I came across a post that was deeply disturbing to me. And the comments in response were even more disturbing. People attacking each other over what they believe. I find it sad. So sad do I find it that is has brought me to tears.
I realize that many of my friends here on Gather are not Christian. Some have lost their faith. Some have a different faith. Some never had a faith at all. While I understand the impulse to attack back when one is attacked, I (being the type of person I am) feel that turning the other cheek is best. But sometimes someting needs to be said in defense of ones faith. I will try and do so without being nasty.
I can tell you I am a Christian. I can explain why I'm a Christian and why I believe the way I believe. But it would do me little good to "preach" a sermon to people who have no interest in hearing it.
If you were interested in discussing my faith without getting defensive or hostile then I would be glad to discuss it with you. I mostly avoid discussions of religion because of the hostilities it brings on.
Granted, there are some Christians that think that beating you over the head with their faith will turn you around. But, I don't believe that one can do that and get any where. I've discovered there are people who are not Christan who would beat Christians over the head with their opinions (however wrong I think they are) in what looks like attempts to take us away from our faith. This, too, is a futile attempt.
No matter how much hate filled notions you try to use to convince me that God is a hoax, or that Jesus was just a man, or the Church is lying, my faith is stronger than your statements.
And:
No matter how much hate filled notions a so-called Christian would used to try and "save" someone who isn't Christan into believing, those words are going to probably land on deaf ears (if not hostile ones).
I am Christian... to be more specific, I'm a Catholic Christian. I believe in God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. I believe in the Catholic church, in the salvation of souls, in the forgiveness of sin and life ever lasting. (paraphrasing the creeds)
If this disturbs you, if this is so distasteful to you that you cannot possibly stay connected with me, then by all means please disconnect.
I for one didn't go around disconnecting from people because of what they believed. If anything I disconnected from people because their logic was too full of hate and discontent that I found it disturbing to my own moral values.
For those that do decide to disconnect, I am sorry you find my faith so distasteful, but really is one thing that I'm very firm in.
Love to all
Nancy*
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Comments: 136
be by yourside because I am a christain too.. strong baptist...
Good that you voiced your opinion on this. Why keep it bottled up? If they can't deal with you being so religious, then they can drop you as their friend. Or you can ban them from your emails.
Different category, but more relevant in my view to being.
I too was brought up in the Christian (Anglican) faith. I have nothing against it per se, I do have issue with the way some Christians are hiding behind their so-called faith to promote hat as the Fundamentalists, and yes, I do have iissue with them. I now find, no amount of proof, logic or reality can sway these close-minded idiots. Yes, idiots! They haven't an intuitive bone in their bodies and fall for the dogma and the phoney evangelicals who use these people of their congregations to promaote the intolerance that is rampant in some areas of this country.
Namaste
killing abortion doctors and saying it is for Christ!! A man who taugh love and tolerance and never once spoke against abortion? Sickos out there!
But most of us call our selves fundamental because we believe in the fundamental teachings of Christ. That the Bible is true & we don't accept man made rules. Honestly, I've at least changed to saying I'm evangelical (which is a 'little' better:) just to distance myself from what TV has made out of fundies. I hear many that believe as I do talk smart alec and hateful on here. I'm sorry to everyone that they do. We are supposed to be more humbled and loving just because we know we are a mess ourselves & God loves us anyway. I believe the God of the Jews came down to earth Himself to be their messiah. A huge surprise :) He named Himself Jesus. He was slaughtered as a lamb for the sins of every person and now offers eternal life to Jews AND gentiles that puts their faith in Him. He asked us to spread that word to all. That's what we refer to when we say we are evangelicals :):)
If I were you I would just live your life with love and not hurting others, and keep your thoughts with the modern world, in which we live. If you have knowledge all the rest falls into place. If you have instincts, the same happens.
Don't confuse religion and the mundane, or mix it with politics. That is what the Christian Right is trying to do to gain strength, not for the greater good, but to 'rule the world'. The laws of God and the laws of man are separate.
Fundamentalists are a dangerous breed.
Look at the Taliban! They are Fundamentalists, no different from that person you mention in Kansas. Shame on him!
You and I disagree on an understanding of the Bible.
I appreciate your advice is given in love, but I choose to follow God ... actually want to :) I stick with what I believe the Spirit of God revealed in the Bible. His truths are true yesterday, today and tomorrow. I'm not sure what you meant by 'keeping my thoughts in the modern world' but if it means not to lean on the Bible as still true, we separate ways there. As far as living in the 21 century ... I love it :) No problem there at all.
thats why I stay off a lot of the faith post too.
I consider myself a spiritual person and remember the lessons I learned in Sunday school about Jesus teaching compassion, tolerance and love. I try very hard to live by those three things. I am not always successful but I try very hard.
Disconnect from you? No, I'm also a Christian, though I did miss what that post was that you saw, the one that upset you so. One thing that most people can also actually agree on, in any religion, is the phrase "Do Not Judge", which is forgotten as soon as a new post comes around on either Religion or Politics - don't let it get to you. You know who your friends are here...I am one of them as are all of the people (above) that commented,
Hugs,
Marilyn
I did not see the post. I wish i saw it. But we christians....... Nancy please stand firmly by what you believe, that was what Jesus said and did.
Few people can sit by and remain calm when their own point of view isn't agreed with.
In the end, my beliefs are my own. I don't impose them on others, and I don't argue about them with others. If my resolve in my beliefs are so shaky that I can be talked out of it by another person, then it means I'm not strong minded. I just refuse to be baited into an attack about my beliefs.
I will say this- I believe everyone has a right to both believe what they do about religion, and the right to voice that opinion. I do not believe people have the right to attack others over that right.
Kudos to you for speaking up about youe beliefs!
I like to discuss the whys and wherefores of why we believe as we do ... but then enters the ones that want to make a fight about the ideas. It ruins the whole purpose of sharing.
Most of the people around me are religious to one extent or another.
I just get tired of people "praying for me because I need it" or telling me that their god is going to send me to hell.
I have never told anyone they are going to burn anywhere because they believe in god.
You believe in god. Whether I do or not doesnt matter to you all that matters is your relationship with your god.
Now I was just told on another article that I was being disrespectful if I dont capitalize the word bible.
Now that person that told me that might or might not believe in god but they try and make sure everyone around them believes and acts and feels the same way they do. They will not accept anyone not having the same exact beliefs as they do. They are judge, jury and executioner.
I think some people are so worried about OTHERS relationship with god or non relationship with god that they forget to establish their own.
As Thomas Jefferson said "It harms me none if my neighbor has none or 20 gods"
We need to worry about what each of us personally believes and less about what our neighbors believe.
Although I dont believe in god I believe in Jesus. Many people could learn a lot from them I have.
I dont believe in god. I do believe that Jesus lived and he was a great man but he was not he son of god. He was just a mortal like the rest of us but with a better attitude and philosopy.
He was a crusader for the poor and those who based on their lot in life couldnt crusade for themselves.
He was killed by the Romans. But he wasnt resurected. He went from the living breathing Jesus to a different plane and the next phase of his life.
Kind of like Plato.
Does that make more sense?
(See that's not so hard is it folks?)
No Nancy that was pretty painless for both of us.
You keep your faith and I keep my non belief and both of us are happy.
You dont try and covert me and I wont try and make a disbeliever out of you.
I think it boils down to not how much faith people do or dont have in their god or gods or goddess or no god, gods or goddess then it is about accepting each other.
It has nothing to do with being liberal or conservative and everything to do with being intolerant.
And intolerance comes from both sides.
Along with the accepting each other for what they do or dont believe in I dont think anyone has the right to tell anyone else what they do or dont believe in.
If you are a liberal or a democrat you are not automatically an atheist.
Same with a republican. You are not automatically a christian.
Your spirtuality can only be determined by YOU.
Religion and politics should be kept separate
I understand some people feel they need guidance and fellowship with like-minded folks. I understand that some of these groups do a great deal of good works in their communities and don't push people to conform to their beliefs. That's cool, many of us find a civic group or club to join resources with to cause positive things to happen.
It's the people who scream bible verses in political debates and believe that everyone's life must be infused with Jesus and religious hysteria that I wish would shut up and go away. The ones who offer the poor a food basket at Thanksgiving, but require them to listen to a sermon for an hour or two before they can have it. The ones that take government money and put stipulations on the services they are suppose to be providing to anyone in need. They need to go away.
A person who can calmly explain what her faith means to her and how it has helped her to lead a better life is much more effective than a someone who is either "shouting down the devil" or taking the holier-than-thou route.
I have read every comment and there is not one that is anything but respectful of each other.
So why is it that you are urging others to ignore anyone that doesnt believe the exact same way you do?
we will never be equal as a society unless we stop putting people into groups/categories. we group by religion, color, ethnicity, gender & so on. we put people into these groups & think that everyone in that group is the same whether good or bad. not all christians preach hatefully. not all women are bad drivers. not all blacks are on welfare. the list goes on & on.
We all need to believe in something. maybe it's a god or maybe it's ourselves. i need to believe we can all get along someday without hate.
nice article, nancy. :)
That said, I applaud you for the non-nasty explanation, and I agree wholeheartedly that we should all be more respectful of others, regardless their beliefs, on any topic for that matter.
Featured in the Triple Name Club.
I don't even think someone has to believe in god or jesus to be christ like. I've seen atheist who show more tolerance, love; and open mindedness than the most vocal christians. It's not the religious beliefs someone espouses that make them a decent human being, it's making a choice on how to act towards fellow human beings. And again, wonderful post; thanks for speaking out.
Not on Gather, but in my daily life I have been called a Christan, but I am not. I am The Christ, in that the fruits of the spirit are evident in my deeds and yet as Paule of Tarsus might say there is indeed this other law at work in me as well.
What ever God might be, He/She/It most not be limited to the pages of a dead book or the smallness of a mans mind. whatever is known can not be God for that which is known is also mastered.
To pretend to know is vanity and arrogance and so we come to your statement..."I'm a Christan" it means nothing that you have labeled your self. But if it comes to pass that the other the one that dose not no you says "behold The Christ" then you will have cause to glory.
If someone can't speak to me without injecting their religious beliefs, dogma or quoting scripture, I want nothing to do with them. It's a major turn off, mostly because I see their duplicity, hypocrisy, and their sickness in leaning on something so heavily they aren't dealing with reality, or taking responsibility for their own actions.
I have VERY strong opinions about christianity~but they are MY opinions~and I have a right to them just as you have a right to believe in god and Jesus as the saviour~and I do understand there is a big difference between the christians who truly aspire to live by the teachings of Jesus and those who use religion to benefit themselves~
Stacey and you and I and many others come from such diverse backgrounds, growth, and teachings, that that is what makes life interesting~the diversity is endless~
I respect your opinions and your faith~
Just as I respect the choice of both my children to follow jesus Christ~ and how they came to that path is beyond me being raised as they were~however~I respect their choice as they have learned to respect mine~it was a pain in the a** there for a while as they really did try to forcefeed me their beliefs(especially on long car rides when I couldn't very well pull over on the turnpike and make them walk home, lol)but I have made it very clear~that respect is twofold, to get it, one must give t~
namaste
sandwiches are good for the soul~ =)
kissles
Nothing wrong with having a religion. As long as you aren't hurting anyone or denying anyone's freedoms "in the name of God", I say.. more power to you.