am EST
bristlecone pine —
older
than our religions

ayaz daryl nielsen

http://www.theheronsnest.com/haiku/0904o1840/thn_issue.h4.html
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Syed The Shah Feb 12, 2008, 3:23am EST
Thank