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by Devin Barber
Member since:
November 25, 2006

LEFT OF THE RIGHT: Minneapolis Bridge Collapses Two Years After Being Rated Structurally Deficient. But Hey, the Republican's Got Their Tax Cuts.

August 02, 2007 02:36 PM EDT (Updated: August 03, 2007 02:47 PM EDT)
views: 594 | comments: 304

fileId:3096224744299570;size:inter;I’m going to start this article out by stating that I worked in the highway engineering and construction field at the county and state highway department levels for 22 years. So you could say I have more than a passing familiarity with the subject.

 

The catastrophe in Minneapolis saddens me and my prayers and condolences go out to the people of that fine city. What angers me, are those who represent the forces that are responsible for the criminal neglect of our nations highway infrastructure. As a former insider, I know very well the angst and frustration of the dedicated men and women who are charged with building and maintaining that infrastructure. And it is a fatally serious business, as we unfortunately learned on Wednesday. But not only do these silent, unseen civil servants have to deal with this task of galactic proportions, they also have to deal with political forces hell bent on keeping the effort under funded. And when I say under funded, I’m talking a level that I consider shameful.

 

And who are these politicians who are responsible for this neglect of one of the most important elements of our nation’s economy, our highway infrastructure? It’s the Republican’s and their all-important tax cuts. I just don’t understand how they can be so short sighted. They claim to be the champions of capitalism. Yet they are guilty of criminal neglect of our economy’s single most important element, our nation’s transportation infrastructure. It’s an attitude that seems self defeating to me.

  fileId:3096224744299569;size:inter;

There is nothing new to transportation professionals about Wednesday’s news. They’ve been sounding the alarm for decades. But that alarm has remained unheeded to this day. Predictions of incidents like the one Wednesday go back to the 1950’s from highway officials, but they were dismissed as being worst scenario and the issue was just as quickly forgotten by the politicians.

 

I’ll admit that to conservatives, Republican tax cut rhetoric can seem very sound. But they ignore some extremely vital elements of civilizations requirements. In this day and age we simply can no longer afford to neglect things like our highway infrastructure. Our countries system of roads is like its cardio circulatory system. Our countries economic health depends on it. It’s one of the reasons I don’t have any faith in Republican politicians. They are always touting how tax cuts will encourage new investment in our economy. Yeah, what about investing in the thing that economy’s life depends on, our highway system? The Republican’s attitude on this is hypocritical, irresponsible, and short sighted.

 

If the neglect of our nation’s highway infrastructure continues at today’s level, I predict we will see disastrous effects on our economy in the not too distant future. It’s time for the incompetence of the Republicans who have enjoyed power over the last 40 years to end, and the work of making the United States as great as it once was to begin.

 

***********************

 Devin Barber, Politics Correspondent Devin’s column, “Left Of The Right” published twice weekly or more to Gather Essentials: Politics is a Blue Collar Democrats take on current political news. Devin was raised by proud Roosevelt Democrats. Being the son of parents counted among the throng of Americans displaced by the Great Depression has given Devin a deep rooted passion for causes dealing with the poor and the working class. You can find all of Devin’s columns at http://gather.com/leftoftheright You can keep up with Devin’s postings and his Gather activity by joining his Gather network. Just click here:http://kiwina58.gather.com and then select the orange “Connect” button on the left-hand side of the page.  You can find Devin and other Political Correspondents, plus celebrity content and plenty of other politics experts at Politics.gather.com.
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Comments: 304

Lori F. Aug 2, 2007, 3:27pm EDT
Devin its a terrible tragedy. As your column points out the "big boy" cut the funding but the blame will come to the people responsible for maintaining the roads.
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LEЯA © Politcally Incorrect M. Aug 2, 2007, 3:40pm EDT
Oh YES!!! I was wondering when someone was going to blame this on President Bush and the Republicans.

I do love you guys so. You never let me down. Never.

However, it does also continue to be so b-o-r-i-n-g.
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Μόףףý ● ķ ~ Aug 2, 2007, 3:46pm EDT
Yawn.
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 3:53pm EDT
Lera & Moggy...?
I don't think I've seen the two of you before. Welcome to the "I Hate Devin" club.

So talking about neglecting the nation's highway infrastructure is b-o-r-i-n-g huh? Well, all I can say is; God forbid you might find yourself on one of these collapsing bridges one day. I wonder if your precious tax cuts will seem so great then.
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LEЯA © Politcally Incorrect M. Aug 2, 2007, 3:57pm EDT
Thank you for the welcome. I didn't know it was a club though.

What, Devin? Like nothing, no tragedies ever happened during Clinton and the Democrat's watch?
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 3:57pm EDT
Oh, by the way, the DB 1 was just devastating, Ill never be able to write again... boo hoo hoo...

Very childish, but that's what I've come to expect from the Right wing-nuts.
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 4:05pm EDT
Side track... shift blame... mention Bill Clinton...

Very good, you are well trained in Republican debating procedure. Go back and actually READ the article. I'm blaming the morons who think current funding levels for our highways is just fine, and in fact want to cut that funding. That way they can give them selves more tax cuts. And if the fact that it's Republicans who make up the vast majority of these people bothers you, tough.
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Sue * Aug 2, 2007, 4:26pm EDT
I do think this is a tragedy that we may see repeated if something isn't done. According to news reports, thousands of bridges across the country received the same sub-standard rating during recent inspections. Supposedly, the bridge wasn't going to fall...but, it did, so might the others. I'm not sure that it would have made a difference as to who was in office...I hope it makes a difference now that they can see what can happen.
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LEЯA © Politcally Incorrect M. Aug 2, 2007, 4:28pm EDT
Ah, go back and read again. I didn't blame Billy Boy for this specific tragedy. Just don't try to tell me that HE never had something unfortunate happen while he spent his 8 years in office getting blow jobs and feeling up every female in sight!

Stop being an opportunist and using this to blame the current administration for EVERYTHING under the freaking sun!!

I didn't rate your article, but if you want to call Republicans wing "nuts", I will not let you down. Just like the moonbat Bush haters never let me down.
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LEЯA © Politcally Incorrect M. Aug 2, 2007, 4:30pm EDT
Yes, instead of hating and blaming either party let's fix the problems.
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Katie Scarlett (Site Bouncer Wanna Be) O. Aug 2, 2007, 4:36pm EDT
I find it unbelievable how our tragedies and natual disasters always have a way of becoming political. It always moves in a left to right motion too. Sickening.
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Katie Scarlett (Site Bouncer Wanna Be) O. Aug 2, 2007, 4:38pm EDT
Oh and by the way, I'd be more than happy to leave you a 1 with my comments since you asked so nicely.
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Bill's Spirit Aug 2, 2007, 4:42pm EDT
I see what you're saying Devin.

You've struck close to the objection I have to Ron Paul and the small government concept.

First off; The head that should roll over this bridge episode would be that of the person who had the responsibility to close the bridge once it was discovered to be deficient. Then there should be a royal butt reaming of the entire department from top to bottom. The first priority of their job is to keep the public safe. Keeping roads and bridges open is secondary. Don't they have mission statements plastered on the office and shop walls anymore?

Second, about small government; none of the efforts that have been tried over the past forty years have yet amounted to one whit of cheaper taxes. The disappearance of our military bases, the arrays of standing forces and the civilian corps that supported them never brought one single tax cut to the average taxpayer.

As the population grows the government must grow. The idea of keeping government small is by reality a relational thing. There is no workable vision for any small form of government to effectively and fairly look after the needs of 300 million people; especially amid economies that flow in the trillions of dollars.

I'm an adamant, believing voter that government should be actively involved in as many things as necessary to protect the people, keep them safe and help them in their pursuits of happiness.

I have no problems with government getting big as long as it is positively effective in the lives of the populace.

Small governments lead to higher concentrations of power and they too often act like George O's 'Big Brother'.

Big Government is less prone to this because of the numbers. With vast numbers involved, differing opinions are more readily available, power is spread further about, levels of oversight exist and money is more often funneled to public works versus economic special interests.

Our American past is filled with examples of public works doing grand things for the country.

I guess I'll never understand why Republicans don't support public works.
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 4:48pm EDT
Boy, you people on the Right just can't face the fact that we're in this mess because of the Tax hating Republicans can you? Go ahead and call me political (which is bizarre considering this is a political opinion column,) and decree that I'm just playing the blame game. I find it humorous that you on the Right believe you can trump our argument by heaping rhetorical labels on us, as if we should apologize for assigning political blame. It doesn't change anything. The fact remains that it has been the tax hating Republicans that have fought funding for this most important government function from the beginning and their efforts has and continues to spell disaster for our nation.
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Sandra G. Aug 2, 2007, 4:54pm EDT
"It's the Republican's and their all-important tax cuts."
YES!!!!

"I'm an adamant, believing voter that government should be actively involved in as many things as necessary to protect the people, keep them safe and help them in their pursuits of happiness."
YES!!!!

I was beginning to think i was alone!!! Oh my god! Of course, I don't know near as much about politics and construction as the two of you obviously do... but i agree with both of you!

Devin: Republican's are all about tax cuts. The American people think: "Oh my god, yes, i don't want to pay anything, TAX CUTS!" Very few people actually think about what that means. If they're being cut, what's paying for our public school systems and roadways that are already getting terrible funding? I'm so glad to see someone that looks beyond their own wallet!!!

Bill: I so agree with you. I never thought of it before, but you're totally right. Nevermind the fact that minorities and women are underrepresented (which I don't think should be as big an issue as it is), but the whole american population isn't counted for. That leads to a bunch of old white men who all agree. More politicians brings more ideas and arguments. It won't get rid of corruption, but it will make it harder for any politician to get a monopoly in anything.
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 4:55pm EDT
I do not agree that the fault is bi-partisan. Under Democratic administrations both at the state and Federal level, transportation funding has always increased. Unfortunatley, when ever Republican get the upper hand, they undo that progress and more. Despite efforts by the Left to adequately fund our highway system, efforts on the Right to fight that ahve kept funding levels well below what is needed.
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Sandra G. Aug 2, 2007, 4:59pm EDT
However... I don't think people should be referring to eachother as right or left (politician or civilian). It develops preconceptions and no one really becomes a free thinker... I think that creates a terrible voting system. But that's just my personal opinion, I don't have any facts to support it or anything.
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 5:01pm EDT
Bill,
Don't be so hard on the Highway Dept. folks in Minnisota. They often have their hands tied by the politicians. I've seen more than one incident where proposals by dept, proffesionals were ignored or over ruled by elected officials. And most states have rules of employment for these folks that strictly control what they are allowed to say to the media. I worked for the government for 22 years and I know. When you accept employment with the government, you give up a lot of your rights as a citizen.
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Don(time to open them FEMA camps) S. Aug 2, 2007, 5:07pm EDT
Another case of far too many areas where our government is supposed to protect us, not sell us out for profits.
Repeal the tax cuts , stop all foreign aid ,get out of Iraq , and get to work on OUR infrastructure.
America FIRST all the time!
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Douglas Erisman Aug 2, 2007, 5:09pm EDT
Be careful when leveling blame.

First, there are hundreds of bridges all across the country that have graded as "deficient". I would like to know a little more about the structural integrity of bridges and their repair before I assign blame to anyone.

Second, it never helps a situation when less than 24 hours after a horrible tragedy with no explanation people start pointing fingers. Again, let's allow the evidence to come forward.

Could this have been prevented?

Did tax cuts DIRECTLY affect this particular construction repair?

Were there any other factors?

Your article is too accusatory, too slanted, and too early.

Sorry.
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~ Zeldapie Aug 2, 2007, 5:14pm EDT
Devin, the right wingers attack you personally and bring up Clinton's blow jobs because they have NO ANSWERS.

I was almost on that bridge yesterday - I've lived in Minneapolis my whole life, and I am heartbroken by this tragedy.

I find it insulting and reprehensible that Lera, Moggy, and their ilk decide to use this thread as a way to insult you, when the years of tax cuts and utter neglect by our government has, in effect, killed innocent people.
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Bill's Spirit Aug 2, 2007, 5:17pm EDT
Devin - Isn't that The Alberto Gonzales Defense?

"My hands are tied so I must lie even if people die."

This slogan needs to be ripped from the minds of Americans. It is barely acceptable mong the military and intelligence agencies and has no place in the ranks of public service employees; especially SAFETY departments. How many of them changed their driving routes because they knew the bridge was unsafe?

The only proper contrition will be for each employee to make sure this doesn't happen again. Unsafe bridges should be closed until repaired. Period!

Peoples lives were lost !!
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Douglas Erisman Aug 2, 2007, 5:21pm EDT
What about cars?

Airplanes?

Buildings?

Living near volcanos?

Building houses near alligatoor lakes?

Trains?

Let's be realistic. I want to hear more information before I go screaming at Republican tax cuts.
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Bill's Spirit Aug 2, 2007, 5:24pm EDT
Zeldapie - Back up there, missy. You're a little over the top jumping at Moggy. She hasn't laid into Devin at all. In fact, all she did was throw a yawn on the article. That's hardly reprehensible.
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Jeff R. Aug 2, 2007, 5:31pm EDT
Hey, let's make political hay out of everything that happens. Here's an idea...Get a life....
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~ Zeldapie Aug 2, 2007, 5:31pm EDT
Sorry, I guess I'm a little tense, considering there are still dead bodies in the river not more than a few blocks from me.
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~ Zeldapie Aug 2, 2007, 5:36pm EDT
Not to mention that fact that I've driven across that bridge thousands of times. So yeah, I'm a little on edge.
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Don(time to open them FEMA camps) S. Aug 2, 2007, 5:45pm EDT
There is no excuse for the "yawn'' comment , people died.
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Cheri Cabot Aug 2, 2007, 5:47pm EDT
Oh, so very true....and sad...
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~ Zeldapie Aug 2, 2007, 5:58pm EDT
Thanks for pointing that out, Pamela. Very insightful. Very helpful.
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Joe T. Aug 2, 2007, 6:02pm EDT
When every proposal is shot down as a "pork barrel project," what do you expect. Remember, that the Army Corps of Engineers wanted to build dikes instead of the levees in New Orleans. Congress shot it down as too expensive. There went another seaport - down the drain - so to speak. What worries me, also, is how many other bridges are vulnerable to this? If it could happen in Minneapolis, it can happen anywhere.
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donna f. Aug 2, 2007, 6:05pm EDT
I am still waiting to hear from my sister who lives in Eden Prairie and works in Minniapolis. I emailed her this morning, but no reply yet. Her cell goes directly to her voice mail. I am so very angry that the fact of the deficiency was a known fact, yet left to kill innocents. As Bill stated above, it should have been closed when it was discovered, someone with the balls to stand up to the politicians who might lose a damn vote if they go against popular thought, Party be damned.
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Chris Carlisle Aug 2, 2007, 6:10pm EDT
If you're going to make a bold statement, it would help if you backed up your claims with some facts. Show where budget cuts delayed the construction, cutback funding, something. Without facts, it's just rhetoric.
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Jared G. Aug 2, 2007, 6:15pm EDT
Oh wow - another poop fight.
Just sad for MN as a whole today...
G'nite.
Peace.
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Greg Schiller Aug 2, 2007, 6:16pm EDT
Have you no shame?

I am utterly disgusted at your continual barrage of hate and bigotry, but mostly I am disgusted at your ignorance. Federal and state highway projects are funded through dedicated fuel excise taxes.

Devin's state of Idaho taxes fuel at a rate of 25 cents a gallon. Here is a link to Idaho State Tax Commission

Just an added note, I have also worked in government for over two decades. I was also a Democrat for an equal number of years, however the irrational hate and paranoia of people like Devin drove me out of the party, and are a constant source of irratation in civil service.
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Katie Scarlett (Site Bouncer Wanna Be) O. Aug 2, 2007, 6:19pm EDT
Dearest Keith, I said tragedies AND natural disasters. I did not refer to this incident as a natural disaster. Just pointing out the fact that no matter what happens, even an act of God, it seems to become political fodder for the left to find something, somehow to blame on the right. It's ridiculous. BTW, Tara is beautiful this time of year. Ya'll should try it sometime.
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Joe T. Aug 2, 2007, 6:24pm EDT
Wrong, Greg - Interstate 35 is a federal highway. Congress would have to fund any repairs or work. Check it out the resurfacing was a federal project.
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Patrick C. Aug 2, 2007, 6:25pm EDT
Your article gives us all something to ponder. Putting blame aside, I just heard on MSNBC that it will cost us about $1.3 trillion to fix our infrastructure excluding rail, airports and sea ports. That is a heck of alot of money isn't it?
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Greg Schiller Aug 2, 2007, 6:31pm EDT
Joe, I thought I stated that federal projects were funded through federal fuel excise taxes. Forgive me if that was not clear.

Devin is shamelessly exploiting this tragedy to spread his hate. I think we all need to condemn that kind of behavior.
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Patrick C. Aug 2, 2007, 6:33pm EDT
Lera, Bill Clinton's biggest crime was his choice of gwad awful ugly women. Other than that, he did a great job. BTW I am a REPUBLICAN and not a unquestioning blind neocon. I have a brain and I can think all on my own.
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Joe T. Aug 2, 2007, 6:36pm EDT
Greg - think about it. The federal highway infrastructure would never be funded with the fuel excises taxes. It amounts to a pittance compared to the needs.

There is no hate in this article. The fact is that much of the country goes neglected since the tax cuts. That's not hatred - it's reality.
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Digital Dogs Aug 2, 2007, 6:38pm EDT
That "yawn" comment says it all about repubs, doesn't it? They are simply moneytheists. They worship at the alter of personal financial gain at the expense of everyone else.

Yawn, so a bridge collapsed. As long as they've got their phony tax cuts and they think they're getting richer, that's all that counts.

What a ignorant and selfish attitude. It's shocking.

This bridge had been declared unfit years ago, but there was no money to pay for it's upkeep. No money because of phony repub "tax cuts" that have left us with an overwhelming budget deficit in less than 7 years after Clinton left office with a budget surplus.

Name me just one repub who left office with a budget surplus in the last 50 years. Just one.

We must change this failure of a repub plan to dismiss the importance of taxes - it is INSANSE thinking! Taxes pay for the things we need and use every day. How have so many people in the US been hoodwinked into believing that taxes are bad? Why do they buy the lies of the rich repubs who only are moneytheists at heart and only have their own personal financial success at the core of everything they do.

Taxes pay for our infrastructure, bridges, tunnels, roads, our police, firemen, the vehicles they use to fight fires and rescue people, medicare, medicaid, our military and all their equipment and vehicles, homeland defense, social security, our government operations, our foreign missions and embassies, must I go on? Why is everyone so against taxes when it is taxes that pay for everything we all need?

But all the repub apologists can say is "oooh Clinton got a BJ" Yeah, that's so awful. It's much better to sell arms to the enemies we're fighting on the battlefield (Bush Plans To Sell Arms to Saudi's). And it's much better to have an Attny Gen who lies under oath. And goes to hard-sell a sick man in the hospital (Ashcroft) and then lie about it. And much better to not give our men and women fighting in Iraq the best possible equipment. And it's much better to have some fake religous law school grad decide the fates of Attny's - repub appointees themsleves - and then lie about it under oath. And much better to sell our ports and their ops to our enemies. And much better to waste money on building a brdige to nowhere in Alaska. Forget blaming, this country needs an infusion of money to support our infrastructure.
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Greg Schiller Aug 2, 2007, 6:42pm EDT
By the way,
structurally-deficient means significant problems, but not "will fall," according to the Federal Highway Administration. Its definition of structurally-deficient is:

"Structural deficiencies are characterized by deteriorated conditions of significant bridge elements and reduced load-carrying capacity.")


This bridge was an older span, forty years, that had been inspected less then two years ago, and was slated to be inspected again in September. To attempt to twist and obscure this meaning to score some innane political point, is well beyond the bounds of decency.

I have often been disgusted by Devin, but today, with people who I have worked with risking their lives to swim among the debris to retrieve the bodies of the loved ones of others, I have no patience for this.
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Joe T. Aug 2, 2007, 6:42pm EDT
Well, at least, Clinton got a BJ from a tax paying citizen. Our young people will be heavily in debt paying off the excesses of this administration and the rubber stamp Republican Congress of the first six years. The American way of life is definitely going downhill.
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lynn a. Aug 2, 2007, 6:43pm EDT
I've often thought about the jobs refurbishing the infrastructure across the U.S. could cause. I would think that tht would be good for the economy, as well as citizens. Individuals are supposed to have sense enough not to buy a house they can not afford and maintain. We should have sense enough as a nation to know our infrastructure must be maintained.
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Greg Schiller Aug 2, 2007, 6:45pm EDT
Devin, today I will not lower myself to your level. As an American, as a man, as a person -- you digust me.
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Patrick C. Aug 2, 2007, 6:48pm EDT
Digital Dogs ... please remember this . Republicans and Democrats are pretty much the same when you think about it. The biggest difference when it comes to spending is: Republicans are a party that borrows and spends whilst democrats prefer to tax and spend. Both are irresponsible when it comes to spending and both parties rely on a heck of a lot of smoke and mirrors to balance a budget. If we did that with our finance or a corporation did that, bankruptcy would be immediate.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 6:58pm EDT
This is partisan dribble. You should be ashamed of postings such garbage. Before you blame Republican Tax cuts, you should first look at your state leaders. They have the first responsiblity to prioritize funding. Second, it was listed as structually deficent not fuctionally obsolete, which is the worse. A good solution might be to privitize the highway system. We could guarantee they would regularly maintain their bridges due to liability issues. The problems with these kinds of things is that we have let the government run everyting. That is bad because you can not hold government responsible. We should work to limit government not just for lower taxes but for better lives. Big Government only gives us one thing, BAD RESULTS
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Chris W. Aug 2, 2007, 7:12pm EDT
Devin-
We just went through an illuminating experience here in Virginia regarding our state highway budget. The General Assembly, controlled by no-new-taxes Republicans, refused to raise any tax monies to deal with highway needs. So we borrowed some money, and passed a ridiculous bill that charges reckless drivers up to $3000 for several driving offenses. Yeah, get somebody else to pay for the roads that I want to drive on! When the public became aware of that provision in the law, we entered a period of violent recriminations- but they blame the Governor more than they blame the people who actually wrote the law.

I have a suggestion for George W. Bush- one that I bet he will actually follow. I suggest that he stand up at a press conference and announce that he is asking Congress to devote another TEN MILLION DOLLARS to the task to replacing worn out bridges. Never mind the fact that there are hundreds of these bridges and every one of them will cost millions to replace. He will posture with some ridiculously inadequate amount of money, and then when the Dems suggest an amount of $ that might actually address the problem, the Republicans will be able to say, that's ridiculous, way too much cash, we need that money to keep up our pointless stay in Iraq.
*sigh*
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:13pm EDT
To those who wish not to point fingers at those who openly despise government, and wish to "reduce it to the size where it can be drown in the bathtub," it's time to recognize that disasters like this bridge collapse are the DIRECT result of this anti-public sentiment.

Remember how FEMA failed to respond after Katrina? Did you ever wonder why an organization that worked so brilliantly under Clinton suddenly was incapable of even gathering well-published facts, and moving towards rescue efforts? Once again, it was the DIRECT RESULT of the republican mantra of killing government.

The levy project in NOLA was almost completed, and needed a mere $26 additional million dollars to complete. Instead of allowing that funding to go where it was truly needed, Bush funneled it to Iraq, and we all saw the result.

Guess what? SOMETIMES, things are best left to the public sector, believe it or not. Our public infrastructure is best left to the public, and must be funded as the critical asset that it is.

A few years ago, experts estimated that it would take $1.6 trillion to restore our national highway system. Bush's proposed tax cuts for millionaires was exactly that. What he got was a mere $1.3 trillion. Sure would've been nice to use that towards highway construction, don't you think?

And now, we're spending $12 billion EVERY MONTH in a land that we've got absolutely NO BUSINESS BEING IN. While at the same time, our schools are rotting and crumbling, our highways are rotting and crumbling, our bridges are rotting and crumbing, our electrical grids are rotting and crumbling. In effect, the very core of our nation is falling apart before our eyes, as a DIRECT RESULT of republican "gut-the-government" ideology, but we've got $12 billion we can flush down the toilet called Iraq every month.

It's time to finally hold these GD neocons accountable for the damage that they've caused this nation. Yeah, it sucks that a tragedy like this becomes political, but guess what? It IS political. It is ABSOLUTELY the republican's fault that this happened, and will happen again, because they just HAD to have their precious tax cuts for millionaires and their illegal war in Iraq.

Like it or not, neocons, this one is all yours, and we're going to force you to face it, ugly as it is. It's time you started to see what you're obsession with tax cuts for millionaires has done.
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M C. Aug 2, 2007, 7:14pm EDT
You pathetic fool!
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:22pm EDT
"Before you blame Republican Tax cuts, you should first look at your state leaders."

Minnesota's governor is a "government killing" republican. The man in office before him was a former wrestler, who had also bought into the government killing mantra.




"A good solution might be to privitize the highway system. We could guarantee they would regularly maintain their bridges due to liability issues."

Somebody has forgotten about a little company called "ENRON" and the private companies that have allowed our nation's electrical power grids to deteriorate to the point of near collapse. Apparently, you've forgotten the rolling brown outs in CA and the black out of much of the nation a few years back.

And, we're all painfully aware of how "well" the private health care industry has done for us.

Private companies make terrific widgets. They suck beyond compare at managing the public infrastructure. They've proven it over and over and over again.

Let's look at what private entities are in business for. Profit. What makes them more profit? Cutting experienced employees to "raise productivity," cutting back on maintenance schedules (which is what the private power companies have done to weaken our power grid), and gouging customers in any way possible (ENRON, anyone?).

Who is more likely to maintain your roadways, a private company, whose sole interest is profit generation, or a public entity that is driven solely by safety concerns?

Liability will protect us? That's hysterical. How many people from Love Canal have received compensation for being poisoned? How many people have received compensation from ATT for being illegally spied upon? How much compensation did the survivors of Bophal India receive from Union Carbide?

The fact is, corporations have massive resources to fight off litigation, and oh, btw, republicans have also limited the amount of compensation that you can receive...how thoughtful of them. Not only can corporations drag you through court for decades, but they can suddenly declare bankruptcy the moment you finally do win your case, and you get nothing.

Don't worry, though...at that point, the public picks up the tab. This is the beauty of the republiCON con game. They get to screw you 8 different ways, and you still keep coming back and asking for more, because they're hosing you at so many different levels that you can't even keep focused.
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:24pm EDT
"You pathetic fool!
M C., Aug 2, 2007, 7:14pm EDT "

Sweet debating skills. I'm humbled.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:26pm EDT
Clark, I am sorry but you are wrong. The Federal Government never should have been allowed to grow this big. It is increasingly inefficent. For transportation lets look at the gas tax. States also collect gas taxes and sales taxes. So this is how the gas tax works. You fill your car up and pay the bill. The state then gets the taxes. The state then sends the federal portion to the Department of Transportation who then collects that money, and applies a formula and then sends the reallocated amount back to the states to build roads. Excuse me but I think that we could save a lot of money by cutting out the DOT who employs many people just to collect and reallocate. I am not saying kill all government, I am saying smart government. Everything should not be run by the Federal Govenment. If some of you have problems with that dust out that copy of the consitution and think about all the things that the Fedral Government does that should be left to states or local governments.
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Chris W. Aug 2, 2007, 7:27pm EDT
Oh yeah, Publius, great idea, privatize the public bridges. What, put a toll at each bridge, and let some private company like Halliburton collect the money, fix the bridge, and skim off the profits? Wow, that is so creative. And if they fail to do a good job, or skim off all the money and do nothing?

Jesus of Nazareth once supposedly said give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and give unto God that which is God's. In a similar vein, I will say let the public entity handle that which is public, and let the private world handle that which is private. I do not think that the safety of public transportation is the business of the business world.
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Jai S. Aug 2, 2007, 7:31pm EDT
Amen Clark - you spared me a lot of typing. Devin, your article is spot on. I can almost picture Bush using this sad occasion to get on a Bull horn and renew the slogan - 'we are going to get them wherever they are hiding'. I wonder what kind of ghost or witch we are going to hunt for this tregedy?
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Chris W. Aug 2, 2007, 7:33pm EDT
And if the Dept. of Transportation is so dreadfully unproductive and inefficient and hopeless, why pray tell do Republican administrations keep it in operation? Do not complain to us, you could be writing a note to W or your Congressman.
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:37pm EDT
" Clark, I am sorry but you are wrong. The Federal Government never should have been allowed to grow this big. It is increasingly inefficent."

No, I'm not wrong. The problem with the size of the government has nothing to do with public infrastructure, without which this country would cease to be a functioning nation. I absolutely agree that the federal government spends FAR too much money that it doesn't have, but if you take a look at where that money is going, and match it to the priorities that the founders laid out in the constitution, you'll quickly see that it's the massive, tragically wasteful corporate welfare programs, the unfathomably massive military and terrorist industrial complexes and their permanent war machines, and the whorish private health care system that are crippling us.

Spending on social and national infrastructure is an INVESTMENT. Spending on corporate welfare is WASTEFUL. This is the core difference in the philosophy of the left vs. right. The left recognizes that spending for education, well being, and the commons is money that is returned many times over to society. The right simply doesn't accept this. They wish to believe that pouring money into corporate wallets is an investment. However, as is shown time and time again, this is simply not the case.




"So this is how the gas tax works."

I know how it works. I also know that this republican governor vetoed a recent highway funding bill because it involved a 5c tax increase per gallon. In the process of vetoing that bill, he threw away several millions of federal funding dollars. But, at least he can claim that he didn't raise taxes. Penny wise, dollar foolish. The true sign of a republican politician.




"Everything should not be run by the Federal Govenment."

DOTs are run by the states.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:37pm EDT
you would fight its elimination because you dream of big government would be threatened
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C F. Aug 2, 2007, 7:38pm EDT
Construction's definitely your forte, Devin Barber, but I think you should leave the political notions for the Bush administration.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:39pm EDT
Clark, in case you wern't aware there is a Department of Transportation that is a federal department. But of course you did not knew that, but wanted to take it out of context and some lame attempt of avoiding the issue.
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:42pm EDT
"Does anyone know the total spent so far in that country?"

This is a great site for that information, because it not only has a running tally, but lets you see just what this country is being robbed of, in order to continue pissing borrowed money down the neocon hell hole.

http://www.nationalpriorities.org/Cost-of-War/Cost-of-War-3.html
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News Hound Aug 2, 2007, 7:43pm EDT
Under the Democrats in power the New Orleans levees were in disrepair, and neglected. Under the Republican's in power the levees were in disrepair and neglected. Under the Bush administration, the levees which needed to be higher are being rebuilt to the same standards as before they were breached! Neither party cares and I have to wonder; if the Democrats were in power when Katrina hit would it be any better than this present administration? I tend to think naught. So why would it be any different for bridges, roads, and all other infrastructure?
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ELLEN B. Aug 2, 2007, 7:43pm EDT
I don't give a da~~ what Certain People have said about the article's author. He , like normal Americans, is horrified, that under the current watch, the decay that has been going on, has now cost lives again, and money. Remember Katrina, good job! don't you guys get it. People died!! Sixty children where coming home from camp!! People are now lost in the Mississippi. Right about now I'm certain, The loved one's the living have lost, and the reason for it, why they are gone, they were just driving to a destination,is paramount on their minds. They should be outraged, and so should all Americans. And furthermore, that did happen right here in Missouri, over Highway 55, heading South, it is a problem all over our country, A bridge over a major interstate had a walkway that extended over the highway, running along the street that was the bridge above. Innocent drivers where suddenly faced with tons of concrete falling from the sky. The lead car contained a young college student who just could not stop! Behind her , terrified driver's, still not aware of what had dropped from the sky and filled the hiwghway watched in horror as she frantically slammed on the brakes, slid sideways and hit it going over 50 mph. It was a God's miracle that the other drivers suffered no injuries and she survived hers, the car was incredible to see, I just heard on KMOV 4. St. Louis, that the amount of bridges in Illinois and St. Louis that are rated Obsolete or Deficient, is way up there> Over 7,000 in one State and More! in Mo.! So while you are constantly complaining about the facts, think about this, we have right here on Gather, a beautiful lady , who is living close to the horror of this incident, and you ignore all of this, instead defending someone? And you call names to someone who told you he has experience in this field, and gave you an opinion based on that,and all that matters to you two, is the defence of lackadasiel and incompetent D>O>T> and State and Local officials. Was it cheap materials, a scam purchase? Was it a flaw in design? Hell, they are allready saying that it may be "years" before we know why. That is LUDICROUS!!! In 2007? Oh! Puleeeze. Grow up. I suppose you will defend the situation in New Orlean's also. You are not thinking about what Americans used to have. Safety, quality, concern for public safetyand satisfaction. Trust in our products, and, oh1 wait a minute, we really do not have a lot of products anymore. The come from overseas, you know the fuel? Look around where you are. What plan for an attack, God Forbid, does your City/State have for you? Do you know about it? We know about terrorists, someone knew about the bridge/bridges. Do you really want to start a fight about living assholes who are NOW calling for an investigation. You have well learned the "We'll fix it if it happens. Well, it is happening more and more.Look at the Fischer-Price re-call, this is our children. Now I've just heard of a re-call on another food item, green beans, no, not a cheap brand, the minimim wage loser's would buy, and I am being sacastic, it is Schnucks brand. I guess it is all ok. as long as the good leader's we have, from the top to the bottom continue to monitor and demand high performance from those they designate to, so you turn on your TV, and look at the Americans, who work, and trust, and come back with your Distateful comments, no one is gonna listen, and just take a look at those faces in pain, over the most unbelievable scenario in this country one could think of, look at these faces, like yours, or mine, and care if the current administration is defended. And Zeldapie, you are entitled to all you feel, and I am glad you are ok. Thanks Devin for the nudge, the news on MY local is awful, and so is the Mo./Ill. bridge report. Ellen B
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:46pm EDT
Chris,

"Oh yeah, Publius, great idea, privatize the public bridges."


The government kept it safe right. Oh wait. Nevermind
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:47pm EDT
" Clark, in case you wern't aware there is a Department of Transportation that is a federal department."

No kidding? Do you suppose that's who directs federal funding to the states? Gee, I hadn't even thought of that.

Each state has it's own DOT. The work that is done on highways is done by the state DOT. There are no federal DOT crews patching asphalt in MN.

Btw, do you happen to know which political party has been responsible for the massive growth of the federal government over the past 26 years? No, I think not, or you wouldn't be saying the things you're saying, would you? I'll give you a little hint: It's grown by 25% since 2001. Welcome to massive republican government.
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Dr. dummy (I may be dumb, but I'm not stupid) B. Aug 2, 2007, 7:47pm EDT
Just saw some numbers you all might be interested in. I saw it on CNN. According to the American Society of Civil Engineers, it is projected that it would take 9.4 BILLION dollars a year, for the next 20 years to bring our highway system to today's standards. They said that bridge was rated a 4 on a 1-9 scale 1= tear it down. Here's the kicker, they said that 77,000 bridges in the US are rated the same. That number represents 40% of America's bridges, rated the same as the I-35w. They classify those 77,000 bridges as "structurally deficient" They also said that the I-35w had no redundancy systems. So when one part started falling it was like domino's. Where if you look at the more recent collapses, only sections collapse. They have these systems built into the newer bridges.

But as far as the political end, I can't give the democrats a pass. To me, they are just as guilty. At a time like this, I think ALL politicians are responsible. One gives tax breaks, the other increases taxes. Neither one spends as much as NEEDED, to protect us on our highways.

As I have said in the past, the only thing that the federal government is good at is keeping itself in power.
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Clark Kent Aug 2, 2007, 7:49pm EDT
"if the Democrats were in power when Katrina hit would it be any better than this present administration?"

I strongly doubt that the levee would've been left uncompleted, due to a $26 million shortfall that was sent to Iraq instead.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:52pm EDT
Clark,

I am not making this a partisan issue. I do not care about political parties. I just want smaller Federal Government. I dont think big government solves problems. I am against higher taxes because we dont spend the money we collect right yet. To me it is about correcting government. Not one party is right and the other is wrong, in that equations WE THE PEOPLE, LOSE. Take of your partisan blinders and lets talk about solutions.


Denny B
"As I have said in the past, the only thing that the federal government is good at is keeping itself in power."

Well Said.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:55pm EDT
Clark,

"Each state has it's own DOT. The work that is done on highways is done by the state DOT. There are no federal DOT crews patching asphalt in MN."


Thanks for rewording exactly what i said earlier.

and

"Does anyone know the total spent so far in that country?"

Lets make sure everything comes back to the war. Thats really what you want to talk about
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News Hound Aug 2, 2007, 7:57pm EDT
Agreed, the money was spent on Iraq. But we weren't BROKE, we could afford to rebuild higher levees. I can't be certain that the Democrats would have done better, knowing they also neglected for years the levees and waited for a catastrophe to happen.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 7:57pm EDT
"if the Democrats were in power when Katrina hit would it be any better than this present administration?"

I strongly doubt that the levee would've been left uncompleted, due to a $26 million shortfall that was sent to Iraq instead.


Get Real Clark. Take off those partisan blinders. Come on it wont hurt I promise.
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Dannielle S. Aug 2, 2007, 7:58pm EDT
We had a bridge collapse here in NYS last summer when the floods hit, up near Unadilla. The repairs done to that section of Route 88 -- which would thus be "today's standards" -- have already been judged faulty and new repairs are needed. I'm not sure what "today's standards" really are, which is not a snide response to denny b's comment, it is to challenge us to define "today's standards."

We have bridges much older than the one that collapsed that are still standing -- "yesterday's standards" are not necessarily insufficient.
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Charles M. Aug 2, 2007, 8:00pm EDT
Well as someone who lives here in MN I have a little more that passing information on this subject. During the '06 election there was a bill that was passed that shifted ALL of the vehicle taxes to transportation here in MN the problem was that the dem's allocated a large sum I think it was worded that no less that 40% for light rail. As it stands the only ones who use it live in or visit Minneapolis. There are plans to expand it but the soonest that it will even start to break ground is ten years and the current expansion plans won't be finished for 30 years. So who's to blame for that fiasco. Plus the price tag that the plans were sold to the public with just went up because one of the bridges that it would use has "just" been found to be unable to support the weight of the trains. So I guess a new bridge will have to be built shocking. The original rail line bid was suppose to be half a billion dollars and when it was finished it ended up being nearly 3/4 of a billion. They need to quit trying to make Minneapolis/St. Paul into New York and put that money towards expanding the highway system because the majority of the people drive into the Cities from the burbs or farther out. I live 45 miles from there and drive there. None of these pet projects help with the commute of most people here.
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News Hound Aug 2, 2007, 8:00pm EDT
To date, over $387 billion of U.S. taxpayer money that has been spent on the war in Iraq alone to date--roughly $13750 per Iraqi in the country.
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~ Zeldapie Aug 2, 2007, 8:01pm EDT
And Zeldapie, you are entitled to all you feel, and I am glad you are ok.

Thanks, Ellen, for your kind words - I appreciate it.
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ELLEN B. Aug 2, 2007, 8:05pm EDT
Denny, Thanks for the stats, I have been watching it on the news. One wonder's how (?) they all got so bad at once. I do, like a local park of ours, pictures of things falling apart, and we need a bond issue, a tax! Well what makes the "elected" government State, City, Local, or Federal, wait till something is falling down? What happened to when one brick was bad. I see, instead of doing a wall that has a problem, we keep putting in a new brick!! Over and over. And you are right about some of our government's keeping themselve's in a job. But then they were elected, if we don't vote, and I always do, we are not American. The problem is when they get in there, they cannot stand up to the big "GanG', or "old Boy's Club or mickey mouse, I am sorry but that is the way it is . Ellen B
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Amanda R Aug 2, 2007, 8:06pm EDT
Hey to Lera: I don't know if this was said yet, but at least "Billy Boys" blow job in the Oval Office didn't cost 4,000+ American soldiers lives.
Your ignorance is astounding.
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Machiavelli Dayupay Aug 2, 2007, 8:10pm EDT
I think the city's engineering office of MINNEAPOLIS is responsible somehow the construction was left hanging, and they still continue to let vehicles run their motors through the bridge...

That is shocking... the feeling is like the whole world collapse on you...( Gulp, there were some more bridges!)
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News Hound Aug 2, 2007, 8:13pm EDT
Dannielle said, "We have bridges much older than the one that collapsed that are still standing -- "yesterday's standards" are not necessarily insufficient."

Very true. We have 2,000 year old structures still standing all over the world.
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Al Allaway Aug 2, 2007, 8:16pm EDT
C'mon Devin, You can't be serious that ALL of the funding neglect bears 100% Republican labels.
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Machiavelli Dayupay Aug 2, 2007, 8:20pm EDT
Unadilla - sounds like my maiden name... Gilla.

Una dila, means, ''first tongue'' it also means two things one is bad and one is good..., and etc. The Good thing that its means a ''Mother Language''....

''FIRST TONGUE''

------------

Its very important to check every bridges periodically as precaution now that there were fall downs...
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Joe T. Aug 2, 2007, 9:26pm EDT
Excellent point, Katie.
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David Smith Aug 2, 2007, 9:28pm EDT
Very good take on things. I wondered what an insiders take on this thing would be. Thanks for the insight.
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Craig E. Aug 2, 2007, 9:41pm EDT
40% of my income goes to pay income taxes. That doesn't even cover the hidden taxes. America has bled me dry enough, thanks. I'll tell you what, I'll trade you a few bridge projects for Social Security for illegals, health care for illegals, health insurance for everyone else's kids, and the "War on Poverty".
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C F. Aug 2, 2007, 9:47pm EDT
Katie S., you are right on the money! All the money's being used in Iraq!
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Jeff H. Aug 2, 2007, 9:48pm EDT
I think the usual suspects who see everything through a political lens and use what ever pain or tragedy they can find to advance their ideology are pathetic at best and complete lowlifes. They are despicable ambulance chasing misery whores and poverty pimps who race to the keyboard when ever something bad happens or in the case of politicians, race to the microphome. So pathetic.
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Joe T. Aug 2, 2007, 9:50pm EDT
Craig - the highest bracket is still at 35%. You are not paying 40% of your income for taxes. Get over yourself.
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Virgil W. Aug 2, 2007, 10:00pm EDT
There are so many good and bad stories that this is bound to be a movie. i feel for the lost and celebrate withthe saved. let's pray for them.
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Devin Barber Aug 2, 2007, 10:11pm EDT
An example of privatizing highway maintenence. In the late 1990's the Idaho Transportation Department experimented with a pilot program to contract a portion of the annual pavement marking activity to a private contractor. By the deadline for completion, the contractor had only completed one third of the job. And what they had finished was a horrible mess. The contract had to be suspended, and the regular crews stepped up and still completed all the states pavement markings before the end of the season.
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George McNaughton Aug 2, 2007, 10:19pm EDT
Well Devin, if enough bridges collapse the news media might eventually forget about people dodging bullets in Iraq. It occurred to me that the immediate response that we are going to invest a ton of money into building a new bridge, seems to have just about the same amount of brain power as rushing to rebuild the WTC. Perhaps we should simply stop and say -- okay, no more new bridges until all the ones we already have are safe. Meanwhile, you people who live in places where you fight congestion getting to and from work -- well, perhaps you should think of mass transit or taking a pay cut and moving somewhere with a little more sanity than having American taxpayers continue to subsidize this whacked out energy consuming stupidity that we are now engaging in. Yes, I feel sorry for the people who died -- no I don't think they should rebuild the bridge. They should clean it up and dedicate each side to a memorial to remind us that our transportation system is well out of control and we will never allow our politicians seeking porkbarrel kudos in the form of new bridges that we cannot afford to maintain lure people to their deaths ever again.
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ModernDay Publius Aug 2, 2007, 10:24pm EDT
Katie

I dont need to get a clue. If we got rid of a bloated government there would be more than enough to go around. True we are spending a lot on the war. That is a fuction on the Federal Government, and they can do that if they want. The real issue is not always about spending more money but sometimes using money more effectivley
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