You Thought I Was Exaggerating?

Wow

This is the type of "change" I was afraid of with this administration.

Please educate yourself...this is absurd. This bill prevents people from being a victim of a crime...it does not make pedophilia okay, or say that anyone can do whatever they want. Sexual orientation refers to what sex a person is attracted to (as in male, female or both). Exaggerations like this are just silly, it's such a stretch.

I sure hope it doesn't turn out that way. Crinimals do not deserve more rights than there victims or non criminals

omg

Kimberly - Exaggerations? Have you read it? Here are some of the orientations that will now be covered under this bill. many of these included crimes against children.



"Apotemnophilia - sexual arousal associated with the stump(s) of an Amputee
Asphyxophilia - sexual gratification derived from activities that involve oxygen deprivation through hanging, strangulation, or other means
Autogynephilia - the sexual arousal of a man by his own perception of himself as a woman or dressed as a woman
Bisexual - the capacity to feel erotic attraction toward, or to engage in sexual interaction with, both males and females
Coprophilia - sexual arousal associated with feces
Exhibitionism - the act of exposing one’s genitals to an unwilling observer to obtain sexual gratification
Fetishism/Sexual Fetishism - obtaining sexual excitement primarily or exclusively from an inanimate object or a particular part of the body
Frotteurism - approaching an unknown woman from the rear and pressing or rubbing the penis against her buttocks
Heterosexuality - the universal norm of sexuality with those of the opposite sex
Homosexual/Gay/Lesbian - people who form sexual relationships primarily or exclusively with members of their own gender
Gender Identity Disorder - a strong and persistent cross-gender identification, which is the desire to be, or the insistence that one is, or the other sex, “along with” persistent discomfort about one’s assigned sex or a sense of the inappropriateness in the gender role of that sex
Gerontosexuality - distinct preference for sexual relationships primarily or exclusively with an elderly partner
Incest - sex with a sibling or parent
Kleptophilia - obtaining sexual excitement from stealing
Klismaphilia - erotic pleasure derived from enemas
Necrophilia - sexual arousal and/or activity with a corpse
Partialism - A fetish in which a person is sexually attracted to a specific body part exclusive of the person
Pedophilia - Sexual activity with a prepubescent child (generally age 13 years or younger). The individual with pedophilia must be age 16 years or older and at least 5 years older than the child. For individuals in late adolescence with pedophilia, no precise age difference is specified, and clinical judgment must be used; both the sexual maturity of the child and the age difference must be taken into account; the adult may be sexually attracted to opposite sex, same sex, or prefer either
Prostitution - the act or practice of offering sexual stimulation or intercourse for money
Sexual Masochism - obtaining sexual gratification by being subjected to pain or humiliation
Sexual Sadism - the intentional infliction of pain or humiliation on another person in order to achieve sexual excitement
Telephone Scatalogia - sexual arousal associated with making or receiving obscene phone calls
Toucherism - characterized by a strong desire to touch the breast or genitals of an unknown woman without her consent; often occurs in conjunction with other paraphilia
Transgenderism - an umbrella term referring to and/or covering transvestitism, drag queen/king, and transsexualism
Transsexual - a person whose gender identity is different from his or her anatomical gender
Transvestite - a person who is sexually stimulated or gratified by wearing the clothes of the other gender
Transvestic Fetishism - intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving cross-dressing
Urophilia - sexual arousal associated with urine
Voyeurism - obtaining sexual arousal by observing people without their consent when they are undressed or engaged in sexual activity
Zoophilia/Bestiality - engaging in sexual activity with animals"

you're children will no longer be safe because a pedophile will be able to claim that you are committing a hate crime against them by not allowing them to do what they please.

I hope you are happy!

That's what my 45 caliber pistol is for. I'd rather go to jail then say that some behaviors should be condoned. I always said, if someone every hurt my son in that way, I'd bail him out of jail and then he'd be mine. You want hate? Watch what happens when some of these pervs get away with their crap. You'll see lots of 'justice' being handed out by the victims and their families. Bad bad move for this bill to be so collective.

Amen katie. I've got several shotguns and you best believe i'll use em if anyone gets in the way of the safety of my family! This is ridiculous. This country is goin' to hell in a hand basket.

The Democrats obviously don't care about chilren or anyone who disagrees with their policies. All they care about is getting their way. They don't think about how this will impact the whole country.

Gee, where have I heard this before?

I don't feel that by passing such a bill, pedophilia will become either legal or endorsed by the government. You raised an important concern, but I don't think that the ramifications are quite as wide as you make them sound. Crimes will not become legal with the passage of this bill.

Kimberly and Tony, I wholeheartedly agree with you.

I'd like to know where you got your list of protected orientations.
Attraction and desires are NOT illegal, ACTING on SOMEof those attractions or desires IS.
MOST of these orientations don't involve anything criminal. YOU may not find these things arousing, you may even feel repulsed by them, that doesn't make them illegal and CERTAINLY doesn't mean they deserve to be persecuted for them.

Whoever says I am wanting my son attacked because of how I vote is a MORON!!!!!!! I wil personally shot, maime, and kill anyone who comes near my son you stupid looser!!!!!!!! My voting has nothing to do with the way I feel about my son's safety. i have so reported you for discrimination.

they refused to define what sexual orientation

Somehow I don't think that if they defined it as Heterosexual, Homosexual, Bisexual, or Transgendered, you'd be any happier.

exactly....and bi, homo, transgender are not breaking any laws because they love differently

I would be happier Elizabeth. My problem is the broad category and some areas that are placed in this bill. I'm sorry, but anyone who commits an offense against a child, the elderly or another innocent is going to be hated. I'm not talking about 'consenting' adults or people, but some of those categories are not covering these. They are saying we can't hate or act in hate against people such as pedopiles, or those which involve an unwilling person. I cannot fathom someone having a family member who is abused by such a person not feeling hate. I would hope even with myself that I would have the self control NOT to harm the person accused, but there are many who would not. It's hard when someone you love has been violated.

Tony, I do understand. But you must see that the broad generalization that is in this bill will not be understood by people who are victimized or have family that has been. They will feel that the perp is protected and take matters into their own hands. It's just human nature. The bill is too broad, and should really just be trimmed so that MOST people understand that their children and families are not in any type of danger.

Not the kind of change I wanted.

Thank you for the info.



Spicecomments.com - Hi Hey Hello Comments

I have never equated gay with pedophilia, Tony. Acting on impulses that encompass being gay or transgender are not illegal. However, acting on impulses related to pedophilia and some of the others mentioned in this bill ARE. That is what I object to in this bill. People will feel that the perpetrator of such a crime is protected by this bill, and take matters into their own hands. They just will. Emotion will take over reason. Therefore, I think the wording of this bill needs some trimming and cleaning up.

I agree with you Tony. I think we need to study this law a little bit more. and find out what it is all about.I am sure we are getting a little off center here. We need to stop and comceder what the law realy says.

I know you didn't say me, I wanted to make that clear to anyone who wasn't reading every word, lol. Yes, this bill as worded will be a lawyers heaven with trying to prove what is and is not illegal and who acted in HATE or just anger and disgust or in defense of their family. It's a nightmare as it stands.

I think that in the heat of the moment, if you feel you are not getting justice, people will take justice into their own hands, right or wrong. If they are wrong, they will pay the penalty. If they are right, they know that the criminal will never be able to commit that crime again. It will be that persons' personal choice. I'm simply trying to point out that if this passes as it now reads, there will be mistakes made. It is inevitable. And BTW, I never said I'd kill the person, now did I?

If that's what it took to get a confession, yeah! It's not a hate crime until I shoot him in a vital area. My point is, most people would go over the line and not stop at getting a confession or vindication for the person, they will go all the way, and all because illegal acts are being protected under the same bill as legal ones. Since you don't want to get into semantics, I don't know how to explain it to you any clearer, since you seem to have your mind made up.

I think the whole hate crime bill is absurd. Anyone who has ever had a relative raped and murdered knows that the crime is not done by someone with lots of love in their hearts. Just because my cousin was a white straigh woman does not make her murderer any less hateful than one who murders a gay black woman.

"pedophilial [sic] is a disorder that can be treated" Really?

I heard a few weeks ago that they were going to NOT define sexual orientation and thought that was a bad sign. Heck, it means that if someone claims to be a "toe-sucker" they'll probably be a protected class.

Guns and misinformation! that makees for a good mix!
What the f**k are you talking about. The hate crimes bill simply prevents the likes of you people from getting a lot of mis-information and going out vigilante on their asses!

Pedoplilia is ILLEGAL as are all the sexual peversions you list here, It does not open up the leeway for anybody. It simply gives rights to ho,mosexuals. Who are less deviant than most of the redneck fathers out there who routinely sneak into their daughters rooms. And the Republicans caught in public restrooms trolling for young boys!
What is your fear of homosexuality. There is someone for everyone in this world and bless em all!

I wonder what's going to happen now in our churches...when our pastors preach from the Bible about homosexuality being wrong.

I know very well the difference between having the urge and acting. In this make believe scenario, although I would like to shoot the person accused of the crime, I would prefer to bring them to justice even if it means committing a misdemeanor myself. MOST people in that situation WILL NOT stop and think about their options but act on impulse. Again, there needs to be a definitive line drawn for hate crimes against legal and illegal actions.

I agree with you Tammy. I'm an avid fan of crime shows and investigations into the mind of criminals and their behaviors. I have not seen any reports by any reputable person or site to convince me that their behavior can be changed short of chemical or physical castration.

Children are not consentable. This is why this bill does not include them. Pedophiles are criminals and pondscum. I blame our education system in this country for all the Bible banging, uneducated yokles who lack critical thinking skills. We have a lot of Limbaugh sheeple ditto heads on Gather. Learn to READ!

Well, that's another area where I'd disagree with you Tony. We do have a separation of church and state here and as long as the church is not preaching hate as certain pastors have against America, there is no crime. Most will tell you that while you believe the act is wrong, you don't hate the sinner. Just because something is legal, doesn't make it moral.

I prefer the real deal for my information and not the 'hollywood' hype.

Well I never met one who did! So, now that you want to go on and attack religion, I'll take my leave since you can't stick to the subject.

We have shows here on cable and books written by people who have studied the criminal minds and that is where I choose to get my information. I'm not talking about CSI, or any of these so-called 'dramas' that you're thinking about. Not all of us are glued to the boob tube for information or believe everything they see or read without more investigation.
Again, I'm done.

Religion is going straight to hell, anyway. Now, Miss California is saying she's a good Christian spokesperson for Heterosexuals by posing naked!

You need the last word? No I don't bother looking at unclickable links such as the one you posted. You can go to ten sites and get ten different viewpoints on the same subject and it's not a matter of believing this one or that one, but of taking all the information and forming an opinion based on the overwhelming factual information gathered. Good night.

The crimes are passed to render the white straight man as a second class citizen. -L Wade

Oh yes, the poor oppressed white, straight male. So silenced! Rush who?

BTW, not ALL white, straight males CARE what's going on in the bedrooms of other consenting adults...In fact most TRULY straight men could care less.

"The next time you have a thought, let it go."-Ron White You Can't Fix Stupid.

Emotion will take over reason.-Katie

I understand what you're saying, but I think that if someone attacked one of my kids, that would happen REGARDLESS of ANY bill.

Who are less deviant than most of the redneck fathers out there who routinely sneak into their daughters rooms. And the Republicans caught in public restrooms trolling for young boys!-Georgie

Don't forget about the priests that are protected be The Church...

"Heck, it means that if someone claims to be a "toe-sucker" they'll probably be a protected class."

And? Should murdering a person for being a "toe-sucker" be treated any differently than murdering a person for being a Christian or for being white? According to this legislation, all could be treated as hate crimes.

"These hate crime bills about sexuality are the same as the bills about race. They are to stop white straight men from voicing dissent. Whenever they take a stand or say something on an issue about race or sex it's a crime."

They don't stop anybody, including white straight men, from voicing dissent.

"We seen it with Don Imus and plenty of other people."

Yeah? Don Imus was convicted of a hate crime? Are you sure you're not making that up because you have no idea what you're talking about?

The reason they don't define sexual orientation is that it is irrelevant even if the perceived orientation is pedophilia. However if someone goes out and commits crimes against people who are or are perceived to be pedophiles those commenting here could be arrested for inciting the "hate crime". One of the many purposes of this bill is to be able to prosecute the people who engage in discussions such as this and to provide unlimited funding for the incompetent criminals in our justice system while promoting and funding more junk science, making more classes of pseudo victims. It also removes the need of a specific victim for the state or local "authorities" to arrest someone. If you wrote something about how you think democrats or republicans have made bad decisions and someone on the other side of the country has an act of violence committed against them and just so happens to be a republican or democrat you could be facing charges. In conjunction with some of the Department of Homeland inSecurity's current and proposed legislation it pretty much helps to classify everyone as some sort of an extremist.

According to the community tag of "hate speech" someone believes you are "inciting hate" and could be arrested and prosecuted under the provisions of this bill which changes about a dozen plus other statutes that are already on the books. It makes your existing states statutes and "hate inciting" blogs/comments felonies. Even if they don't result in a specific crime.

Because someone "got the urge to smash some head together after reading the initial post" you could be prosecuted and actually found guilty of inciting a "hate crime". An act of violence does not have to be committed you are "inciting hate".

If you implied that someone was bisexual or even heterosexual, engaged in strange behaviors or was fat,skinny, etc. or in anyway indicate a behavior or a class of people you don't approve of and someone commits suicide after reading your post/comment (what-have-you) you could be charged with a hate crime even if the comments weren't directed at them and they didn't even participate in the discussion.

"Hate crime" legislation and all this other nonsense that are funded in this way do nothing to prevent crimes, punish those guilty of committing violence against someone (regardless of the motivation), provide restitution or justice to the victims and actually makes L. Wades statement one of the most accurate on this thread. If someone is offended by what you write, say or wear or just wants to be vindictive they can have someone arrested and drag them through the courts claiming they are inciting "hate crimes" and the courts will jump at the opportunity as they will receive "bonuses" to prosecute these cases. Those who are actual victims of crimes are already ignored unless they can be attached to some sort of victims organization with congressional funding.

"I wonder what's going to happen now in our churches...when our pastors preach from the Bible about homosexuality being wrong."

They'll no doubt continue to do so, as long as they can find people willing to listen. Hate crime laws have been in effect in many states for years. Can you offer a single instance where a preacher was convicted of a hate crime for preaching that homosexuality was wrong?

Here are a couple of excerpts from the text of the Senate bill:

CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTIONS- Nothing in this Act shall be construed to prohibit any constitutionally protected speech, expressive conduct or activities (regardless of whether compelled by, or central to, a system of religious belief), including the exercise of religion protected by the First Amendment and peaceful picketing or demonstration. The Constitution does not protect speech, conduct or activities consisting of planning for, conspiring to commit, or committing an act of violence.

Your religion doesn't call for the commission of acts of violence, does it Marilyn?

FREE EXPRESSION- Nothing in this Act shall be construed to allow prosecution based solely upon an individual’s expression of racial, religious, political, or other beliefs or solely upon an individual’s membership in a group advocating or espousing such beliefs.

Feel free to express all the hared you like, and to associate with others who freely express their hatred. This law is about dealing with acts of violence, not expression.

I do NOT believe it can be legal for anyone to touch another person's body anywhere without consent. Sexual behavior between consenting adults is one thing, but assault is something else entirely.

I guess this is why the 21 year old male will only serve 4 months for shooting a store owner.The store owner was white and the shooter was a 21 year old black male that had 21 crimes on his file.Bills like this are why the people (can not call them criminals because I might be wrong even if they have a rapp sheet 7 pages long)are not in jail.They go in and come out in a few months.
Thank you for posting to sparealine.gather.com

"I guess this is why the 21 year old male will only serve 4 months for shooting a store owner.The store owner was white and the shooter was a 21 year old black male that had 21 crimes on his file"

I wonder how this would have worked out if the shooter was a white heterosexual male as well as a U.S. Citizen and the store owner was an undocumented lesbian Muslim?

This bill effects title 18 sec. 245 and the violent crimes prevention act. All that is necessary is for one of these groups to express fear of you committing a violent crime wether warranted or not. The rules of construction are in every title of the USC and mean absolutely nothing. The constitution means nothing to our courts either especially when it comes to grants, "statistical victims" and non governmental "advocacy" groups. Our courts operate within the special maritime jurisdiction and are not constitutional courts.

While a mass round-up of people are unlikely you can be sure that in order to increase the amount of money and continuing support there will be many people arrested and prosecuted under these new definitions and as always it will be selective, meritless and vindictive. This bill adds an extra $100,000 dollars to each enforcement jurisdiction and their are often many within a single town as it can encompass schools, police and other social service agencies.

I am not really worried about this bill. My pastor will continue to preach as he feels God is leading him and I doubt there will be prosecution against him for doing so. He has never taught us to hate gay people, just as he has never taught us to hate black people, or Jewish people, or anyone different than ourselves.

I am all for a hate crimes bill because it doesn't condone certain activities. All it does is say I am not allowed to kill/hurt anyone based on things like race, religion, sexual orientation, etc... The burden of proof will remain with the prosecutor, so they will have to show evidence of this hate before it is ruled a hate crime. I also believe that white, straight men would be protected under this legislation --- if they were killed by another race, or another gender, or another religion, or another sexual orientation. Hate crime isn't only when gay people are harmed --- it is anyone who is hurt for a reason like race or religion, etc.... So anyone can fall into the protected status AS LONG AS the prosecutor has evidence that the crime committed was because of that status.

I say, relax. God is still on the throne and while I am not a democrat, I think it is a mockery of God to believe that any man (Bush and Obama included!) is controlling the USA. God has a plan and it will come to pass. He didn't promise us an easy road, he just asked us to be faithful to him. We know the final outcome, right? Well, in order to get there, a lot of crap has to happen first... so, relax...

Oh, look ... this got flagged as a hate speech!

Hm, Cathy L. seems to be confused. Homosexuality is no more normal than pedophilia; it's just more accepted.

Incidentally, Chris seems to have presented an impressive list of "sexual orientations". Perhaps those are more in the sense of categories rather than orientations. To me, an orientation would apply more to polar differences, such as gender, age, alive or dead, etc.
The term "Gerontosexuality" seems to be a bit awkward. I would have expected "gerophile" or "gerosexual". Oh well, I’m not a lexicographer.

Is there some type of reading disconnect going on here?

"The Hate Crimes Bill" HR1319/S.909, provides for a stronger sentencing for crimes against Racial, sexual, Religious or immigrant status, among others females and children are more protected than before.

Therefore: crimes against humans because of their status or race or sexual orientation etc will carry weightier sentencing than random acts of violence.

The police enjoy enhanced sentencing for crimes against their “Blue Brotherhood“, as does anyone who commits an act of aggression against a "Public/elected official".

Gay teens beaten to death, Hate Crime--
Blacks dragged to death behind a pick-up truck, or any other method causing harm or death, (previously included) Hate Crime--
Lesbians raped, Hate Crime--
Transsexuals attacked, beaten, or killed, Hate Crime--
Women, any woman or child raped, (previously included) Hate Crime--
Mentally or physically disabled (previously included) Hate Crime--
Mosques, Synagogues and Churches burned or vandalized, Hate Crime--
Members of any religious group harassed and or assaulted, Hate Crime--Acting aggressively against any human of any age causing harm because of their differences is a Hate Crime.

If you, as a responsible parent, see or know of a pedophile or any person with a mental or physical disorder as a threat then you have a responsibility to safe-guard your family and or friends NOT to take any actions against that person we have authorities for that very purpose. "The Hate Crimes Bill" HR1319/S.909, provides for Law enforcement to be equipped and able to convict perpetrators of such crimes and provide closure to many families where none was available before.

thank you Johnice.

I can never understand why people think a gay/lebian is attracted to children...they are attracted towards adults of the same sexual orientation.

most molestors are straight white men.

Johnice --- and I would think straight white men could also be protected under this law as well? If they were beaten for their religious beliefs? Or if a black man killed a white man? Hate crimes can go both ways right? And I hope there has to be actual evidence presented that they are actual hate crimes. A random act can still kill a gay man without the perpetrator knowing he was gay. Anyway... I agree with you that the bill doesn't protect illegal behavior.

Yes there is some type of disconnected reading going on here. HR 1319 has nothing to do with "hate crimes" and is a technology bill. Maybe you confused it with HR 1966 which also amends chapter 41 of title 18 and would also be affected by this "hate crime" bill.

Sec. 881. Cyberbullying

`(a) Whoever transmits in interstate or foreign commerce any communication, with the intent to coerce, intimidate, harass, or cause substantial emotional distress to a person, using electronic means to support severe, repeated, and hostile behavior, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

Thanks for posting at ~3,000 Here We Come!~ . Your content has reached 25 comments for which it has been removed from the group. Thanks for your support.

So, since all of you who take homosexuality so lightly

Not me.  It's an abomination to God.