WE the People....

You're so right. Every day more of our rights are stripped away and it seems as if no one cares.

Well, Marilyn...at least there's you and I!

We people have always been lazy, irresponsible, selfish, and fearful. We have never really cared about anyone's rights but our own or anyone's welfare but our own. We elect scoundrels and then complain about the party we voted against when things go wrong. We haven't changed hardly at all in over 200 years. We are reaping what we have sown.

I have discovered a solution but nobody really cares because it's too much trouble to think and certainly too much trouble to actually do anything.

www.nopom.info

C A.... you Marilyn and I.... that's 3.

Why weren't you writing and protesting when GWB 43 was pissing on the Constitution?

I guess it doesn't matter if a Republican is in office.

Erik - explain to me how that happened?

And, Erik, deflection tactics mean nothing to me. Tell me you're happy with the direction your country is headed....and I'll seriously doubt your sanity.

See, Tammy...we're gaining momentum!!

I'm not sure what rights you see as being immediately threatened. I know that we're in deep trouble and I have many ideas about where we've gone wrong, but I am hopeful about the new administration. What do you want us to write to Obama?

Right, I'm addressing a guy who looks like a corpse and a woman in a burkha.

You must have been asleep the past eight years.

http://www.truthout.org/article/jason-leopold-bush-authorized-domestic-spying-before-911

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB24/nsa25.pdf

http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/documents/olc-memos.htm

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE5216XR20090303?sp=true


These are a start. I don't need to use deflection, CA, the truth is ugly enough.

What exactly are you protesting?

Did any of you happen to notice the fact that we lost rights under Bush such as the right to privacy and due process? Did any of you know that people were eavesdropped on simply because they were journalists? Did you know that people had their property searched and taken away from them without even a search warrant? Did you know that people were tortured? Did any of you know that people were held in custody without having the right to contact an attorney and were imprisoned for years at a time even though they were innocent? This all happened under Bush and were you protesting then?

If anything, we're going to get back rights under Obama, a constitutional lawyer.

Unbelievable. Now that Bush is out of office, these people are going to cry over the rights that were stripped over the last eight years and blame it on President Obama? Unfreakingbelievable. Well, it should be unbelievable but considering they haven't got much of anything right yet, I guess it isn't really.

Y'all are (almost) all missing the point.

President Obama has socialist leanings, but he's such a clueless newbie that he will soon fade into insignificance.

What YOUR (and my) representatives are doing, right now, and what they did in 2008 - yes while President Bush looked the other way (dammit!), is destroying our future way of life.

Please read something besides liberal blogs, and the MSM, to get a well-rounded view of what's happening.

Bashing Bush won't stop this boulder from rolling down the hill, and frankly, you lose all credibility when you start talking as if anything he DID in the PAST has anything to do with what I'm talking about NOW.

Gail - click on the name Thomas Payne and you'll see a video about what I'm referring to.

"and frankly, you lose all credibility when you start talking as if anything he DID in the PAST has anything to do with what I'm talking about NOW."

That is singularly the most inane statement you've ever made on Gather. It absolutely has everything to do with what's going on now. If he hadn't taken the actions he had, there would not be any discussion, or any need, to take action. The "destruction of our way of life", as you call it, started happening according to some under FDR. Of course, none of that is true.

Please read something besides wingnut blogs and Newsmax, and listen to something besides the big bloviator, to get a well rounded view of what's happening.

Carla...

Have you ever watched anyone be tortured? I have. I was stationed in the Middle East at the time. My job at the time was to pass video feed from unmanned aerial aircraft that patrolled the area. The enemy shot down one of our aircraft and I watched via live video feed as the enemy systematically removed our soldiers and airmen from the wreckage. What happend next was unspeakable... and real. In comparison, those people would most likely considered waterboarding a walk in the park.

War today is not as you expect or hope for in a civilized world. We (Americans) are expected to fight against an enemy that is ruthless and persistant... we are expected to behave and leave our arensal of defenses limited while our troops suffer emmense tragedy because they are "following the rules". All is not fair in love and war... but we should be able to defend ourselves equally. I have no mercy for those that commited heinous crimes against our soldiers and airmen. None. If you had seen the same things I have, you would agree... or agree to surrrender.

Detainees are not Americans and should not be protected by the US Constitution. If their host country abides by and accepts the Geneva Convention, International Law of Conflict, and Law of Armed Conflict rules, they should be protected accordingly. If not, they are not protected. I can tell you first hand, many enemy combatants do not abide by the rules.

I, for one, agree that a certain amount of civil liberty needs to be sacrificed for our over all freedom. The case of para-military camps in Georgia (and throughout the USA) is a perfect example of this. We need to be able monitor them... I'm all for wire-tapping these types of activities. If not, then we deserve the outcomes they support.

No civil liberty needs to be sacrificed for our overall freedom. In fact, the loss of any civil liberty calls into question whether we have any overall freedom at all. If one Administration can declare some people bad, imprison them, torture them, and deny them due process what make you think they can't / won't do it to you? What makes you so special? You don't think they can come up with some excuse.

Sorry. I get upset about these things.

What I find particularly interesting is that this post is about 'We the People.' Never once did you mention any particular president or administration that is responsible for the stripping of the rights of the people. You've said it happened over time and have also pointed out that it's also largely the fault of 'We, the People.' Yes, you did mention some current events, but it appears that you did so because that is something we can do about now.

Inevitably, however, we get the 'me thinks thou dost protest too much' group in to stand by their man and, if that's not enough, to get in some Bush bashing. I wouldn't mind if they didn't do it on every single post that they comment on that isn't singing the praises of their hero. Even when it's not about him they must make it about him or make it a negative about Bush. They wonder why he gets labeled their Messiah. Absolutely incredible!

That video might work better with a laugh track. Apparently "Mr. Payne" doesn't realize that "We The People" rejected that nonsense back in November.

I'm a citizen of the United States, and I don't revere the Declaration of Independence as a sacred document, and apparently neither does the author of this article, since "We the People" isn't from the Declaration of Independence, but rather from the Preamble to the United States Constitution.

God Bless You, Sue!! YOU at least get it.

And, Wil...you are right about the Declaration/Constitution mix-up, something I often do....I have edited the article, and thank you for pointing out the mistake.

Tammy N., my respect and admiration for the brave women and men who protect me knows no bounds.

Thank you seems so inadequate, but they're the only words I have.

God Bless.

The Dems and the GOP are just alike and they know that if the other gets elected they can rape the Constitution from the other end. When is everyone going to open their eyes and realize that?
Bush did it several times in the past 8 yrs and now Obama is doing it. Both hit the 1st Amendment and Obama will deffinately hit the 2nd as it threatens their big government plans being the last form of checks and balances not completely negated yet.

I've been saying it for years, but the MOST IMPORTANT people in this whole process are the Justices that sit on the Supreme Court.

God protect us from the liberal whack-jobs that the Obama administration may choose if any of our current Justices are forced to leave their positions during his Presidency.

Wil, thanks for the chuckle.

Gee, Tammy, I wonder what Jesus would say about torture....

I have a cousin who works at the Pentagon. He served in the Air Force, a career militarist. He is a high ranking member of the armed services. He disagrees with what Bush/Cheney commanded to be done during the Iraq war. He saw it from the other side and found that disagreeing could lead to trouble in your career. He has been to war himself and he does NOT believe in torture. He knows that torture does NOT work. It was proven during WWII. Torture by those in command in Guantanamo was used by emotionally and psychologically damaged people to take out their anger. It was used to humiliate. This made those who were tortured even more angry and hateful towards Americans. It has fueled the fire of anti-Americanism and more and more terrorists are being trained because of the torture that we have inflicted upon these people. It has backfired. It is another example of what energy you put out there will come back to you tenfold.

Carla - can you provide a single piece of corroborating material to your anti-torture tirade "facts"?

Stopping by to say

Why weren't you writing and protesting when GWB 43 was pissing on the Constitution?

I guess it doesn't matter if a Republican is in office.
Erik B., Mar 23, 2009, 1:34pm EDT

Erik B., you really should read the Constitution before making comments like that.

Carla, how do you explain the results the enhanced interrogations brought to bear. And, how would you have felt if Los Angeles would have been attacked through a second wave of terrorism if those techniques had not been implemented? Just wondering. I guess American human life is not that important to you, but the image we have in the world is so much more important? HMM??

I've been saying it for years, but the MOST IMPORTANT people in this whole process are the Justices that sit on the Supreme Court.

God protect us from the liberal whack-jobs that the Obama administration may choose if any of our current Justices are forced to leave their positions during his Presidency.
C A., Mar 27, 2009, 8:19am EDT

C.A., you have hit the nail on the head with that thought. Once the liberals have all three of our powers, we will be but sheep heading for slaughter. I know I've jumped into this article late, but I saw it on my article as something I would be interested in. I am certainly interested in hearing from folks of my own political ideology. Thanks for the article. Oh, we already have a couple of folks on the Supreme Court who will be leaving under Obama's administration. One of them has pancreatic cancer and I don't know how long she will be on the bench.

We all need to get as angry over this as many do violations of the Second Amendment. If we all stood up for the Bill of Rights as strongly as many do for just one article of it, DC would be rocked on it's heels. Until that happens, those who care about constitutional government will continue to watch it be chipped away, in bigger and bigger chunks as is happening lately....

I'm sorry to hear that you feel that you've become complacent, lazy, and fearful, CA. Have you tried neuro-linguistic programming? I hear that Tony Robbins can really help. Also, you might try holding a gun in one hand and a bible in the other, while insisting that the only way to save America is to get back to living the way the Founding Fathers intended, including scrapping all but the first ten amendments.

I think the Tea party needs to uses (not specifically endorse) State politicians committed to weakening the Federal government's power.
That remains our best path to total victory. This is because Liberty is obtained and retained only thou competition, not monopolies.

The State politicians representing the State Government's power interest, That interest and the power it welds presents us an opportunity for the the needed reintroduction of competition with not only with the Federal Governments power (which is an absolute monopoly) but between the States for both votes and each individual business (money) and person (wallets). Because unlike the Federal government business and people can much more easily and reliably chooses to escape any State government's abusive reach. This makes them a commodity that States can't so easily abuse as the Federal government does by much more effectively holding you (and them) captive with immigration and trade controls.

To this end it is incumbent upon us that we MUST utilize and support ANY State Politician, Republican and Democrat alike who is willing to support this cause. Because their power interest is based in the State Government not the Federal Government, and their power presents us with the very best hope and chance to limit and check the Federal government’s power perpetually.

It is federal politicians that have advocated larger FEDERAL government that should and must be the subject of our scorn, for they really only advocate a larger scope and impact of the monopoly that most significantly is the cause of our long-term and short term problems.

While we cannot afford to have our movement hijacked exclusively by any ONE party, but we also cannot afford to disallow any politician's help in our cause. WE MUST TAKE THAT HELP AND USES IT FOR ALL THAT IT IS WORTH!

Simply hating everyone and forbidding forgiveness won’t get us anywhere but obscurity and doom.
That does not mean we should trust them, but rather trust their self-interest, with vigilance! The same thing we should always have been done. For now our interest are very much allied and depended upon our State’s power interest, we must press that alliance and uses this vital tool our founding fathers provided us with(our States) to check the federal government!

The State's rights movement IS the only real permanent rout to victory in our cause.
Because States compete with each other unlike the Federal government, it is exactly that competition that maintains liberty and enables “we the people”, we the individuals to check their excesses just as we are effectively checking California's in accelerating its collapse thus forcing it's eventual reform, before it takes all of its people down with it.

Federalism is the best hope for maintaining liberty over the long run, we must to restore and retain our system's Federalism or we can never restore and retain our liberty over the long run!

An EXCELLENT post, CA!! Many Americans are now choosing else feeling forced to shake themselves awake and open their eyes to the dangers that have stealthfully, premeditaed and behind the scenes going ons that have been threatening our nation for decades! You may find my recent post "We the People" interesting and challenging though uplifting as well. Not all Americans are blinded to the truth of what's ahead if we continue to slumber and many are now awake and stepping up to the bat of individual responsibility to bring our government back to the reality that they serve the people, not the other way around!