My comment from someone else's post who asked, "So is it Science Fiction - do you think there are clones walking around? Have you ever met someone who acted like a clone? By that I mean people who seem to be lacking something. Do clones have souls? Would they have a conscious?"
The last I heard was that the cell used to clone Dolly didn't magically become young when cloned, and it still had the shortened DNA one gets from aging. Therefore the clone would not live very long due to DNA problems. I haven't heard that they've gotten past that problem ... basically you'd have a child or an organ with a very limited life span before it died or went bad (like getting cancer).
I believe there are plenty of souls to go around and if a test tube baby can grow up to have a soul and be a real person, so would a clone that was started as a single cell. I think if God doesn't want them to have souls, they won't live. I'm sure he's up to the challenge.
The whole area of cloning is interesting, not for making more people, since we seem to be darned good at populating the world, but for making replacement organs that won't be rejected. Imagine ... your father has blocked arteries, but they can grow a replacement that would allow surgeons to replace the bad part and he won't have to suffer the side effects of anti-rejection drugs.
Or what if your child is in a fire and has damaged lungs? If they can perfect the procedure, they could conceivably grow new lungs that would be exactly the same as the old ones. No shortened life span from taking steroids to stop rejection. No 20-pills-a-day. No waiting for some other child to die before yours can live.
I believe God gave us intelligence to use it, not to cower in fear in a dark corner. I believe He has safeguards ... I'm sure he's smart enough to do it ... that would prevent abominations from living.
We have unraveled many of the mysteries surrounding DNA ... and only discovered more mysteries! We have a very long way to go before we're cloning people, and no, I don't believe cloned humans are walking among us. That's B-movie stuff.
Science fiction has been considering the question of souls and the morality of cloning for years. There are some very, very good books on the subject out there.
We have a lot of things to consider ... I think cloning isn't going to be as much an issue as some think it will be. I think there will be self-limiting factors.
Now, I'm just waiting for the first sentient computer. :)
I believe there are plenty of souls to go around and if a test tube baby can grow up to have a soul and be a real person, so would a clone that was started as a single cell. I think if God doesn't want them to have souls, they won't live. I'm sure he's up to the challenge.
The whole area of cloning is interesting, not for making more people, since we seem to be darned good at populating the world, but for making replacement organs that won't be rejected. Imagine ... your father has blocked arteries, but they can grow a replacement that would allow surgeons to replace the bad part and he won't have to suffer the side effects of anti-rejection drugs.
Or what if your child is in a fire and has damaged lungs? If they can perfect the procedure, they could conceivably grow new lungs that would be exactly the same as the old ones. No shortened life span from taking steroids to stop rejection. No 20-pills-a-day. No waiting for some other child to die before yours can live.
I believe God gave us intelligence to use it, not to cower in fear in a dark corner. I believe He has safeguards ... I'm sure he's smart enough to do it ... that would prevent abominations from living.
We have unraveled many of the mysteries surrounding DNA ... and only discovered more mysteries! We have a very long way to go before we're cloning people, and no, I don't believe cloned humans are walking among us. That's B-movie stuff.
Science fiction has been considering the question of souls and the morality of cloning for years. There are some very, very good books on the subject out there.
We have a lot of things to consider ... I think cloning isn't going to be as much an issue as some think it will be. I think there will be self-limiting factors.
Now, I'm just waiting for the first sentient computer. :)
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Comments: 40
I always wondered about that!
The truth is that the media only tells you what they want you to know. I don't think people should worry about clones walking around whether they are or not. It is a topic that provokes the thinking process, something of which too many people are not doing these days. They accept anything they hear.
I would just say, they can clone and sell a dog but they are not cloning body parts for all the people who need transplants.
They've been working on it, though, and have mananaged to grow ear cartilidge on the back of a mouse. The soft tissue seems easier.
They are a religious group that sees cloning as the way to eternal life. They want to be able to copy their minds onto a blank clone of themselves... Which seems kinda pointless to me since it wouldn't transfer their consciousness, it would just make another person with the same thoughts as them. Now if they could just replace all their failing organs, they might be onto something...
But there are clones running around. They are called identical twins.
Cloning is just making a copy using the same DNA. The clone still grows up the same as a naturally concepted (that a word?) organism. It's not like clones are created as full size adults with no life before that.
I don't have an ethical quarrel with cloning. I hope someday they can pick and choose what genes a clone would be born with. It would be nice to be born with genes that make life easier and more enjoyable, that makes you resistant to diseases and other health problems, and so on.
The only thing I'd be concerned about are wackos who want their kid to be a clone of their favorite celebrity or other things that sound like good ideas but can negatively affect child.
http://www.rael.org/
Absolutely wild I think! :D
I think the technology to download one's self into a clone is WAAAAAAAAAY down the road. LOL! Way down, if at all possible. Any clone grown from cells through infant to adult is going to have its own personality and soul, imo. There have been several SF stories about people making clones and basically killing them to use the body. I could be wrong, but I just don't see God letting us put ourselves into another brain.
Thanks for posting, Barb. You've pointed me to the answer to a lifelong question.
Absolutely. Like identical twins, but without a twin to mimic.
"I could be wrong, but I just don't see God letting us put ourselves into another brain."
I don't think it'd accomplish anything anyway, since it would be a separate consciousness. I mean... If you could manage to copy your thoughts into another brain, you would still exist yourself and would be looking over at someone else who also has your thoughts. You're still gonna die and that other person is gonna continue on, just with your memories. Pointless. Might as well suck it up and die, and stop trying to take up so much space. Was that too harsh? :P
Christopher Reeve was involved with stem cell research, it is a shame that he is no longer here to promote the idea - either is his wife.
After hearing about the dog yesterday my conclusion is that cloning would be a 'for profit' enterprise. Since I am not one of the elite with all the money I cannot say if the wealthy have had more transplants than the rest of us, I do know know there is a long waiting line.
After all, we are paying for water which is essential to life - why not body parts.
Are they what you're thinking of? No... they're identical (and mirror) twins.
Dolly DID die with her cohort (sheep that were born when her donor was). there are strands on the end of DNA helixes called Teleomeres (or sunthin' like that). Each time a cell spilts and replicates, those strands unwinde one turn. Once theyre fully unwound, no more replication. No more replication... no more repairs. No more repairs... soon dead.
Now I am too amused to make a rational comment. Look! A chicken!
Secondly ~ there was a time when medicines used were frowned upon by some who thought doctors were playing god.
With that said, cloning and stem cell research will eventually become common practice ~ if a medical practice is used for the good ~ i.e., helping a cancer patient, helping food production, helping helping ~ then is it not in the best interest of all?
As you said, Barbara, loosely translated, if god gives us tools, he would wish us to use them.
I am sure there are some negative sides to cloning (I don't know much about it) and am positive stem cell research is for the good...but still has negative sides. However, the day will come when we (humans) have researched and tweaked enough that we understand how to use in a beneficial way.
Oh ~ and I don't know if I've seen my clone, but if I have, I sure wish she would come on and help me.
love you much Barbara C. ~j
There are ramifications for defying the natural order of things and it is to our detriment when man changes the dynamic.
Every single day, we all make decisions on whether to do good or to do evil. To take away the tools is to stifle learning and remove the free will we were given. We're here to learn to control ourselves! (in my opinion)
Even our very words can be used for good or evil. Words have hurt more people, more deeply, than any clone research will ever manage, I'd think.
And I've been hurt more deeply by "religious" people than by any other kind of person. Does that make religion evil? I don't think so. I think those people who hurt me were not really following their religion, since I know the basic premise of this religion was based on Jesus' teachings. I'm not sure I believe Jesus was God, but I do think he was special and had some good ideas. [I'm not saying I DON'T believe he was God, I just don't know. I'm waiting to find out.] But the people who hurt me supposedly followed his teachings, and I KNOW what they did was against what he said.
So as long as there are humans, those humans can use knowledge and tools to hurt each other. Would we have been better to stay in the caves? Don't learn to make fire or the wheel or the lever or any of those early tools. I'm sure some early people thought that making fire was playing God, too, since didn't God give them fire? It usually came from the heavens ...
if something is used for the good, how can it be bad? ~ you are quickly becoming one of my fav reads on gather ~ not only because of subject matter, but how you respond to responses ~ kudos times a google ~j