Why Global Warming Instead of Global Cooling?

Also global dimming.

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Hey Bert, I think there's a huge flaw in your argument. Here's the simple truths:
1) Does global warming exist? ABSOLUTELY.
2) Does global warming have the potential to significantly and disastrously affect us? YES.
3) Do people (such as Al Gore and others) make money off of talking about issue like global warming? YES.
4) Does their making money affect the reality about the tremendous effects of global warming? No.
5) Thus is global warming truly something that we need to care about? Only if we want to continue to survive as a species on this planet.

I believe that global warming is here and being in denial will not help at all. Everything scientific shows global warming to be reality.

We cannot stop global warming but we can slow it by using the knowledge we have to stop our part of it so we and our children will not suffer as many disastrous effects in such a damaging way.

In my opinion, global warming is a problem that needs to be taken seriously. The brain trust of the Republican party has decided that it is within their interests to be global warming denyers. You would think, with their "family values" platform that anything that might threaten the survival of their children would be taken seriously. Since it does not appear to concern them, then it must follow that their "family values" platform is a complete and utter sham.

Look, we were sucked into a war with Iraq on flimsy evidence, but global warming, which most scientists agree is a fact, is not credible according to the Republican hierachy. Clearly, the Republican party's platform is an out and out lie. In my view, it is all about greed.

Of course there is Global Warming and there is Global Cooling. It's a never ending cycle. Can mankind affect it significantly either way, maybe marginally?

If you take the time to read any of the reverences (not by flakes BTW), you will see that both may be caused by CO2 emissions. The question is where do they come from, and most of the research indicates 97% natural causes and 3% from man living here (which is really natural too). The cooling right now appears to be from reduced sun spot activity. You guys want to try and control that too?

It is rather arrogant to say man can control it one way or the other. And, there certainly isn't a normal, since when the Vikings landed in Greenland, they named it that for a reason. It was green, not covered with ice. We have been in a cooling cycle for quite a while now.

I hope the Global Warming crowd is right. It presents a lot prettier picture than Cooling. But maybe you ought to get a few extra pairs of long johns just in case.

Why don't you read my other article and find a Republican conspiracy in it?

Disastrous Decisions of the Government: Part I

Bert, you're right, there are normal global cooling and warming cycles. There have been since the beginning of time. I don't mind more people recycling though. ;)

Lacey,

I couldn't agree more. I was one of the first to do it here. The problem is that we have to find ways of productively using our garbage.

All too often now communities are picking up recycling and simply taking it to dumps as there is no where to sell it, give it, or use it. I find that frustrating.

Thanks Bert,
I agree global warming has been a reality ever since the last (mini) ice age, and as you say an impending new mini ice age has scientists all up in arms.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/11/1130_051130_ice_age.html

The important question about Global warming is, is it human induced?
That is what the global warmists have not proven.

Cooling and warming cycles occur over tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of years. We're talking about changes that have occurred in the last 50.

It does seem one must spend a lot of money to be considered Green. New appliances, new light bulbs that cost a lot. New cars, different clothing, it goes on and on..Global warming has even occurred on Mars, and just how is that our fault??I saw where Sea Ice Levels were higher than anytime in the last 35yrs..

Yes Deborah and they (the ice areas) will get even higher.

Just be careful when you break one of those new light bulbs we'll be forced to buy. They're full of mercury. That's great for the environment.

David,

And over the last thousand, they've gotten colder. Just tell me what is normal??

David,
The Medieval Warm Period (MWP) or Medieval Climate Optimum lasted 400 years from around 1000-1400

The Little Ice Age (LIA) which followed lasted 300 years.

Change always costs money. I'm willing to spend it to leave my children with clean, breathable air. Previous generations didn't care for the earth and we pay for it now. The sins of the fathers... It excites me to see people go green. I hope it's not just a trend. We've been a green family for years. Global warming or not, it's exciting to see people change for the better.

Global Warming? Global Cooling? Call it "GLOBAL CLIMATE CHANGE". (a rose by any other name is still a rose.)

I don't really care how much money Al Gore gets for speaking engagements or anything else. The "global climate change" is very real, and I'm thankful that Mr. Gore brought it to the world's attention.

The very serious problem of "global climate change" is and will continue to effect each and every living thing on our planet. It already has ~ frogs, bees and fireflies are vanishing. Our oceans are dying ~ coral is rotting beneath the waves,sea mammals have changed their migration and birthing habits. Take a look at the massive increase in radical weather.

Take a walk around your neighborhood and really LOOK at the things around you.

I don't care what you call it, Bert. But something is going on and we'd better pay attention.

Deborah Mc,

"I saw where Sea Ice Levels were higher than anytime in the last 35yrs."

Where might you have "seen" this. Let's "see" the link to the scientific data if you don't mind.

I don't know what world you live in but I "see" polar bears swimming for miles, just looking for a scrap of ice where they can rest, hunt for food, or have their babies.

On the NASA home page we see the startling head line: ARCTIC PERENNIAL SEA ICE COULD BE GONE BY THE END OF THE CENTURY. But that was the GOOD News from a few years ago.

http://www.nasa.gov/vision/earth/environment/Perrenial_Sea_Ice.html

More recently a National Geographic study suggests that ARCTIC SEA ICE GONE IN SUMMER WITHIN FIVE YEARS. Scientists feel we have "passed the tipping point".

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/12/071212-AP-arctic-melt.html

I don't know what is wrong with you conservative doo doo heads. Don't you know about something called GOOGLE?

When you make some inane statement, at least back it up with a link so you can show there is at least one other person on the web as stupid as you.

Bert,

Thanks for your links.

I think the undeniable reality is that due to climate change driven by human activity at a DRAMATICALLY accelerated pace over the past 50 years, we will see an increase in the frequency and power of storms, globally. We are seeing this. It has caused and will continue to cause dramatic loss of life and property. We are seeing that.

Sea ice levels have increased because the are created by ice shelves that detach from perennial Artic and Antartic ice. An increase in sea ice is actually a sign of global warming.

Yes, we have Global Climate Change, it is called nature.

I've tried to live a "green" life before a lot of you were born. I not only recycle, I reuse. Our gas bills have actually dropped 25% over the past year which means we have reduced our driving by 40% or more. Out thermostat is set at 78 in the summer and 64 in the winter.

We raise our own vegetables, basically organically. I've been canning pickles and relish for over a month.

My gut tells me, except for saving a few bucks, I'm accomplishing nothing.

My fear is we will destroy the very economy we are going to need (or our children will need) at the altar of another religion, Global Warming End of Times.

This is not a political discussion even if a lot of you think it's all George Bush's fault.

From what I have read, the Arctic ice is diminishing and the Antarctic Ice is increasing at a far greater rate, that there actually more total ice than before. ????

I was in Alaska last fall and saw how nasty the glaciers looked first hand. It wasn't a pretty sight. I wish they would be in their full glory for my grand kids to see, if I ever have any. I guess they will have to go to the south Pole instead???

Sledge- your lack of understanding of the CFC crisis of the 1980s disturbs me. It is a fact that the international agreement to halt the manufacture of CFCs such as freon has saved many human lives. Why? Because freon destroys ozone high in the atmosphere, where ozone deflects ultraviolet light back into space. As a result of the weakening of the ozone layer from CFCs, it is now policy everywhere in Australia for school children to wear hats during recess to protect them from ultraviolet rays that cause thousands of cases of skin cancer there every year.
And then you proceed to say that foliage produces ozone, so we are fine. What are you talking about? Ask any atmospheric scientist and he will tell you how wrong you are. If not for the 1986 agreement to ban CFCs, we would eventually have lost the ozone layer everywhere, not just at the south polar region. In addition to causing countless melanomas and other skin cancers in humans, this would pose the threat of eventually destroying most of the crops we depend on, as ultraviolet light also has the ability to kill plants. This topic is of interest to me partly because of the melanoma that was cut out of my right arm ten years ago. I am one of the lucky, I am alive.
You need to read a bit more before you post something like this.

Obviously you have you side of the view, and I'm sorry you had the melanoma, but show me the evidence that the high altitude depletion was caused by the CFCs.

I don't say we can change warming or cooling of the climate all I am saying is we may be able to slow the effects of it by being more responsible with our carbon output.

Politicians can't stop climate change but they can enact laws to help slow the effects.

The things we do around home are beneficial for us but will not make a difference in climate change.

For every plastic bottle you or me recycle Bert probably their are a million or so thrown into the landfill.

At least recycling will make some of our natural resources last a little longer.

Chris,

I hope I didn't sound a little abrupt. I should have waited until I had more time to respond.

I am well aware of the whole in the ozone about half the size of Australia. And, a good friend had a melanoma removed about 4 years ago, and I'm happy that so far he appears to be ok. My dad had the white type removed several times, in fact part of his ear in gone from it, so I am not making light of anything. He worked out doors most of his life so no amount of ozone was going to help him.

I'm sorry for being so cynical when the world acts on limited scientific evidence. And just because a group decided doesn't hold a lot of weight with me.

Look at DDT. It was banned on totally junk science, actually no science. And, because of it 4 million people, mostly kids, die every year of Malaria. They are using on a limited inside only spraying in South Africa and it has helped tremendously. If she wasn't dead, Rachel Carson should be tried for crimes against humanity, since so many people had to die to further her career and make her famous.

Jack,

Again I hate to be a cynic (I guess I really don't, as one definition of a cynic is a "searcher of the truth"... whatever), but deep down inside I think all we accomplish by recycling is get warm & fuzzy feelings.

I still believe the answer lies in using and converting the garbage. If a way can be found to make money on it... problem solved.

I must have been a sleep for the last few decades. The whole scientific community was up in arms back in the late 70s about the comming "ice Age" and the cooling of the earth. I don't know how I could have missed all that ice floating by.

Sledge,

If you don't recycle, all those bottles, cans and paper just become part of our "garbage" problem.

But lots of people HAVE found solutions to our energy needs, and some of them are GARBAGE:

http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2007-03/prophet-garbage

Our biggest problem is the naysayers and anti science government (like bush and now McCain) that does not have the vision or the political will to take action.

I forgot to add Capt. Seaweed to that list of naysayers/deniers.

Well, since I'm not running for office and am a die-hard capitalist, I look at it as a potential way of making a profit. I can't do it myself, but someone will when it is profitable enough, and that is probably now, especially for use in energy or agriculture.

Ah, if I were only 40 years younger, that is, knowing what I know now. As with everyone back then I was just young and dumb.

Cythnia,

Naysayer/denier?? Naysayer/denier in reference to what? Careful your answer doesn't come back to bite you!

so, the people who argue against global warming are not getting paid?

thats a laughable argument my friend, considering the 1% of scientists who diasgree with global warming are on the payroll of the oil companies.

look it up.

I don't buy into the Global Warming stuff.
I think there are a bunch of people dipping into the Kool Aid !!

And I will assume that Al Gore and Michael "Fatty" "meathead" Moore are making a fortune touring and speaking about this right? And of course they are not flying to these events right?

What is the argument? Isn't the issue to polute or not polute!

To pollute or not pollute that is the rubbish.
Wether this nobler in the minds of Gore to suffer the plastic waste
or to Hawk, perhaps to sScam, to Rip until one can Rip no more.
And thereby as would Elmer Gantry sow the rip.
For as goes the saying of yore......
As ye rip so shall ye be ripped.
Amen

I think Dan H stated it best

Yes there is Global change, always has been, and always will be.

Mother nature rules!

There is a book out there called "Collapse", written by Jared Diamond. It explains the evolution of civilization and the inevitable collapse of these civilizations. What it all comes down to is that there is a peak, then there is a decline, then there is cannibalism, then extinction, and or migration.
Now that the entire world is involved in the processess described in the book, ie: raping the enviornment to the point of non-sustainability, plus the inevitable overpopulation that is occuring, it is only a matter of time before the entire population either becomes extinct, or declines to the point of sustainability. That could occur sooner or later, depending on Mother Nature. It will occur, though, even if Mother Nature is silent. It seems people are thier own worst enemy.

Bert Sledge: "Yes, we have Global Climate Change, it is called nature."

Since humans are a part of nature we can imagine they are a factor in global climate change. The question that is really of concern is how large is the human component. Do human activities cause enough change to push the global climate into a catastrophic state. Is human influence one-tenth of 1%, or is it 10% of the change? If the latter then we, us humans, may be pushing our planet into a global climate catastrophe. So how much do you think human activity is causing changes in the average global temperature?

Well let's see Richard,
according the the global warmists it is carbon in our atmosphere that is causing global warming, right?

so according the this page;
http://oceanworld.tamu.edu/resources/oceanography-book/carboncycle.htm
and this page;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_cycle

There is about 750 gigatonnes of carbon in our atmosphere and humans burning of fossil fuels put out 5.5 gigatonnes annually, but if you look at this page;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_dioxide_in_the_Earth's_atmosphere
it says we we humans put out 7.4 Gts in 2004 and 8.4 Gts in 2006 so lets go with 8.4 just for arguments sake.

So how much of an effect can we puny humans have in driving global warming if we are producing less than 1.2% annually of the product that is claimed to be responsible for global warming?
Especially if you look at the previous years output, 2004 we were puting out 10% less, 10 years ago we were putting out even less, ect, ect, ect.

Now let's reverse it, The global warmists want us to reduce our carbon output and want to do that by putting massive taxes on the use of carbon, if carbon is indeed the global warming culprit then how much of an effect will reducing our 1.2% by 10% or even 50% have on reducing global warming?

Dan,

CO2 does not cause Global Warming directly. The theory, and it is a theory, is that CO2 will cause a build up of moisture in the troposphere and THAT will cause Global Warming. Unfortunately for the IPCC and other religious institutions -- THAT is not going as planned.

Scientists call this "Carbon Sensitivity" and the earth is proving to be much more resilient than models predicted.

Most of the IPCC's models are so far down into the error-bars as to be considered falsified.

Greg,
Thanks for the clarification.

Thank you for posting to Point Whore! Wishing everyone many, many points!

Dan E: "So how much of an effect can we puny humans have in driving global warming if we are producing less than 1.2% annually of the product that is claimed to be responsible for global warming?"

EXCELLENT response! You are to be congratulated.

For our next lesson, boys and girls, please study the words system and feedback.

To see how a small change can make a BIG difference, take a look at this page about human body temperature.

Discuss amongst yourselves before tomorrow's class.

Dan E: "...ect, ect, ect."

Please, this kind of stoopidity hurts my haed!

Did you mean et caetera?

Bert, GREAT article. Personally, I subscribe to the fact that God created this earth and the theory that is goes through cycles of climate change. Humans may have affected it on a small scale, but not enough to see what we are seeing. What we are seeing is a normal climate cycle. Most meteorologists will tell you that.