NOW, FIRST OF ALL, DON'T GET MAD AT ME........WELL, AT LEAST TRY NOT TO........I'M JUST TALKING OUTLOUD AGAIN IN A TEXTUAL FORM.............NOT TRYING TO UPSET OR OFFEND ANYBODY...........JUST BABBLING ABOUT STUFF........NO REASON TO GET UPSET AT ME.........
I'M HARMLESS...........JUST LIKE TO THINK ABOUT STUFF AND TAP IT OUT ON THE OLD KEYBOARD SOMETIMES...........LIKE, FOR INSTANCE, I WAS SITTING HERE THINKING ABOUT THE CONCEPT OF MARRIAGE........I COULD GO ON AT LENGTH ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS.......
BUT I THINK I'VE NARROWED IT DOWN TO ONE QUESTION..............FOR NOW....................
I'VE BEEN SITTING HERE TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW TWO PEOPLE.........AND FOR THE SAKE OF MY PARTICULAR ARGUMENT, I'LL SAY A MAN AND A WOMAN.......HOW TWO PEOPLE ARE ANY DIFFERENT AFTER A WEDDING CEREMONY THAN THEY WERE BEFORE IT..........
I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW, FOR EXAMPLE, TWO PEOPLE CAN GET MARRIED, STAY MARRIED FOR, LET'S SAY, ONE YEAR, AND THEN GET DIVORCED. YET NO ONE DISPUTES THE IDEA THAT THEY WEREN'T ACTUALLY MARRIED FOR THAT ONE YEAR. BUT IF WE TAKE TWO DIFFERENT PEOPLE (STILL A MAN AND A WOMAN, OKAY??) WHO LIVE WITH EACH OTHER WITHOUT HAVING EVER HAVING PARTICIPATED IN A MARRIAGE CEREMONY OF ANY KIND, YET THEY LIVE HAPPILY TOGETHER FOR 55 YEARS, AND RAISE FIVE CHILDREN IN THE PROCESS.
MOST PEOPLE WILL STILL ADAMANTLY STATE THAT THEY WERE NEVER MARRIED.
DO YOU MIND IF I AM CONFUSED BY THIS??? NOW, "LEGALLY", I AGREE, THE SECOND TWO PEOPLE WERE NOT ACTUALLY "MARRIED" AS FAR AS CITY, STATE AND FEDERAL LAW IS CONCERNED. THERE MIGHT BE SOME ISSUE REGARDING "COMMON LAW" MARRIAGE IN THERE SOMEWHERE, BUT I'M NOT REALLY DEALING WITH THAT RIGHT NOW. I'M TRYING TO SORT OUT THIS FREQUENTLY USED CONCEPT CALLED "LIVING IN SIN" THAT PEOPLE TEND TO USE WHEN REFERRING TO CO-HABITATION BETWEEN A MAN AND A WOMAN WHO ARE NOT "MARRIED".
BECAUSE, APART FROM A LEGAL MARRIAGE LICENSE, IF "MARRIED" AND "UNMARRIED" IS DEFINED BY WHETHER OR NOT TWO PEOPLE STOOD TOGETHER AND SWORE BEFORE GOD THAT THEY WOULD STAY TOGETHER FOR THE REST OF THEIR LIVES, THEN ANY TWO PEOPLE COULD PERFORM A WEDDING CEREMONY BY THEMSELVES. THEY COULD EVEN DRAW THEIR OWN HOMEMADE MARRIAGE LICENSE IF THEY WANTED TO. IT WOULDN'T BE RECOGNIZED BY THE I.R.S. OR ANY OTHER LEGAL INSTITUTION, BUT THEY'D HAVE ONE.
SO, IS THIS SAYING THAT MARRIAGE REALLY ONLY CONSISTS OF A LEGAL CONTRACT BETWEEN TWO PEOPLE, LIKE A BUSINESS MERGER OR SOMETHING. AND, IF EITHER PARTY WISHES TO BREAK THE CONTRACT, THEY SIMPLY HAVE TO GET THEMSELVES A QUALIFIED ATTORNEY AND THE DEAL'S DONE??? HOWEVER.........IF "MARRIAGE" IS MORE THAN MERELY A LEGAL CONTRACT BETWEEN TWO AGREEING PARTIES, THEN WHAT DOES THAT "MORE" CONSIST OF???
BECAUSE, IF WE SAY IT IS AN AGREEMENT OR PROMISE THAT TWO PEOPLE MAKE BEFORE GOD, THEN WE'RE RIGHT BACK TO THE DO-IT-YOURSELF MARRIAGE CEREMONY THAT I DESCRIBED ABOVE. SO, WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BEING "REALLY MARRIED" AND BEING TWO PEOPLE JUST "SHACKING UP"??? WHAT SEPARATES THE ONE FROM BEING SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE AND THE OTHER FROM NOT BEING SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE???
I SHOULD POINT OUT THAT THOSE OF YOU WHO DO NOT HOLD ANY STRONG RELIGIOUS BELIEFS OR WHO WERE NOT RAISED WITH THE STIGMATIZATION OF TWO PEOPLE LIVING TOGETHER "OUTSIDE OF MARRIAGE" WILL PROBABLY NOT FULLY UNDERSTAND WHAT THE HECK I AM TALKING ABOUT. BECAUSE THE SUBJECT I AM ADDRESSING HERE IS PREDOMINANTLY A "RELIGIOUS MATTER". IT IS RELIGIOUS MORALITY WHICH DEFINES THE DIVIDING LINE BETWEEN BEING MARRIED AND BEING UNMARRIED. BUT, I AM NOT ABOUT TO GET INTO ALL THAT, BECAUSE IT WILL ONLY CREATE A VIOLENT DISAGREEMENT THAT,
IN ESSENCE, WILL NEVER REACH A SATISFACTORY CONCLUSION.
SO...........I GUESS I'M DONE HERE.................ANYBODY WANT SOME CAKE ????
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Comments: 17
Living together is more like a trial and sometimes is easier to stay together as you know you can just walk away, it is harder to do that when you are married. Living together you know you are both there because you want to be.
When you get married you take on roles and responsibilities even though living together is pretty much the same, it becomes real with marriage and we may expect more from the other person than when living together.
It amazes me that people pick on Elizabeth Taylor for her many marriages when all she really did was legalize her affairs. So many have many affairs and we accept that.
I have been married for the second time for 27 years and I am happy. I do think the emotional bond we have has kept us together far more than the marriage certificate.
and personally, i think marriage for most (always an exception) is a union between two people and the one who loves the most is SLAVE to the other..........ARRRGGGG!!!!
Strategies for Living With a Mental Illness Tip #1
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Some people have elevated marriage to a level higher than a civil institution by making it a religious institution. This, of course, bring religion and government together, which is not a good idea. Marriage, from a civil perspective, should be granted to meet social needs. The blessing of unions should remain in the church. The two do not need to be the same. Or as others have pointed out, the union between two people can be meaningful and eternal without government or religion involved. People should commit to one another because they love each other and wish to support each others dreams, to seek government recognition of their union or to seek the blessing of a community of faith are all separate issues.
I went through the same process early in life after marrying a man in the church who beat me and the children. I later divorced him. Then the issue of gay marriage hit the news. I'll never believe that two people who love each other and make a commitment, whether to God or to each other or both, are less married than me and my first husband. Yes, we satisfied a legal requirement which the a few governments set forth in order to try to make it the "normal" way of life and which also allows them to keep tabs on their citizens. But, I watched a video of a wedding in a small tribe in Tibet. These people consider this a legally/religiously acceptable marriage. It involved 1 bride and 6 grooms between the ages of 16 and 6 with the idea being that if the first husband died or as he aged, the younger men would step in and take his place in the marriage bed. The idea behind this marriage was to increase the chances of more children being born to the woman than if she just had one husband and it also ensured economic stability of the family. They don't have to have welfare in that tribe. The marriage is a marriage according to this tribe, but our Judeo-Christian mentality here would not accept it. This made me wonder just what God did say about marriage. We all know the part about a man leaving his family and binding themselves to each other, and the bible does say marriage is good. It also says it is an abomination for a man to lie with a man, but this is in the priestly laws given in Leviticus where it says do not wear a garment made of two materials, and to do blood sacrifice, etc., which Christians have deemed to be cancelled. So, how that one law out of the many many that are in there can still be in effect when the rest have been cancelled due to Jesus's sacrifice is beyond me. NOWHERE does it say the marriage must be approved by the government. It doesn't say spend money on a license. There is a part that says there should be a contract between a man and woman to be sure the woman is well taken care of if the man divorces her. Yes, that part IS in the bible, but I know so many women who lose their financial security, etc., in divorces, I think it's safe to say we do ignore that part in the Bible. So, we ignore the parts we want to ignore, hang onto the parts that are supposedly defunct, but we like them. Pretty much it comes down to this....
Marriage is an institution which each society uses to feed it's needs. In places where procreation is the main idea, that's the focus of what's a proper marriage. In places where the government must/wants to know where each citizen is and what they are doing and tax them accordingly, it becomes a registration-type thing. In religious societies where it's important to know that "we" are the "right" group and are going to heaven so you must identify a "them" who do "wrong" who are going to hell. Marriage serves the purpose of defining who you are in your society. A spiritual commitment is something else again. It's two people who love each other and agree to be codependent in a positive way in order to get through life and to honor the love they feel for each other.
Make sense? And, thanks again for posting this to my group! It is greatly appreciated.
Nor is marriage a private agreement between a man and a women. This idea is often used as an excuse for unchastity before marriage. The argument is made: "Although we have not been officially married, we have agreed between ourselves to be married, so actually we are already married." This idea is contrary to the Scriptures. In the Bible a marriage always takes place according to certain norms of society and always involves other people who serve as witnesses. A marriage is an occurrence before God and before man. A Christian is obligated to abide by the laws of the society in which he lives to the extent that they do not conflict with the laws of God.
The laws of God and of society are for the purpose of protecting the parties involved and society in general. Thus a marriage is more than a private agreement between a man and a woman.
"In the Bible a marriage always takes place according to certain norms of society and always involves other people who serve as witnesses (Name of Book, Chapter ??: Verse ??). To be honest, when people say "the Bible teaches" I always assume that they don't know where unless they can cite a source because so many people, as I said, actually mean, this is what I learned in church that the Bible says" which is not the same as "This is what I know the Bible says."
I personally feel it is the way to go from a Christian aspect, a moral aspect, and a legal aspect. It is hard work, are for people that a mature and willing to give and take and respect one another. It isn't easy, even when in love, but worth it. I am married 30 years, and would not have it any other way.
Are you married, Berf?