Can be read prior to Romans. Definitions 1
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Definitions 2
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Definitions 3
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Something completely unexpected had happened in the world. The Jews were expecting a Messiah. They were expecting a king.
The Messiah came. A Messiah far greater than they could have hoped for. God came to earth as a man. Jesus, born of the Spirit of God and a woman. an unbelievable concept. But He didn't come as a king and most didn't recognize Him.
In Romans 1:4 
Paul says that Christ was "...declared the Son of God with power by the resurrection from the dead..." Notice the singular, the. Christ was different from all who came before Him.
Why did He die on the cross? Why did He resurrect? What affect does that have on you? In Romans, Paul spells out the mechanics of the unexpected gospel. How it affected people than ... and how it affects you now in the 21st Century.
Romans 1:16 "I am not ashamed of the gospel for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes..." To the Jews first, then the Gentiles.
Two things here; 1. No matter what the world says, we are not to be timid or ashamed of declaring all the truths taught by the gospel. 2. The gospel is God's powerful plan for salvation for all who believe.
Verse's 18-20 are amazing. God makes a very strong declaration of His wrath against men that deny the truth that God has revealed to them.
God said the truth regarding Himself and the type of God that He is has been made clear to all men because God Himself made it clear to them.
God says since the creation of the world His eternal power and divine nature is not only clear, but understood by men, therefore they are without excuse.
There are two solid revelations from God. The Bible and Creation. Through these two means, the Spirit of God Himself reveals, not only the existence of God, but the character of God.
I look at people differently now. When people act like they can't believe in a living and interactive Creator ... it seems they must be in one of 4 stages. Either;
* God hasn't yet opened their eyes to the truth He has revealed.
* They have seen and believed the truths about God but haven't yet had their eyes opened to the gospel. (It took me 22 years to see.)
* They know their state of sin and they know the gospel but haven't yet made a decision.
* They have rejected God's word and have fallen under the terrible curse of Romans 1:21,22 "... their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools..." The penalty for rejecting what God said He made it clear to them.
No wonder God says, vrs 20 "therefore they are without excuse."
Verse 24 & 25. God says when we reject Him, and worship the created ones (ourselves) we will be consumed by our own desires because we have become our own god.
Verses 24 to 32 show the downward spiral a society goes through that has rejected God. God gives them over to the lusts of their own depraved minds. Sin escalates into all unrighteousness, wickedness, homosexuality, all impurity, greed, evil, full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice, gossip, slander, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, disobedient to parents, without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving and unmerciful.
The Bible claim itself to be the Word of God. If this is an untrue statement, it is deceitful and should be discarded. If it is indeed the Words of God, then our attitude should be as David's. "Thy Words were found and I did eat them and Thy Words are unto me the joy and rejoicing of my heart."
There are some things in the Bible that make me uncomfortable. Some things I don't understand. But I have decided, for several reasons, to put my faith in the fact that the words of Scripture are God breathed. I accept, as Jesus accepted, the accuracy of the Bible.
You can see the foolishness of only accepting what you want and denying what makes you uncomfortable. People make a great error when they do not listen to all the Spirit of God wrote through man.
According to God's teaching, Love is not soft and fluffy. Our God of love came to earth and died for all that put their faith in Him and received new life. Our God of love said He will reveal His wrath from heaven to those who choose to reject Him. Love is always what is best for the object of that love. Love gives us a choice.
The last sentence in the last verse of Romans is very interesting.
Romans 1:32 b "Even though God revealed what they are doing is sin, they not only keep doing it but become a cheering section for others to do the same thing." We hear that all the time today, each cheering for the ‛rights' of others to be as immoral as they choose without any judgment.
Many Christians get caught up in the spiral from time to time in their lives ... (all of us to some extent) but for a true child of God I see a difference. They don't shake their fist at God as non Christians. When confronted they are usually ashamed. They call out to Him to deliver them from the mess they're in. Also, they try to prevent other Christians from falling into the same sin.
The gospel may not be clear to you yet. Each chapter of Romans will give you a better and better understanding of this wonderful plan. Meanwhile please feel free to ask question.
Also, if you want to ask questions privately, please feel free to send me an email. I'm sure the others would be glad to receive an email for discussion also.
There are many mature Christians on Gather. I hope you will feel free to exp
and on what is said here or give your own understanding.
Please read the first chapter or Romans to receive the full teaching. We'll go on to chapter 2 in a couple of days and we'll learn something very interesting ... comparing your sins to mine :):)
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Comments: 41 ( 1 removed by Glome . . . )
I like vs 16 about the gospel being the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes. For anyone who doesn’t believe then presumably there is some other means of salvation. Hereby we get a means of understanding all the good people who are not Christians. Think Ghandi.
Cheers.
Jim
It's good for all to hear. I think you make me laugh. I'll have to hear you a few more times. Your icon certainly does. I just can't figure out what kind of creature is behind it.
Thanks for your effort :) And for coming by and being an encouragment.
Exactly ... the part about knowing and loving 'God through creation. I thought that needed to be brought out more and it slipped my mind.
For All. "There is no other name under heaven, given amoung men, whereby you must be saved" Of course this verse refers to Jesus. However ...
That leaves a lot unsaid. God reveals Himself through the Bible and through Creation. (According to the Bible) Also .....................
John 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was with God in the beginning.
3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
(And of course the 'Word' is referring to Jesus. A name God has given Him.) NIV
Rev 4:11 " Worthy are You, our Lord and our God, to receive glory and honor and power; for You created all things, and because of Your will they existed, and were created." (This was spoken regarding Jesus.) NASU
These two verses show that Jesus Christ is the Creator. I'm sure there are people all over the world that have dropped to their knees (metophorically at least) and submitted themselves to the God of the heavens because the Spirit of God Himself gave them light.
Salvation came to them through Jesus Christ, even if they don't know His name. They, at the moment of putting their faith in the Creator, the God of heaven, were putting their faith in Christ and receiving new life.
Because of the revelation of creation, as Rosa See Ya mentioned, I myself think this has to be true.
Any other thoughts?
A person wouldn't think they would need them, but once you start going over them it sometimes helps. I always teach adult Bible studies the same way I do children's. The simplicity always opens my mind to fuller understandings.
Thanks for coming by.
Believe me, I get easily confused. The question I had is on the first 2 sentences in the 2nd paragraph. We probably agree but I wanted to ask who you are referring to when you say "we?" Are you meaning those who have put their faith in Jesus? I agree again.
Did you mean everyone in the world? I wouldn't agree that the Bible teaches that. But I know many feel that way so I'm going to use that possibility to give some scripture regarding the belief that no one is any longer under judgment.
John 3:17-19 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. (He came that the whole world COULD be saved)
18 " He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
(Putting our faith in Jesus removes us from judgment. He that fails to put their faith in Jesus is under judgment for rejecting Christ)
19 "This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil.NASU
(Christ and His truth is the light of the World per Scripture. Those that reject the light do so because they would prefer to be part of the world)
Debbie ... on the last line, did you just mean He could have died back then or He could have waited until today to come and pay for our sins? I would imagine that is very true also, I never thought of it before.
Anyway ... it's just those two sentences pretty much that I wasn't sure of. But if anyone has opinions or questions about the John 3 verses, please speak up!! :):)
Here are the final two verses of that section.
John 3:20-21
20 " For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light for fear that his deeds will be exposed.
21 "But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God." NASU
In one way it is my worst subject because many good people are so opposed to a loving God allowing people to go to a place that was prepared for Lucifer & his followers.
But more passages discuss Hell (whatever that is) than discuss heaven. So as much as I hate that subject, it needs to come up.
Of course those that have the Bible are accountable for that priveledge. (Whatever that means :)
Even if Jesus were here today he would still be crucified for the sins of
the world."
Would we recognize Jesus if he were alive in the world today? Or would
he come in a form that we wouldn't recognize, like he did 2000 years ago?
Obviously, I don't know the answer. Just a question, but maybe a reason
why we should try to be kind to evryone. God bless, rpw
It would be interesting for other to mention what they thought the reaction would be.
He comes as a lover and a man of justice and truth. I wonder what area's of lovelessness he would point out in me. Would He have expected me to give all I could & live at a much lower level? We seem to accept our own faults. Compromise on TV watching. Mine are reality shows or news. But wasted time? I can't imagine.
I think todays people would be amazed that he would talk to a lot of us like a Romans 1 society. Romans 2 will be very interesting along these lines. Which are the bad sins and which are the not so bad ones :):) I'm excited to get into that one but I want to wait a while. Hopefully others will share their thoughts on this one first.
Non Christian and older Christians wanted them too... a few did. I create all my own Bible studies so have a lot of material. It works well for me but there are so many experts out their publishing they don't need amateur's :) I do have a helpful one on 'Loving your enemy' to post next. It is the most life changing because it is a way to get over all anger and bitterness, no matter how small amount you carry or how horrible your bitterness problem is.
We'll see if these generate enough interest. Thanks for your encouragement.
This chapter speaks of the "H" word - not Hell (yet) - homosexuality. It is telling us that homosexuality, etc. is a negative result of not acknowledging God for Who He is and giving Him thanks. I am told that this gives "Christians" the backing they need to be "intolerant" of gays and lesbians.
If this ISN'T so then what should "tolerance" look like.
I was very aware of including that word in the quote; I know and love some who are fighting that temptation and ache for them. I have to quote God's word exactly ... I can't water it down. I see how many wonderful people are suffering from the whirlpool that is sucking America down and away from the standard of God and ache for them. I'm affected by that whirlpoos also. I am a glutton. I've been trying to escape that pull ... making some progess but it's hard.
I'm still wondering what we can do to make it evident that we, far from being INtolerant, actually see ourselves as fighting similiar temptations. I think that maybe what is expected is a ?churchwide and individual acknowledgement that homosexuality is NOT a sin. I'm thinking that no amount of loving will suffice and that "homophobic" will always be the label for anyone who continues to call it sin.
As an aside, I have found that, for me, friendship with a gay is wonderful. I think it's about having the male perspective to draw on without the tension that comes with dealing with the opposite sex. If I could find a way to NOT call it sin, I would very willingly do so.
My particular temptation is gossip, and my gut reaction is to be incredulous that God would lump the "innocent" act of gossip in with MURDER! I have come to realize, though, how insidious gossip is in breaking down relationship/breaking down trust - between ALL parties in the act of the gossiping.
It occurs to me that you and I, though we obviously love ourselves and don't treat ourselves despicably(manifest intolerance toward ourselves), must, nevertheless, be radically, uncompromisingly intolerant of our own acts of gluttony and gossiping when confronting the temptation to do them. Our intolerance is against the sin; and as long as we call homosexuality a sin - no matter how much we love and care for homosexuals, we must accept the label of intolerant. I guess that it comes with the territory of acknowledging God's Word as the Truth and our feelings as not the Truth.
Kat
Gossip ... Gluttony ... bragging ... impatience ... murder ... sexual sin of any kind are all the same as far as they are all breaking the law of God. God said anyone breaking the law makes you a law breaker. Breaking the law is sin. We all sin BECAUSE we are sinners. That's what sinners do.
Though all sins equally cause us to be separated from God. Not all sins are equal in every way. Some sins are the result of more corrupt hearts and do mor social damage as well as mental and physical damage. God Himself said that the results for refusining to accept the Lord would be worse for some people than others due to the magnitude of their sin.
But for this part of the study ... the important thing for us to know is that when Adam sinned, he died; his spirit was searated from God and could no longer be or act holy. Adam passed on that dead spirit to all the people of the world. That's why everyone is born lost. How interesting.
And thank you Andrea ... thank you for the blessing.
Collecting all verses that reflect truth in that area; or any portions of scripture that seem to embody an illusion to one truth or the other ... Here are the truths that presently guide my thinking on this issue.
1.
Eccl 3:15 (great & fun verse) "That which is has been already; that which will be has already been, for God seeks what has passed by."
We humans operate in 1/2 dimension of time. Imagine rolling that straight line of time out into a flat surface. A 2nd dimension ... just 1 more, adds unlimited possibilities to reality.
2.
"God is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance."
"Whosoever will, may come." Plus many other verses.
"Anything you ask in My name, I shall give you."
These verses show God making promises in reaction to the choices people make.
3
Acts 13:48 "When the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed." NASU
4
1 Peter 1:1 "...To those who ... are chosen 1 Peter 1:2 according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit ..." NASU
"Foreknowledge" of WHAT? He doesn't say. That leaves the field wide open.
Look how many of us pray for our loved ones. He promised if we prayed according to his will it would be done. The verse says he is not willing that any should perish.
Is it foreknowledge of all those things? Foreknowledge of who would put their faith in Him. Since Eccl says 'What is to be has already been' it appears that is a possibility.
God called those whom He foreknew would respond ...
I don't mean I have all the answers ... I just think He has given us several pieces of truth that seem to fit together to our limited created minds :) But when we're dealing with 'an uncreated being' ... you can't be too sure that our logic is applicable to His reality :)
You were kind to say takes humility instead of arrogance. I have a feeling you struggled over that word a little. :) Thank you for coming by.
The doctrine of election is one of the most hotly debated mystries of the Christian life. Theologians through the ages have pondered the meaning of Romans 8:29. You must have read quite a bit about the Arminians argument for foreknowledge - they had argued that the universal call (Tim 2:3, 4:2 Pet 3:9) for all sinners to repent and believe the gospel is meaningless if salvation is determined solely by God apart from the free will of a person. The Calvinists believed that foreknowledge is God's sovereign choice and not a person's excersised faith that determine who the elect are.
I happen to lean towards the Armenian view - for I believe that God knows who will accept Jesus Christ as our savior excersising our free will. You call it the 2nd dimension ;))
Looks like the Lord has put you into my life at a time I have reached a level of stagnation. I have a compulsion to feed my brain continuously. God has used the last three years of my life to teach me patience and has been rewarding me for learning the painful leason.
I just noted that the Bible actually teaches both. I don't think we can deny that. BUT ... when you add the other verses that give us a peek into the abilities of this uncreated creator ... it appears it is no big deal for both facts to be true. It appears the Bible says He appointed those He forknew would respond to His call. & yet He still called them all. If they were not appointed for salvation it is because they said no. God just knew it ahead of time because "that which will be, has already been." So I am Armenian also... :):)
Another section that is interesting (as far as God still calls those He knows won't respond (& I guess works into the verse 'Many are called but few are chosen' and reinforces your verse 2 Tim 4:2 "Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with great patience and instruction."
2 Cor 2:14-17 But thanks be to God, who always leads us in triumph in Christ, and manifests through us the sweet aroma of the knowledge of Him in every place.
15 For we are a fragrance of Christ to God among those who are being saved AND among those who are perishing;
16 to the one an aroma from death to death, to the other an aroma from life to life. And who is adequate for these things?
17 For we are not like many, peddling the word of God, but as from sincerity, but as from God, we speak in Christ in the sight of God. NASU
We've all had many that God has used us as a witness to His call resulting in their dead spirits entering into that permanently dead state. (I guess)
I feel a little silly doing this, but it is a perfect example. but less than a year ago I had a awe struck moment standing in the hall of my apt building with a woman that was crying. The story would make a book so I decided to go the opposite. I wrote a tiny skinny skeleton poem of the incident.
My Mom lived in apt 408. We just assumed God brought this man to us to pray and lead him to Christ.
It covers this whole subject & I'd like you to read it in that regard. Apt 409
I'm kind of excited to watch you over the next couple of years. I'll check out your pictures and see if you have family pics.
Please don't feel pressed to keep up with Gather. We'll be here when you have more time. Moving is a HUGE job.