Thomas Sowell Undermining Allies              (OH. HE DIDN'T :)
The British 
newspaper The Telegraph has reported that part of the price which President Obama paid to get Russia to sign the START treaty, limiting nuclear arms, was revealing to the Russians the hitherto secret size of the British nuclear arsenal. This information came from the latest WikiLeaks documents.
--------------------------READ----------------------
I can't imagine what the fall out for this will be.
----------------------------------------
NEW INFO AND CORRECTIONS
This is also a good article and the one Guy presented, however, his article, while denying the exact problem published in the Telegraph, does point out other concerns. ******Guy's article******
ANOTHER IMPORTANT READ. offered by Gail Mountain.
You can read 'the real thing' for yourself :)
******New Start Treaty and Protocol*******
*****************************************
OK ... THIS PARAGRAPH WAS IN THE TREATY & WILL ADD ABOUT 1/2 INCH OF UNDERSTANDING OF OUR OBLIGATION.
******************************************
Article XI11Â Â Â Added to post 2-14-11
To ensure the viability and effectiveness of this Treaty,
each Party shall not assume any international obligations or
undertakings that would conflict with its provisions. The
Parties shall not transfer strategic offensive arms subject to
this Treaty to third parties. The Parties shall hold
consultations within the framework of the Bilateral
Consultative Commission in order to resolve any ambiguities
that may arise in this regard. This provision shall not apply
to any patterns of cooperation, including obligations, in the
area of strategic offensive arms, existing at the time of
signature of this Treaty, between a Party and a third State.
recommend
Facebook
Twitter
bookmark 
print
Comments: 168
Guess I better run back and reread. It's worth the time. I would think Europe was seething. I believe these leaks were just put out last night.
That info has been out a couple weeks, but the msm is ignoring it.
I'm not trying to trash him. He's my President & I want him to do well but he embarrasses me. I do feel like he does not try to hide it when he disdains people. In fact, I feel like he enjoys showing it.
If you have something to show me to show we are mistaken I would happily receive and acknowledge it.
We do worry about the problems she has but ours are about the same. We'll just have to encourage each other.
Something bad is happening all across our earth. I really think it is simply that there are not enough people living for the Lord and so there is a great lack of integrity everywhere. Evil is getting out of hand. We need to pray for each others country as well as our own.
I don't see that as an accurate description of what's going on over there.
I'm not English.
I don't think lies are only written about Americans by British newspapers... it's a two-way street.
Well I don't know about our President right now, but I know Americans love Scotland. There is something happy and sad about it. I think because of your songs and music.
Are you homesick?
I do have a friend in Wales so I shouldn't have jumped to the conclusion it was only England :):)
According to your link, there appears to be doubt.
I'm glad you spoke out about the error. Certainly it didn't come down like my article said it did. As far as any changes or things that were a compromise, I'm much slower that most at getting a clear picture. I'm going back to reread and find some other articles.
Thanks again.
You've maintained an arrogant, hateful attitude. That's your choice.
No, I'm not dealing with blind ideologues. They've all been quick to admit the error and search for more truth.
You are the only one here that fits that description. Either treat my friends with more courtesy or please don't come back.
Thanks for coming by.
That is a tragedy. I feel very badly for you. I hope that soon you find people who provide overwhelming evidence that you can trust them completely.
But don't trust any politician no matter what they say.
Plain old people are still great!
Well that's a relief. I was feeling quite sorry for your plight. :-)
Glad you know better than to trust politicians.
Did they learn that from Fox or did they invent the procedure on their own. :-)
Actually, we already knew that. We LOVED the Russian people all through their dark years. We feel the same for N Korea. We love their people and worry about them.
I guess all I've learned is not to put too much trust in any leaders, whether they be considered good or bad.
I would rather put on the lie and then say that's what it is than remove my art work. Get a sense of humor!
SO, Guess which one was the easiest. WIKIPEDIA. At the bottom of their article they have the leaks listed by year.
It may not be a complete list as the others list all the different countries and their postings but I think I'll be satisfied with Wikipedia :):)
Fact of history, nations have befriended former enemies and made enemies out of former friend since the beginning of mankind. The U.S. fought two wars with England, and during the Civil War they favored the Confederacy over thUnion, now they are one of our chief allies. England and France have a long history of being enemies, now they are allies. The United States, England, France and Russia were allies against Germany in two wars, now Germany is our ally and Ruyssia, while not an enemy, is not totaly friendly.
As far as the story by Glome, I have a hard time believing it.
Steve, when have we betrayed our allies this way before?
I have read both memos, and the sources for Wiki-leaks are usually fairly accurate.
While this concerns me, I think instead of arguing, that I would rather just pray to God that HIS WILL be done, not mine.
I'm getting to the point where I don't know what or who to believe in politics anymore, I am not sure an honest politician exists!
There are so many things I'm uncomfortable with since President Obama took over.
There has been much talk about posting all bills before the vote but I'm not aware of any program that does that. Are any of you familiar with one?
Even leaving out this Russian deal since we don't know what all came down, just the way he treats Britain and Israel embarrasses me.
Like you said, it will be water under the bridge by the time another President takes office.
I agree with you 100%. I look around at America; where we are ethically and morally and realize I have no idea what would be the best thing to improve us. God knows.
That's what makes people that trust God strong. We can give up my own desire and pray for His.
I'm pulling your leg, but He does love you. And He did die for you. That wasn't a joke.
I would be happy to tell you. I could even put it in poetry form if you want :)
He is really a good poet you guys.
Well jj, I guess if he doesn't want me to preach to him I could psychoanalyze him :) But I'd rather preach.
This administration is the biggest bs group I have ever seen and I have been around a while! Gosh, I can still remember when I was a dumbocrat.
"We'll have to pass it before we can know what's in it" is a statement never to be forgotten.
A measure, I'm sorry to say Democrats, of her level headedness. (Or lack thereof)
And I can't imagine why anyone would care if the President returned a bust loaned to the former President so he could create his own decor.
Stretching here.
I was mad as all get out when Barry Boy did that.......
Obama has done his best to alienate our allies, and make friends, bowing to heads of states (remember that one), with our enemies!
I have read the articles but my verdict is still out.
Wiki Leaks usually has some very good sources, but only time will tell about this one.
Even if it were true, do you think our administration would admit that it was true? They would say its a lie......
Mooch
Let me suggest that you (and anyone else) go the the source where you-all can read the Treaty and its Protocols and where you will find that identifying numbers are a part of this Treaty -- not exactly a big secret.
He could have placed the bust elsewhere, Even in Congress (anywhere), I still call it a slap in the face, and I still believe whether he meant to or not insulted our Allies. Sorry, its my honest not so humble opinion.
I don't think many British even know about the return of the bust of Churchill, and less would care! Mr Obama is free to do what he wants with gifts to the presidency. The contempt he seems to hold us in has become more apparent over time.
We do know it isn't true. Thanks to Guy that gave us the 2nd article. I posted all that on the bottom of the original post itself.
Thanks for the URL to the Treaty and its Protocols. I'll add that to the post also. I'm excited to read them myself. Hope they aren't as long as some of our bills to Congress :)
they will defend him to no end.
SO, how about all those Obama drone killings?
What other position do you put non-conservatives in when wacky lies like this are being spread?
We love you! Great icon you choose by the way. PLEASE ignore Guy W.
THANK YOU !
HAPPY VALENTINES DAY!
Yes I got your message! THANK YOU !
Don't let Guy W., et al., bully you. Just so happens you've got fans. We love you! May not always agree with you, just the same we admire you.
Myspace Comments
Thank you for reminding me to keep an eye on the needs of others.
Today you're my best friend. Ha ha ha. :)
I'm glad Guy let us know that the report was in error. In fact he and Gail gave us good material to correct the wrong.
I haven't been on much today because I keep having company. Some just left :)
I'll search tomorrow and get my article straightened out. Maybe Gails site will help.
I do have a question though ... Maybe I don't quite understand the Wikileaks page or the format. Don't know who can answer it.
Here goes:
First, it says here ... that:And second, while this page (Guy's link) says:My first question is ... (by way of getting to my actual question) is the first bit correct and the second bit wrong? Or is the first bit wrong and the second bit right?
Or is the first bit (from Wikileaks/The Telegraph?) true and correct but is a secret kindof something that was leaked but did not get into the public treaty and is destined to be deemed wrong even if it is a behind-the-scenes truth (it is Wikileaks after all)? (However the treaty itself says those identifiers won't be made public, so someone must be having them and/or sharing them if the rule is that they won't be made available to the public)
Finally . . . : This can't be what that means and I've feeling I've missed something, but thought I'd ask anyway ...
Only just ran across this thread and haven't done any research on my own yet (as to definition of terms or final version of the treaty, etc) yet, so am using only the links provided here for info.
I read through the Treaty last night and over 100 pages of the Protocall; well over 100 BUT ... after getting the hang of it I scanned. Possible to have missed some mention of it but I didn't find anything. (It wouldn't down load the last many pages:) But I never have gotten the gist of the rebuttal page from Guy. The writer acts like there is a big deal that was overlooked but the only thing he mentioned was a common sense action.
If Russia is keeping track of our arsenal, and vice versa, along with all the numbers on the items, of course we would have to catalogue where each one was. After reading the protocols, it would have known that was a requirement myself. How can we keep track of each others stuff if some are missing and not accounted for. So unless someone else finds something I'm not sure it is a big deal.
Therefore, the 2nd article is confusing but the 1rst article was still wrong. Ha ha ha. And to think my eyes are burning today from reading so much last night and I found out ziltch!
Trying to understand the criticism the writer of your article seemed to give a little ways down into the article. I can't back it up anywhere. I plain don't understand it.
I'm tired of this now. I'll go see if there's another article I can mess up. Something to keep you busy. :)