I became aware of this local controversy somewhat accidentally. A week or so back, I was having an unfortunate health episode which took me down to my local emergency room for six hours. I will spare you the details of my condition, because this post is not about me. While I was whiling away the hours, I saw a guy in an orange jumpsuit and handcuffs being escorted by two policemen. I said to myself, wonder what that's about.
Later on, the next day, I saw the story on my local news. An ex-marine had been posting pictures of himself on Facebook shirtless and holding a shotgun, with some odd comments about people getting their heads removed and the time has come for a revolution against our government. Somebody got worried about him and the police were called. They found the young man at his home shirtless and in a combative mood. Long story short, he was taken in for a psychiatric evaluation and is still being held.
This event has not been without controversy. Some friends and relatives of the young man actually were waving signs outside the hospital the day after I was there, saying set him free, police state, yada yada. While I am sympathetic, I think of all the Iraq and Afghanistan veterans who have suicided over the past couple years. There have also been a few who have killed others as well. I think to myself, friends and family, would you prefer for this young man to be dead but free? Free is nice, but when you are dead you don't get to enjoy freedom. The local news hunted up the young man's former commanding officer, who said, yeah I remember him- and if he was saying those kinds of things, then he absolutely needed to be taken to see a psychologist, better safe than sorry. Apparently this young man was not given to idle threats- when he made threats, he meant them.
recommend
Facebook
Twitter
bookmark 
print
Comments: 36
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/group-representing-ex-marine-says-veteran-is-being-detained-for-anti-government-facebook-posts/2012/08/20/gJQAdNplAY_story.html
Did you know this and referred to him as whatshisname because you believe what has happened to him is just?
on the other hand, he might commit suicide by cop as soon as they release him. That's also a possibility.
"Your government is evil. It is as simple as that. And the cavalry is coming."
"Dear Friends in the Military, the time for choosing has come. Will you continue to ignore the obvious lie of 911 or will you stand and fight for your people?"
"I'm starting the Revolution. I'm done waiting."
"This is the part where I tell the Federal Government to go f*ck itself. This is the part where I tell Generals, training our young men to fight Americans, I am coming for you. The Veterans will be with me."
"If you are unaware of the great amount of evil perpetrated by the American Government I suggest you take your head out of the sand. The day of reckoning is almost at hand."
"I am standing against a great evil. I will do it all by myself if I have to. Unless some men in power stand with me."
And on and on it goes. And perhaps one of the most bizarre conspiracy-theory mash-ups I've seen in a while:
"If you are my friend, you deserve to know the truth. This world is secretly run by a shadow organization of people who among other things enjoy raping children. Some of the leaders were involved with the bombing of the twin towers. It was a sacrifice and a complete inside job. Also the Bush's are very sick twisted problems. I believe they have a secret Castle in Colorado where they have been raping and sacrificing children for many years. Think I'm crazy? Think again. Also, there's about the be a revolution. Which is why I'm here."
Wow.
His parents and supporters are right, his rights are being violated.
You don't like him vocalizing his point of view so you feel that it's O.K. to violate his rights.
He served us well and continues to serve us in vocalizing his opposition to an increasingly invasive government.
You claim of personal concern for this man is shown as false in your willingness to have his freedom restricted.
It's sad that so many don't. The man is a veteran. He served his country. And he clearly has psychological problems, quite possibly as a result of the trauma of war. The problem isn't his whether he thinks one solution to the issues that we face is better than another solution, it is that he voices delusional rantings and backs those delusions up with violent rhetoric and gun-wielding.
Again, to ignore this man's medical problems until he does something violent, perhaps killing himself or many innocent people, is simply irresponsible. He deserves medical treatment.
It's a shame so many people don't feel the need to support our veterans.
He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself.
Thomas Paine
US patriot & political philosopher (1737 - 1809)
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
US author, diplomat, inventor, physicist, politician, & printer (1706 - 1790)"
But then we are not talking about people giving up their own rights...In this example we are talking about people advocating stripping others of their rights because of they fear what they/he says.
Freedom of speech as long as I approve of what you say....Is no freedom of speech.
So much for all the conspiracy theories, then. If the cops couldn't provide a sufficient explanation for why he should be held for evaluation, then they shouldn't be able to hold him. According to this judge, they couldn't, so he order the guys release.
According to his attorneys, he was held longer than legally allowed without a temporary detention order. If true, then clearly the cops didn't follow the law. That's not surprising. Cops break the law every day. I don't think that's a good reason to get rid of cops and laws, but maybe some people do.
I guess guarding others (even enemies) from oppression didn't include slaves, women, American Indians, Loyalist Tories, etc.
I wonder how Paine would've responded to the suggestion that somebody guard against oppression by killing Thomas Jefferson or George Washington and offering freedom to their slaves?
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
So no tax-supported standing armies, then?
Being part of an army of occupation in which one is constantly under threat from the people around them is very high stress. Such stress levels for months can drive people insane. It's only natural.
It was being protested due to the claim that it's all talk and no action - yet.
His mother claims that he is harmless and does not own a gun. Yet his Facebook picture has him holding a shotgun.
he is a veteran of both Iraq and Afganistan.
If he resists medication, they will either retain him for a long time or hold him down and forcibly medicate him, if practice similar to that in Oregon is used.
I know of a woman who was held for a year for resisting medication. Others did not resist and suffered serious side effects. There are now communities to help people who want to get off, but this is not available everywhere.
Ironically, I believe there is a non-medication support facility in Virginia somewhere, but I believe it is patronized by people who can pay steep fees. It is highly unlikely this young man will go there.
Veterans for Peace is one of the most open and active research groups regarding what happened on 9-11. Some think it was insurance fraud, and some think it was to destroy evidence. Building 7 contained CIA operations, and the video of it falling most resembles text-book planned demolition recordings of other buildings falling.
The architects and engineers doing research are not going near motives, on purpose. Only the veterans groups seem to have enough people with this sort of expertise. They are looking into the corporate backgrounds of the companies who had access to the buildings before they fell.
Another interesting myth is that the boxcutter crew were fundamentalists. In fact, there is evidence that Atta's behaviors resembles that of debauched congresspersons, not of a person why prays a lot.
I am relieved that those of you wanting this man detained do not express overt wishes that his reliability as a witness in his own defense be damaged by forced medication. This Soviet practice is dismayingly present here, and it frequently comes out that self- and other-harming individuals were on psychoactive medications at the time of their acts.
You can now find this out about Kip Kinkel, for example.
An M.D. I know who works in a jail reiterated the research from Britain about suicidality. Care workers who are paying attention to research off-shore from the U.S. are well aware of this, as they keep up with independent science as opposed to customer-service science.
my feeling is save their lives irst, then work to improve their lives.
Regarding veterans, there is a researcher named Belleruth Naparstek who has established some non-pharmaceutial therapies for veterans, including a CD produced by a veteran himself after the veteran's son committed suicide. It is pretty interesting. You can see a trailer on her website. To be honest, I relate somewhat better to the veteran's sales pitch about listening to calming affirmations than I do to the calming stuff itself. I'm already calm most of the time. I don't need to be more calm.
Anyway, I feel confident your take on the whole site would be different from mine, but Belleruth has done fabulous work with veterans. That is where I first heard her, talking about this on NPR.
If the statements from the judge and the guy's attorneys are true, then it looks like the cops didn't follow proper procedure. If so, then the judge did the right thing (and hopefully there will be an investigation into the matter).
Which isn't to say that this guy isn't disturbed and dangerous. He may be. But if the authorities are going to take people into custody for psychiatric evaluation, they need to at least manage to follow the appropriate laws.
It is difficult to get a recovery for false arrest from the federal government. I doubt he will get much of a recovery for unlawful detention. A week isn't that bad, and they fed him, gave him liquids, and possibly let him sleep during that time. From what I hear, he refused medication, and they did not force it.
In a separate case, a fifth year engineering student in California, arrested for possible drug use, and who was left incarcerated and uncharged for five days, without food or water, by the DEA, probably will get something in damages, as he almost died and may have some permanent physical damage.
It is my understanding that one has to get permission from the feds to sue them, and much of the time, they don't grant that permission.
It is pretty interesting how much news the Raub detention did not make.
At one time when I searched, Chris's Gather posting came up at the top of the page.
In the meantime, it looks as though the R convention will be a showcase of designer gowns and partying by people who have no clue about anything outside their friends and families and people they think of as like themselves.
Why should anyone else watch such a private, family celebration of itself?
Brandon Raub was talking about research done by Architects and Engineers for Truth.
Architects and engineers have reasons to show why buildings designed to resist what is said to have happened fell because of temperatures much hotter than could be produced from fuel burning.
While much of the evidence was quickly shipped to China, breaking general rules about chain of custody in such cases, thermite dust particles could not all be recovered to be shipped to China.
Some of the people who know what thermite is also have experience as veterans. Getting rid of everybody who knows about this would be more than a little tricky, though estimates of what powerful people think they can cover up have to account for some delusions of power, grandeur, and entitlement among cover-up professionals. It's a pity Richard Feynman could not be part of the official inquiry, but anyone watching report can see the officials talking have little resemblance to Feynman.
The first two implosions did not happen from jet fuel, but this is even more evident in the case of Building 7.
Building 7 housed the CIA and some other interesting tenants. Anyone can watch Building 7 come down, and then watch video of controlled demolitions. Building 7 was not hit by airplanes. It came down in its own footprint. It requires certain physics for this to happen. The best of the pros sometimes screw this up. This one was pretty textbook, though.
As for believing that civil war is a risk, I guess if you think Occupy is dissolved and that more labor and port actions are unlikely, you could be right.
Then again, you could be in the position of all those economists who had no idea there was going to be a housing crisis, before there was a housing crisis.
There can be differences of opinion about these kinds of things. A functioning first amendment allows for different ideas about the future to be aired, or so I thought.
Gather has the potential to be a source of detail on matters of some substance, even among all the other stuff that is on here. For me, this is an interesting thing to learn from this incident.