When I was younger, I had many people tell me that the answer to every one of life's questions could be found somewhere in the Bible. I was also more or less told that everything that I ever needed to know could also be found somewhere within its pages. It was explained to me that God had provided us all with an "All Answer" book that could help us solve any problem or difficulty that we would ever encounter in our lives.
But, as I grew older, more and more I began to encounter situations, circumstances, and various "trials" that nothing in the Bible had a real answer for. I would search the pages of the Bible for a solution to my dilemma, but the closest I could get to a solution or an answer was just general statements about things that did not help me in my specific problem.
I don't know if any of you have ever found youself in the same situation. You desperately needed an answer to something happening in your life, and the Bible just didn't have it. This has happened to me many times. However, one thing I have discovered is, whenever the Bible doesn't have your answer, God still does. Receiving an answer from God isn't always as quick and as easy as just finding it in a book, but in many ways-----it's a lot better.
I guess I wrote this article and asked this question because I was curious. I wondered how many of you have been told the same thing about the Bible in your personal experience. I also wondered how many of you have ever found yourself in the same situation as I have been in. Looking in vain for an answer that the Bible simply did not contain. And, in the end, like me, did you also discover that it is only God who has all the answers??
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Comments: 38
In bible study today it was brought to my attention that we don't ask the Holy Spirit nearly enough for the help we need and that is why Jesus asked God to send the Holy Spirit. So I will start utilizing that route too. I need all the help I can get to be a better person!!
I know exactly what you are talking about. A lot of people use the Bible like an ouija board that way. They just let it flop open to any page and lay their finger on any verse and think that God will miraculously cause them to point to the exact verse they need at that moment. I even used to try that a long, long time ago (until my finger kept landing on verses that began "Woe unto you, depart unto eternal damnation!!" or something along those lines).
Maybe good stories. .. answers. . not so much.
I have found mom to be true to her words.
For posting this :
I know many criticize mankind capacity to figure out solutions, but I cannot criticize all of mankinds supposed weakness, and yet still think that I have somehow praised God.
By all reasoning, it is God that put this brain into us, and so to turn around and complain that mankind is too inept, stupid, weak, etc...is to actually be criticizing the Maker.
Of course not. The bible had all the necessary "answers" or guidance needed for the time in which it was written, but this is a different age with different problems.
Stealing, rape, murder, hatred, bigotry, and all that are just outdated concepts?
Thomas:
Why must people be so stupid as to think that God would only speak to mankind once in history, then be silent for the rest of eternity? That is the absolute height of ignorance. Wake up!
G-d is still talking. You just don't want to stop complaining about how he doesn't speak to you, long enough for you to actually 'hear' Him.
Well, as your token Mormon, I have to say that the Book of Mormon has some of the plain and precious truths that were removed from the Bible in the early days of its existence.
Judaism has NEVER believed that G-d came to earth from another planet, and had sex with human women.
Dubby:
I also believe in other scripture and a prophet on the earth today (who literally talks with Jesus) to answer today's questions that didn't even exist 2000 years ago and to give us guidance in these troubled times. He continues to refocus us and steering the ship, so to speak.
We have something remotely similar in Judaism. In every generation there are at least 36 tzadicks who are fully capable of becoming HaMoshiah when the time is right. They, however, do not talk to dead people. Only the living.
Dubby:
But I also believe strongly in prayer and answers to prayers.
Prayer should mostly be for thanking, not for asking. We do ask for general things (peace on earth, The Messiah, ect.), but not for personal things.
there are plenty of people that say we believe he came to earth from another planet and had sex with Mary. I don't and I don't know of any Mormons who do. the other planet thing is a stretch -- he lives "out there" and who is to say where. It isn't something you think of like spacemen or something.
Well, that's a relief. I never really asked any LDS if this were really true. Most LDS I have met personally (as well as most JWs) have been very polite and respectful, and have never really tried the conversion thing with me. They seem more curious than anything else. In no way do I mean all of them (the vast majority seem to be good people), but Baptists seem to be the ones who are into being annoying.
Dubby:
We don't talk to dead people. And prayer is mostly for thanking. So we agree there as well. We do ask for healing of the sick, knowledge that what we are doing is right, and strength to endure. Prayer for guidance is is really what we are talking about in this article.
We do the prayer for the sick (and injured) as well.
Duby:
How does the Torah compare with the Old Testament?
The Torah is the first five books (sometimes known as the books of Moses). Sometimes the Tanach (Torah, the prophets, and the writings) is called the Torah. There is the Mishnah Torah for studying the books of Moses, and the Oral Torah, which explains those things which are not explained in the Tanach. They are usually in Hebrew, not English, but you can find translations... but everything loses something in the translation. For example, find the pun:
Gen.4: 1. Now the man knew his wife Eve, and she conceived and bore Cain, and she said, "I have acquired a man with the Lord."
As long as Mormons continue to answer this question by saying that Christ is the Spirit-brother of Lucifer...
Lucifer is Latin for the planet Venus, correctly translated as 'light bringer' or 'bringer of light'. It is also known as the 'morning star'. In the Greek testament of Revelations, JC is called 'light bringer' or 'Lucifer'. The is also a reference in Luke, I think, that compares him to the serpent on Mose's staff, which may be a reference to the serpent in the Garden of Eden.
Adam:
(Isaiah 53:3-5)
Kirk, who is this talking about?
That can best be answered:
52:15. So shall he cast down many nations; kings shall shut their mouths because of him, for, what had not been told them they saw, and [at] what they had not heard they gazed.
53: 1. Who would have believed our report, and to whom was the arm of the Lord revealed?
2. And he came up like a sapling before it, and like a root from dry ground, he had neither form nor comeliness; and we saw him that he had no appearance. Now shall we desire him?
3. Despised and rejected by men, a man of pains and accustomed to illness, and as one who hides his face from us, despised and we held him of no account.
It's quite obvious what this is referring to. The servant is Israel (the servant is ALWAYS Israel), and this is from the point of view of the kings, nations of the world, looking at what they have done to the Jews.
Are the books of the Torah the same as the first books of the Bible?
The first five yes.
Dubby:
Have you ever compared the wordage?
I have on several versions, but no translation comes close to the original. The absolute worse translation I have seen is the king james version.
Dubby:
Are there books in the Mishnah Torah that don't appear in the Bible?
No, but they are divided into 'parshas', which are daily and weekly readings.
Dubby:
Maye I need to go get one and compare
I would recommend the Stone Edition Tanach. I think it has the best English translation, and has plenty of footnotes to explain the more obscure meanings. There is also an online translation that is pretty good as well, and contains Rashi's explanations for most of the Tanach:
http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/63255/jewish/The-Bible-with-Rashi.htm
Why does it say, "Despised and rejected by men, a MAN of pains and accustomed to illness, and as one who hides his face from us, despised and we held him of no account."
Isaiah usually called Israel in the singular, as to separate us from the other nations (for you shall be a nation apart).
Adam:
Who is the "man?"
We Jews is the man! :-)
Although Isaiah originally wrote this about king Uzziah, it is still prophetic about how the Jews would be treated. One can easily see the holocaust in it, but if one looks at current events from Israel, one can see those words applying today as well. Anything the Jews do to defend themselves is wrong, whatever the 'Palestinians' do to murder Jews is fine.
Of course this is all leading to the fulfillment of the prophecies of Zechariah that so many would be Messiahs tried, but failed. Only now do we understand how those enemies of Israel can have their own weapons turn against them, and do such devastating damage.
I'm just curious: did you come to those conclusions on your own exegetical studies, or was it more of a theological upbringing?
Actually, it started with my wanting to be a better Christian, so I started studying Hebrew. The more I learned, the more I realized that almost everything I had been taught as a Christian was wrong, and that the 'old testament' verses had to be mistranslated and/or taken out of context to to make JC fit in there. The more I studied, the further from Christianity I went, and the closer to G-d I got. I became (you would say converted) Jewish, and I have never been more content and happy in my life.
As far as this part of Isaiah goes, it's just simple Jewish history. Also, what your translation has as "accustomed to illness" is "'v'yada choly", and is sometimes translated as "know illness". Yada does mean 'know', but not in the understanding way, but in the sexual way. In this context, it means 'to be infected'; 'something inside'.
The word "choly" means a disfiguring skin disease, and usually means leprosy.
I have read nothing that said JC was infected with leprosy... have you?
Kirk, I wish there were some way you could tell me so much more about this experience in your life. When I read these words you wrote, it affected me more deeply and more profoundly than anything I have read here at Gather in a long time. I hope some day, when you feel the time is right, you will tell your story.
In some ways, I envy you. For you have found your truth, while I still continue to search for mine.................
God speaks to me through the Bible.
"God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life" ~1 John 5:11-12~
You can accept Christ or reject him...it's wholly up to you. See, if you will...John 10:1-18.
Have blessed Good Friday:
Speaking of JC, how were these OT passages mistranslated in your view:
"Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel." (Isaiah 7:14)
Kirk:
Ah, you start with a perfect example, and one that even modern Christian translations have corrected. The word that was translated virgin (almah) means 'young woman, maid, woman of marrying age'... not a woman who has never had sex. That would be 'bethulah'. In every other place in the christian translations, the word almah has been correctly translated except here. The word following that is 'hareh', which means pregnant, in the present tense. IOW, she was already pregnant. Reading the whole chapter, in order for this to apply to JC, king Ahaz and Isaiah would have to had personally known Mary, and JC would have been over 500 years old when he started his 'ministry'. Oh, and if you read the next chapter, Mary would have had to have been married to Isaiah, not Joseph.
Adam:
"I will be his father, and he shall be my son." (1 Chronicles 17:13)
Kirk:
Misleading. A much better translation would be:
13. I shall be to him as a father, and he will be to Me as a son, and I shall not remove My loving-kindness from him as I removed [it] from he who was before you.
Read in context, it's easy to see that G-d is telling David that He will watch over his descendants, and his line shall not be cut off like Saul's was.
Adam:
"He shall cry unto me, Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation. Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth." (Psalm 89:26,27)
Kirk:
"...a firstborn.... Highest of the kings...." This refers to kind David and his descendants.
Adam:
"I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee." (Psalm 2:7)
Kirk:
7. I will tell of the decree; The Lord said to me, "You are My son; this day have I begotten you.
"I will tell of the decree" Said David, "This is an established decree, and [one] that I have received to tell this and to make known."
"The Lord said to me" through Nathan, Gad, and Samuel.
"You are My son" The head over Israel, who are called "My firstborn son." And they will endure through you, as is stated concerning Abner (II Sam. 3:18): "for God said, etc., 'By the hand of My bondsman David shall I deliver… Israel.'" And for their sake, you are before Me as a son because they are all dependent upon you.
"this day have I" for I have enthroned you over them.
"begotten you" to be called My son and to be beloved to Me as a son for their sake, as it is stated (II Sam. 7:14) concerning Solomon: "I will be to him a father, and he shall be to Me a son." We find further concerning David (Ps. 89:27) "He shall call Me, 'You are my Father, my God, and the Rock of my salvation.'"
Adam:
(My view here is that Messiah would be a descendant of David but not of a Jewish father. As the New Testament later tells us, he had a virgin mother but no human father.)
Kirk:
Krishna, Attis, Mythras, Ossiris, Hecules, and many other pagan gods/demi-gods had virgin mothers, and no human fathers. Go not in the ways of the gentiles, for there is no salvation in their customs.
Adam:
"Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us." (Matthew 1:22.23)
Kirk:
JC was never once called Emmanuel. This was an attempt by someone who didn't understand Hebrew, and used the Greek translation instead, to force JC into prophecy. Learn the truth, and the truth shall set you free.
Adam:
"Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh." (Romans 1:3)
Kirk:
That kind of shoots the virgin myth in the foot, doesn't it? "According to the flesh" means that both his parents were quite human... after all, G-d is not flesh and blood.
Adam:
Surprisingly, the very first promise of the virgin birth (Genesis 3:15) calls the promised Deliverer: "the seed of the woman", not the seed of the man. It was God, not man, who would provide the Redeemer: nevertheless, he would be born of a woman:
Kirk:
You sure take the human fear of reptiles to strange heights.
Adam:
Whom who? I believe it is JC. What do you think?
Kirk:
I think you had to use mistranslations and out of context verses to come to your conclusions.
Kirk, I wish there were some way you could tell me so much more about this experience in your life. When I read these words you wrote, it affected me more deeply and more profoundly than anything I have read here at Gather in a long time. I hope some day, when you feel the time is right, you will tell your story.
Kirk:
I never found it to be very interesting, but I do not mind relating it... if most people here would not mind being bored to tears.
BERF:
In some ways, I envy you. For you have found your truth, while I still continue to search for mine.................
Kirk:
Searching and learning is the only way to knowledge. But even when you find it, you still have to keep searching, it's a never ending quest. The hard part is losing all your preconceptions.
Why is it that when people turn from Christianity we always hear them say they now feel "contented", "freedom", and "spiritually uplifted"? Providing these people have hearts, if not being a Christian frees them from what they consider is an unGodly religion then shouldn't they feel even the slightest bit of concern over the fact that there are still so many Christians in the world?
Kirk:
Those things were given by G-d for the gentile non-believers like you:
Deut 4:15. And you shall watch yourselves very well, for you did not see any image on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb from the midst of the fire.
16. Lest you become corrupt and make for yourselves a graven image, the representation of any form, the likeness of male or female,
17. the likeness of any beast that is on the earth, the likeness of any winged bird that flies in the heaven,
18. the likeness of anything that crawls on the ground, the likeness of any fish that is in the waters, beneath the earth.
19. And lest you lift up your eyes to heaven, and see the sun, and the moon, and the stars, all the host of heaven, which the Lord your God assigned to all peoples under the entire heaven, and be drawn away to prostrate yourselves before them and worship them.
Teresa:
Or is it possible that this newfound "contentment", "freedom" and "spiritual uplift" is due to the fact that Satan no longer has a need to do spiritual battles with them that are necessary to win their souls?
Kirk:
You god satan is a false god, and is biblically and scripturally nonexistent. HaSatan is just an angel of G-d. If he was so evil, and rebelled against G-d like your man-made myth says, why are G-d and him so buddy-buddy in the book of Job? Why did he make Baalam's donkey talk, and why did he talk Baalam into not cursing Israel?
Isaiah 45:5. I am the Lord, and there is no other; besides Me there is no God: I will strengthen you although you have not known Me.
6. In order that they know from the shining of the sun and from the west that there is no one besides Me; I am the Lord and there is no other.
7. Who forms light and creates darkness, Who makes peace and creates evil; I am the Lord, Who makes all these.
Your satan only has the power you give him.
(Is. 9:6-7)
Kirk:
The Hebrew gives all those praises as G-d, with the exception of Prince of peace, which is given to Ahaz's son.
Adam:
I appreciate your consistent Jewish interpretation of the verses I previously listed….but in order to remain open-minded, I would urge you to re-consider your Christian roots and try to put aside the negative personal experiences I'm sure you have had.
Kirk:
I could never go back, I know too much. Christianity is fine for Christians, just like Islam is fine for Muslims, and Hinduism is fine for Hindus. I had no negative experiences in Christianity, if you don't count a few individuals. I was even what was termed a "Jesus Freak" back in the late 60's early 70s. My desire to open the eyes of 'lost' Jews opened my eyes. Besides, I would have to 'give up' way too much:
1) I would have to deny the Unity of God, and support a Trinity of Persons, which is Idolatry, (see Deuteronomy 4:16,) and take the name of a man (a "male") as a God, into my mouth.
2d) I would have to deny the Seventh Day Sabbath, which is the Seventh "Spirit of God," or the Seventh Spirit of his Existence, which is Rest, and keep the ROMAN SUNDAY.
3). I would have to deny C i r c u m c i s i o n, which is a positive command of God, never to be abrogated or gainsaid by any inferior testimony: Excision is the penalty. See Genesis. 17:10, 13, and 14.
4). I would have to deny and cease to keep the Four Annual Feasts, which were to be "kept forever throughout their generations."
5). I would have to deny the whole Law (God exists morally or Spiritually, and the strength of his Existence depends alone upon the Law of his Constitution.) of God, as being "Abrogated," "dead," and "Married to another," (see Romans 7:4,) and "Finished," and not merely succeeded, but superseded by a Gospel (so called,) and thus destroy all that preserves the existence (Man exists physically, and the strength of his Existence depends alone upon the Laws of his Constitution.) of the moral character of God, or his Attributes, which is the same thing. And who cannot see, if we destroy the Law, the Gospel (so called) has no foundation whatever?
6)."I would have to lose sight and deny the Supremacy and Pre-Eminence of Israel as a Nation, and "Kingdom of Priests," (Exodus 19:6,) over the whole world, also Esau's selling his "Birthright" to Jacob, which included also his "Blessing," of being "Lord over him" and the whole visible creation. Genesis 27:29.
7). I would have to deny God's positive command, "That Israel shall dwell alone," (Deuteronomy 33:28, and Numbers 23:9,) "and not be reckoned among the nations;" and by mingling myself amongst the Gentiles, lose my own Identity, and if I had any more children, they must be neither Jew nor Ashdod. Nehemiah 13:24.
8). I would have to deny any difference between "Clean and Unclean," "Sacred and Profane," which God positively commands in his Law. See Leviticus 11.
9). I would have to use "Blood," "Things Strangled" and "Offered to Idols," even to Three (Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.) DISTINCT PERSONALITIES, which is Spiritual "Fornication and Idolatry," (see Deuteronomy 4:16,) and whenever I eat anything blessed in any other name than the "name of the only one God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob," I would be sacrificing unto a "Strange God;" besides I would have to deny and destroy, as far as I can go, the design God has in keeping the distinctness and Identity of His People upon whom alone "he has named" and placed His Great Incommunicable and Ineffable NAME, as the alone medium of Blessing the whole world.
No one ever said it would be easy. But the choice to follow Christ supersedes the legalism involved with keeping the law.
Kirk:
Not if you believe Jesus:
Matthew 23:2 "The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat.
3 So you must obey them and do everything they tell you.
Matthew 5:18 I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
19 Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Jesus said to follow the Law, and to obey the teachers of the Law (rabbis and Orthodox Jews) and was more than critical of those who disobeyed it. Saul/Paul is the idolator who falsely preached a god that our fathers did not know, and this is what G-d says about Paul/Saul:
Deuteronomy 13:1. Everything I command you that you shall be careful to do it. You shall neither add to it, nor subtract from it.
2. If there will arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of a dream, and he gives you a sign or a wonder,
3. and the sign or the wonder of which he spoke to you happens, [and he] says, "Let us go after other gods which you have not known, and let us worship them,"
4. you shall not heed the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of a dream; for the Lord, your God, is testing you, to know whether you really love the Lord, your God, with all your heart and with all your soul.
5. You shall follow the Lord, your God, fear Him, keep His commandments, heed His voice, worship Him, and cleave to Him.
6. And that prophet, or that dreamer of a dream shall be put to death; because he spoke falsehood about the Lord, your God Who brought you out of the land of Egypt, and Who redeemed you from the house of bondage, to lead you astray from the way in which the Lord, your God, commanded you to go; so shall you clear away the evil from your midst.
And whoever it was who wrote Revelations, saw what Paul/Saul was doing, and wrote about it in Revelations 17; the introduction of Mythralism (a Babylonian mystery religion) into Judaism, but removing the Mythras name, and replacing it with Jesus. So the resurected man-god myth moves from Babylon, to the seven hills of Rome, and corrupts the teachings and message from Jesus. Those that broke away from that 'church' unwittingly kept the pagan aspects, and therefore unknowingly worshipping the same whore, and drnking from the same cup of blood.
JC's disciples kept the Law, Paul said to break it.
G-d said the Law was not too difficult, nor was it out of reach. Paul called it a curse.
G-d and JC said the Law was forever. Paul said it was made obsolete.
So, who are you going to believe, G-d, or Paul? But wait! Before you decide: Paul said that to the Jew, he became a Jew, and to the Gentile, he became a Gentile. This means he was willing to be deceptive. He also said that if his lie brought people to 'the christ', how could that be a sin? This means he was willing to lie to get people to follow his beliefs... and those beliefs was very different from JC's beliefs. JC was nothing but an ordinary man.
That has GOT to be the longest comment anyone has EVER left on one of my articles.............
I think he was going for an information overload to discourage a response... But G-d and I are not easily discouraged. I copied and pasted it so I can respond a little later.
If JC were just an ordinary man, why is it that the wind and waves obeyed Him?
Kirk:
Jesus calming the sea sounds so much like the story of Jonah. Did Matthew plagiarize some Hebrew Scripture? Sure appears so.
Matthew 8 (KJV)
23 And when he was entered into a ship, his disciples followed him.
24 And, behold, there arose a great tempest in the sea, insomuch that the ship was covered with the waves: but he was asleep.
Jonah 1 (KJV)
4 But the LORD sent out a great wind into the sea, and there was a mighty tempest in the sea, so that the ship was like to be broken.
5 Then the mariners were afraid, and cried every man unto his god, and cast forth the wares that were in the ship into the sea, to lighten it of them. But Jonah was gone down into the sides of the ship; and he lay, and was fast asleep.
Matthew 8 (KJV)
25 And his disciples came to him, and awoke him, saying, Lord, save us: we perish.
Jonah 1 (KJV)
6 So the shipmaster came to him, and said unto him, What meanest thou, O sleeper? arise, call upon thy God, if so be that God will think upon us, that we perish not.
Then both stories tell how the waters became calm. Jonah, by being cast into it and Matthew altering it saying it only took the words of Jesus to calm it, making it to appear of the super powers Jesus had over nature.
Jonah 1 (KJV)
11 Then said they unto him, What shall we do unto thee, that the sea may be calm unto us? for the sea wrought, and was tempestuous.
12 And he said unto them, Take me up, and cast me forth into the sea; so shall the sea be calm unto you: for I know that for my sake this great tempest is upon you.
15 So they look up Jonah, and cast him forth into the sea: and the sea ceased from her raging.
Matthew 8 (KJV)
26 And he saith unto them, Why are ye fearful, O ye of little faith? Then he arose, and rebuked the winds and the sea; and there was a great calm.
27 But the men marvelled, saying, What manner of man is this, that even the winds and the sea obey him!
Do you think it is possible that Matthew had the story of Jonah in mind when he made yet another claim of Jesus's power of nature?
Reminds me like Matthew's story of Jesus walking on water by simply misinterpreting (in his favor) the Greek word of "epi", which as a couple of meanings, like walking on, or walking besides.
Adam:
Why is it that He performed countless miracles in front of eyewitnesses including turning water into wine, healing the sick, walking on water, feeding the 5000, etc.
Kirk:
G-d says not to believe anyone who does these kind of things. It is a test to see if we will stray from Him (Deut. 13)
Adam:
How is it that the crucifixion, death, and subsequent resurrection of Jesus are the single best attested, most historically reliable manuscripts in antiquity?
Kirk:
Are they, now? Then why are they all different?
Adam:
Let's take a closer look at the passages you mentioned….
"Not if you believe Jesus: Matthew 23:2 "The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. 3 So you must obey them and do everything they tell you.">
You need to look no further than the next sentence to get the context…
"But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach." (the rest of Matthew 23:3)
Christ is warning His disciples to be weary of the hypocritical Pharisees because they do not practice what they preach….he is not informing them to disregard His teaching and continue in the futile attempt to follow the law until they die.
Kirk:
So, when Jesus said to do something, he always meant: "Do the opposite of what I say"? I think he was repeating what G-d said in Deuteronomy 17:
9 Go to the priests, who are Levites, and to the judge who is in office at that time. Inquire of them and they will give you the verdict.
10 You must act according to the decisions they give you at the place the LORD will choose. Be careful to do everything they direct you to do.
11 Act according to the law they teach you and the decisions they give you. Do not turn aside from what they tell you, to the right or to the left.
Adam:
Thus, your continuation of the Deuternomony passages and mention of Christ's sermon on the Mount do not make the point.
Kirk:
Can't come up with a good argument to contradict what G-d clearly says, so ignore it. Figures.
JC's 'sermon on the mount' was 'created' by altering wise sayings found in the Hebrew Bible (Tanach) or taught by contemporary Rabbis. Fortunately, the latter were later recorded in the Talmud, in their original form:
The "Original Passage" from the Tanakh or Talmud is listed first, followed by the plagiarized text.
Proverbs 29:23 || …he who is lowly in spirit shall obtain honor.
Matthew 5:3 || Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom.
Psalms 147:3 || He heals the brokenhearted, and binds up their wounds.
Matthew 5:4 || Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted.
Psalms 37:11 || The meek shall inherit the earth, and delight themselves in the abundance of peace.
Matthew 5:5 || Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.
Psalms 5:13 || You do bless the righteous, O L-rd; You do encompass him with favor as with a shield.
Matthew 5:6 || Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied.
Talmud, Shabbath 151b || Rabbi Gamliel said: "Whoever has mercy upon creatures will be granted mercy from heaven…"
Matthew 5:7 || Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy.
Psalms 24:3--4 || Who shall ascend the mount of the L-rd, and who shall stand in His holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart…
Matthew 5:8 || Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see G-d.
Psalms 34:15 || …seek peace and pursue it.
Matthew 5:9 || Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of G-d.
Talmud, Baba Kamma 93a || Rabbi Abbahu said: "A man should always try to be among the persecuted rather than the persecutors…"
Matthew 5:10--11 || Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when men revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account.
Talmud, Aboth 5:14 || …hard to anger and easily reconciled is a kindly man.
Matthew 5:24 || …leave your gift there before the altar and go; first be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift.
Talmud, Kallah, Chapter 1 || He who regards a woman with an impure intention is as if he had already had relations with her.
Matthew 5:28 || But I say to you that every one who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
Talmud, Gittin 90a || The school of Shammai said: "A man should not divorce his wife unless he finds her guilty of an unseemly thing."
Matthew 5:32 || But I say to you that every one who divorces his wife, except on the ground of unchastity, makes her an adulteress…
Talmud, Baba Mezia 49 || Rabbi Judah said: "…your 'yes' shall be true, and your 'no' shall be true."
Matthew 5:37 || Let what you say be simply "Yes" or "No"…
Lamentations 3:30 || Let him offer his cheek to him who smites him….
Matthew 5:39 || …but if anyone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also….
Psalms 37:21 || …the righteous deals graciously and gives.
Psalms 37:26 || All day he deals graciously and lends…
Matthew 5:42 || Give to him who begs from you, and do not refuse him who would borrow from you.
Proverbs 25:21 || If your enemy is hungry, give him bread to eat, and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink….
Matthew 5:44 || But I say to you: "Love your enemies, and pray for those who persecute you...."
Ecclesiastes 9:2 || All things come alike to all; there is one event for the righteous and for the wicked…
Matthew 5:45 || …so that you may be sons of your Father Who is in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust.
Talmud, Shabbath 133b || Abba Saul said: "Be like Him…just as He is gracious and compassionate, so you be gracious and compassionate."
Matthew 5:48 || You, therefore, must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
Talmud, Baba Bathra 9b || Rabbi Eleazar said: "A man who gives charity in secret is greater…"
Matthew 6:3--4 || But when you give charity, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your charity may be in secret…
Talmud, Berakoth 61a || Rabbi Huna said in the name of Rabbi Meir: "A man's words should always be few in addressing G-d…"
Matthew 6:7 || And in praying do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do; for they think that they will be heard for their many words.
Talmud, Rosh Hashanah 17a || Whose sin does He forgive? Him who forgives transgression….
Matthew 6:14--15 || For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father also will forgive you; but if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
Talmud, Baba Bathra 11a || After King Monbas' family rebuked him for giving away all the family's treasures, he answered: "My ancestors stored treasures here below, and I store treasures in heaven...My ancestors stored treasures in a place that could be reached by human hands, but I have stored [them] in a place that can be reached by no human hand..."
Matthew 6:19--20 || Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust consume and where thieves break in and steal, but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust consumes and where thieves do not break in and steal.
Proverbs 30:8--9 || ...give me neither poverty nor riches....Lest I become full and deny You, and say: "Who is the L--rd?"...
Matthew 6:24 || No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve G-d and mammon [riches].
Psalms 147:9 || He gives to the beast his food, and to the young ravens that cry.
Matthew 6:26 || Look at the birds of the air; they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them...
Psalms 37:4 || Delight yourself in the L-rd, and He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Matthew 6:33 || But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things shall be yours as well.
Talmud, Sotah 48b || Rabbi Eliezer said: "He who has only a morsel of bread in his basket, and asks: 'What shall I eat tomorrow?' is a man of little faith."
Matthew 6:34 || Therefore, do not be anxious about tomorrow, for tomorrow will be anxious for itself....
Talmud, Berakoth 9b || Moses said to G-d: "L-rd of the universe, sufficient is the evil in its time!"
Matthew 6:34 || ...let the day's own trouble be sufficient for the day.
Talmud, Shabbath 127b || Our Rabbis taught: "He who judges his neighbor favorably is himself judged favorably."
Talmud, Sotah 8b || Rabbi Meir said: "The way one measures others will be meted out for him."
Matthew 7:1--2 || Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get.
Talmud, Arakin 16b || Rabbi Tarfon said: "...for if one says to him: 'Remove the speck from between your eyes,' he would answer: 'Remove the beam from between your eyes!' "
Matthew 7:3--5 || Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the beam that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother: "Let me take the speck out of your eye," when there is the beam in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the beam out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.
Proverbs 23:9 || Do not speak in the ears of a fool, for he will despise the wisdom of your words.
Matthew 7:6 || Do not give dogs what is holy; and do not throw your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under foot and turn to attack you.
Jeremiah 29:13 || You shall seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart.
Matthew 7:7 || Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
Talmud, Shabbath 31a || Rabbi Hillel said: "What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the whole Law; the rest is its commentary. Go and learn it!"
Matthew 7:12 || So whatever you wish that men would do to you, do so to them; for this is the law and the prophets.
Psalms 6:9 || Depart from me, all you workers of evil...
Matthew 7:23 || And then I will declare to them: "I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers."
The "pious fraud" and "plagiarism" of the authors of the New Testament is clearly evident! Even as the Christian writers, editors and copyists were depicting Rabbis as lowly degenerates, the pearls of wisdom uttered by these very Rabbis were being stolen and attributed to Jesus!
Adam:
Consider these cross references as to the real identity of Christ:
1. Messiah's humanity (Genesis 3:15).
Kirk:
Big deal. Lot's of people don't like snakes.
Adam:
2. Messiah's Jewishness (Genesis 12:1-3; 28:10-15).
Kirk:
I don't know any easy way to tell you this, so I will be blunt. Lots of people are Jewish.
Adam:
3. Messiah's tribe (Genesis 49:10).
Kirk:
That's kind of a "duh!" type listing. Of course, that only mentions HaMoshiah Ben Dovid, and not HaMoshiah Ben Yoseph.
Adam:
4. Messiah's family (2 Samuel 7:16; Jeremiah 23:5-6).
Kirk:
There is no need to point out that HaMoshiah Ben Dovid will be a male decendant of King David. That's another "Duh!" statement. Can't apply to you JC, though. No one really knows who his father was.
Adam:
5. Messiah's birthplace (Micah 5:2).
Kirk:
I think you meant 1. That shows the birthplace of king Dovid. However, verse 2 IS a Messianic Prophecy:
2. Therefore, He shall deliver them until the time a woman in confinement gives birth. And the rest of his brothers shall return upon the children of Israel.
The "woman in confinement" is the land of Israel, " and from here we deduce that the son of David will not come until the wicked kingdom spreads over the entire world for nine months (Yoma 10b, Sanh. 98b)
Adam:
6. Messiah's life, reception, and death (Isaiah 52:13; 53).
Kirk:
That's not about The Messiah, It is about Israel.
Adam:
7. Chronology of Messiah's appearing (Daniel 9:24-26).
Kirk:
24. Seventy weeks [of years] have been decreed upon your people and upon the city of your Sanctuary to terminate the transgression and to end sin, and to expiate iniquity, and to bring eternal righteousness, and to seal up vision and prophet, and to anoint the Holy of Holies.
"Seventy weeks [of years] have been decreed" on Jerusalem from the day of the first destruction in the days of Zedekiah until it will be [destroyed] the second time.
"to terminate the transgression and to end sin" so that Israel should receive their complete retribution in the exile of Titus and his subjugation, in order that their transgressions should terminate, their sins should end, and their iniquities should be expiated, in order to bring upon them eternal righteousness and to anoint upon them (sic) the Holy of Holies: the Ark, the altars, and the holy vessels, which they will bring to them through the king Messiah. The number of seven weeks is four hundred and ninety years. The Babylonian exile was seventy [years] and the Second Temple stood four hundred and twenty [years].
25. And you shall know and understand that from the emergence of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until the anointed king [shall be] seven weeks, and [in] sixty-two weeks it will return and be built street and moat, but in troubled times.
"And you shall know and understand" from the emergence of the word From the emergence of this word, which emerged at the beginning of your supplications to tell you, you shall know to understand [how] to restore and build Jerusalem.
"until the anointed king" Time will be given from the day of the destruction until the coming of Cyrus, king of Persia, about whom the Holy One, blessed be He, said that he would return and build His city, and He called him His anointed and His king, as it says (Isa. 45:1): "So said the Lord to His anointed one, to Cyrus etc." (verse 13): "He shall build My city and free My exiles, etc."
seven weeks Seven complete shemittah cycles they will be in exile before Cyrus comes, and there were yet three more years, but since they did not constitute a complete shemittah cycle, they were not counted. In the one year of Darius, in which Daniel was standing when this vision was said to him, seventy years from the conquest of Jehoiakim terminated. Deduct eighteen years from them, in which the conquest of Jehoiakim preceded the destruction of Jerusalem, leaving fifty-two years. This is what our Rabbis learned (Yoma 54a): "For fifty-two years no one passed through Judea." They are the fifty-two years from the day of the destruction until they returned in the days of Cyrus. Hence, we have seven shemittah cycles and three years.
"and in sixty-two weeks it will return and be built" i.e., the city with its streets.
"and moat" Heb. . They are the moats that they make around the wall to strengthen the city, which are called fosse in French, ditch or moat.
"but in troubled times" But in those times they will be troubled and distressed, for in the subjugation of the kings of Persia and the heathens, they will burden them with harsh bondage. Now although there are sixty-two weeks and four years more that remain from the eighth week, whose beginning, viz. the three years, was included in the fifty-two years of the duration of the exile, those four years were not counted here because here he counted only weeks, and you find that from the beginning he started to count seventy weeks, and at the end, when he delineated their times and their judgments, he counted only sixty-nine, proving that one week was divided, part of it here and part of it there; and he mentioned only whole weeks.
but in troubled times They will be troubled in those times.
26. And after the sixty-two weeks, the anointed one will be cut off, and he will be no more, and the people of the coming monarch will destroy the city and the Sanctuary, and his end will come about by inundation, and until the end of the war, it will be cut off into desolation.
"And after" those weeks.
"the anointed one will be cut off" Agrippa, the king of Judea, who was ruling at the time of the destruction, will be slain.
"and he will be no more" Heb. , and he will not have. The meaning is that he will not be.
"the anointed one" Heb. . This is purely an expression of a prince and a dignitary.
"and the city and the Sanctuary" lit. and the city and the Holy.
"and the people of the coming monarch will destroy" [The monarch who will come] upon them. That is Titus and his armies.
"and his end will come about by inundation" And his end will be damnation and destruction, for He will inundate the power of his kingdom through the Messiah, and until the end of the wars of Gog the city will exist.
"cut off into desolation" a destruction of desolation.
27. And he will strengthen a covenant for the princes for one week, and half the week he will abolish sacrifice and meal- offering, and on high, among abominations, will be the dumb one, and until destruction and extermination befall the dumb one.
"And he will strengthen a covenant for the princes for one week" , for the princes, like "and all the officers of () the king," in the Book of Jeremiah (39:13).
"will strengthen" Titus [will strengthen] a covenant with the princes of Israel.
"for one week" He will promise them the strengthening of a covenant and peace for seven years, but within the seven years, he will abrogate his covenant.
"he will abolish sacrifice and meal-offering" This is what he says in the first vision (8:26): "and in tranquility he will destroy many." Through a covenant of tranquility, he will destroy them.
"and on high", among abominations will be the dumb one This is a pejorative for pagan deities. i.e., on a high place, among abominations and disgusting things, he will place the dumb one, the pagan deity, which is dumb like a silent stone.
"high" Heb. , lit. wing, an expression of height, like the wing of a flying bird.
"and until destruction and extermination befall the dumb one" and the ruling of the abomination will endure until the day that the destruction and extermination decreed upon it [will] befall it, in the days of the king Messiah.
"befall the dumb one" Heb. , reach; and total destruction will descend upon the image of the pagan deity and upon its worshippers.
Adam:
Let us look at these in a little more detail….
Scripture says that the Messiah had to become a human being.
Kirk:
Well, duh! Most human beings have to become human bengs.
Adam:
This circle is obviously a very large circle. The Messiah's humanity is prophetically spoken of in Genesis 3:15, when God is pronouncing judgment against the serpent following the fall of Adam and Eve:
"And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel."
Kirk
You think the Messiah will be afraid of snakes?
Adam:
The word "offspring" refers to descendants.
Kirk:
You mean the word "zerah" means descendants. It also means seeds offspring and sperm.
Adam:
The Messiah would be a descendant of the woman — that is, He would be a human being.
Kirk:
Kayin was the offspring of Eve. Are you saying he was the Messiah?
Adam:
We find this fulfilled in Galatians 4:4-5:
"But when the time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under law, to redeem those under law, that we might receive the full rights of sons."
Kirk:
This is just replacement theology. It has no merit.
Adam:
Scripture says that the Messiah had to be Jewish — that is, He had to be a descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. This narrows the circle considerably. Of all human beings who have ever lived, only Jewish human beings would qualify.
Kirk:
That is what the scripture seem to indicate.
Adam:
How about the Jewish person in Genesis 12:1-3, where God makes a covenant with Abraham (the "father" of the Jews):
"The LORD had said to Abram, "Leave your country, your people and your father's household and go to the land I will show you. I will make you into a great nation and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."
Kirk:
Huh? It's quite clear the 'Jewish person' you are reffering to is Abram (Abraham), however, I think you are mistakng the Jews in general as being singular.
Adam:
Now take a look at Genesis 28:10-15:
"Jacob left Beersheba and set out for Haran. When he reached a certain place, he stopped for the night because the sun had set. Taking one of the stones there, he put it under his head and lay down to sleep. He had a dream in which he saw a stairway resting on the earth, with its top reaching to heaven, and the angels of God were ascending and descending on it. There above it stood the LORD, and he said: "I am the LORD, the God of your father Abraham and the God of Isaac. I will give you and your descendants the land on which you are lying. Your descendants will be like the dust of the earth, and you will spread out to the west and to the east, to the north and to the south. All peoples on earth will be blessed through you and your offspring. I am with you and will watch over you wherever you go, and I will bring you back to this land. I will not leave you until I have done what I have promised you."
These passages indicate that the promised seed (in Genesis 3:15) was to come through the line of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
Kirk:
Yes, the Jewish people. They will be a kingdom of Priests, a light to the nations, they will be known as the keepers of G-d's Law. Through them, the world shall learn morallity and goodness.
Adam:
The circle gets even narrower because the Messiah had to come from the tribe of Judah. This is shown in Genesis 49:10:
"The sceptre will not depart from Judah, nor the ruler's staff from between his feet, until he comes to whom it belongs and the obedience of the nations is his."
Here Jacob is on his deathbed. Before he dies, he affirms that the sceptre (of the ruling Messiah) would be from the tribe of Judah.
Scripture tells us that the Messiah had to be from David's family. This narrows the circle still further. We see this affirmed in 2 Samuel 7:16:
"Your [i.e., David's] house and your kingdom shall endure for ever before me; your throne shall be established for ever."
We also read in Jeremiah 23:5-6:
"The days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will raise up to David a righteous Branch, a King who will reign wisely and do what is just and right in the land. In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the name by which he will be called: The LORD Our Righteousness."
Clearly the ruling Messiah had to come from the family of David.
Kirk:
Who are you trying to convince?
Adam:
Scripture clearly prophesies that the Messiah was to be born in Bethlehem. This narrows the circle of possible candidates for the Messiah tremendously. Micah 5:2 tells us:
"But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times."
Kirk:
All this states is where king Dovid was born... not HaMoshiah.
Adam:
So far we have seen that the Messiah had to become a human being, had to be a Jew, had to be from the tribe of Judah and the family of David, and He must be born in Bethlehem (a small, insignificant city in ancient times). Failure to fulfill any one of these conditions disqualifies a person as a possible candidate.
Kirk:
He must also:
gather the Jewish people from exile and return them to Israel -"And he shall set up a banner for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth." (Isaiah 11:12)
He must rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem - "...and I will set my sanctuary in their midst forever and my tabernacle shall be with them.." (Ezekiel 37:26 - 27)
He will rule at a time of world-wide peace - "...they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore." (Micah 4:3)
He will rule at a time when the Jewish people will observe G-d's commandments - "My servant David shall be king over them; and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall follow My ordinances and be careful to observe My statutes." (Ezekiel 37:24)
He will rule at a time when all people will come to acknowledge and serve one G-d - "And it shall come to pass that from one new moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me, says the L-rd" (Isaiah 66:23)
All of these criteria are best stated in the book of Ezekiel Chapter 37 verses 24-28:
And David my servant shall be king over them; and they shall all have one shepherd. they shall also follow My judgments and observe My statutes, and do them. And they shall dwell in the land that I have given to Yaakov my servant, in which your fathers have dwelt and they shall dwell there, they and their children, and their children's children forever; and my servant David shall be their prince forever. Moreover, I will make a covenant of peace with them, it shall be an everlasting covenant with them, which I will give them; and I will multiply them and I will set my sanctuary in the midst of them forevermore. And my tabernacle shall be with them: and I will be their G-d and they will be my people. Then the nations shall know that I am the L-rd who sanctifies Israel, when My sanctuary will be in the midst of them forevermore.
If an individual fails to fulfill even one of these conditions, then he cannot be "The Messiah." A careful analysis of these criteria shows us that to date, no one has fulfilled every condition.
Adam:
Regarding the Messiah's manner of life, rejection, and death, point the Jewish person to Isaiah 53. Note the following excerpts which I have mentioned before:
"Who has believed our message and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed? He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground. He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not. Surely he took up our infirmities and carried our sorrows, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted." (Isa. 53:1-4).
"He was oppressed and afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; he was led like a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth. By oppression and judgment he was taken away. And who can speak of his descendants? For he was cut off from the land of the living; for the transgression of my people he was stricken. He was assigned a grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death, though he had done no violence, nor was any deceit in his mouth." (Isa. 53:7-9).
Note from these verses that: (1) The Messiah was to be despised and rejected by His fellow Jews. (2) He would be put to death following a judicial proceeding. (3) He would be guiltless. Obviously these facts about the Messiah narrow the circle still further.
Kirk:
None of that has to do with The Messiah. It has to do with the Jews.
Adam:
Let's take a look at Daniel 9:24-26:
Kirk:
I explained this away above.
Adam:
Clearly, this narrows the circle of potential candidates incredibly. Is there anyone who has fulfilled all these conditions? Is there anyone who was a human being, a Jew, from the tribe of Judah and the family of David, born in Bethlehem, was despised and rejected by the Jewish people, died as a result of a judicial proceeding, was guiltless, and came and died before the destruction of the second temple in A.D. 70? Yes there was, and His name was Jesus Christ!
Kirk:
There are literally thousands of Jews who did all that as well. And most of them did not perform magic tricks.
Adam:
To further demonstrate that Jesus fulfilled the messianic prophecies of the Old Testament, note the following facts:
God's ability to foretell future events is one thing that separates Him from all the false gods. Addressing the polytheism of Isaiah's time, God said:
Of course, anyone can make predictions—that is easy. But having them fulfilled is another story altogether. But God was never wrong; all the messianic prophecies in the Old Testament were fulfilled specifically and precisely in the person of Jesus Christ.
Kirk:
As well as many others.
Adam:
Jesus often indicated to listeners that He was the specific fulfillment of messianic prophecy. For example, He made the following comments on different occasions:
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them" (Matt. 5:17).
Kirk:
All Jewish people who follow the Law fulfill them. This is no more proof of someone being HaMoshiah than having a nose on their face.
Adam:
"But this has all taken place that the writings of the prophets might be fulfilled" (Matt. 26:56).
"This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms" (Luke 24:44).
"You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life" (John 5:39-40).
"If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. But since you do not believe what he wrote, how are you going to believe what I say?" (John 5:46-47).
"Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him, and he began by saying to them, 'Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing'" (Luke 4:20-21).
Kirk:
Lots of people made those same claims. Not one of them was The Messiah. But there are ways to tell if a prophet is false:
If the prophet speaks in the name of the Lord and the oracle does not come true, that oracle was not spoken by the Lord – Deut 18:22
What does this mean? It means that if a prophet makes prophecies that do not come true, then they are not one of God's prophets. It doesn't matter how many miracles they do. It doesn't matter how many nice things they say, or how many good teachings they have. It doesn't matter if they feed the starving and heal the sick. The scripture is quite clear, if a prophet speaks in the Name of the Lord, and it does not come true, then the oracle is not from the Lord.
Matt 10:23 – Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the son of man has come.
This is the first false prophecy Jesus makes in Matthew. Speaking to his apostles, he tells them that he will return before they are able to spread the word throughout all of the cities in Israel. Well, the word was spread all throughout Israel, and Jesus still hasn't returned.
Matt 12:39 – An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall be no sign given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas.
Now, who asked him for a sign? The people he was speaking to. So which generation wanted to see the sign? The present generation, of course. And the sign of the prophet Jonas, three days in the belly of the whale, is clarified in the next verse as being his three days in the tomb before the resurrection. Now, Jesus said that this would be a sign for the generation. Yet, the entire generation didn't see it. It was to be a sign unto the Pharisees, yet they didn't see it. Only his followers supposedly saw it. Thus, there was no sign, and it was a false prophecy.
Matt 12:41 – The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it
Now, during the time of Jesus, Nineveh had not existed for almost 600 years. It was a pile of rubble. This prophecy states that the dead shall rise in judgment with this generation. Which generation? The one that Jesus referred to as a 'wicked and adulterous generation that sought a sign'. And who was seeking the sign? The Pharisees. That was the generation he was referring to, that was the generation he was speaking to. Generation has a very special and specific meaning in the original Greek, and cannot possibly refer to a future generation in any tense that could be translated as 'this generation'. False prophecy # 3.
Matt 16:4 "A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall be no sign given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas."
Here Jesus makes the same false prophecy that doesn't come true. He told the Pharisees that his resurrection would be a sign for them. But it wasn't. The Pharisees simply never received that sign. False prophecy # 4.
Matt 16:28 "Verily I say unto you, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the son of man coming in his kingdom"
Now, this is a little bit of a different situation. Jesus was all by himself, with his apostles. He had just gotten done telling them about his upcoming trail, death, and crucifixion. Thus, he is not referring to his resurrection, but his second coming. He also tells them that they shall not see death UNTIL they see the second coming. So, excuses such as 'they have everlasting life' simply don't cut it. Jesus said they would die, after the second coming. Of course, none of this ever happened either. They all died, and Jesus never came back. It is historical fact that early Christians and the apostles all believed Jesus was returning within their lifetimes as well. More on the history of that in the conclusion of the false prophecies in the four gospels. False prophecy #5.
Matt 23:36 "Verily I say unto you, all these things shall come upon this generation"
Here, Jesus is speaking to the Pharisees again. He directs every comment made toward them, and ends with 'these things shall come upon this generation'. There is no possible context where 'this generation' could refer to a future generation. The original Greek simply doesn't allow it, and even in English, there is no context that would allow it in this chapter. These things didn't happen – false prophecy #7
Matt 24:14 "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come"
Now, this poses no problem for some Christians, who simply say "Oh, there are still places where the gospel hasn't been preached yet." But according to Paul in Romans 10:18...
"Verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world."
So we have a problem. According to Paul, the gospel has been preached unto all of the world, and yet Jesus still isn't back yet. (Not to mention that Paul was wrong, and during that time period the gospel wasn't preached unto the ends of the world.) Well, the gospel has been preached in every nation in the world. Yet, the end still hasn't come. If you don't believe that the gospel has been preached in the every nation, then you are probably naïve. Paul actually stated that it had ALREADY been preached all over the entire world in Romans. So I guess Paul lied too. False prophecy #8.
Matt 24:33-35 "So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, this generation shall not pass, until all these things be fulfilled."
Ok, in this situation Jesus is speaking to his apostles again. He tells them that they will see ALL of the things that he mentioned, which include the stars falling out of the sky, and the son of man coming in the clouds. Now, the apostles obviously didn't see all of these things before they passed. Again, the idea that they have 'everlasting life' still doesn't apply, because he says that the generation will not pass until those things are fulfilled. That means that after they are filled, the generation will pass. Thus, no everlasting life. So the everlasting life excuse just isn't going to cut it. Anyway, the apostles didn't see any of it, the generation passed, and we have false prophecy #9.
Matt 26:64 "Hereafter shall ye see the son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven"
In this instance, Jesus is on trail, and speaking to the High Priest. He told the High Priest that he would see all of this. This simply never happened, the High Priest 2000 years ago has been dead a long, long time. False prophecy #10.
With this many false prophecies, its pretty safe to say that Jesus was a false prophet.
Many people look to Jesus' miracles as proof that he was who Christians think he was. However, Deuteronomy 13 tells us that G-d will send false prophets, ones who are able to do miracles, to test Israel. Sounds like Jesus fits this description well...
"If there appears among you a prophet or a dream-diviner and he gives you a sign or a portent, saying, 'Let us follow and worship another god' - whom you have not experienced - even if the sign or portent that he named to you comes true, do not heed the words of that prophet or that dream-diviner. For the Lord your G-d is testing you to see whether you really love the Lord your G-d with all your heart and soul."
Adam:
Today is the Day we celebrate His victory over the grave. He is risen indeed! Hallelujah!!
Kirk:
Since not one of the stories of his so-called resurrection mesh with any of the others, it's a safe bet it never happened.
all i can say is: OMG! lol.