HOMEGROWN AMERICAN TERRORISTS

You got that right.

Good points, Thomas. I would add that the KKK is a a bunch of religious fanatics. They burn the cross on lawns, etc. Hardly a Christian act but in the name of Christ. I am also a bit off of pointing at guns as the culprit or thinking that eliminating guns will stop the mayhem. "Ve haf ozzer vays!" The longer that people keep pointing their fingers at side issues and fail to face the real issues, the more mayhem will come until they wake up and "smell the roses." That is to say... it is so convenient to focus one's attention on this coming election, as if that is the problem, "the wrong guy as President." BS. The problems are much more basic and deeper. The solution will not come by banning weapons or shouting over and over, "Peace." We need a complete overhaul of our cultural standards, world wide, cultural non-specific. All of these side issues are only aspirins for a deep and fatal disease. The longer we take the aspirin and ignore the real issues, the further progresses the disease that is killing us.

In my opinion, there is no time left for polite acquiescence to these trivial stop gap efforts to keep people thinking that they are "doing something" effective when they aren't. I say, keep the guns firing and killing until people wake up and "smell the roses." Actually, the NRA is right in saying, "Guns don't kill people. People kill people." We MUST grow up socially and religiously or give up our place on this planet to some new race of men who will.

This entire society is so focused on objective physical sensory material gratification that they have no real idea of the subjective spiritual interconnection that exists connecting us all with it's unconditional love that gives us full freedom to learn by trial and error experience ...

Such experience results in eventual growth, but usually only when the pain received becomes great enough, finally then, the person chooses to seek something different and better.

When all available materialistic remedies are finally exhausted, then one may seek the INternal subjective spiritual potentials ... and then, only IF seeking highest truth, will they finally find what has always been missing ... the truth of God, of a generic personal nature (non-institutionalized), that being finally the truth that sets them free ... free from fear and hatreds that cause people to use force amplified by weapons against each other.

This world will never be very safe until everyone wakes up to this truth, one by one on a personal level of "self responsibility" ... there is NO one "other" person or group that can or will do it for us, we MUST do it ourselves based upon truth and honesty ... terrorism is the antithesis of the required love that is the only light that can displace the darkness of fear ... the only thing to fear is fear itself ... all bad come from fear and all good comes from love ... IMnsHO.

Jerry Kays: You are right. Our general cultural, spiritual immaturity is the problem. Even Road Rage" is just another aspect of this same problem.

Jerry: You're right.

There are so very many ways to say that if everyone would just be peaceful and cooperative, the world would be more peaceful and cooperative . . . Coming up with new ways to say it, is not the challenge we face, I don't think.

The "challenge" is to understand the "truth" of it so that one will "believe " it enough to utilize it ...

Jerry,

Well, I agree to some extent, though I would perhaps say "live it", rather than "use it". But I still think little or nothing will come of telling others how wonderful the world could be if all were dedicated to such a path . . . most already know that, and those who don't can't hear you, for they are not dedicated so. It's kinda like spending vast sums on billboards extolling the virtues of literacy . . .

Or as is oft said, "You're preaching to the choir".

Very well written and reasoned, Thomas! You asked about anyone at risk and I have to say that Obama is at severe risk for his life. The Arean Nation group was exemplary of some peoples attitude, that black people are not human and can therefore be killed without committing sin! Though the Arean Nations is gone, it supporters and believers linger on and would, if possible, assassinate a black person to prevent his becoming president!

Donald,

Your first comment is an excellent analysis of the situation and one with which I completely agree. Time is running out and we need to face the real issues to bring society to where it should be.

Donald: Thank you for sharing your wisdom. An alcoholic must hit bottom before he will pull himself up and do what he must do if he wants to become part of society and fulfill the role he was created for. Mankind today is like that alcoholic, intoxicated with warfare and violence. When he hits the bottom of depravity, and he will, he will turn around and carry out the plan for which God created him.

"" ... hitting bottom ... "" Well said Thomas. John, then I would preach that the "choir" became "more harmonious".

yes and don't forget timothy mcveigh, army trained unibomber

Jerry,

Do you mean "more harmonious" with you? Or more harmonious with each other? It is quite possible to claim that one seeks "harmony". while simultaneously attempting to incite disharmony. You, for instance, claim that all ought to accept the beliefs of others, yet, incessantly seek to defame and discredit any that don't ascribe to your particular views on these "spiritual" matters.

I understand that a simple minded person cannot distinguish between what a speaker claims to be pursuing, and what that speaker actually pursues, but that is of no consequence to those that are not so simple minded. It has become rather fashionable to recite dogmatic condemnations of those one finds "disharmonious" with one's views, and excuse such blatant violation of civility, and indeed their own declared principles, by simply making more accusations about those they deem unworthy of the respect they ostensible call for. Such double-talk will succeed in charming the easily charmed, but not those with integrity.

John a man with integrity ... what a joke.

Yes, as I said; "by simply making more accusations . . "

> Can you think of any prominent figures today who might be
> the target of some crazy, gun wielding assassin?

Is this a productive question to ask?

Then after you have gotten everyone scared you leap to the
assumptions that gun-toting people are the danger because
anyone who "totes" a gun has not grown up.

Try calculating the percentage of people who tote guns
out of the number of people who commit crimes or kill
people ... it is really not that large. Most gun owners are
rational people who are concerned about their own protection
in a society that does not have the money to protect them
well from from the criminal element that is growing and
getting meaner.

Then finally you want to call them terrorists. Geez, Thomas
get a grip.

Donald:
>> The solution will not come by banning weapons or shouting
>> over and over, "Peace." We need a complete overhaul of
>> our cultural standards, world wide, cultural non-specific.

Wow, completely agree.

Too many laws, too much greed, too many singing me, me, me without respect for others.

Rome fell and we are on the same path.

Not too late to change directions.

VOTE!

David: You have said a lot with so few words. You're right, it's not too late. Change will come, and just in time.

I know that the US has their fair share of nuts and extremists. I just hope they can stay peaceful.

Karen: There is a light at the end of the tunnel. When the human race grows up and matures, which won't be too much longer now, things will turn around. There is a new day coming.

Thomas,

I realize this is a somewhat irksome concept to many, but I myself find the "logical reduction" of a given statement or concept, to be useful quite often, in discerning it's real "weight", in the real world. When I apply the general principles of logical reasoning to your statement about there being a "light at the end of the tunnel",, it reads thus;

When man ceases to be irrational, he will cease to be irrational, and someone named Thomas thinks that will happen soon, so others ought not worry overmuch.

It's a fine sentiment, but does not to my mind, qualify as actual reasoning. Again;

"There are so very many ways to say that if everyone would just be peaceful and cooperative, the world would be more peaceful and cooperative . . . Coming up with new ways to say it, is not the challenge we face, I don't think."

You are not offering any actual insight, but just a statement of hope. That's certainly a good thing, but not so certainly if it functions as a distraction from actual insight, I feel.

John Knight: Thank you for your comments. My approach is to state truths in a very simple way clothed in language easily understood by most people. I do not attempt to convince anyone of anything or to "prove" a point. If someone wishes to dissect and analyze the tree he will miss the beauty of the forest. There is a story in the bible, if I recall correctly, about the casting of seeds, some of which fall on stony ground and some fall on fertile ground. I see myself as casting seeds. I care not what my readers do with what I write however engage in debate is something I do not care to do.

John lives for debate because he thinks that if he can appear to be the winner of a debate it means he is better and the other person is worse for it. If you say the moon is full he will insist that you tell him what it is full of and why that means anything. If you say that your God is about unconditional love he will say his is about "perfect" unconditional love ... if you agree with him he will tell you that you are astute, beautiful and wise ... :-)

You make many valid points. Hate seems to be running rampant in our country. Our streets are dotted with the blood of the inocent. Our country is in hock up to it's eyeballs to many oreign countries. All they would have to do is call in their loans and our country would cease to exist as we know it.
Our country is killing itself from within.

Jerry: I get no satisfaction from argument. Once I have said my piece I shut up.

Patti: Wise observations. But there is hope - more than hope, there is assurance of a better future. Let's all hang in there.

I don't even watch the news anymore. Every time you turn on the tv, there's just more violence, more attempts at shameless ratings. For once, I would love to see the news and see more positive things. Like a child in school getting an award for volunteering and helping those in need.
Oprah Winfrey is a positive role model, that's why I watch her show every day.
I try to only fill my vision with things that make my day bright and cheerful. So, I can make it through the day.

Thomas, yes, you may say your piece and shut up ... I was not speaking for you, I was speaking about the one mentioned and that concerning earlier comments on the same thread made by him concerning me.

Are you trying to tell me that I should not respond as I do because it is not "your" way ?

There is a fine "beauty" of sorts, in the notion that all of what men call sacred is in fact sacred. Yet, that very "beauty" turns to extreme ugliness, if it is used to justify defaming the very things one has ostensibly called sacred.

It is no big trick to speak of one's own views as inclusive or above the fray of the human condition. It is not a big trick to claim one has taken everything into account, and ones conclusions are without bias. Such claims are no harder to utter than to recite any other ridiculous dogmatic non-sense. No human can possibly take everything into account, or rightly claim that their views are all inclusive. To do so is simply to claim one is God.

There is no beauty in claiming that mankind will settle into a vast harmony, simply because that is a beautiful thought. No more than claiming folks ought not prepare for harsh weather, because fair weather is more delightful. It will leave people in a very poor position when the next storm arrives. That storm rages as we speak, and that is in fact the reason many speak of fair weather being so appealing, is it not?

Angela: Good for you! I really admire your attitude.

Jerry: Thank you for responding. And please continue commenting in your way. Your input is valuable.

Very interesting article Thomas.

Thomas, thanks for the clarification. :-)

Bill: The two groups mentioned sow seeds of hatred which can be extremely destructive down the line. There is no telling what those seeds will reap in the future.

"There is no telling what those seeds will reap in the future."

Precisely, and that reveals the underlying contradiction of your assertion that "When he hits the bottom of depravity, and he will, he will turn around and carry out the plan for which God created him."

No such reasoning bares out in reality. The deeper we go into the darkness of self justification and its companion, violence; The LESS likely recovery on our own becomes. In such darkness there is only stumbling and foolish striking out. If that were not so, we would have long ago become "angels" of orderly society. A hundred million or more, were murdered in cold blood, in the last century alone, by "Godless" rulers, and those who followed blindly in their darkness. "We" learned nothing from this, and do not even consider it important. "We" bitch and moan about the relatively minute fruits of misguided, or better said "false" religious types, and use nothing more than vague rumors of their deeds, to frighten folks away from God, the Light itself.

Thomas-----

You left out the likes of Timothy McVeigh, John Allen Mohammad, Theodore Kaczynski, and even Charles Manson, for that matter.

America has always had terrorists of some kind.

.....John Wilkes Booth, Leon Czolgosz, Charles J. Guiteau, Lee Harvey Oswald, Lynette "Squeaky" Fromme, Sara Jane Moore, John Hinckley, Jr., Eric Harris
and Dylan Klebold.........the list goes on and on and on..............

Bill B: Yes, of course, I see your point, and you are quite correct. But consider this: The Islamic terrorists have been performing their nefarious acts for a comparatively shorter time; they have killed many people, including their own, but they have not demeaned the Western, or non-Muslim, world; we still stand proud. Think of what the KKK and the American Nazis have done to the entire Black race in America over the centuries. It will take a long time to overcome their terrifying activities.

Honestly, I'm surprised we've gone so long without any major home-grown incidents, especially given the failing economy. The fact is, though, you can't really talk about them, unless you particularly enjoy being on government watchlists and being prohibited from leaving the country or flying on airplanes.

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