This is a response to "xxx" a poem written by Greg Sampson. Click here to read it.
************
What do you see
When you look at me?
No
Wrong Question
What do I see
When your heart is full of hate
What do I feel
As the abhorrence stretches
Catching the Muslim
Burning the black man
Shooting the Christian
Killing the Jew
Torturing the woman
Abusing the child
Poisoning those
Whom you do not understand
Because you fear what is different
The gun barrel is cold
Icy against my skin
The ropes burn against the flesh of my hands
I listen to your voice
As you tell me what I've done wrong
You tell me it is my time
But I have committed no crime
Except to love
To save and to protect
Those who were objects of your hate
No those who ARE objects of it
To tell you to your face
That no one deserves to die
To tell you to your face
That every one you killed tonight
Surely shall rejoice in Paradise
While you will suffer in flames
Your eyes they burn bright
It is with Satan's fire they do so
And trying as you might
Hatred coils outward
Like a venomous snake
You pounce
You hiss and pace
Dark eyes smoldering
Before going out
Turning to ice
Freezing the blood in my veins
Colder than dry ice
Your voice changes
Thunders, rumbling mighty
Deafening in my ears
Whispers curses, threats
I am all-aware
You speak to me, to me
Your intended victim to-night
You pray loud and clear
For all around to hear
"Father God
Strike this one down with Your wrath
Poured out with fire
Upon the one who dared
To question Your holy sovereignty!"
Omein
Leering eyes
Staring, peering
Can't help not caring
Closing in
From within
All around
Comes the sound
Surrounding me
Taunts, jeers, threats
Laughter
As I look into your eyes
Hatred glowing fierce
I ask you
For one last dying request
You hesitate
Nod
I drop to my knees
"God, Lord in Heaven,
Forgive this one
And forgive me
Let this one know Your love"
Enough!
Enough!
It is enough!
You cry
Silence!
You summarize the list
Of my nonexistent crimes
You smile
Exuberance flowing all through you
Hatred, Hatred, Hatred
I feel it pulsing in the air
Beating to the beat of my heart
I stare down the gun barrel,
Black as death
Streaked with rain
Falling continuously
I feel anger welling up inside
But I push it aside
Willing myself
To accept this fate
My death-on account of hate
You seem more confident
Than ever before
You look right into my eyes
I see yours
They are a light brown
With streaks of darker tints
Highlighting your dilated pupil
They are simmering with rage
Overflowing with hate
As I look into your eyes
Your trigger finger moves
I am still
Completely still
And you pull the trigger
There is a blinding flash
And all turns black
The last thing I see
Your eyes...
Weedy, thrushy brown
Softer they might have been
If Hate hadn't crept in
You look at me
Right through me
But you see nothing
Except someone you hate
Someone you've come here to kill
I am not a person
Not anymore
Not to you
I am the object of your hate
I find it within me
The gift of God's grace
And to your abject horror
I offer you a parting smile
As I fall
My blood
Staining the ground
Where I lie
My world goes white
I am free at last
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Comments: 78
Shame there is so much suffering in the world, pity more people can't be peaceful...
awesome and perfect
Thankyou Ylanne greatly to share the raring emotion !!!
I don't think I want to read the poem this is in responce to though...
this is a very powerful one!!!
There are times at which I feel as though I am falling apart, and being torn into a million pieces. The strange thing is that most of this hate I feel is not directed towards me, but is reflected onto me, because I am stabbed right through the soul when any one person or group is attacked, verbally or physically, because of hate. And it happens all the time, every day.
Writing is a way of dealing with things for me. It has become my existence, a way to escape the wayward gale coming for me. I write to make you think, I write to inspire you, I write to open your mind; but most of all, I write as a last ditch attempt to save myself.
Hate is something that I have never experienced to the best of my knowledge. I am a Christian and come from a Christian family and "hate" is not allowed. It is sad that some people do display a hatred and not only that they allow the hatred to cause them to do some very bad things. I especially like the part: "That every one you killed tonight Surely shall rejoice in Paradise While you will suffer in flames".
I must clarify. I do harbor hatred in my heart but it is for Satan and his Demons. I think that is a justified hate.
but I will be back to read all your articles.
He loves all of His children, and He hates it when we do things to each other, such as the Holocaust, and the Palestine-Israeli conflict. He is so saddened, surely, by the hate that is the driving force behind all things. I used to say I hated Satan too, but I feel that it would be hypocritical to hate anyone, even if it is the Evil One. But I cannot love Satan, either. It is a remarkable question that has been posed.
There is a contest that might interest you. It is sponsored by the RAVING DOVE organization, www.ravingdove.org/award This is an online literary journal that embraces peace and human rights. I'm going to submit an article because I also want to do what I can to help banish hatred and anger and promote peace and human rights. God bless you!
I was reminded of this scripture when I read this poem.
I've been spit on because of my religion. I wasn't preaching or anything, just walking down a hall when this person made a derogatory statement about my religion and did this.
Miraculously, I was on a seven-day fast at the time and had been praying a lot. God gave me the strength to forgive and show love.
Later that person became a friend.
I wish this could be the end of every wounded person's story.
This poem you have written speaks to my soul. It is great poetry. But it also reminds me that we must continue to spread love--real love. It is the only thing that can stop hatred.
Barbie
If strong emotions are the basis of hate, then are all strong emotions evil?
Would you kill a thousand to save the child you loved?
Would you kill someone who disagreed with your beloved beliefs?
Would you feed a leper with food taken from another because you love mercy over justice?
Which of these are good? Which are evil?
*****No. We alone control what we feel, think, and do. And we alone can allow our emotions to take the better of us. It is not wrong to feel angry, afraid, sad, miserable, giddy, and exuberant. But how we allow these feelings to direct our actions is of paramount importance because we control our own actions, and none of others. I can allow my anger to overtake me and turn into a murderous act, but I can also simply let it wash over me and flow away.
Would you kill a thousand to save the child you loved?
*****No. If the means is wrong, so too is the end, at least in my own beliefs (yours may differ greatly). I believe that in order to have a complete right action, both the intention, the means, and the end must be right OR the intention and the means must be right. If you intend well and you go about it well, and it comes out wrong, you did the best you could. If you intend well and you go about it well, and it comes out well, well pat on the back to you! If you intend well, and you know the end result will be well, but the way you go about doing it is wrong, then the complete action has been made wrong. So I cannot kill a thousand people in order to save someone I love, even if she/he seems worth more to me than the thousand others because killing is wrong.
Would you kill someone who disagreed with your beloved beliefs?
*****Nope. No way Jose. I respect and love all who disagree with my "beloved" beliefs. Most of my friends (in real life) are totally different cultures, religions, and ethnicities from me, totally different political beliefs and philosophies, but we love each other for who we are, not for what we believe.
Would you feed a leper with food taken from another because you love mercy over justice?
*****Mercy and justice cannot be made superior or inferior to each other. Mercy goes hand in hand with justice. I would not feed a leper with food taken from another, but I would feed him with food from my own plate, or food taken from another with their freely given permission, but first from myself.
Which of these are good? Which are evil?
*****What are "these"???
Example #1: All human life is holy. (an extension of love and religion)
Because of this: contraception is considered evil by many people, abortion is considered a major crime, and populations are allowed to expand to the point of collapse. Eventually millions will die as opposed to thousands. This is through love and religion not hate.
I re-read your poem. It is powerful and thought stimulating. The only problem I have with it is the salvation reward in the end... not because it is wrong, but because it takes the urgency out of solving our problems on earth.
A reward for fidelity does not actually help the situation here on earth. For that we need a more positive down and dirty approach. I'm sorry to say I don't know what that would be and if I did I'm sure someone would kill me before I could finish explaining it to the world.
Powerful poem. Thanks for sharing.
You asked: "If strong emotions are the basis of hate, then are all strong emotions evil?" and then later commented that "strong emotions tend to destroy societies."
I do not think that strong emotions are the problem. I think that the problem is (a) the irrational thinking that gives rise to inappropriate emotions, and (b) acting on emotion without thinking, especially when one's action violates the rights of others..
Emotions are not causeless. They are an instantaneous and subconscious evaluation of things, events, or people as either beneficial or harmful to one's values. These subconscious evaluations result from a person's conscious conclusions about reality. A person feels love (or like), joy, desire, approval, etc., towards something or someone he/she views as beneficial to his/her life and values, and feels hate (or dislike), sadness, fear, anger, etc., towards something he/she views as harmful to his/her life and values. A person's choice of values and disvalues are a result of one's conscious beliefs, which are the ultimate cause of all emotions.
If a person hates another person based on race, national origin, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, this hatred is based on the irrational belief that such characteristics determine the worth of the other person. The problem, therefore, is not the emotion of hatred, it is the irrational belief. If such person were to be persuaded that, in fact, these characteristics tell you nothing about what is important about any given individual (ie that individual's character and abilities), then the hatred would evaporate. Moreover, a person, who believes in the principle that all individuals have the right to their own lives, liberty and pursuit of happiness, and that no one has the right to initiate force against others, would be horrified at the very thought of using the violence described in Ylanne's poem, even against someone he/she hates.
Emotions themselves are not good or evil, since they are instantaneous responses, and therefore non-volitional. They can only be viewed as appropriate or inappropriate. One can properly only judge as good or evil, a person's ideas and choice of values or disvalues (which are volitional and are the ultimate causes of the emotions), and a person's actions (also volitional). If a person experiences an inappropriate emotion, and recognizes that it is in fact inappropriate (an example of an inappropriate emotion might be experiencing sadness upon learning of a friend's good fortune, perhaps because of envy), then the proper response would be not to act on the emotion, but rather to use introspection to determine (and, if necessary, correct) the evaluations and beliefs that caused the emotion.
Negative emotions are not necessarily inappropriate. For example, there are situations when hatred is a more appropriate response than love. It is appropriate to feel hatred (or at least, strong dislike), anger, disapproval, when listening to the rantings of a white supremacist. However, that does not justify violence (or even censorship) against the white supremacist, as long as he/she is merely expressing a viewpoint (however offensive) and not engaging in, or inciting, violence against other people. This answers one of your other questions: No one has the right to harm even one hair of a person (let alone kill him/her) because of his/her opinions.
Even when an emotion is appropriate, the person's actions in response to that emotion still can be wrong. That is why it is so important to think before acting and not to act on one's emotions. For example, it is appropriate to be enraged at an unjust law. It is wrong, however, to engage in indiscriminate violence based on anger at that law. By thinking rationally before acting, a person, who is angry at an unjust law, might develop a peaceful and effective strategy for getting the law repealed eg by writing to elected representatives and newspapers, engaging in peaceful demonstrations, filing lawsuits challenging the law, making speeches, etc. For a person taking the latter, rational approach, his/her strong anger can be the motivation that keeps him/her going in the difficult struggle to accomplish his/her goal, and therefore an asset. A person who did not feel particularly strongly, might give up in the same circumstances. So strong emotions can be beneficial both to the individual feeling the emotion and to society, as long as it is reason, and not the emotion, that is in the driver's seat.
The examples you gave of abortion and contraception are not the result of emotions but of irrational beliefs. Those who wish to ban contraception and abortion (particularly early-term abortion) are influenced not primarily by emotions (and definitely not by love), but by their consciously-held religious beliefs that contraception and abortion are against "God's will."
For these reasons, I do not believe that emotions move societies. I do believe that ideas (good and bad) move societies, and that it is the predominant ideas that are accepted by a particular society (ie by the majority of people within that society) that determine whether that society will thrive or self-destruct.
If that is true, it's not that far a leap to understand the thought processes can be bypassed by emotions. eg. - lynch mobs, suicide bombers, and a society deciding in mass to behave in a specific way due to emotions (yes, often supported by rationalizations). Your comment about appropriate emotion is culturally driven by your filter that might well be opposite anothers.
Reasoning is capable of over-riding instinctive reactions but it must be intentionally engaged. Even when it is engaged the culture may filter it in a way you or many others would consider evil. If emotion itself was understood to be socially oppressive perhaps we could develop effective ways to suppress it. After all isn't that the way Prozac, Zoloft, and a multitude of other drugs effect behavior?
On the light side, my hobby is writing movies. One script that's never been well recieved is a story about a government intentionally using drugs to suppress emotions in an attempt to control society.
You wrote: "As I recall from anatomy most emotions are generated in the mid-brain and are filtered through the high-brain (cerebrum)."
I do not think this would invalidate what I said about emotions. Presumably, the midbrain is associated more with the subconscious than conscious thought, in which case it would not be surprising to find emotions generated there, rather than in the high brain. This is consistent with emotions being a "subconscious evaluation of things, events, or people as either beneficial or harmful to one's values." I would argue that the content of one's subconscious is a result of one's conscious thinking, beliefs, values and experiences. Regarding the filtering of the emotions through the high-brain, this seems to have more to do with impulse control than with the initial generation of the emotion.
You wrote: "If that is true, it's not that far a leap to understand the thought processes can be bypassed by emotions. eg. - lynch mobs, suicide bombers, and a society deciding in mass to behave in a specific way due to emotions (yes, often supported by rationalizations)."
Certainly, many people act on their emotions without thinking (which I did address in my earlier comment), but that does not mean that their thinking was not the original cause of the emotion. For someone to join a lynch mob, even on impulse, he/she must have a certain view of reality and certain beliefs. In the case of suicide bombers, who rarely act on impulse, this is even clearer. If you examine the beliefs of suicide bombers, you will see a definite cause and effect relationship between their beliefs and their actions.
You wrote: "Your comment about appropriate emotion is culturally driven by your filter that might well be opposite anothers."
I was not using the word "appropriate" in socially subjective sense. What I mean by "appropriate" is that the emotion be consistent with an objective, rational value. For example, if a woman always falls in love with abusive men, then her emotion of love for such men is inappropriate in the sense that it is inconsistent with her well-being and safety. However, her emotion of love is not causeless. For example, it may be the result of her belief she does not deserve better, or that this is normal (eg if she grew up in an abusive home).
You wrote: "Reasoning is capable of over-riding instinctive reactions but it must be intentionally engaged."
I agree that reasoning requires effort. Emotions are the result of beliefs, but oftentimes those beliefs are just a mishmash of ideas accepted without rational thought from one's parents, teachers, and society in general. It is not surprising that people who derive their beliefs in this way might view their emotions as inexplicable. However, I think that it is possible to analyze such emotions and draw a line back to one or more of the person's beliefs.
You wrote: "If emotion itself was understood to be socially oppressive perhaps we could develop effective ways to suppress it."
Are you saying that government should force people to take drugs that suppress emotions, or that doctors should talk people into taking such drugs? I would oppose both scenarios, and cannot imagine a worse tyranny than one in which the government forcibly turns its citizens into emotionless zombies.
Not only is forcible drugging to suppress emotions a gross violation of individual rights, it is undesirable. Emotions (even negative ones) serve a useful purpose. In my prior comment, I gave an example of anger serving a useful purpose. Negative emotions seem to serve a similar purpose to pain, which is also essential to life. People who are born without the ability to feel pain do not survive very long. I suspect that the same would apply to those unable to experience negative emotions. Moreover, any drug that was able to suppress negative emotions, would also suppress positive emotions, like love, joy, desire. Would you really want to live your life that way? I would not.
You wrote: "After all isn't that the way Prozac, Zoloft, and a multitude of other drugs effect behavior?"
Actually, I think Prozac, Zoloft, and other anti-depressants, just try to correct the chemical imbalances that lead to clinical depression. They do not suppress emotion.
I also meant to comment on your lighter note of "one script that's never been well received is a story about a government intentionally using drugs to suppress emotions in an attempt to control society." I can think of two books that I have read, which had such stories: Aldous Huxley's "Brave New World" and Ira Levin's "This Perfect Day." Both stories did an admirable job of portraying dystopias in which people's emotions and thoughts are thoroughly controlled by the government using drugs and brainwashing.
I still see your point and It may be absolutely correct. I just think some of this is hair splitting. And I do not think love, joy, and desire are necessarily good emotions. These emotions have led to some of the most horrendous crimes ever committed.
Lastly, I would never favor a govenment using drugs to control the general population, I was actually suggesting research that would uncover the vast array of problems generated by 'emotions'. Perhaps understanding this undiscovered connection would lead to a social shift to 'logically' compensate.
I appreciate your comments.
I appreciate your comments too.
You wrote: "I just think some of this is hair splitting" and "I was actually suggesting research that would uncover the vast array of problems generated by 'emotions'. Perhaps understanding this undiscovered connection would lead to a social shift to 'logically' compensate."
I think that we do agree on some issues, but not on others. I think we agree that acting on emotion is a problem and that, as you put it: "reasoning is capable of over-riding instinctive reactions but it must be intentionally engaged." In this area, I agree that it is important for people (starting from childhood) to develop their ability to control their impulses and to engage their reasoning when they experience strong emotions, rather than blindly acting on their emotions. I also agree with you that culture plays a large role in this, partly because most people accept the dominant ideas and beliefs of their culture, and partly because some cultures encourage people to use reason while others encourage acting on emotion (unfortunately, nowadays, most or all do the latter).
I do not know whether or not we agree on the original causes of emotions, because I am not clear on what your view is on this. Our main disagreement appears to be on whether or not the strength of one's emotions, in and of itself, is a problem. I do not see emotions as a problem. In fact, I think that emotions serve an essential function, similar to that of pleasure and pain (except on a psychological, as opposed to physical, level), and that it would be harmful (both to the individual involved and to society) to try to suppress emotions. Moreover, positive emotions are a rational person's means for enjoying life, and there is research showing that such emotions increase health and life expectancy.
The problems that you view as generated by emotions, I would blame not on emotions, but on the bad/irrational ideas, beliefs, values that are the original causes of those emotions.
You wrote: "I would disagree about the drugs mentioned. I believe research has shown they do suppress emotions. The literature is just clever marketing."
You might be right about this. In retrospect, I realize that I do not have enough evidence to assert, as I did, that these drugs do not suppress emotions. I based my comment on (1) the way the drugs are supposed to work, and (2) the experiences of several friends and family who are taking, or have taken, such medications (which is hardly scientific evidence). Incidentally, at least one person I know, who has been depressed for years and has tried numerous different types of anti-depressants with no success, actually felt more depressed (and more emotional) while taking these drugs.
Color, religion, politics or anything else to me is no reason to either hate or kill another just because they or what they believe is different from what I believe...
:O\
I found myself thinking this was written by a witch being burned at the stake, but then the reference to the gun brings me back to our modern day; which reflects how well you captured the timelessness of hate, bigotry and prejudice.
Thank you for sharing this.
Well done !
Go to my page and read some of my stuff and see how we see the world in a similar fashion. Another fabulous mind-changer ! How great thou art !
For Irridescence, ClickHere
with what you have stated my friend. Thank You
10 4 u
faboulous dicussion and so important.
Thank you
Great poem too.
And Awsome Poetry, too!
Be blessed
I just wanted to say I am finally going through what is now under 6,400 pieces of gather new mail that is in my inbox on here. So with that in mind I have finally come to a piece of mail that was addressed to me in regards this article submission you have created to share with the gather community. Thank you for taking the time and sharing your piece with us here at gather. :o)