THE TORAH, THE BIBLE AND THE QUR'AN

I'm trying to get your analogy. Are you saying that college books have more info that then
Bible or that one of the books is a more advanced version of the other?

As with school texts, which carry the politically correct anthem of social experience, I have found that the information that is not carried in the mainstream holds deeper truths and higher insights... For instance, in the Bible you will find statements like "it is written in the book of Jasher" So I looked until I found the book of Jasher, and it is amazing! The book of Enoch is another one referenced in the Bible, but not in the Bible.

Shelley: The analogy may be summed up in two words - 'progressive revelation'.

Don't: The Book of Enoch is the holy scripture of a religion that preceded Abraham.

Denny: The Koran (Qur'an) certainly was the final word of God UP TO THAT TIME and Muhammad was the 'seal' (last) of the Prophets just as the Koran says. Muhammad ended the 'age of prophecy'. We are now in the 'age of fulfillment'. This does not mean that God does not continue to send Messengers or Teachers periodically throughout history; there have been two since Muhammad each with divinely revealed scriptures of their own. This is a never-ending process. Thank you for your very wise and enlightened views.

Who is Denny? Did someone named Denny delete a comment?

Cary: That must have been the case. Pity!

We CAN give ourselves authority to think for ourselves. Not to do so is to be vulnerable to the wishes of others, to be pressured into the ways of other people, no matter what those wishes are or how sincere they are.

Spiritual thought progresses just like all humans do. It's how we survive, how we progress, how we discover new things about the world around us, how we discover we are more than just our parents' experiences, more than just our ancestors' experiences. We can take life as an adventure; not to do so is to stay in our own cave and die of hunger, hunger of mind and body.

Peace.

Jerome: How very true. Thank you for your insights.

Mary: Never a wiser word was spoken. Thank you.

They found some more books of the Bible. Thomas was one of them. There are very few differences between the book of Thomas and the other books of the new testament. But I would like yo see a copy and read it, instead of them telling me there is little difference.

J R B: You're right. It's best to check things out for yourself. That's called "independent investigation of truth".

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I read fiction books like crazy until I got interested in cars and girls ... or was it girls and cars.

Then I hardly touched a book until I got well into midlife crisis when I read a very few self help books ... then when I lost my son I read quite a few books related to that ... then I quit again for a few years ... but suddenly had a spiritual awakening and studied nonstop for many years in an attempt to better understand what had happened to me. I have read hundreds of books since then until I felt qualified to write my own about it all, which I have done.

Now I spend most of time on Gather attempting to spread the word of my findings, even offering my own book for free download ... I find little time to sit and read as of late due to this ... one thing though, when I quit reading fiction as a kid, I never began again, all I want now is the highest truth ... there is nothing so important. IMnsHO.

PS ... for you folks interested in spiritual and religious history, and things even FAR more esoteric, I highly recommend the Urantia Book ! [other than my own of course :-)]

Various religious traditions throughout history have stated that they have the final word. Anyone who believes they own the final word of God is a fraud and is only trying to use that stand to consolidate power. God is bigger than any one person or any one movement. God is continuously being revealed to us and as we as individuals mature God is revealed to us in more mature ways.

Jerry: Thanks for sharing your life experiences. I admire your desire to seek out the truth.

Gary: I certainly agree with you that God is continually being revealed to us and as we mature God is revealed in more mature ways. That is a profound truth. I would agree that no faith has the final word, rather I would say that each faith has the word up to that time. That is the point of my article.

I think many of us grow in faith or science during this time of self growth. It can be especially disturbing to some, that they start to question truth or the lack there of.

Of course ,there is a great difference in belief (faith) and factual evidence. To those that have blind faith, and an everlasting hope of being saved ,I have great respect for.

I am in the beginning stages of my own journey and at times it takes me to places where people seem intolerant and offended that I would believe different then they.

It seems to go against what is taught in the most popular Holy books. Sorry to ramble on Thomas, but I feel the need to put myself out there. Thanks. PS. I love the


" progressive revelation."

Work on establishing a foundation. Learn logic. Study history - especially Jewish history.

Pepsie: Thank you very much for sharing your views.

Denny L: The Holy Koran does not say that it is the end of religious progression. That is a misconception fostered by self interest of Muslims who want to think that it is. The word in the Koran for the Seal of the Prophets is "Nabi" which means "prophets", those who prophecy. Muhammad was also a "Rasul" or "Spokesman for God". The Koran does not say that Muhammad was the last of the Rasuls. In Surah 5, the Koran says that Muhammad completed his religion, not all religion. In the history of religion, no prophet has been accepted in His own time and only by a relative handful (except for Muhammad). "Cult loyalty" is more powerful and pervasive than loyalty to God and His Word.

Donald: Thank you for this added information.

Thomas,

I understand you analogy all right, but unfortunately, I lack sufficient understanding of two of the books, to give the idea a fair appraisal. What I have seen of the Qur'an, I didn't think was an advancement over what is in the Christian bible. But that is based on a very, very limited sampling.

I got it... This happened to me as well.

James... Your comment prove to me that you read another Quran than Muslims believe in. If you read it, you would know that the Bible is so different than the Quran in the main beliefs.

mary J.,

I stated I've not read the Quran, mary, just excerpts from it. And these were chosen by someone else to make their particular point. Most of my feelings about the Muslim faith is based on the persons who currently are practitioners of that group. That is not a fair evaluation of the book, any more than studying Christians will give you accurate knowledge of the Bible!

Actually, the excerpts I've read would lead me to think that the Quran is a reversion to the old testament. Although, in reality, it matters little what the book says as the lives of the practitioners is the only meaningful result of the book, be it Bible or Quran.

James: All religious texts, whether Bible, Qur'an, Hindu or Buddhist texts, are extremely difficult to grasp by the casual reader. They are filled with spiritual insights that are only open to the pure in heard. Does not the Bible say, "the books of God are sealed up until the time of the end"? I admire your open mindedness toward the Qur'an.

Does the Bible really say that, Thomas? I can assure you that the criteria you stated leaves me out as I'll never make the "pure in heart" category! The whole purpose of the Bible is actually to bring in the errant person and bring them to an understanding of the ways of God. As Mathew states that he is writing so that Theopolis might be converted/convinced.

Where the problems in understanding the Bible hit their peak is in trying to understand the last book of the Bible. Each person who dwells on it comes up with differing interpretations of that book.

There were many of these apocryphal books written but only the one by John made it into the Bible when it was finally assembled. John is very emotional in that book, far more than he is instructional.

You appear to have studied the Qur'an. Does it dictate such customs as the prayer five times a day facing Meca or is this more tradition than dogma? I'm told that, like the Bible, the Qur'an contradicts itself at times and is apocryphal in places. Is that true?

Regardless of the book one follows, if man were to follow them more completely and work with those of other faiths for the common good, the world would be a better place.

Are you also versed in the Buddhist faith? I've always had a soft spot in my heart for this doctrine and its origin.

James: Religious scripture cannot be compared with any textbook on any subject. Religious scripture is addressed to the heart and soul, school texts to the brain. One is intended for spiritual enlightenment, the other for material advancement. A good school text is written to be clearly understandable to the widest possible audience. Scripture is written in such a way as to weed out the "pure in heart" from the strictly materialistic individuals. Each type of literature addresses a different audience. If properly understood no divinely revealed scripture contradicts itself. Both Buddhism and Hinduism are parts of the stream of religious revelation. Each has its place just as each grade in school fills its intended purpose. Your next to last paragraph is a gem of wisdom. I heartily agree.

the comments here are actually better than the post, that is a rare feat, well done

Paul: The post begat the comments.