"The more often American Christians go to church, the more likely they are to support the torture of suspected terrorists," at least according to the recent survey by the Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life."
"More than half of people who attend services at least once a week -- 54 percent -- said the use of torture against suspected terrorists is 'often' or 'sometimes' justified. Only 42 percent of people who 'seldom or never' go to services agreed."
"White evangelical Protestants were the religious group most likely to say torture is often or sometimes justified -- more than six in 10 supported it. People unaffiliated with any religious organization were least likely to back it. Only four in 10 of them did."
Don Mooney, the Talking Points Memo blogger, gives a very interesting list of top ten reasons American self-righteous Christians favour torture of suspected terrorists:
10. Using those hard wooden kneelers at Sunday Mass seems like a worse "stress position" that used at Guantanamo.
9. Due to today's short attention spans, most bible study classes never make it past that "eye for an eye" stuff in the Old Testament.
8. Its not just terrorists. If questioned further they also believe that Catholic Bishops should be tortured to disclose locations of pedophile Priests that have been given a "second chance."
7. Waterboarding seems pretty mild compared to the last 40 minutes of "Passion of the Christ."
6. They believe it was Jesus who said "The ends justify the means."
5. Infidel terrorists won't make the cut on Rapture Day anyway, so what's a little more pain?
4. A lot of those regular Catholic Church goers grew up eating fish sticks on Fridays. Now that's torture!
3. Spanish Inquisition nostalgia is a powerful thing.
2. Thought that whole "turn the other cheek" thing referred to CIA's face slap questioning techniques.
1. Got confused and asked themselves WWCD? (What would Cheney Do?) rather than WWJD?
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Comments: 29
However, many Christians are saddened and some mortified that others in the community support torture.
Regarding lethal injection as a means of execution, a 2004 Gallup/CNN/USA Today poll finds that 75% of the public says that states should be allowed to use lethal injection, while 21% say it represents cruel and unusual punishment and should not be permitted.
Some of the sharpest differences in public opinion about the death penalty occur along racial lines. More than two-thirds of whites (68%) support the death penalty, while only 40% of blacks express the same opinion. Hispanics are evenly split on the issue; 48% support the death penalty, while 47% oppose it.
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Its easy... just dont do the crime and you wont have to be put to death....
There are very, horribly, violent, evil people in the world. If you havent met them, you should go to a prison and see for yourself. If you havent seen them, you words here dont mean much.
These are not people that are like you and me. These are not the people you see everyday at the store or the workplace. These are people that would just as much cut your heart out in front of your family as give a piece of gum to you.
Its easy to be all high and mighty about it...until you meet someone like this or even worse, when they take someone from you in an unspeakable way.
~M
An abortion is a death penalty for committing no crime. There is a huge difference.
~M
One person never did any crime and still was condemned to death, after a severe torture. In case you've forgotten, his name was Jesus of Nazareth. I think it's more than enough reason for me to claim solemnly that nobody who supports either capital punishment or torture deserves the name "Christian".
As for abortion, even if we accept your position for a moment, again, in case you've forgotten, no doctor in any clinic of the world couldn't be even closely compared with God when it comes to abortions.
Blessings and best wishes - S.
Christ said to "Love one another". He sat at the table and ate with the sinners.
Matthew 9: 10Then it happened that as Jesus was reclining at the table in the house, behold, many tax collectors and sinners came and were dining with Jesus and His disciples.
11When the Pharisees saw this, they said to His disciples, "Why is your Teacher eating with the tax collectors and sinners?"12But when Jesus heard this, He said, "It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick. 13"But go and learn what this means: 'I DESIRE COMPASSION, AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
I totally agree with you. No one can serve two masters; love and hate cannot reside together.
In any case, being against torture is a great concept. But try this scenario:
Imagine you know for certain a bomb has been placed in a major city and you have a suspect who claims to know where it is. The bomb could potentially kill or main thousands. Do you torture him, sacrificing the pain of one person to save thousands? Or do you take the high ground?
By the way, I read my Bible, so I know that "an eye for an I" means to restrain punishment so that it only meets, but never exceeds, the crime. That makes it totally irrelevant to this discussion, because I have absolutely no information that suggests we use torture for anything but extracting information. Other nations have and do use torture to punish, such as the NVA did in the Vietnam war.
Svetlana, nice try with that...but I was referring the the mortals on the earth committing crime. Jesus didnt sin. He has also not been here for 2000+years. Obviously I was not referring to Him.
The rules of the state are put in place to guarantee the equal freedoms of everyone in that state. When one person takes that freedom to live from another, it is sometimes punishable by death.
Funny how no one actually comments on others posts... Has ANYONE in here visited a prison and seen what these monsters are like? Or is everyone just philosophically spewing thoughts about something they know nothing about? Just being in the presence of someone on death row will give you an understanding you do not have. Not to sound nuts, but these people are evil. You can feel it when they look at you. You can see them thinking about it. I have seen this myself. I know the difference.
~M
**According to Numb 35:31 there are criminals which "deserves to die".
**Genesis 9:6 "Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made man."
**Numbers 35:31 "Do not accept a ransom for the life of a murderer, who deserves to die. He must surely be put to death."
**Numbers 35:33 "Do not pollute the land where you are. Bloodshed pollutes the land, and atonement cannot be made for the land on which blood has been shed, except by the blood of the one who shed it."
**Ezekiel 18:23, 32 "Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? … I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign Lord."
And here, finally, is a quote from the nun Helen Prejean. She is a well known abolitionist, but despite that she has courage and insight enough to write in this way about this Bible passage:
"It is abundantly clear that the Bible depicts murder as a capital crime for which death is considered the appropriate punishment, and one is hard pressed to find a biblical ‘proof text’ in either the Hebrew Testament or the New Testament which unequivocally refutes this. Even Jesus’ admonition ‘Let him without sin cast the first stone,’ when He was asked the appropriate punishment for an adulteress (John 8:7) - the Mosaic Law prescribed death - should be read in its proper context. This passage is an ‘entrapment’ story, which sought to show Jesus’ wisdom in besting His adversaries. It is not an ethical pronouncement about capital punishment." From the book Dead Man Walking.
Jesus encouraged love and forgiveness between people, but at the same time accepted the punishing authority (Matt 15:3-4, 26:52, John 19:10-11).
In Rom 12:17-21 Paul speaks of the relationship between people. The text says that we must not avenge each other but give the revenge to God. Only a few verses later (Rom 13:1-6) Paul speaks of the authority, the judging authority, which on the other hand is "an agent of wrath". (v 4)
Matt 15:3-4 "Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, ´Honor your father and mother´ and ´Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death´."
Luke 20:14-16 "But when the tenants saw him, they talked the matter over. ´This is the heir,´ they said. ´Let´s kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.´ So they threw him out of the vineyard and killed him. What then will the owner of the vineyard do to them? He will come and kill those tenants and give the vineyards to others."
Would you like me to go on?
~M
My point was that you commented that you thought Jesus didnt believe in capital punishment and you were wrong.
~M
~M
~M
Also, "an eye for an eye" is what we allow for justice. Or do we expect governments to not resist an evildoer? What is appropriate for an individual is clearly not appropriate for a government. Pacifism is good for a Christian, but impossible for a government. Governments provide justice-- sometimes-- and Christians provide an example.