by Esther IS Flesh and Blood S.
Member since:
May 8, 2007

Just Say Grace

December 30, 2009 07:22 AM UTC
views: 0 | 5 people recommend this | comments: 66

My cousin Grace has now been in the county jail for four months.  We just got the news that the state has given her two years for her crime.  Her crime?  Her 11 year old daughter accused her of child abuse.  Child Protective Services came out  and investigated her and found there was no proof of any child abuse.  Her daughter called CPS a second time and this time showed them a bruise that she told them that my cousin had given her when punishing her.  This time CPS put a warrant out for her arrest and had the sheriff’s department go out and pick her up.

I don’t condone corporal punishment for children at all.  I do feel however that sometimes a swift swat on the butt will help unruly little ones from time to time.  I don’t have any children of my own so I really couldn’t be objective about this one to be perfectly honest.

The truth of the matter is that Grace did not cause that bruise on her daughters arm, nor does she ever spank her children.   I know that she has been known to yell and scream at her two kids (the other child, a son is 13).  On the other hand, I do not live with them so I don’t really know the truth.  My cousin told me that what had truly happened is that she had grounded her daughter and taken away some new clothes that she had bought her.  Her daughter found a way to get even with her mother and went for it and called CPS.

Grace’s daughter is now left in the custody of her grandfather as there really isn’t anyone else to care for her.  Her father divorced my cousin many years ago and now has a family with four more little children of his own and doesn’t provide for Grace’s daughter nor does he communicate with her or see her.

Since my Uncle by marriage is at work 12 hours a day and six days per week, Grace’s daughter is becoming more and more out of hand.  She is alone most of the time so as everyone knows, while the cat is away the mice will dance.  The last thing I heard was that she had gone to spend a couple of days with a friend and had come home with a pierced lip!

I had Grace’s daughter over her for a weekend before Christmas and she seemed nice and sweet enough.  Not unruly or disrespectful whatsoever.  I feel for her because all one has to do is look into her eyes to see the sadness in them.  As much as I feel for her, I can’t take her in.  I just cannot help everyone as much as I would like to.  Furthermore with my anxiety and depression, I don’t feel as if I would be suited to try to raise a child.

What do you think of this situation?  I am filled with sadness over the entire situation.  I don’t know what to do and feel that you my Gather family could possibly give me some insight into this.

Oh, I know you are probably wondering about Grace and her conviction.  This is her second stint in the correctional system.  She had been out of the penitentiary for almost four years and had remained mostly out of trouble.  Her first crime was for trying to bring across the Texas-Mexico border a truck full of marijuana.  She was at that time given five years of which she served three years on that crime.

Supposedly the reason that CPS was so rough on her this time was because she was considered high risk since she was a convicted felon.  This hardly seems fair to me but who am I to say?  What do you think about all of this?

Comments: 66

Spencer T. Dec 30, 2009, 7:37am UTC
I have always felt it unfair to put undo pressure on felons who have completed their time. It would make sense if the next crime they committed was related to their privious crime but it doesn't necesarily work that way. So much of that system is very unfair and does little to help the felon.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 7:50am UTC
You are so right Spencer. Her three prior years were spent in vain. Learning nothing and doing nothing to prepare her for her life when released. Instead she learned new ways of committing new and different crimes and continuing on with old friends and old habits that she should have left behind long ago.

Now she will be back again to do the same thing. Now being a two time loser, with no skills and little or no possibility of finding a job.

And so the recidivism rate continues to climb...
Spencer T. Dec 30, 2009, 8:08am UTC
I spent a few years with a volunteer group helping to transition felons from prison to home but the reality is they wear a stigma and its hard to break. For some reason too many people hold serious grudges against them and to my way of thinking force them back into prisons by their actions.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 8:12am UTC
I used to volunteer visiting inmates with my church some years back until the new sheriff came in and stopped this practice.

I know what you mean about the stigma that these people carry with them. For that matter they'd just as soon wear a big F tattooed on their forehead!

That was nice of you to volunteer to help those people trying to transition to their homes away from the penitentiary.
Deb J. Dec 30, 2009, 7:43am UTC
Oh Esther, I completely understand why you yourself cannot take her in especially with emotional problems like myself. I know I can barely take care of myself sometimes it seems, let alone raise my 11 year old daughter all on my own.
As far as the CPS and what they have done to Grace I think this is a gross injustice of the system. My cousin who served as a Nuclear Physicist in the Navy for 20 years retired and had an episode just like this with his daughter who was then 16. They did the same to him except he served just a couple monthes...but all in all it cost him his entire retirement fund of over $100,000 and now they are left with house payments, 3 other children to raise and stresses that just should never ever have been placed on them!!! He is just the nicest guy you could ever meet and he served and protected our country for over 20 years and this happens to him!!! Now his next oldest daughter is losing it on them too. What happened to those days when a child was disobedient they did deserve some sort of punishment? How else do we teach them respect and obedience? I never spank my daughter, not because I am afraid to, it's just that I have waited too many years to do it. I was so depressed and sad and in pain for so many years that it was just too much effort to even try to disipline her. Esther if you ever want to talk about this you can call or message me.
You are a dear, loving, caring person I know, but this I do truly believe is out of your realm! I really do feel for Grace! Why oh why do bad things happen to good people???
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 7:56am UTC
You know Deb that the reason Grace was not given a chance was because there simply was no money to be had for outside legal representation. With a court appointed lawyer, one just as soon blow it off because they are going to have to do time no matter how you look at it. I sometimes wonder why attorneys even bother working for the judicial system in the first place as they are only paid a small stipend and then don't do the work they are supposed to do. It's practically better to represent yourself than to have a court appointed lawyer.

I am so sorry that this happened to your cousin. What a drag!

I don't know what has happened to too many generations that have come after mine. Kids these days just seem to out of control and feel as if they can get away with anything anymore.

We have a child abuse law here in Texas where all a kid has to do is accuse their parents of child abuse and their parents are investigated. A lot of kids do this to ge back at their parents when the majority of the times their complaints to the law or CPS are unfounded.
Lisa Frost Bailey Dec 30, 2009, 7:49am UTC
Many know somebody is a felon and will take advantage of it by putting them in bad situations for their own advantage, then people wonder why so few improve their lives...It is unfair, life gets that way for some and just stays there because of others not wanting to give them a break...
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 7:59am UTC
So, so true my friend. Truer words were never spoken. These people get out of the pen and then can't find jobs so they resort to breaking the law over and over again in order to survive.

I feel that Grace did not have to have been given time for this. Instead she and her child should have been offered counseling or something else like perhaps an ankle monitor or something so that she could still take care of her children. Now what will happen is that in the two years that she will be incarcerated her children will go to pot because of her absence and their lack of parental guidance.

Such a shame...
Deb J. Dec 30, 2009, 8:01am UTC
Be it right or be it wrong, as a belief, but the one thing I have taught all 3 of my children is to remember "No matter what else you believe, LIFE is NOT fair!!!
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 8:13am UTC
Life isn't fair but we must do the best to do the best that we can with the lives that we have been given.
Lisa Frost Bailey Dec 30, 2009, 8:16am UTC
I taught my children the same thing, but I also taught them that only they can get over it when they find these situations. That doesn't mean we can't fight these things either.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:49am UTC
As long as people take responsibility for their actions I believe all is good.
Mad Dog Wilson Dec 30, 2009, 7:57am UTC
While protecting children is tantamount - I feel that Child Services goes too far at times.
If there is solid proof of abuse or the child is in immediate danger - by all means get them out.
But, if the child abuses the system and a parent or guardian is wrongly accused - they're permament scarred by having the child abuser lable put on them

When I was growing up in the 60's we had corporal punishment in schools - The "board" (paddle) of education - with the holes of course. It was actually never used (at least in my time at school) but the kids understood that disrespect will not be tolerated. I got my butt whupped when I was out of line and I grew up somewhat normal - which is a relative term.

Now I see youth back-talking, cursing and hitting their siblings, other kids and even their parents with little or no disciplinary action - sorry but timeouts work in short term but do little to encourage change.

bring back the "bootcamps" for out of control kids BEFORE they escalate to breaking the law
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 8:03am UTC
I remember those paddles from when I was in school. They even had them up to the time that I was in high school and used them when kids got unruly or disrespectful.

This child of my cousins was in no danger. Instead she is a capricious and spoiled child who knew what the consequences of her actions would be. She knew her mother would get into trouble but I know now that she is regretting the fact that her mother will be gone for two years for these lies of hers.

There are bootcamps here in Texas for those out of control kids. They are given the opportunity to be taken to one of those if only first time offenders. The rest of them must go to juvenile correctional facilities. I dread to say if, but I feel as if my cousins children may be headed down a very bad path...
Deb J. Dec 30, 2009, 8:03am UTC
Wow...Mad Dog...you are so right on...in my home I got a butt whipping often and that "board" at school did get used on my brother!
Kimber L. Dec 30, 2009, 8:31am UTC
I think it is very sad and that the little girl who did this to her needs to go through one of those boot camps for kids to teach them to respect their parents.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:06am UTC
You kmow Kimer. we were thinking that something needs to be done with this child. Where to send her or what to do with her is a big problem right now. If not, we're afraid she will continue to spiral downhill as she is way too mature for her age and looks much older than she is as well.

I think that CPS or her school counselor should look into this situation. Her grandfather is never at home and always at work. He cannot do much for her besides providing a roof over her head and feeding her. At this point in her life she needs psychological couseling and adult supervision.

I hope that someone can come up with some help.
Kimber L. Dec 30, 2009, 11:33am UTC
Esther - you are in Texas aren't you? I think this resource might help....
http://www.teenhelponline.com/boot-camps/index.php?q=texas
If not try googling to find out what is available to you - you might be suprised at what comes up. There are a lot of resources from boot camps, church camps, counseling center sponsered places etc.
Good luck to you with her. I hope someone gets her straightened out before she ruins her life or further damages other peoples. I hope someone can help her feel remorse for what she did to her mother and stop her from growing into a full blown sociopath!!!! Help her to realize there are consequences to her actions and grow up not getting everything she wants!! Her poor grandpa is probably worried sick having so much responsibility and not being able to be home to supervise every minute.

Good luck!
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:39am UTC
Thanks for the resources Kimber! I really appreciate them.

Her grandfather has his hands full as my Aunt is in a nursing home and has been there for four years now since she suffered a devastating stroke. The poor man has his hands full is an understatement!

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Kimber L. Dec 30, 2009, 11:41am UTC
Happy New Years to you too Esther. Good luck to your family. I hope you are able to help her!
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:49am UTC
I am going to look into some of these places and consult with the rest of my family and my Uncle to see what can be done to help.
sally g. Dec 30, 2009, 9:05am UTC
My butt got spanked if I needed when I was younger living with my parents. I have spanked my kids on the bottom. But now a days the law has it you yell abuse they come running and you go to jail.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:08am UTC
I do believe spanking on the bottom is appropriate but some parents go overboard and hit anywhere they can and with whatever they can out of anger instead of waiting for the situation to cool down.

You're right about the child abuse thing ~ it is far out of hand now!
JOHN BECK Dec 30, 2009, 9:24am UTC
What is jail time going to do for the mother? for the daughter? for society?
Most courts try to avoid separating a mother and child. There are ways that the services can provide help to both the mother and daughter; jail time in my opinion does neither.
JOHN BECK Dec 30, 2009, 9:28am UTC
Esther, you have a warm, loving heart. Please recognize that you can't take on this problem--it's out of your hands and you don't need the worry, stress and frustration. Give the problem to a higher power and live your life. Hugs, and Happy New Year.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:09am UTC
Jail time isn't going to do anything for anyone John. The jails are overcrowded and I believe that other things could have been done in my cousin's favor had someone had the money to get her proper defense. Alas that was not to be.

I do believe that my second cousin needs urgent help now before something bad happens to her.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:12am UTC
I appreciate the kind words John. I wish that I could help everyone that crosses my path that needs help but sometimes my hands are tied. I know that it is out of my hands but perhaps I feel so badly about this because I wish that this child had had a better opportunity at life than she has been given.

I will turn this problem over to God and pray that something good happens for the good of all involved.

Thanks for your unending support John.

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Sophie S. Dec 30, 2009, 9:33am UTC
My sister tried pulling something like this on my parents when she was younger and almost tore my family apart-- which is what she said she wanted. She was and is very manipulative and vindictive and it was so hard to live with her. Even after she left, she would try and threaten my parents with CPS when they would not do something she wanted-- let my sisters visit for the summer, co-sign a car loan, borrow her a few grand-- the last time was just about two Christmases ago.

I think the only thing that you can do for the girl is to try and give her sage advice, let her know that she is loved and that she only has the one parent to rely on and even that might be ruined now.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:43am UTC
It seems that since that law came into play about anyone and everyone being able to call CPS for suspected child abuse there are some who use it improperly. I have heard of many people having their children call in false reports of child abuse to the authorities. I don't know about you but this makes me very angry. That law must change as it stands now.

Too bad this happened with your Sister. *shaking my head* I hope that your Sister has grown out of this sort of behaviour.

All I can do for my second cousin is do as you say. Be there for her and offer her advice and show her love and caring. I don't feel that she needs to be chastized right now. I know she has enough on her little shoulders right now. She was way out of line and very wrong doing what she did though.

Thanks for your advice!

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Kathy W. Dec 30, 2009, 9:58am UTC
No one mentions the 13 year old son who's life is also affected. Where does he go, who takes him on?
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:13am UTC
Grace's 13 year old son has been taken in by Grace's oldest sister and her gay lover. With what is going on with this young man now she didn't want the same fate to happen to her daughter. Too much negative influences going on...
Ian Thorpe Dec 30, 2009, 10:07am UTC
Esther,
I'd like to put this in The Daily Stirrer, a web page dedicated to fighting political correctness and the advance of The Thought Police.

If you are willing to do that pls PM me with a name you would like to publish under. It ought to be simpler just to link your article here but I have tried that before and people following the link tell me they are asked to sign up to gather. Most will not do that as they lost track of all their signups long ago.

What I do with The Daily Stirrer is create each article in its own page and link from a short summary in the main page. That avoids getting hit for duplicate content, gives your article its own url to link to and boosts the Daily Stirrer brand.
I'm also now looking for fiction and general article writers and content creators for my whole Greenteeth Labyrinth multi media project. Consider yourself invited. I don't pay or do points but you will have fun and I'm looking at ways of enabling writers/performers to earn better than third world wages from their content.

Ian
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:16am UTC
Ian it would be my honor to have you include this post in the Daily Stirrer.

I will email you re this.

Thank you!

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Kimberly Ripley Dec 30, 2009, 10:52am UTC
This is so sad....on a number of levels. I will keep all involved in my prayers, Esther!
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:45am UTC
It is pitiful Kimberly! Sad indeed.

Thanks for the prayers ~ we all need them!

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Darin Waugh Dec 30, 2009, 11:36am UTC
That's sad!
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 11:47am UTC
Very sad indeed Darin!

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Dan R. Dec 30, 2009, 11:53am UTC
As much as I loved being in Texas, this is one issue, thatr also plagues many states, in that they do have a problem. CPS has gotten too much power, in that many good parents are afraid of them, while many poor parents have no worries. Which should be just the opposite. I seen this before there, where a girl who was sneaking out to spend the night with a 27 year old, and she was 14, her parents locked her in at nights so she could not escape to his adult lover. The girl called CPS and even with all the information, and proof that the young girl was sleeping with this adult, CPS found in favor of the girl, in that her rights were steped on... And then took the parents to court for "Child Abuse", yet failed to charge the adult who was sleeping with the underaged girl.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 12:13pm UTC
Outrageous and this stuff continues to happen all around us. I can't believe that the 27 year old man was not prosecuted. It is a sad shame that who should have gotten in trouble legally didn't.

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Elizabeth O. Dec 30, 2009, 12:04pm UTC
This is a travesty on so many levels ~ no one wins. I agree, sometimes young children do need a quick swat on the backside to get their attention and to show boundaries, not an old fashioned a**-whuppin' like I used to get, but to send home the realization at a young age that certain behaviours are NOT tolerated ~ but the 'system' (which has so many bugs) teaches them to call CPS when things don't go their way ~ it happened in my family with a cousin...I don't know a solution, but I'll pray for your family.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 12:14pm UTC
Thanks for the prayers Elizabeth. Lord knows my family needs them.

Happy New Year to you and yours!
Rose Hill Dec 30, 2009, 12:20pm UTC
Sounds like a no win situation at the moment. I can understand how upsetting this is to you, Esther - let's hope it will all get sorted out in the New Year!
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 1:38pm UTC
You're right Rose. No one wins in this situation. Sad but true.

Happy New Year to you and yours sweetie!
Larry H. Dec 30, 2009, 1:24pm UTC
One of my daughter's did that to my wife once when she was young. Called the police and they came out. They had dealing with my daughter before it happen, knew my wife didn't do anything. I believe a girl friend hit her.
When I was a kid I got beat with a belt all the time. Use to go to school with belt marks across my face. They called it disaplend (sp). Now if you yell at your child that is abuse. When we first had kids I spanked our kids almost like I was, Later did the grounding thing and time out. I worked two jobs for awhile when we first got married. My wife was with the kids then.
Esther IS Flesh and Blood S. Dec 30, 2009, 1:41pm UTC
I know that some children used to get bad whippings back when but I don't feel that hitting someone in the face or on the head is appropriate ever. I am so sorry that happened to you Larry. I know it couldn't have been a good thing.

I do believe that the deterioration within families has a lot to do with parents not disciplining their children enough and a lot of them feeling as if they have their hands tied because of the laws now.

Too bad this happened with your daughter.

Happy New Year Larry!
Larry H. Dec 30, 2009, 3:35pm UTC
I got whipped with a belt that had a diamond shaped patteren on it. My mother would whip (beat) me with. Her hit were all over my body, head to toe, she didn't always hit the butt. In school they use to give you a swat on the behind.. Some teachers hit harder than others. Now they can't do a thing to the kids. Kids just laugh at them..
Amanda "middle of nowhere" C. Dec 30, 2009, 4:33pm UTC
It is very sad and I'm so sorry for your family. I have heard of this happening, but I'm assuming that your cousin was convicted by a jury. Very sad situation.
Shannon W Dec 30, 2009, 4:38pm UTC
That is a hard situation. I'm afraid I don't have any advice for you but my thoughts are with your family.
Linda T. Dec 30, 2009, 7:24pm UTC
This is a very sensitive issue for me. Child protective services did its best to destroy my family. My oldest daughter with the assistance and prodding of my ex husband used the system to retaliate against my husband and I. We spent thousands of dollars on legal defense and custody fights. The system does not work as it should and has needed fixing for some time. My situation occurred 12 years ago and we are still feeling the after effects. My daughter never learned that what she did was wrong. The system coddled her until she turned 18 then they could not get rid of her fast enough. In fact they wanted me to assume custody when she turned 17 after they were the ones to insist she be removed from the home. If you read any of my posts regarding this daughter you will note that her behavior continues in similar patterns even today. She is not capable of accepting the consequences of her actions.
I don't know if you cousin was a good parent or not but I know that allowing children to control their parents in this manner is a travesty that needs to be stopped.
This child may seem sweet but she too is learning to use the system to her advantage. If you did take her in and crossed her in some way Social Services would be knocking on your door. You do not need that kind of hassle. The best you can do is keep in touch with her and maybe take her on outings or for an overnight now and then. Do not feel guilty.
Paidra Delayno Dec 31, 2009, 1:27am UTC
Esther,
1. I completely agree with Linda because...

a. You DON'T need the grief that this will bring you not long after it lands on your doorstep.
b. You DON"T need the grief that getting involved in a situation you did not have a hand in will bring you.
c. This young woman made a conscious decision to screw up her mother's life. She needs to take responsibility for her actions and make her own way in her life. No mooching off of her family. It is time for her to grow up and face up to her actions. I realize that she's no relation of mine but we as a society will have to deal with this little sh*t at one point or another. The only way she needs to be handled is as harshly as possible.
d. I realize that I have been nominated for the crappy friend of the year award but that doesn't mean I can't wince when I see a friend heading for the line of fire.
Ed Da Head Toker Dec 31, 2009, 3:21am UTC
This is screwed up shit to the max.
...I almost hate saying this BUT the little girl has brought this on herself.
...I could see the state being really harsh IF the first sentence was for abuse. But no, not this.
...IF you took her in, just HOW long would it be before she would accuse you??
..IF she was my sister's kid, I would not let her into my house, for fear of some false charge. Because she will use her "trick" whenever she does NOT get her way.
...I feel sad for the 13 year old brother. He did nothing wrong, and his world gets crushed. He I might help.
...Also, just how could she get a piercing at 11, when most states need "parental permission" for those under 18.
...That's my opinion. I would continue on like you have been. BUT if she gets worse, you may have to keep her out of your house, and maybe also, out of your life.
...What if she became a crack whore that stole? I would bet a buck that UNLESS she does change, something like that is what she will become. Because she has already sowed the seeds of the "whirlwind and that bad karma is of the 100 fold bad.
...And, no matter what you do; or do not do, will bother you like hell.

I feel sorry for you.
mysweet sunshine Jan 1, 2010, 4:35am UTC
Very sad. Heard an 11 year old and her 15 year old boyfriend set the bed her mother was sleeping in on fire a few days ago... maybe your cousin is lucky. The mother lived.

Sounds like a raw deal to me. Her daughter may learn that sometimes when we get what we want, it isn't always the best thing for us.
La Bellota Jan 1, 2010, 11:12am UTC
I am sorry it is happening too. I have a suggestion from left field. Refer the girl to TWLOHA. (google it) You have tried everything else. Love is the movement. This group is for people who do self destructive behaviors due to depression. And this is self destructive behavior. It is worth a shot. good luck.
Dennis Gilman Jan 4, 2010, 3:49pm UTC
I wonder if this happens to Jamaican parents also. We spank our kids even in the U.S. If my child ever did that to me, she would find herself without parents or grandparents. If the law insisted on punishing me, then they government takes over the child.

Some of the stuff I see reported is shocking to me. I one documentary, the child punished the parent for taking away his computer by destroying things around the house. I that were me, he would not have a soft spot anywhere on his behind to sit on. And if the authorities ever arrested me for that crime, I would abandon him to them. My kids already know this.
Charles T. Jan 4, 2010, 8:48pm UTC
It's hard to be in that situation but if you can't take her in, you can't. Kids for some reason think they can use the government to punish their parents but have no consequences like its some game. The person I feel for is your cousin. Sounds like she has a ton of crap on her shoulders and then her daughter did this...
Janie E. Feb 6, 2010, 1:01am UTC
This is an extremely sad situation. Too many children have fallen through the cracks and been killed by their own parents or relatives. I'm sure you've heard of all of the Texas stories. Then again, there are children who call CPS just to get someone in trouble. I'm so sorry this happened, Esther. My prayers are with you and your family.

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