Hi Everyone -
I wanted to update you on our thinking as we try to create the best possible experience for all members on Gather when it comes to openly enjoying the site and sharing your thoughts, images, and content freely.
As Tom mentioned Tuesday in his live chat, Gather is considering several ideas to better enhance our understandings and methods surrounding content protection.
One idea is to create a Member Advisory Panel to help us further research and isolate industry standards and best practices across the worldwide web. We are also considering bringing top experts on internet copyright law to the site for a series of educational discussions.
We are working hard to create a solution that works well for everyone – easier said then done!
The fact of the matter is, we are still in the thinking and planning phase of this project. We hope to get back to you soon with some concrete plans of action.
Thank you in advance for your feedback, support, and patience! We really appreciate it!
Have a great weekend,
Pam
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Comments: 100
I, too, am one who is glad that you have not disabled the right click ability on images. I realize there are many who would like to have had it disabled, and I really feel badly that they've experienced theft of their images. But I also know that disabling the function won't solve the problem for anyone who is determined to steal (from any site), and I have occasional need for this function.
So maybe the optional turn-on would be handy if possible and if going that way?
Look forward to hearing more on the content protection and information!
There's been a lot of talk about Hacking on Gather. Here's a website that explains how hacking works and what to do to protect yourself. Security Reference Guide
My comment isn't intended to further the paranoia, or concerns on Gather. It is meant to help others understand and know what can and cannot be done to protect yourself and your property. If anyone knows more and can add to this, feel free.
The only people in my opinion who should be allowed to use script on their pages is Gather Inc.
Thanks for the information and update, Pam. Good luck with everything!
Content protection is certainly something badly needed, but perhaps we can only make it very hard to copy and absolute protection may be impossible at the moment. But we must always do whatever we can. Even making very hard to copy is some protection. 'Copyscape' or whatever it is, that option can also be provided to make copying harder.
The information you provide above is misleading. There are services available on the internet which provide 'hit counters' for web pages. These view counters are common throughout the blogosphere, and most websites use something similar. I tested the use of these services on Gather and determined that they represent a potential risk to members. I then informed Gather of my findings and, per Tom, this type of technology is now against Gather's Terms of Service and they take action against members that use it. Also, hit and stat counters do not work in the manner you have described and would be virtually useless in protecting images or other content, which is the basis for Gather's initiative and this article.
I already told you that it doesn't matter who is breaking TOS.. if it's happening on Gather, then there should be no reason why I can't talk about it. Who freaking cares that she happens to be talking about Kevin?
You guys are ridiculous. If I came in to agree with someone who was talking about the person who stole images from Sue, would you be all over me saying I'm up that person's arse? If I came in and added my 2 cents about games or mass mails, would you be all over me saying I've got an unhealthy obsession with those???
My god... stop this. You guys are really, really annoying and I'm SO tired of the 3 of you following my every move on Gather. It's sad, actually.
Does this mean that Lisa and Debra have unhealthy obsessions with their heads up Kevin's arse since they both commented about it too?
I'm sure all the members of Gather appreciate the effort made to protect the content posted.
I believe that the moment that you've written and date stamped an article it is copyrighted in the authors name.
The minute anyone copies a part of it without permission they can be sued.
Is it possible for Gather to detect precisely duplicated passages and then tell the author about it.
There are many programs that intstantly tell you if you have duplicates on your hard disk. Surely Gather can do the same on the Gather network? Pleaaaase.
The information you provide above is misleading. There are services available on the internet which provide 'hit counters' for web pages. These view counters are common throughout the blogosphere, and most websites use something similar. I tested the use of these services on Gather and determined that they represent a potential risk to members. I then informed Gather of my findings and, per Tom, this type of technology is now against Gather's Terms of Service and they take action against members that use it. Also, hit and stat counters do not work in the manner you have described and would be virtually useless in protecting images or other content, which is the basis for Gather's initiative and this article.
Kevin (sitewizard.gather.com) V., Mar 15, 2008, 10:03am EDT
Kevin, my info on embedded script was in no way meant to be a jab at YOU personally. I was not suggesting that you have done anything wrong.. and gave a link to hit counters, pointing out that they DO give out IP addies.. which can lead to others using malicious scripts.. I provided links to this information. I did not intend for anyone to make accusations that you would do any of this. For the reasons I stated, that once scripts are allowed to be embedded on any member's page.. anything goes, malicious or not. Thank you for clarifying that scripts are no longer allowed.. I did not know this.
I have believed that everything I write here is date-stamped with when it is posted. If someone used what I wrote, when they went to officially copyright it, it would also be stamped. If a question came up about who said it first, it could be traced back to me.
On the other hand, Gather is a very public place. Consequently, one could argue that when you write here, you have become a public person. Rules regarding language used by public persons are different, right?
It is also interesting to speculate how anyone would enforce copyright laws even if the date-stamp proved you produced content first?
1. An agreement ought to exist between gather and each member which states gather won't re-license content with the authors approval and that the author can publish to other sites for their content (or something close to that) and
2. That Gather publically pronounce that all material contained on their webpages is copywrited by gather and all rights to this property are reserved.
the effort on gathers part to protect material on behalf of the members is greatly appreciated.
Gather, however, is helping members to make their work more secured when posted here. The introduction of Guthrie is a part of it. Pam's article here is the next step towards helping us secure our posts.
From past experiences I know that Gather takes member concerns with content security seriously and steps in to help us out about this if we need.
People who violate the TOS don't give a rat's arse about them, so standing on a bunch of words and saying that they are going to protect you is a false argument. An individual has to find the violation first, report it to Gather, and than wait for Gather to do something about it. And that something is usually just booting the person off the site.
If a person is intent on making money from another person's work, there are always ways around anything that is put in place to protect the creator of the work. As soon as something new is done to protect you, there are ten people out there finding a way around it, so every solution becomes nothing more than a small band aide for a foot long gash.
We have all heard the stories here, I am sure, of members who have alter ego accounts. Who says that if a person is removed from the community, that they don't just come back under another name? A Frog is a Toad is a Frog sort of thing. None of us have had to show ID to belong, so it is easy.
I am sorry Kevin, but any solution, no matter how temporary, is a preferred solution until the technology catches up with the flow. Attacking other people personally is, in itself, a violation of the TOS. Let's put down the gun slowly and walk away.
The bickering is and has led to members leaving.
Other people may have invented the Internet, but it is people like us that made it. If we do not do something, no matter how short lived the solution is, it is letting others drive away with the car, the groceries, the new dress and the baby all at once right after we handed them the keys.
What I said (edited) was that the idea that we cannot perfectly protect our work, put forth to imply we should not use what measures we can, is like taking the view we shouldn't lock our car or our house. Yet, sanely, fully aware that someone who wants to steal from us bad enough will still find a way, most of us still lock our house and our car, rightly taking the view that using the protections we have to discourage what theft we can is better than leaving our doors standing open.
I'm sorry I'm not perfect and forgot to close out the html code back there, making the entire comment bold instead of just the first sentence. You're saying my bold comment is a "tantrum" because you're trying to hurt me by calling me childish and it's getting really old.
Now will you PLEASE stop stalking me, personally attacking me, abusing and stabbing at me every chance you get? You're preventing me from using and enjoying Gather. Thank you.
"A Frog is a Toad is a Frog sort of thing."
Don't tell Nippy that! I'm pretty sure there's a clear distinction between toads and frogs.
Its not an easy task, especially as its being "defined-as-we-go" on the internet......its a whole new world, with new (and 'untested') rules.....
I really believe that as long as Gather and members are consistent in whatever policy is developed, and there isn't any back-door back-stabs by whoever for 'other agendas,' that it is defensible in any court of law...if need be. Again, that won't "need be" if the policy is the best that can be determined under a new technology.
I still believe that the minute that we post articles to Gather, it creates the equivalent 'publishing copyright' that comes with any newspaper.....its just electronic. Gather does an excellent job of maintaining an enduring record (albeit computer based, so that feels kind new/strange, but its just as valid as The NYtimes) of who posted what, when, to whom, etc....and updates web servers with this information, so its accessible to anyone....if they look hard enough. That is enough to establish 'creative ownership.' This can be further documented by simply sending $40 and a copy of what was published to the Copyright office.
Regardless of this very solid rule, and verifiable record, people being people someone will steal other people's work. Sux, but that's our world right now, where it seems "ok" to many to "borrow." The avenues to get "justice" are just as frustrating in electronic/web media as it is in any other area......you have to wade through a court system thats already overburdened. That "job" has to be left to the individual(s) who feel wronged.....not Gather. They can't be the police of good/honorable behavior.......Gather can only be a "site of record" for whatever brilliance (or drivel ;-) we write.... AND I think that is enough, and a great service that all members should appreciate. Now that the sneaky/private agenda folks have departed or gotten bitch-slapped enough to wake up to mature behavior, there shouldn't be many issues to worry about. As long as gather preserves a safe, reliable, and consistent record of everything they are safe and we are given a rare privilege.
An Idea: I think gather should contact all First Chapters entrants, once this policy is clear, and encourage those thousands of folks to publish their books here online.....as a form of EBook. Now, folks are naturally protective of years of work; but honestly, the publishing biz is so weird right now that at least they get it published. Then, maybe a Paypal link can be included for readers to donate as they wish/can......even if its only $2 its something, and can add up. Then, have another link to a "print-on-demand" publishing house (the writer's responsibilty to select/pay/etc; but gather provides a "button" for it) THEN, people can order a copy online if they want to have a hard copy/real book.
yes, people will steal other people's ideas.....oh well. they have always have done that. but if you think about it, its easier to track that down electronically now that ever before.
yeah, the whole concept requires faith; or no faith....depends upon how you look at it. Faith, that people will pay responsibly....or 'faith' that you think people won't. Doesn't really matter, eh? Sitting on a shelf, or in 100's of slush piles is worse. I never sent my manuscript to a publisher. I visited one (reputable) one in NY city.....only to be told by the receptionist (quietly) that all the manuscripts went to slush pile, and aspiring writers/'students' reviewed them and every once in a while threw one up for review. Otherwise, the clear implication was that all unsolicited manuscripts were just grist for the writer's "mill". Duh....makes sense in a ruthless, amoral world, yeah?
Soooo, publish it on Gather....and give folks a chance to buy a hard copy by investing $900 in a online print-on-demand publisher. I saved that much money on copy cost and postage alone ;-)
Soo, a big "thank you" to Gather for actually being a publisher in themselves! :-)
Again, I think it will help gather...and a lot of writers.....to set up a formal procedure for this. Lets get folks back to Gather. If they know its safe, they will return.....
justa few thoughts.....
:-)
Pam, as you can see, the same rouse continues today. As Sandy has said in the past, and as some have written in your thread, people have left because of people constantly badgering them. Some must have a useless life, if they must follow another member around Gather to harass, and haunt them.
Faith, you are completely fine, and those who are trying to cause issues are truly the ones in the wrong. They were a year and a half ago, and they still are today.
The sad part, is evidence by their own hand has been given to Gather, but these annoying people are still here.
Questions the complete integrity of Gather as long as it continues.
RANDY--THE WHITEKNIGHT yes i did yell and throw a tantrum...anyone wanna whine about it?
Randy the whiteknight.. what? you were dipped in Wite Out?
Come on Randy, you don't have two legs to stand on pointing that crooked finger of yours.
I apologize that you had to sift through the bickering here... if I had known this would happen later on in the comments, I never would have directed you to this update.
> Hello.
>
> If you are worried about the protection of your content posted on Gather, then Pam Johnston wrote an update telling us what Gather is doing to help us.
>
> Please read her article titled "UPDATE: Protecting Content on Gather" for further information about this important concern.
>
> Thanks, and I hope you have a nice day.
> Faith
Pam - again, thanks for this update... I know everyone appreciates this as well as the other ways you've been keeping the community up to date.
I have said this before, and it's still as true now as it was the first time: If something that is worth stealing is put on the worldwide web, it can and will be stolen. If you don't want it stolen, don't put it on the web.
When are they going to do something about the content of people outide of the USA, along with being able to do something with our Gather points????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I just wanted to say I am finally going through what is now under 6,500 pieces of gather new mail that is in my inbox on here. So with that in mind I have finally come to a piece of mail that was addressed to me in regards this article submission you have created to share with the gather community. Thank you for taking the time and sharing your piece with us here at gather. :o)