There are a couple of areas in which science is argued by non-scientists, as if what one believed were somehow equal in value in discussion as observed data and the results of generations of evaluation and experimentation. There is a very real disconnect between scientists and the non-scientist general public, whatever their level of education… that disconnect looks something like this:
Umlaut: “Hunting Leader, there is no snow, no ice… there are no Auroch (a giant relative of Bison).” (The word "Auroch" is an error, corrected by Chris W. in the comments, but I will leave it since I have no other word. The "Super-Bison" of which I was thinking did exist at this time)
Hunting Leader: “Umlaut, you’re a fool. There is snow and ice in those mountains. We will find Auroch.”
Umlaut: “Many of our hunters have gone toward the mountains. They say many Auroch are dead there, and the few left are dying of lack of food. We will die of lack of Auroch.”
Hunting Leader: “Some of them exaggerated how many were dead to each other. They are all liars. Snow will be here. We cannot AFFORD for there to be no Auroch! Auroch will be here!”
Umlaut: “We will have to eat smaller game… deer, horses, perhaps even Bison.”
Hunting Leader: These animals are too small. We cannot afford to chase them. There are not enough of them. The Auroch eat all the grass.
But, of course the snow and ice WERE gone. And the Auroch were gone. It did not matter whether Hunting Leader needed there to be Auroch, or would die without Auroch. There were no more Auroch. Bison, deer, elk… these animals slowly filled the niche abandoned by the Auroch. And the summer came…
Evolution works like that. Species diversification takes no note of belief. Species arise, conditions change, species change… or not. If the species changes (adapts), the change may ultimately be so dramatic it can no longer interbreed with members of the original version. It has become a new species. The original species may continue to exist, but not in that location. Galapagos finches are the most often cited example of this. If the answer is “not,” the original species ceases to occupy that niche, and something else moves in. The original species still exists, but its range and numbers are reduced. Eventually, if the change is extensive enough, and especially if there are other pressures (hunting, lack of water, inter-species competition) the original species may die out entirely. The Auroch – Bison exchange is a pretty good example of the latter condition.
Matilda: “George, the sky is pea-green and the clouds are moving in a circle. A tornado is coming.”
George: “There’s no tornado, and there’s not gonna BE a tornado!”
Matilda: “Sure there is. Why would you say there isn’t? You KNOW what that sky means.”
George: “There CAN’T be a tornado. We don’t have any homeowners’ insurance.”
Well, of COURSE there can be a tornado. George is a fool. A denialist, if you will. Tornadoes will cost him too much, so… tornadoes do not exist. Well, wall clouds and anvil-base super-cells don’t care whether he has homeowners’ insurance or not. I can attest to that first hand.
And Climate Change/Global Warming has no interest in whether we can “afford” to do what’s necessary to reduce its impact. Denying its existence in the face of data, simply because something called “Cap and Trade” will cost too much won’t make it go away. Insisting that humans have nothing to do with it, and cannot affect it, will not negate our impact and responsibility. There are more than SEVEN BILLION humans on this planet, and that is only possible because we CAN and DO directly and dramatically affect our environment. It’s absurd to say otherwise. I work at a plant that burns more than a thousand TONS of coal an HOUR! That’s a lot of carbon to put back into the atmosphere. But it pales in comparison to the world-wide burning of gasoline, diesel fuel and natural gas for transportation, heating, cooking and power generation. We need to… what’s the new expression? Ah, yes… “Cowboy up” and face front. The light at the end of THIS tunnel IS a freight train… and it’s a high-speed rail.
Student: “How do I prove that I’m right about something?”
Mentor: “You try to prove yourself wrong about the obverse. The obverse is called the “null hypothesis.”
Student: “I have a theory. You grade pretty girls higher.”
Mentor: “That’s not a theory. That’s an assumption based on an observation that pretty girls get higher grades in this class. Your assumption is that the two facts are related. So, we’ll call your assumption a hypothesis. Your null hypothesis would be that the pretty girls in this class are the best students, and THAT is why they get the best grades.”
Student: “Why would I try to prove myself wrong?”
Mentor: “Because if you try to prove yourself right, you probably will.”
Student: “Seems like a lot of work.”
Mentor: “It’s called the “Scientific Method,” son. And it IS a lot of work. But if you don’t do the work, nothing you propose as a fact (scientific theory) has any support.”

















Comments: 49
There CAN’T be a tornado. We don’t have any homeowners’ insurance.”
ha ha HA HA HA
I have feeling that is what is going on in the head of a certain Dan, here on gather......
although the African Elephant and the Indian Elephant are surviving cousins.
Went and did some quick look-up. I knew that American and European Bison were similar (they ARE different species), so I assumed the Aurochs (or a very similar animal) existed in the Americas. Wel-l-l-l... sort of. Bison antiquus was a good bit larger than Bison bison, and was descended from Russian steppe ancestors, but was NOT related to Aurochs.
Humans of that era can be credited, I suspect, with the "additional pressure" that completed the mega-fauna extinctions that began as the habitat changed with the retreating glaciers. I would not not necessarily credit us with the full extinction responsibility... unlike today, when we can be seen to be the direct and ONLY reason for the extirpation of many species. But then, there are a lot more of us today, no?
Thanks for posting this to Dicks Cafe.
The earth is in a warming cycle, however, it's a natural cycle based upon the solar activity
There you go again. I am outraged at your audacity, and absurd attitude regarding science and related stuff. I will have you know that it is a proven fact that absolutely not one single professor has ever, in the history of life on Earth ever given better grades to pretty girls, and your slanderous assertion, that such an abhorrent and aberrant practise would ever even be considered, verges on the brink of slander and infamy. You will hear from my lawyers.
And whatever you might hear about me from someone named Mary Jane is a total lie.
was just acting out her fantasy...she did not know your name..just the action
How did you find out? I thought we had it all so well covered.
Anyway, we are still trying, and frankly I cant wait until we win, and take over the world, and I get to rule over you. Personally. Mwahahahaha
Stick to the Kamasutra: this is real science.
Poor Haiti when the hurricain season gets here in a couple months. How fast can some public hurricain proof stadium type things be built?
I buy into an ice age coming on the heels of all this heat and glacier thaw stuff. When Greenland's glacial thaw hits that Atlantic pull under and it stops, England and the New England states are in for one rough winter and a lot more will follow the next winter. All that water melted has to go somewhere and it will turn to snow when it hits the cold air. Something like that anyway. The heat and drought maybe something pretty tough to deal with but the cold and snow that will follow will cause even more upheaval and displacement of populations. So, buy Zorries, sun clothes, and heavy boots and coats. Looks like we are in for one wild ride.
Some folks just might benefit in reading with an open mind and imagination when there are no citations provided. Just saying!
http://nsidc.org/images/arcticseaicenews/20100303_Figure2.png
indicate that 2009 ice extent is low, nearly as low as the record low year of 2007. and substantially below the averages of the years 1979 to 2000.
Instead, here's a recommendation. Yeah!
i sort of do a bit of that insurance thing here. Out in CA. if any earth movement causes damage you need either 1. flood insurance, or 2. earthquake insurance. Earthquake insurance is out of most peoples range, being that you pay an extra $1200 a year, AND have about a $40,000 deductible. Not much if you lose a $1m home, but still out of range. Same with flood insurance, but I have this huge pine tree, leaning over my house a bit, I worry when it rains followed by wind, as my insurance company would define any damage to either 1, or 2, flood or earth movement. It is a vicious circle
If the sea's were rising, then there would be a "steady stream"of rising high tides, yet there has not been any, but the normal tides..
Science theories also need some proof to back them up.
Is the air dirtier? Hell yes.
>>I admit that there is much more pollution that there was 100 years ago.
Please keep posting to our group and ask others to join.