Discussion: Lying and Stealing

interesting discussion topic

Lying is lying and it is hardly ever okay. Stealing is just wrong. Sharing a drink, hmm, that's a hard one.

hmmm, sharing a drink.

When the kids and i go out we always share a large drink, cuz of the free refills and i cant afford 4 drinks;)

Sharing a drink is NOT stealing, thats why its called "sharing" , although i think Dnbuster is pushing it, by sharing 1 with 4 and going back for free refills,.(No offense meant, Dn, just calling it as I see it) Lying is rarely ok, unless it is done to save another's feelings and you know they are not looking for an "honest" answer...For example, if asked how I like a new hairdo...if its a good friend, I'd be honest, but if its my boss, "It looks great!"..

I think Donna pretty much covered how I feel about things.

Sharing a drink, or even a meal is not stealing - unless it is from a buffet.
My husband & I go out all the time & share a meal. There is nothing wrong with it.

Lying is lying. Even lies told to spare someone's feelings are deceitful. It's a slippery slope. Is it OK to lie? I'd have to agree with Donna. Guilty as charged.
I would think sharing a drink is not stealing. I mean the drink was paid for. Now giving you old cup to someone so they can refill it at one of those self serve soda fountains, that would be stealing.

I have to agree with Steve. Lying is Lying. I too, agree with what Donna said.
I don't think Sharing a drink is stealing even though it is something I personally don't do (just don't like the thought of it, although when my kids were young they did drink out of my cup often). But I agree with Steve that giving your old cup to someone to refill at a self serve soda fountain would be stealing. And stealing is wrong, period.

It's all been said.

10 4 u

I think there is alot of grey areas like you said, I know people who take straws and sugar and napkins from places they eat so they dont have to buy it for thier house, they dont consider that stealing, yet i would trust them alone in my house.
If you take something you didnt pay for, it is stealing, sharing a meal is border line,often thought the places charged fee so then it wouldnt be.
Lying, thats even harder I think, I see no reason in hurting feeling when it doesnt matter - do you like the book, I gave you, yes I do - no one hurt and the person is ok. white lies
I know it is lying but I cant see hurting people ether
what do you think

I don't think sharing a drink is considered stealing. That's no different as ordering one dessert and splitting with someone else.

I agree with Donna. Lying is rarely ok. There are occassions where it calls for someone to lie. For example, you're invited to a surprise party for a co-worker on Saturday night. That co-worker asks you what your plans are for the weekend. Of course, you are going to make something up so you don't give away the surprise. You're not going to say I'm going to your party.

Lying or stealing is not okay, because it leads to other things. My Grandmother use to say if you lie you steal and if you steal you will kill. I believe that with all my heart because I have seen people nearly kill because they got caught. That is a serious issue.

Lying is only ok if it is going to prevent someone from getting hurt. I cannot lie, I have a really hard time...just can't do it!

I can't stand lying, partially because of my past. I say its wrong just as stealing is wrong. Sharing is different then stealing.

lying is lying no matter what. It is done at times to spare ones feelings but I would still ask forgiveness for it. My husband are guilty of sharing and refilling drinks sometimes. Now I fee guilty.

Lying has it's purposes. If my friend's new dress is really ugly, what good does it do either of us for me to tell her?

Stealing is a similar matter. Is it okay to steal food to feed your family? If a loved one is sick and the mediicene is too expensive, do I let that person die?

Great topic of discussion !!!

I believe 'lying' is permissible when a doctor tells his/her patient an untruth that results in the patient getting better instead of the patient dying as was the doctor's original assumption. In that case the doctor's action might better be described as 'treatment'.

I think everyone really knows the definitions of lying and stealing. Lying is not telling the truth. Stealing is taking something that is not yours.

My mother taught me (because it's Biblical...and because it's certainly easier to remember) to always tell the truth. If someone asks your opinion about a hairdo or dress that is UGLY, one can always say, "That's some dress." And that's still truth. It is SOME DRESS.

While I don't think that sharing a drink between two persons is stealing, I do question sharing one between a group and getting free refills. That, to me, is stealing. If one cannot afford drinks for everyone, most restaurants either give water away for free or charge very little for it. Everyone could have their own ice water and it would be much better for them. :-)

In the book that I wrote back in 1985, I presented a questionnaire that included the question, "Do you always tell the truth?" It was meant to be a trick question, because it is rare that anyone can answer yes honestly to it. Telling the truth always is not an easy thing to do, for sure; lying is not to be commended, however, even if people do it so frequently.

Stealing is wrong. Stealing is not the same as sharing, though. Sharing a drink between a group and getting free refills -- that already stretches it. I would echo Marilyn's words: it's possible to go with water, which is a healthier alternative anyway.

Most has been said -

Sharing a soft-drink can be stealing if you go overboard on "free" refills. Most restaurants build in the cost of a couple refills.

When it comes to the alcohol-based drinks - sharing a few tastes with someone of age is OK if they are not sure if they even like the wine or mixed drink.

This topic really hit home because I live with someone that lies constantly. Lying is never o.k. It hurts people and destroys relationships. There are ways to say things to remain truthful and still not hurt someones feelings. If someone is asking how you like their dress etc and you don't really like it you can always turn it around and say something like I bet that sure felt nice to get to buy yourself something new for yourself. Or something similar to what Marilyn said about it being some dress. There is always a way to say something that will not hurt someone and yet still remain truthful. One must remember that to be a lier you have to be extremely smart. You have to remember what you say from one time to the next. Most people are not that good at it and will eventually slip up and say something that does not coincide with their last story. Then people are doubly hurt because they then know the person lied to them in the first place.

Stealing is just plain wrong. Sharing a drink or meal is fine as long as seconds were not taken. When a restraurant offers refills it is meant for one person. It two people are sharing a drink and getting free refills they are in essance drinking the equivilant of two drinks with refills but only paying for one. How is that not stealing. As I said if you are taking the original meal with drink and splitting it because it is more than enough and you do not get any refills than that is fine and is not stealing. Taking extra napkins and other items are stealing also. These items are meant for your use with your meal and not intended to stock your house. Everyone pays more for their meals because these costs are added in because the companies know people do this and they have to cover their costs. The morals of this world have went seriously downhill when people start splitting hairs and looking for grey areas. There are none. God did not say do not steal unless your family is hungry. He said do not steal. He did not say do not lie unless you can rationalize that it will keep from hurting someone's feelings. He said do not lie.

Thank you for submitting your content to:
The group: We Comment Back

Well lying is an interesting topic. I think there are some "white lies" that are ok that will save everyone a lot of hurt, such as if your best friend thinks they looks awesome in their new dress but it makes them look fat, you shouldn't tell them it looks awful and they should take it back. Now, all other lies except for white lies are unacceptable.

As for your example I think stealing is wrong, but I don't think sharing a drink at a restaurant would fall under that category.

The only lie that isn't wrong is omission under circumstances that the truth would hurt someone without helping them, and the omission does not hurt them.

Stealing, to me, is taking belongings without permission, or payment. Mooching is not good, but I'm not sure it is theft.

Selene: i usually agree with you, but...a lie of omission's a lie nonetheless. if you've got a relatively shrewd individual in your sights, they'll probably probe a little more. "But, like...this is a Yes or No, hon': IS...my HAIRcut...NICE."

Thomas Millington: i like your "placebo lie". very cannily wrought.

ladies and gentlemen: there's not a SINGLE vice which doesn't have "windows".
is murder wrong?
not during a war, it isn't. (no cornering, here: look up the word, if you need to.)
theft?
well, somebody already mentioned feeding one's kin...and it's the situation that BRINGS a person to such dire straits that is inherently "wrong".
if that.
lying?
uh...HELL yeah. -lying can do more than save feelings--it can save LIVES. i've always detested those staunch, go-ahead-and-kill-me heroes who have just been given the Join Me Or Die speech by the villian.
i mean, you could always Play Ball--and THEN turn on the motherfucker.
principle, unfortunately, is often The Wrong Answer.

cheating?
at what? -give me details, and i'll give you a response.

adultery?
if both people are Into It, it CAN be right--i would expound, but i sense i will be my own effigy.
oxymoronic as that may read.

on and on, i might wax--there are exceptions to each rule. here are the things that must be weighed, down to the hair:
Why is this purported vice being carried out?
Is the person doing it out of malice?
Does the person feel backed into a corner? -ARE they backed into a corner? We're animals, whether or not we'd like to believe otherwise...and that means, if threatened, we respond in self-preservation. or Maternal Instinct. or Paternal. or Matrimonial.

Lies are lies and can hurt, There are ways to tell the truth in a way that will be less painfull just think before you speak.

Well, when you see an ugly baby, I think it's okay to lie to the proud parents. But honestly, most babies are homely little things. My son looked like Yoda but everyone said he was beautiful. He wasn't until he was about 4 weeks old.

Lying and stealing are wrong but there is a lot of gray area. We're pissed off when goverment lies about WMDs and starts a war, but we're forgiving of the person who says, "I lied so you wouldn't have to take the punishment."

Stealing working folks' pensions and leaving them without retirement money is outrageous. Stealing food because of hunger, not so bad.

The magnitude of the crime makes it worse.

I think no matter what there are gray areas in life. Lying is wrong, we know it is but then again there are times when not telling the truth isn't hurting anyone. Example, your friend wants to know if a picture of her daughter isn't just the best thing when you know that the kid is really not a pretty child. You would be ignorant to say "no, she's ugly" and lying to say "oh she's so beautiful" so you lie by stretching and saying "oh it's a beautiful shot of her!". Technically you're lying. You get the drift.

Stealing also has some gray areas. It's never right to steal. Stealing is taking something that is not yours. Sharing a drink with someone, technically it IS stealing from the restaurant because you should purchase your own drink. Two drinking from one glass is taking in double what a "serving" is normally IF you have refills, etc. BUT in the same token if you share drink and get no refills, what's the harm? Even if you get ONE refill, many people do that normally so you haven't taken anything above the normal purchase... yet you have technically stolen.

To me there are gray areas in life all the time. Nothing is black and white and those that see the world in that color are those who are generally self righteous and quick to judge others from what I've seen.

Great discussion topic.

I personally think that there is alot to be said for HONESTY!

If the one asking the question has the right to hear the truth and you don't give it, then it is a lie.
If the Nazi's were asking me to tell them where I could find a Jew, then I would think they didn't have the right to know because of what they were doing, so I would not tell them if I knew.
If someone says to me, "Does this dress look okay?' then I must tell them the truth even if they won't like it, but I think if I could make them answer their own question, by saying ,"What do you think" or the like, then they could realize they already know the answer. Because if they go out in something that makes them look bad, then others will see them that way and that could prove painful.
So, I always tell the truth and I want others to tell me. I would rather be told that a dress made me look bad than go out where the entire public could see me looking bad.

And as far as stealing: each person is born with a conscience. Most hear it say, 'no' don't do that, or 'yes' that is something you should do. If you don't listen, then it stops working correctly. If the restaurant says, 'free refill with purchase' then they are expecting the one buying the drink to be the one drinking and getting a refill. Two will drink more than one, so there is likely to be more than one refil, and this of course is stealing, in my view. One patron usually doesn't get more than one refill per visit. But two people know they are likely to want more than one alone. If you stick to one cup of drink and don't get seconds, then no, it is not stealing. Only if you get more than the one person alone would have is it stealing.
If you are in doubt, then you should ask the management if sharing a drink is okay with them. If they it's okay, then it isn't stealing.
I listen to my conscience and it guides me not to lie or steal or be deceptive. Each person should train their conscience to be honest in all things. That is my belief.

We should always tell the truth, but we don't always have to be telling it.

wrong all the way around.

Lying is wrong. Sharing a drink all depends on who it is beeing shared with. Like a young child or a date.

Good discussion here.

I agree with many of the posts here and especially with Rfuaw D and - Shirley U understand Me S -
Yes, it is true, get away with a little and you'll try a lot - and - the conscience is another case where we must Use it or Lose it.

Organically yours,

Diana

http://organicgiftsbydiana.mybisi.com/

http://www.dianascraft-antiqueshop.4t.com

http://www.squidoo.com/OrganicandNatural

http://www.squidoo.com/NaturalProductsbyDiana

http://www.squidoo.com/AllNaturalPerfume

Greta discussion, i don't think I have something to add, since evetyhing was said already.

great discussion--everything's been said.

everything's been said

Lying is lying...wrong!

Stealing is wrong and most of the time against the law...

Sharing a meal is not stealing if you paid for the one meal as long as it is not from a buffet...same for a drink...

:O)

Lying and stealing are both sins. (Exodus 20:15,16). Sins are wrong, and therefore, yes, wrong. God gave these commandments, and doing what He said not to are sins, and again, wrong.

LYING is WRONG!!!! NEVER okay! You could simply say "I am not going to talk about this" rather then lie or something!!! STEALING again, never okay. So many people work so hard for what they have, who do criminals think they are to take it. Sharing a drink when there are free refills and one person didn't buy a drink, still stealing, a small offense BUT STILL STEALING!!!

Lying to conceal a surprise party is probably the only case I can think of when it is all right. But, even then, it is probably best to evade the issue. I wouldn't even take office supplies from work. I don't understand people who help themselves to things that aren't theirs.

I think there are a lot of gray areas. I think sharing a drink and getting refills is wrong because why not just order water? At most places (here anyway) it's free.

I don't think sharing a drink is stealing, any more than ordering a meal without ordering a drink is stealing. Stealing cheats someone of something to which he is entitled. Lying steals the truth. Cheating also steals the truth. All of these can change the outcome of a given situation. Who wants to live a life built on lies, stealing and cheating?
Lying to conceal a surprise party is more keeping a secret than lying. Not making a truthful comment about someone's appearance is a kindness. It's not robbing anyone of the truth. It's being kind.

I had a very clearcut view on all of this until we adopted a little boy. He was 5. He never had enough to eat before he came to us. In order to get enough to eat, he had to steal food when no one was looking and hide it. Was his 'stealing' wrong or was it a survival skill? In his orphanage, some children did starve to death. After he came to us, he hid milk high up on shelves and I'd discover the glasses when they started to smell funny (he'd hide them behind books).

He soon learned there was plenty of food but I don't fault him for stealing. I don't fault him for lying about it when we first confronted him. In the orphanage, if he admitted he lied, he would have been beaten.

So I think the answers to these questions really do depend on the circumstances. I agree that there very few times - in the normal course of normal life (whatever that is) when lying is right. It is too often done out of fear or laziness rather than being honest and direct. But I think every situation is different. We raise our children to be honest and compassionate. I think compassion is key. But that is just my take.

This is a very interesting discussion :)

I think lying is wrong. Do I think I will "go to hell" if I do it? No. If someone asks me a question I assume they want my answer. MY answer. So if they want to know if I like their dress, hairdo or whatever I will answer the truth. I would say, well, that color isn't as flattering as that blue dress you bought last month. Or, I like you better with longer hair. If they are friend, they value my true opinion. If they are my boss, they probably know better than to ask me the question.

Is stealing wrong? Yes. If my child is starving and I have no food, will I steal it if I have no other option. Yes. Do I think I will go to hell for that? No. (don't believe in hell) Do I believe God would send someone to hell for stealing food to feed a child? No.


If I want to know how an outfit looks or a haircut looks I always ask my son, Andy. He tells me if it looks like crap. You got to have at least one person you can trust.

Lying is wrong - period. Even when I am having a surprise birthday party and I don't want that person to know, and I have to come up with a way to keep them from finding out, I will come up with everything I can think of to keep from lying. In the end, I still end up lying. I ask for forgiveness from God, knowing that of course He will forgive me. All of us who have told our children about Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, the Tooth Fairy, etc. have lied to our children. Those things do not exist. They are made up tales that we take delight in telling our children that have become traditions in American culture.

As far as stealing. Stealing is always wrong. We usually will tell the waiter at the restaurant that we will be sharing an entree or sharing a drink (we don't usually share drinks). Most restaurants don't care about sharing the entree - as long as it not a buffet. After all, they have to make their money too.

I try to look at both sides of the situation. And I try to look at things in absolutes, because that's how God looks at things.

I think lying is wrong, but sometimes it's easier than telling the truth.

Lying and stealing are wrong--they are both taking something from someone. I have lied to protect a person's feelings, but it is still lying.

A man told his friend that he do not drink liquor, use cigarrette and no other vices, but would lie. Do you got the catch!
What ever he said as will not do... is a lie. That is the 'value' of lying! So, I would consider it is the foremost of all sins!

Regarding stealing... Stealing of food items by a non-adult is ok for the first time! is my opinion.

Lying is lying - be it a white lie, a fib, or a big ole black lie - I don't even understand what anyone gets out of doing it.
My family, friends, and anyone who knows me knows - 'if you don't want the answer, don't ask the question.' Because if you ask it, I will answer it.
I have resorted to the 'that color is nice for you' when it comes to hair or clothing questions... those aren't any sort of lie. But I probably will go on to qualify my answer if they have honestly asked me. If I ask someone how something looks on me, I want an honest answer - I don't want to go out in public in something that makes my butt look like the broadside of a barn.
Stealing is also wrong. But I guess there are some gray areas when it comes to starvation and such. Sharing a meal at a restaurant is usually ok. Although some places have signs posted that sharers will be charged double.
I find in restaurants that the drinks usually top the cost of the meal, so always opt for water.
Good topic for discussion.

Nit picking. Something chimps do.

interesting topic
I say that no lying and stealing are never right
all though there are times that you have to lie in order to keep a secret or protect a loved one who might of done something wrong. another reason you might lie is because you might have overslept and did not make to somewhere in time so you want to lie to keep the secret hidden
There are many times why you want to lie and that would be okay
but stealling is never right i do not know why the call stealing a base a good thing because that could promote people into doing the wrong thing
i think that just because there is something that you need it dose not mean you need to steal it. you need to save up your money and get the proper consent and buy the item the item you so desperatly wanted.

Giving someone a drinkof a free refill pop would not be stealing. But buying only one drink & getting it refilled when you are both sharing it is obviously stealing.

I think the drink analogy is not stealing because someone is paying for it. Lying on the other hand is not right, and I can't think of an example of a "good lie" off hand.

Sharing a drink or meal, no harm, no foul. As far as lying, that's up to the person and their God. Great topic. Gave you a 10.

Yes, lying is wrong, and no, lying is never right, and there's not such a thing as a little white lie. You may say something that you think is right, and it turns out that it is not true, that's not a lie that's a mistake.

Thank you Sara for all the comments on my articles.

I will lie for certain reasons. To spare feelings. To keep things fun- like Santa or the Tooth Fairy. For surprises. White lies. Otherwise I don't think it is ok to lie.
Stealing is a tough one. I am not sure when sharing crosses the line into stealing. Really, paying $2 for a soda filled to the top with ice feels like stealing on a businesses part.

If you share a drink that you won't drink yourself, I don't see anything wrong with that.
I share with my kids all the time. They are just seven and three. (The youngest will be four the the 22nd of this month)
And, I am of the mind that lying is wrong, in principle.
There are those little white lies, such as "You don't look fat."
And, stealing is wrong, if you are truly stealing.
Like taking things that are not yours.
My boss at work, lets us eat omelets for free. He doesn't mind.
We just aren't allowed to eat a full meal without paying for it.
That would be stealing.
There is just so many gray areas here.

This comment is to let you know that this content has reached at least five votes and over 8.0 average rating, and as such has been removed from Rating Resurrectionists! Congratulations!

This comment is to let you know that this content is no longer a perfect ten, and as such is no longer among Best of the Worst! Better luck next time, and check out this week's Leaderboard to see who's on top!

For some lying becomes a way of life. Not hurtful lies but to boost your own ego. I know someone who lies about such mundane things, but each lie appears to be a way of making her look bigger & better. I don't think she can tell a story straight, as it really happened. Later she tells it with even more exaggeration. It sickens me but I guess it's a habit and she's very, very insecure. I hold my tongue a lot when she tells me or "recalls" about some event or conversation that I was present for and I hear it told so distorted from the truth. She doesn't remember that I was there with her.