When The Shoe Is On The Other Foot - Someone Else's

Rob, you just reminded my of the Miss Universe Pageant fiasco last week when Miss USA was booed by the Mexican audience. It really confused me. If you don't like America, then why come?

Those laws sound good to me. Sometimes I think we spend too much time bending over backwards for the little guy.

I read yesterday that they are being recruited for security mercenaries, like Blackwater. (Bush doesn't do anything within our actual government any more.) Just wait till the first time you are given a ticket, or rounded up in a protest by one of these people.

No wonder we see so much illegal immigration... you get treated better here than in Mexico. I wonder if they would continue to immigrate if they had to play by the same rules?

It seems a complex and difficult issue. However the word illegal should influence solutions.

Honestly, I don't know what I think about the whole immigration issue. I did know that Mexico has very strict laws about migrants in their country. Should we rise above the limited mentality of other governments? What do you think?

Rob, thanks for a great post! You bring up a valid point... If that's how they treat foreigners, why do they expect to be treated any differently when they are the foreigners?

Ron, That is the most valid argument against all this immigration reform b.s. The word is "illegal." They are breaking the law and should not be rewarded for it.

Judi, touche!

This is such a hot topic, I really don't know how I feel about it. I think building a wall is simply stupid...as if that will do anything. I think expecting those that are already here to pay $5000 to stay, is probably impossible for them. I had no idea Mexico had those laws, I'm afraid to even visit. I know somehow I'd be the one someone slipped something in the suitcase, and I'd end up in a Mexican prison. I'm not anti-immigrant, it is what our country is based on...but, there needs to be some controlled regulation that works.

Sue, I agree 100 percent with you assesment of the immigration issue.

My blood boils from this conversation. I was in a restraunt (Applebee's) having dinner with my family. I wear a hat that says God Bless America and an American flag on it. Our waiter was Hispanic. I could tell that my hat offended him right off. Our food showed up and there was 5 people in our party. 4 out of the 5 people had mixed vegetables and my veggies were lased with so much salt that it almost took my breath away. No one elses vegetable were salty.
I am a disabled American Veteren that served his country for 13 honorable years and I am now having to endure this kind of treatment by a person that hasn't earned the rights he has. When are we as Americans going to start making Countries like Mexico start taking care of there internal corruption and making it a place that there citizens wont want to run across the border to make things better? I ask you this. What would have happened if Americans would have run to Canada during the Revolutionary War instead of staying and fighting to make a great FREE Country? Would we all be saying (A) at the end of all our sentences? There is only one way to deal with Illegal Imigration and that is to TAX the heck out of them and make it not worth there while to make the gourney across the border. Does this sound harsh? Tell me this, why is it that our teachers dont have to learn Russian, Arabic or Indian languges in our Schools so they can cater to them? I dont get it. Why is it that our Poloticians have lost there backbones when dealing with the Hispanic Race? Do you have any Idea the strain that Illegal imigration has put on the healthcare system? Yet my Mom and Dad who have been paying taxes there entire life are paying huge money for Prescriptions on a fixed income? I heard our VP tell some people that we Americans are too lazy to do the jobs the Hispanics are doing. MR VP go try and get the jobs they are doing for the wages they are doing the jobs for and tax the money for the American who is doing the job. You would have to redefine the poverty level.
One of the biggest problems we are having as Americans is we are being thrown into a World Economy. We are not wanting to level the playing field by making the whole economy level with the rest of the world. Its called greed. If you want to compete with the rest of the world then you have to make your economy and cost of living the same. Take a look at what your house is worth and see what that same amount of money will buy you in the third world nations our companies are going to, to have there products built.
This paragraph is for anyone out there that is living in the USA and dont want to play by the rules we have made. GO HOME AND WAIVE YOUR FLAG IN YOUR COUNTRY AND DEFEND YOUR COUNTRY WITH AS MUCH ZEAL AS YOU HAD WALKING TO THE USA.
Walking across a border is what I call taking the easy way out. Is that the solution (Think About IT)

Simply put, but we have a serious problem. I was not aware of these Mexican laws.

I have seen this before.

I don't understand why we have to be so 'PC' yet other countries can treat Americans like crap and nobody does anything about it. There is something seriously wrong there.

Well, if Mexico has these laws and people have to abide by them, then I think it is no wonder Mexicans have invaded our country, and I am using that word literally. I live in New York State, The company that owns our apartment complex is from the south west somewhere, and they are renovating or updating each apartment here and there are 830 garden apartments in this complex. All the workers employed here on a regular basis do not speak English. They are Mexicans. If there is something needed to be done in your apartment, a super comes with him, listens to you and I don't know how he explains it to the worker that actually does it, but you sure can't communicate with him when he is in your house. The only sentence they know is don't speek Englis. Now as for the people actually doing the renovations, and the rent is going to increase by $400 to $450 per month, per apartment, they are actually worse. Three were sitting in a truck outside the other day and I asked them how long it would be before they were away from the front of my building, and all of them said those three words, I asked them, then , how are you driving. Since they didn't know what I said, they all just grinned ear to ear. If you say anything about it you are a biggot. So I don't know, we are now all grinning and bearing it waiting until it is our turn to get a notice we have to take one of the newly refurbished apartments of find another place to live, frankly I am looking. I could buy myself a new fridge, stove and dishwasher for less than the increase over one year and this thing will keep spiraling upwards each year. Are they worried about the empties? no, because they are counting on people commuting to NYC from here where the rents are twice as much. Without these workers doing a terrible job, I have to add, so far tiles put down in hall ways have had to be replaced twice since January. They don't know how to do the things some good old American guy who would get paid maybe twice what they are getting could have done it right the first time. Well, Rob, you got me off track here, but have wanted to say this for sometime. Perhaps Mexico should put in their constitution, you can't leave Mexico, it is agains the LAW.

Yes, something needs to be done, and we need to at least enforce the rules that we already have to stop all the illegals from coming in. And we need to stop accommodating them at tax payer expense. My sister used to live in New Mexico and both her marriage license and her daughter's birth certificate were in Spanish! Shouldn't legal government documents be in English?

Rob,
This is the most logically piece I have heard on this issue in a long time but I have mixed feelings about this. Being the decedents of immigrants (forcible migration but immigrants all the same) and the only native people here (American Indians) I can see both sides of the story. Our country should not be forced to bend over backwards for anyone ( I don't believe I should be forced to learn Spanish just to get along in my daily life ( which is what I have to do in Miami) when I live in America) . If you are in America you should learn the American way of life. Learn to speak the language and get along in American society. On the other hand no other country is calling themselves the home of the free and the brave. We have plaque in our statue of liberty saying give us your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free ( The New Colossus
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!")
, yet our immigration policy is very biased. We have no problem letting the rich in but the poor burden us and our economy so keep them out. At least Mexico has equal opportunity bullcrap immigration laws. This country was built on immigration and now that we are a successful country we turn our back on it? It's a slippery slope and I personally feel there is nowhere to draw a clear and defined line.

Wow, I didn't know this about Mexico.

I'm confused about the investment policy, though. Don't Americans have investments in Mexico already?

We seem to be concentrating on Mexican immigrants, legal or illegal. The truth is that there are many migrants, legal and illegal, from other countries. The Asian countries have lost citizens by the boatloads that have landed on United States' shores. Many have tried to apply for political asylum only to be turned out. The percentage of those granted asylum is very low.

We are not a heartless people and we certainly are not a closed system of government. I went through a period of time resenting migrants for taking jobs, health care, and other benefits from Americans. After doing research and using my noodle for something other than hatred, I realized that no one can take anything away from us. If we are not getting our benefits from our government, there are reasons that reside within our own homes and psyches; if we are losing jobs to migrants, perhaps it is because we don't want to do those jobs. I could go on and on and now that I'm a bit riled up about this, I'll do further research and come up with REAL statistics and percentages. Blanket statements of huge numbers doesn't make good sense and certainly does not impress me.

Great aricle , Ellen B. It's a 20!

Rob, it's not what Mexico does or other countries do. We are NOT Mexico. What their government has chosen to do should not be taken out on their people. I'm not saying we should let people in here illegally but how about really addressing the problem and putting processes in place that actually work? Look at Mexico and other countries. No question why they want to come here.

However, with that comes responsibility to learn our language and to work to support your family. Many are willing to do that but instead of focusing on those who are here illegally, the government has institued these new ridiculously long red tape filled processes which work against those who are already here contributing to the country by paying taxes, getting educated etc...and I'm talking about those trying to renew their visas, not NEW ones. As usual, our government officials need to pull their heads out of their asses and focus on the REAL problem.

Wow,serious subject,I believe the reason for the invasion,is because of big business,money,money,money.They can hire aliens to do the work much cheaper,and therefore keep more money in their own pockets.I have no problem with the people per say,I would do the same thing if I lived in a society like theirs.What I do have a problem with is the idea that we owe them...Interpreters, bilingual public servants, public assistance, free health care etc.I had to work,pay taxes,pay for health insurance and strive for everything my children and I needed,wasn`t anything handed to me and I didn`t expect it to be.Time after time I see the same thing going on all over our country.......I know many immigrant's.... I`m only aware that the Mexicans are making these demands on our government.....and their getting them met.

The sad truth is that this issue is politicly driven-in the wrong direction. The Republicans want the cheap labor;the Democrats want the votes. Both parties seem oblivious to the economic hardship that this legislation will bring to millions of taxpayers if allowed to go through. Our laws don't have to be as xenophobic as Mexico's,but our leaders need to understand that the era of unimpeded immigration has long passed.

Does not surprise me at all. Mexico has always wanted their cake and to eat it too.

Great article. I have commented on similar one's in the past. Mexico's Constitution forbids ownership of property by foreigners within 100km of a land border and 50km of a coastal border. Here's the ironic part, the laws intention was to protect Mexico from foreign invasion. Being it is part of their Constitution, they claim it cannot be changed. To own property as a foreigner in these exclusion zones, a trust (fidecomiso) is set up through a bank. You basically own the property in all but name (which legally is the most important, LOL). This basically stifles any large investment in any property worth looking at. I'm a building contractor in south FL and off the top of my head as I'm typing, I could name three people I could call willing to invest (a substantial amount) and develop waterfront property in Mexico. The problem putting it all together is the ownership issues. With all the property of any value tied up in trusts through the banks, it seems like an nice and easy package to nationalize if some leftist nitwit were to come to power. Don't forget, Manuel Lopez-Obredor had 49% plus of the popular vote in the last Mexican election.

Elsie:

Call your local ICE Department (you can do it anonymously) and report the construction company that has hired all of the illegals. Try to get the name of the company, address and any other important information before you call. Let ICE bust the construction company!!!!

Tinch:

If you want to see how many illegals are involved in accidents, murder, rape, etc. against US citizens, go to this site...........

www.americanpatrol.com

Click on "Family Values" on the left-hand side of the screen. The site updates twice a day!!!

Click on the link below to sign the petition!!!!!!

www.statelegislatorsforlegalimmigration.com


Definitely citizens can help to give this more momentum!!! Also, please sign this petition and pass it on!!!! Once you sign the petition, they will keep you updated on all current events/activities regarding this issue through email.

www.statelegislatorsforlegalimmigration.com

"American citizens nationwide can encourage their state lawmakers to become official members of State Legislators for Legal Immigration by urging them to contact Representative Metcalfe at (724) 772-3110 or via e-mail at dmetcalf@pahousegop.com."

State Legislators for Legal Immigration Founder Urges President Bush to Choose

U.S. Constitution Over Congressional Illegal Alien Amnesty Sellout

05/31/07

"New nationwide coalition of state lawmakers launches unprecedented and historic effort to secure borders and cut off all economic attractions for illegal aliens

Rounding out a jam-packed, inaugural schedule of nation-wide grassroots activity that included major media events in Pennsylvania, Arizona and New Hampshire, State Legislators for Legal Immigration Founder, Pennsylvania State Representative Daryl Metcalfe (R-Butler County) issued the following letter last week calling on President George W. Bush to honor his oath of office by fulfilling his Constitutional responsibilities to secure America's borders against illegal alien invaders.

"Dear President Bush,

We are writing this letter to express our concern that the security of our nation is being held hostage by elected leaders in Washington, D.C., who are advocating on behalf of those profiting from the illegal aliens. Advancing legislation that gives any degree of preference for becoming citizens of our nation to individuals who have violated our borders and disrespected our rule of law is an affront to each and every patriotic U.S. citizen.

Last year, House Resolution 799 was passed by the General Assembly of Pennsylvania and a copy was transmitted to you and the Pennsylvania congressional delegation. HR 799 memorialized the President of the United States and the United States Congress to secure all borders of this nation to protect American citizens from the dangers of unlawful invasion and illegal immigration.

President Bush, as you well know, the federal government has a Constitutional obligation to secure our borders from the entry of illegal aliens.

Article 4, Section 4 of the U.S. Constitution states that our government "shall guarantee" to every state in this Union a Republican form of government and shall protect each of them against INVASION."

It is the responsibility of the federal government to secure our borders and we demand that you use the power of your office to do so, with our full support.

Some may think it audacious of one to demand anything of the President of the United States, but what we demand is only what you have already sworn to do during your oath of office, just as we have sworn to do in our oaths of office.

The illegal alien invasion must be terminated to protect Americans from increasingly documented incidences of homicide, identity theft, property theft, serious infectious diseases, drug running, gang violence, human trafficking, terrorism and the growing cost to taxpayers.

The resolution to this problem is with in our grasp. We are members of State Legislators for Legal Immigration, which is a nation-wide coalition founded to provide a network of state legislators who are committed to working together in demanding full cooperation among our federal, state and local governments in eliminating all economic attractions and incentives for illegal aliens.

These economic attractions and incentives include, but are not limited to: public benefits, welfare, education and employment opportunities for illegal aliens. We are standing together for securing our borders against unlawful invasion. Once the economic attractions of illegal jobs and taxpayer-funded public benefits are severed at the source, these illegal alien invaders will have no choice but to go home on their own.

State Legislators for Legal Immigration also believe that American citizens, both born and naturalized, along with legal resident aliens, must be shown the respect that they deserve by requiring each and every person who desires to reside in our nation to do so through the legal immigration process.

President Bush, we oppose any legislation that grants favored immigration status to those individuals who have violated our borders, and we demand that you and Congress uphold and defend our U.S. Constitution by securing our borders immediately."

Including Pennsylvania, lawmakers from 25 state legislatures have signed on as pioneer members of State Legislators for Legal Immigration. View the latest State Capitol press releases and letters of support, state and national media coverage, and statewide illegal immigration reform updates by logging on to the coalition's new and frequently-updated web site at StateLegislatorsforLegalImmigration.com."

American citizens nationwide can encourage their state lawmakers to become official members of State Legislators for Legal Immigration by urging them to contact Representative Metcalfe at (724) 772-3110 or via e-mail at dmetcalf@pahousegop.com.

Rep. Daryl Metcalfe
12th District
Pennsylvania House of Representatives
(724) 772-3110
(717) 783-1707
www.RepMetcalfe.com
Contact: Ty McCauslin
House Republican Public Relations
(717) 772-9979

http://www.repmetcalfe.com/?sectionid=59&parentid=1&sectiontree=59&itemid=423

Reverse the situation. Go to Mexico or Central America illegally. Will you, as the illegals do, have a home waiting there to accept you? Will you have a newly purchased identity? Will you be accepted, be hired for a job, be educated, be fed, free medical, dental, and vision? On and on, ad nauseum!

Will they allow you to stay there, aka, grant amnesty? Think they'll send your retired parents or disabled child a check every month? Endless benefits.

These are things our own government won't bestow on most of our own citizens! Yet the illegals here have it. They(the gov.) are giving away our tax dollars to people who have no right to be here in the first place.

I am not opposd to any specific ethnicity but I am opposed to those that are stealing what our own people need. Why do we have to tolerate others breaking our laws?

I guess I should be happy to finally get my green card ;-)

Brenda' Thank you for the link. I just signed the petition.

How about the remainder of Gather people?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander...great post!

Judith/Tinch:

No problem. Once you bring up the site, you can click on the petition on the left hand side of the screen.

There was a question about owning property in Mexico. Yes you can but the thing is that even if you pay cash for the property the bank in Mexico holds on to the Title. Now ask yourself this question. What happens if I get deported or Mexico just says leave? Do you have any paperwork showing ownership of the house or does the bank? There is also a yearly handling fee that you have to pay the bank to manage your title.
I am going to share another story of horror that happen right across the street from where I live. The Hispanic Blue gang lives in the house across the street from me. One of there little soldiers got stabbed to death and they brought his body home with them across the street and had a Morning Party. A Morning Party is basically a bunch of Gang Members Fighting, Crying, throwing beer bottles and just in general scaring the crap out of the neighborhood. Oh yeah, the body, they propped him up in a chair and put a beer bottle in his hand.
While all this was going on the Police was called by several of the neighbors Including my Daughter who was scared out of her witts by the action of the gang. Did the police do anything????? NO, They could break the law across the street on many different counts and get by with it. Now I pay an exhorbanent amount of Taxes and my daughter can set in the house and be terrified and the police wont even come and check on her????? I guess I need to move to the country.
On Memorial Day I put up the American flag in front of my house and the neighbors started waiving the Mexican flat at me. Are We really that blind to not see what is happening in America? When are we going to hold our Polititians accountable and see that they vote for what the people want. Not some special interest group.

Rob there is one more thing I would like to say. On this website not very many people sign there Complete names to there comments. I just wanted to say that I respect the fact that you put your full name to your articles.

Rob dont forget it is a FELONY to illegal immigrate to Mexico.

In Australia you have to either be sponsered by a family member that is a national or PROVE that you will be beneficial to their country and economy...basically skilled labor.

People act like it is a right to come to the USA. If they can illegally make it over the border they are entitled to stay....Hello it is a privledge.

I live in a very small town that is less than a mile from a chicken plant. Georges is the name of the plant. We have illegals coming in by the bus loads. It was raided last week and one of the employees told me there are on 6 hispanics left working there. By next month if not sooner it will be full of illegals again.

Bruce:

The next time that you call the police and they do not come.........Go down the road to a phone booth and anonymously call the police and tell them that you heard shots fired!!!! The police will definitely come then!!!

Tomi:

Wait 3 months or so and call ICE again stating that you know illegals are working their again!!

you know I read all your comments, or most of them but I have to go back to Ron B. the word illegal is the key here. They shouldn't be able to stay here long enough to have to abide by our rules. If they go through the right channels then they should be able to do everything we can but until they are legal ship their asses back. It's as simple as that.
Good article Rob....as always :)

You said it all

Press Release of Senator Sessions

Sen. Sessions Releases List of 20 Loopholes in the Senate Immigration Bill

Monday, June 4, 2007

"WASHINGTON – U.S. Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL) released a list of 20 loopholes in the comprehensive immigration bill today which reveals that the bill is fatally flawed and will not establish a functioning immigration system in the future.

The list of loopholes includes flaws effecting border security, chain-migration and assimilation policies. The list exposes the lack of serious attention given to ensuring that the legislation fixes America's failed immigration system.

"I am deeply concerned about the numerous loopholes we have found in this legislation. They are more than technical errors, but rather symptoms of a fundamentally flawed piece of legislation that stands no chance of actually fixing our broken immigration system," Sessions said. "Many of the loopholes are indicative of a desire not to have the system work."

For example, one loophole in the "enforcement trigger" fails to require the U.S. VISIT system – the biometric border check-in/check-out system established by Congress in 1996, but never implemented – to be fully functioning before new worker or amnesty programs begin. Without the system in place, the U.S. has no method of ensuring that workers and their families do not overstay their visas.

Another flaw in the legislation prevents the benefits of merit-based immigration from taking full effect until 2016. Until then, chain migration into the U.S. will actually triple, compared to a disproportionately low increase in skill-based immigration. As a result, the merit-based system in the bill is only a shell of what it should have been.

A third loophole in the bill allows immigrants to avoid demonstrating a proficiency in English for more than a decade. Illegal aliens are not required to learn English to receive full "probationary benefits" of citizenship. Passing a basic English test is only required for the third Z-visa renewal, twelve years after amnesty is granted.

Sessions will highlight many of the loopholes contained in the list this week during Senate debate on the immigration bill."

http://sessions.senate.gov/pressapp/record.cfm?id=275456

Click on the article link regarding Jeff Sessions (above) pointing out ALL of the loopholes in this bill, it will make you sick!!!!

In Thailand, foreigners aren't allowed to own land at all.

There are countries where illegal immigrants are shot and killed.

In now way am I advocating that illegal immigrants in the U.S. should be shot and killed. My point is that there are countries with much tougher immigration laws than we have.

Brenda M.
I was out of town when the Morning Party Happened and my Daughter was home alone. She was to afraid to even unlock the door. I found out later that our Police force is under a Non Confrontation Directive because it would make the Police Force look like they are Racist if they deal with the Criminal actions of a Certain Race. Do you know how often I hear the word (Racist). That is a good word to hide behind when your ducking Justice for criminal acts. Dont get me wrong I think there is Racist in the world but when you blatently brake the law and throw it in Law abiding (TAX PAYING) peoples face that your rights are being broken! Sorry but I dont buy into that line of thought. The other thing is why would you escape from a Country and want the same thing in the one you escape to???? I dont understand.
Does anyone Know how many Canadians come into the USA illegally?
Everyone needs to read the words Tony Blair spoke to a Journalist. Here it is

Thought for the day:

In case we find ourselves starting to believe all
the anti-American sentiment and negativity, we
should remember England 's Prime Minister Tony
Blair's words during a recent interview. When asked
by one of his Parliament members why he believes so
much in America , he said:

"A simple way to take measure of a country is to
look at how many want in... And how many want out."
Only two defining forces have ever offered to die
for you:

1. Jesus Christ
2. The American G. I.

One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

YOU MIGHT WANT TO PASS THIS ON, AS MANY SEEM TO
FORGET BOTH OF THEM.

AMEN!

Tim:

"My point is that there are countries with much tougher immigration laws than we have."

You definitely got that right........And, France is a great example.

Ever since the riots, France has definitely had enough with illegal in their country!!

France gets tough on illegal immigration, setting quotas for arrests, expulsions
By Associated Press
Monday, June 4, 2007 - Updated: 04:53 PM EST

PARIS - France set tough new quotas for the number of illegal immigrants authorities should arrest and expel each month, the new immigration minister said Monday.

Brice Hortefeux, who heads the newly created Ministry of Immigration, Integration, National Identity and Co-Development, said a monthly quota also would be set for ferreting out those employed in France illegally.

In a meeting with security officials, Hortefeux reiterated President Nicolas Sarkozy's goal of 25,000 expulsions by the end of 2007 - compared with 24,000 in 2006 - and set a year-end goal of 125,000 arrests for alleged illegal entry or illegal residence, a ministry statement said. The number of those already arrested was not immediately clear.

Sarkozy, who was elected May 6, pledged during his campaign to create a ministry of immigration and national identity to rein in the flow of migrants and ensure they are integrated into French society. Riots in French housing projects in 2005 were largely driven by anger among children of immigrants at persistent discrimination and a feeling of alienation from mainstream society.

Hortefeux said the new measures were aimed at "dismantling networks that exploit the misery of illegal immigrants," the statement said.

His orders came after he and Prime Minister Francois Fillon visited a holding center for illegal immigrants Monday _ and three days after the bodies of 18 illegal immigrants were fished from the Mediterranean by the crew of a French frigate.

The dead _ 12 men, two adolescent boys and four women _ were believed to be seeking new lives in Europe, though it was not clear what country they were coming from. They will be buried in France.

"The French Republic will be extremely firm. It will ensure laws are applied," Fillon said, adding: "Naturally, these laws must be applied with the greatest humanity."

Many saw Sarkozy's proposal as a nod to the electorate on the extreme right, which long has made fighting immigration one of its main causes.

"Generosity is not opening wide the borders without thought for how people will integrate, how they will live, how they will subsist," Fillon said.

Hortefeux, in his meeting with security officials, also insisted on the need to develop a system of paying illegal immigrants to voluntarily return home, setting the number of paid departures at 2,500 for this year _ a 25 percent increase from 2006.

Those volunteering to leave, as part of a program started in late 2005, are given a fixed sum of money, normally $4,700 per couple, with $1,350 each for the first three children."

http://news.bostonherald.com/international/europe/view.bg?articleid=1004803

Bruce:

Take all of this information to your local police chief, township meetings, etc. Don't let them get away with saying that they cannot enforce our current immigration laws any longer!!! This is the information that I send to mayors, police departments, etc.

287(g)
Here is another option that cities can use to LEGALLY enforce federal immigration laws in their communities. Please take a few minutes to look at the links below. Numerous cities throughout the country have already taken advantage of this program, which permits their local law enforcement to LEGALLY assist ICE with enforcing the immigration laws of this country. This is very important, as illegal support groups, La Raza, ACLU, Mecha, etc.---cannot claim racism, xenophobia, illegally targeting Hispanics/Latinos----as this training/certification is a federal program.

I have provided links below---copy and paste them into your browser. Pay particular attention to the links provided by Judicial Watch and ICE.

The 287(g) training and certification is offered through ICE and the Dept of Homeland Security. The 287(g)training/certification program lasts five weeks and costs approximately $520 per officer. It gives cities/communities the LEGAL right/authority to enforce our federal immigration laws-----as the training/certification are through federal programs.

I am sure that you will agree that this is a very small expense for gaining the ability to regain control and rule of law in your community.

Please call your local ICE/Dept of Homeland Security office to get your local law enforcement enrolled in the 287(g) Program so that they can be trained and certified and able to immeidiately begin LEGALLY assisting with the enforcement of our federal immigration laws in your community.

Please copy and paste the following links into your browser for more information, sometimes the links will not work if you just click on them.


http://www.judicialwatch.org/287_g_.shtml

http://www.ice.gov/pi/news/factsheets/section287g.htm

http://www.ice.gov/exec/s287g/section287g_packet_request.asp

http://www.heritage.org/Research/HomelandDefense/em994.cfm

It takes money to enforce our immigration laws. Most people want less taxes. When we reduce the taxes, something has got to give. Enforcement of our immigration laws is one of the places that receives less funding now. We have no one but ourselves to blame. We say we want the borders secured but aren't willing to pony up the money to pay for it. Such hypocrisy!

Brenda,
Someone is listening and acting on the information you supplied. By the way thanks for the information and the time it took to gather it for us.

I'm listening. Thanks Rob for a really good article.

Bruce:

No problem!! Did you provide them will all of the links as well??? As the information from those links is very important---and even includes the application for the 287(g) program!!!

Bruce:

I forgot to add.....This is very important.......Based on when raids/deportations have taken place in other cities/states, the illegals and illegal support groups will lie and try to make false accusations!!! Therefore, it is always a good idea for them to work in pairs and to video everything whenever possible!!!!

I have it on reliable authority that Al Qaeda mistreats its prisoners too.

/snark

Kathleen,
We live in a time that is full of Passiveness (Hope I spelled that right). Things happen and instead of making the people responcible for there actions they say (Whatever). Let me ask you this? If a drug dealer lived across the street from you do you think it would be ok for him to do it because there is 10 million other people are doing it? Its Illegal. Just like the first word in Illegal Alien (KEY WORD ILLEGAL). Do you think its fair to all the people who have come to the USA on Visa's and went through the (Legal steps to become USA citizens).
People tend to call other people who are organized extremist. More power to you Brenda.

Is Illegal Immigration a problem in the USA?
Do Americans and Mexicans not get on with each other?
A friend of mine had a mother who married an American and went to live over there. On the fourth of July she always put up the British flag in her garden. This was just met with good humour.

Brenda,
I did send all the links and even offered to send one of our Policemen to the training free of cost and the responce I got was our Policemen are constantly trained and due to shortages of Policemen we cant send one ( But thanks for offering). I call it the Ostrich Effect, if you put your head in the sand it will all go away. Problem is when you have your butt in the air, that is when you get bit.

Bruce:

Try this.......

First, start a petition informing citizens of your community that there is a way for your police to enforce federal immigration laws, but they are refusing to do so. In other words, your city is acting like a "sanctuary city". Therefore, the petition is a DEMAND that some of the police officers become trained/certified through the program. Also, make sure to include that citizens will file a class action suit anytime an illegal----or one of their children-----is caught committing a serious crime in your community. Include information regarding the 287(g) program.

Next, show up at community/township/county meetings and provide the same information to citizens (bring the petition). Try to get an opportunity to speak!!!! Have all information/facts regarding the 287(g) program ready for them to review.

Get as many people in your community involved as possible!!!!!!

Bruce:

I forgot to add...........Under all articles in your local newspapers regarding illegals----put comments stating that the police are refusing to take steps to stop illegal immigrants from committing crimes in your community----even though there are legal steps that they can take. Post information about the 287(g) program under the articles as well!!

Bruce:

I saw this article. This is similar to what is going on where you live!!


'Sanctuary policy' draws calls for county reversal

By Natasha Altamirano

THE WASHINGTON TIMES

June 6, 2007

"A Northern Virginia group trying to reduce the influx of illegal aliens asked Prince William County yesterday to reverse its policy of prohibiting police officers from asking non-felony suspects about their immigration status.

"We have come before you today to ask that you exercise your oversight powers over the police department to ensure that they comply with federal law, comply with the will of your constituents and help improve the safety of the community," Help Save Manassas President Greg Letiecq told the county's Board of Supervisors. "It is illegal. It must be revoked."

Mr. Letiecq was joined by about 20 other group members who also asked county officials to reconsider the so-called "sanctuary policy."

Police Chief Charlie T. Deane attended the meeting and said officers do not ask about one's immigration status when issuing traffic citations or handling less serious crimes. However, they ask a suspect arrested in a felony or involved in a criminal gang, or one who uses a gun while committing a crime.

The chief said officers also notify U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) "when deemed appropriate."

"The police department's primary mission is to control crime and community safety," he said. "Immigration enforcement is a complicated national issue that could divert significant and limited resources from its primary mission. We have chosen a balanced policy that prioritizes the use of police resources coupled with the enhanced immigration training ... within our jails."

Correctional officers at the Prince William-Manassas Regional Adult Detention Center are in the process of partnering with ICE to implement a federally funded program, known as 287(g), that trains local police to carry out some duties of federal immigration officers.

Herndon police began program training last month.

Mr. Letiecq said a sanctuary policy in Virginia Beach led to the deaths of two teenagers killed by a drunken driver -- an illegal alien with three alcohol-related convictions.

Virginia Beach last month reversed the policy after drawing national criticism.

"This is a national tragedy that could potentially visit the citizens of Prince William County," Mr. Letiecq said.

Chief Deane said the department's two-year-old policy is similar to those of other departments in the region."

Remainder of article available through link below..................

http://washtimes.com/metro/20070605-103734-6241r.htm

Brenda,
The biggest problem with this community is that in the last 5 years it has become a safehouse for Illegal Imigrants. If I did start a petition I would run into 6 out of 10 doors being Illegals. Let me tell you another story about a run in between an illegal imigrant and a neighbor of mine.
My neighbor was asleep and he awoke to a huge bang and the house shuddering. Across the culdesac from his house his neighbor (an illegal alien) drunk out of his mind slammed into his 1 ton pickup and drove it though the side wall of his garage and broke the Gas and Electrical hook ups to his home. He ran out of his house and yanked the guy out of his car because he was trying to drive off but his car was too broken. About 5 minutes went by and the police showed up. The policeman had 6 guys stand on the sidewalk including the guy that rammed his house and asked my neighbor which one did it? He pointed at the guy that did it. I forgot to mention that when he hit the house it threw him into the steering wheel and left a half moon cut on his forhead. After my neighbor pointed out the guy the policeman went and talked with the guy. Soon after that the policeman returned and told my neighbor that the guy told him he had gotten into a fight earlier that day and that is how he got the cut on his head. My neighbor got really mad and the policeman threatend to write my neighbor a ticket for being in his underwear. I know this all sounds unbelievable but I went down and saw his house with my own eyes and his pickup and the illegals car.
I want you to know that I am reading and doing research into how to change things here. Its realy disheartining to see our community secumming to Gangs and people who have little or no regard for peoples property. Pretty much what has happened in our community is that a very large city near where I live basically told the hispanic gangs that if they didn't move out of the large city they were going to clean house. At the same time the police told these gangs that the city where I live would not mess with them and it would be in there best interest to move there. Well here we are with graffiti, Gangs, Illegals Drug dealers and lawlesness. Like I said in a previous post its getting time to move to the Country. Unfortunatly my home isn't worth what it used to be.

Bruce:

No, your story definitely does not surprise me----stories similar to yours are going on throughout the country!!!! The situation is only going to get worse in the very near future. If this immigration bill passes, you are going to have a US citizen uprising against the illegals---which is going to lead to riots!! If it doesn't pass, we are going to have illegals rioting in our streets----and they are going to become braver and more violent!!!

Definitely do all of the suggestions that I stated above. Believe me, you are NOT alone in your viewpoints!!!! A good place to find those people who believe that same as you are under the comments sections of your newspapers, everytime they post an article regarding the illegals.

Also, be sure to join the following forums/sites-----as you will find support, advice, information---- from thousands of US citizens throughout the country!!!!!!

www.minutemanhq.com
Go to The Forum>>>>then General Discussion

www.patriotscorner.com
Forum>>>General Patriot

www.numbersusa.com
Register>>>Go to Send FREE Faxes

www.americanpatrol.com
Articles/information regarding the illegals from throughout the country. The site is updated twice a day.

Bruce:

Also...........

If you go to www.minutemanhq.com and click on "State Chapters", you can see if there is a chapter in your area. If there isn't a chapter in your area, they will be able to refer you to organizations/people in your area who are also very active in trying to stop this illegal invasion.

Please don't believe all of the media BS regarding the Minuteman organization, as it is not true!!! However, just as you have become aware in regard to your police department, the majority of the media also supports the illegals. Therefore, they try to present the Minuteman organization as a racist, vigilante group. The Minuteman organization is made up of men, women, blacks, whites, Asians, and LEGAL Hispanics/Latinos. A large number of members of the organization are also former military and law enforcement.

Bruce:

This might help to wake up some people as well!!

Watch this video......These will be our new citizens!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBONmdeRvpM&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fsaveourstate%2Eorg%2Findex%2Ephp

Rob, I enjoyed reading your article. Reading thru the comments, gave me the urge to reply to many of you, mostly in agreement. Instead of a long drawn out commentary, let me instead say this:

I woke up about 10 yrs ago, after moving in to my first newly built home.
Its a small subdivision in a wealthy part of St Louis County. (no I am no longer wealthy, but I still live in my dream HA house)
I woke up because there are more foreigners here than any other place I have lived in. Most are fine, but some are the reason even the wealthy invaders are not welcome in america.
My next door neighbors are lower class asians who, while they own a chinese place to eat, when spoken to about a problem, they Pretend they do not understand english. So trying to explain to this man that blowing his leaves into my yard, and using the trash service that I pay for and digging up my Elephant Ear bulbs to eat is futile. I have been considering moving, and a big part of the reason is these non americans.

My other point is one of the differences in the people coming into America today.
We called ourselves a melting pot when the people moving here from other countries worked hard at Becoming Americans. They Wanted to learn to speak english and to become like the rest of us.
Not keep themselves separate while considering themselves better than the people born here.

This is my country and if you want to live here, the least you can do is try to blend in and act like an American. Pay taxes like the rest of us, and better this country, instead of trying to make it a place like your home country. If it was so great, stay there please.

Terry,
That was a well written Nutshell. I just got done writing a few of them to Senators, Congressmen and State representatives.

Copying Foreign Laws for America has been the in thing, especially for Liberal and Swing vote Judges on the Supreme Court (although nowadays we have only 1 swing vote Judge on the Supreme Court, making him a deciding Judge pretty much).

But since copying Foreign Laws is in, why don't we copy Mexico's laws on Immigration.

I also think we should capture and microchip illegal aliens.

I guess I have to ask if Mexico really enforces their laws? The U.S. has had for years immigration laws but they have never really been enforced.

The INS estimated that there were seven million illegal aliens residing in the United States in January 2000. According to INS, 69% of this unauthorized immigrant population was from Mexico. However, the top 15 sending countries accounted for 89% of the total illegal alien population and included Mexico, El Salvador, Guatemala, Colombia, Honduras, China, Ecuador, Dominican Republic, Philippines, Brazil, Haiti, India, Peru, Korea, and Canada. This means that a significant number of illegal aliens entered the United States through other than the Mexico-US border and that they fall under the jurisdiction of the investigations section (interior enforcement), not the Border Patrol. These statistics further indicate that the illegal alien problem is both a border and an interior enforcement problem. What is more important, the interior problem seems to be far greater than the border problem. However, the INS never placed much emphasis on interior enforcement. As a matter of fact, there is very little interior enforcement of the immigration laws going on. Interior enforcement lags behind all other functions of the agency and the INS clearly prioritized the Border Patrol function.

Eleven months ago, Colorado passed one of the toughest set of anti-immigration laws in the country. Now, heads of state agencies report that illegal immigrants really didn't use state services — and the new laws cost more to implement than they save.

I wonder what things would be like if my Ancestors had the foresight to have an immigration law?

1) You will not force us to forsake our language to speak yours.

2) All Government business will be conducted in our language.

3) Foreigners will not have the right to vote no matter how long they here.

4) Foreigners will never be able to hold political office.

5) You will not force us from our homes and put us on reservations that make us rely on Government assisted programs.

6) You cannot force your religion on us and send our children to boarding schools in which they are forced to learn Christianity and are not allowed to speak their own language.

7) Foreigners can buy land, but not the land we are already on, even if gold or oils are discovered on said land.

8) If Foreigners do want to buy land, which will be okay. But options are restricted, occupied land is reserved for citizens naturally born into this country.

9) Foreigners may not protest or bad mouth those who are already here.

10) If you do come to this country and can't play nicely, you will be hunted down and sent straight to jail or sent back from where you came. Likewise those carrying diseases like smallpox should not come at all.

I am some what joking here and yet I am saying things could have been a lot different.

At times I really believe that Americans should really be fearful. Not of the immigrants but of Americans. You see hate breeds violence and that is where we are heading. We live next to an open area, I am outside doing yard work and two men are mowing the open area. A car passes by and yells out obscenities and then go home Mexicans.

I talked to both of the men, one is a third generation American, his grandfather was born here and his father and of course so was he. The other man is a Hopi Indian and was born on the Hopi reservation, made in American so to speak for many generations. I am assuming those who drove by in their car with their blatant ignorance assumed they were from Mexico because of the men's dark skin and eye color.

Then again, so what if they had been from Mexico? Without seeing their paper work there is no way of knowing. There are many who have come here that have legally immigrated. No one can tell by looking at another person, if they were born here, if they are here legally or if they are here illegally. If all they can speak is Spanish that doesn't mean they are from Mexico. They could be from anywhere from South America to Spain.

Not only foreigners - but naturalized citizens of Mexico are also severely limited in what they can and cannot do - certain jobs such as Police and Government jobs are not available to non-native citizens.

Just IMAGINE the huge backlash if something like that were ever suggested HERE!!

Joan:

Also, consider this...................

If a US citizen resorted to fraud, identity theft----because his grandmother did not have insurance and that was the only way that he could get the life saving money for her operation-----do you think that he would get away with it????

But, we are supposed to accept/accommodate illegals committing fraud, identity theft, etc.-----because they had to do it in order to get a job.

Why is there a belief that America doesn't have immigration laws? Of course we do, but we also have the Constitution of the United States of America. It was written to protect everyone on American soil. At the time the Constitution was written more people here in America were immigrants than non-immigrants.

Among the most important sources of legal protection against governmental discrimination or abuse are the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the Constitution. They provide that no person will not be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law and that no person will be deprived of the equal protection of the laws. Thus, the right to due process, equal protection and the other fundamental rights that are encompassed by these principles apply to all persons in the United States, including non-citizens.

The Supreme Court has permitted each state to decide their own laws in certain respects, such as voting, elected office, policymaking positions in government, and certain jobs such as a police officer or school teacher, under a "political function" exception. More significantly, the Supreme Court has held that the federal government, because of its exclusive responsibility for supervising immigration, has broad powers to discriminate on the basis of alienage, including in federal benefits programs.

Immigration has built the political, economic and cultural strength of this county from colonial days to the present. Yet, virtually every group of newcomers has faced discrimination, hostility and stereotyping from those already here. Particularly in times of economic difficulty or fear about national security, immigrants are blamed for the problems of our society and are viewed with anger, suspicion and fear. Racial, religious and cultural prejudice, have fueled hostility toward each wave of new immigrants. For example, between the 1880's and 1965, immigration laws targeted Chinese, Japanese, Jews, Catholics, Italians, Mexicans, Eastern Europeans and other non-English speaking non-northern Europeans for discrimination. In each wave the group or nationality was stereotyped as refusing to learn English, as not assimilating, or as bringing hostile values or cultures to America.

Same song different dance, some things never change.

Nanina,
If you sat waiting for 4 years to become a citizen no matter what ethnic group you are and another group comes into the states Illegally and expects amnesty, is that fair or in any way equal opprotunity? Is it fair for a person not to get hired in a job or relieved in a job because they cant speak Spanish? Is it fair for a Illegal Imigrant not to pay taxes on the money he makes? Your making this about skin color. What its realy about is economics. We live in a time that employers want to get the job done for the cheapest labor possible. The Senator from Missouri said it best today. She could stop Illegal Imigration in no time flat. The way she described it was to put any Employer in a Federal Penatentairy for 6 months everytime they are cought with an Illegal Imigrant in there employee. Sure we can go to China and get things built for 30 cents an hour or Malaysia for 12 cents an hour or we could hire a Hispanic and pay him less because you dont have to pay for healthcare and the money is not reported. I am all for Legal Imigration, what I am not for is exploiting Illegal Imigrants and expecting the Tax Paying United States Citizens to foot the bill for money grubbing low life cheap employers. Excpecially when the employer is worth millions and billions of dollars. All I can say is that I was happy to see the system work today in the Senate. GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!!

Here is everyone that we all need to call and thank tomorrow!!!!!!!!

NAYs ---50
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Bond (R-MO)
Boxer (D-CA)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Cochran (R-MS)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Corker (R-TN)
Cornyn (R-TX)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Ensign (R-NV)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lott (R-MS)
McCaskill (D-MO)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Pryor (D-AR)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Sanders (I-VT)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Stevens (R-AK)
Sununu (R-NH)
Tester (D-MT)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Warner (R-VA)
Webb (D-VA)

Don't stop the momentum!!!! The illegals are going to be marching and demanding in our streets again within the next 2 weeks. Therefore, this bill did not die for good!!!!

Start calling, emailing, faxing, etc. and DEMANDING that they begin to enforce our current immigration laws!!!!


Also, in case anyone is not aware.....There is going to be a HUGE protest by US citizens (against amnesty) this Saturday in DC and state capitals throughout the country!!

Here is the information..................

March for America:

http://www.lframerica.com/march2.html

Nanina:

Illegals are NOT US citizens. Therefore, they are not entitled to any rights/benefits under our constitution-----except the right to be treated humanely while they are being deported.

The illegals have rights in their own countries, not ours.

Also, our ancestors came here LEGALLY. They had to fill out mounds of paperwork. They had to have health screenings. They had to prove that they would not be a burden upon society and other citizens. They had to wait patiently until they were allowed to enter through the LEGAL process.

When they got here, they kissed the American soil. Their first question was not "where is the welfare office". They did not DEMAND that citizens accommodate the customs, culture, language of their native countries. They immediately began to assimmilate and become part of the melting pot!!!

Bruce,

I will quit making it about skin color when others quit making it all about those coming in from Mexico. Because it really isn't, when a man can be admited here legally from the Ukraine. Turns out he sexually abused a young girl here. Turns out he had a long criminal record in the Ukraine. Of course he was deported but someone dropped the ball that he came here in the first place. Put yourself in a crowd of immigrants. Pick out the immigrants that are legally here, pick out the ones that aren't. You can't and I can't either.

Sadly as I told my children while they were growing up life isn't always fair. Many illegal aliens have lived here for ten or more years. Many were promised a better life here by the very employers you are talking about. They were given help getting into the U.S. The last I heard they weren't tax exempt when they bought food, clothing, bought cars, bought houses.

What I said up there is states make their own rules. Eleven months ago, Colorado passed one of the toughest set of anti-immigration laws in the country. In the state of Colorado if you are an employer and hire an illegal aliens you would pay fines for every illegal alien that you employ. Continue to hire more and the fines go up and yes there could be prision time.

Our hospitals and doctors are not allowed to treat illegals who are over 18 years-old. Unless it is a life or death emergency. Children are different of course and would be treated, as well as pregnant women. The state has also put a stop to financial help of any kind from the state for illegals. No food stamps, no welfare, no medical care for those over 18. What the heck are they to do? I am thinking they will be appearing in a town near you.

Yes, I will always say God Bless America, it is my home. My Ancestors have been here long before it was given the name America.

There are no simple answers to any of it.

Brenda,

That is where you are wrong. The constitution protect everyone on American soil. Just the way it is. Ask any immgration lawyer or some one in our Government they will tell you everyone even those who are just visiting by being here the constitution protects everyone who is on American soil.

The melting pot you are talking about. My Ancestors did not come here and kiss the ground they were already here. They were not allowed to speak their language but instead were forced to speak English. They weren't allowed to practice their spirituality but were forced to go to missionary schools. They were forced from their homes and put on reservations. So NO Brenda, your forefathers came here and did not immediately began to assimmilate and become part of the melting pot. Because if that was the case instead of English you all would be speaking my native language you see. Or a language of another American Indian tribe.

For one moment think how people are so afraid they might have to learn Spanish. Imagine if you were forced to speak only Spanish. If they took over your home and everything in it. Oh but don't worry about it, I survived reservation life as a child, I am sure you could as an adult.

--I'm pretty liberal, but it upset me when I see Mexican flags being paraded down
our streets during a protest. "Remember the Alamo"?

Nanina - thanks. I can barely stand participating in these immigration threads because they are so distorted by emotion and by a black and white way of looking at the world - no room for gray or for subtlety or for understanding the historicl conditions that have led so many to immigrate to the US.

There are huge problems with our immigration system, but punishing "illegals" is not the way to solve them.

Nanina, I am a 16th Cherokee, My Great Great Great Grandmother walked the trail of tears before my Grandfather picked her off of it and made her his Wife. Do you think The USA is a civilized Country? What makes the United States different than most third world Nations. Have you ever lived in a Third World Nation? Its easy to set in this Country and Form opinions (Your God Given Right). Try and go to one of these Third World Nations and form an Opinion. You might get your head chopped off or Shot in the head or made to wear a cover over your face. I have had the privalige of Visiting many third world nations. I have actually sent my son to Mexico to build houses for the Poor. I want to ask you how a Country becomes so corrupt as to not see that its inhabitents dont have Pottable running water, Sewer Systems, Medical Needs, But they can Import thousands of tons of Drugs to our country. How about if I dont like your way of Life so we start Genoside like in Africa? People fight for our way of life because its good (Not Perfect) Non of us on this thread have holes in our hands or feet (Jesus Christ). I will quote Tony Blair again (the true measure of a country is the amount of people wanting in not leaving). I live in an extremely liberal community that has allowed its streets to be lined with the Mexican Flag. I spent 13 years of my life defending the Red White and Blue and to see it turning to Red Green and White is extremely Disturbing to me. Its one thing to come to this country but to expect it to asimilate to the country you Imigrated from is another. It says to me that when 70% of the Nation sees a problem and the 30% doesnt, well again democracy worked even if you dont like it.

Isn't it illegal to fly any flag without or above the US flag anywhere in the USA?

We all need to start asking ourselves why so many people want to come to the USA. Why are we not making these countries responcible for there inhabitents instead of turning our heads the other way? This Country of ours is an Infant next to China, Europe, Africa, South America yet we have a system that was made in just over 200 years where people are running, swimming and pole vaulting over our borders. Why is that? I am going to quote a great historian who I think is (Socrates). He said that when to much of an Empires wealth falls into to few of hands it is the begining of the end of that Empires Power. We as Americans need to think long and hard about what this ancient philosipher was saying. Again this is about economics. Is there a middle class in China or Mexico? If there is how big is it as compared to the empoverished of those nations? France was a great power at one point in time until the poor started chopping off the rich peoples heads and started over. When you start cramming the low end of the pay scale it starts riots and that could happen right here in The USA if we let it happen.

Good Question Scott,
If not it should be.

Nanina:

"Eleven months ago, Colorado passed one of the toughest set of anti-immigration laws in the country. In the state of Colorado if you are an employer and hire an illegal aliens you would pay fines for every illegal alien that you employ. Continue to hire more and the fines go up and yes there could be prision time.

Our hospitals and doctors are not allowed to treat illegals who are over 18 years-old. Unless it is a life or death emergency. Children are different of course and would be treated, as well as pregnant women. The state has also put a stop to financial help of any kind from the state for illegals."


I guess that I am failing to see the problem with any of this. They are not US citizens. Therefore, they should not have these benefits and rights.

Let's see.......I will try to put it a different way.......US citizens and LEGAL immigrants are entitled to these rights and benefits. The illegals are not citizens and are not LEGAL immigrants, so they are NOT entitled to these rights and benefits.

They need to go back to their own countries and demand rights and benefits. The US and US citizens are NOT morally or financially responsible for these people.

Nanina:

"No food stamps, no welfare, no medical care for those over 18. What the heck are they to do?"


Let's see...........Perhaps they need to LEAVE and go back to their own countries.

Again, US citizens/tax payers and LEGAL immigrants are not responsible for paying for welfare, foodstamps, WIC, medical coverage, etc. for these people. What are you not understanding????

Nanina:

Just curious..........How much of your paycheck are you giving to the illegals?? How many do you currently have living with you???

They sound good to me.

The Cherokees in 1828 were not nomadic savages. In fact, they had assimilated many European-style customs, including the wearing of gowns by Cherokee women. They built roads, schools and churches, had a system of representational government, and were farmers and cattle ranchers.

The Trail of Tears refers to the forced relocation in 1838 of the Cherokee Native American tribe to Indian Territory in what would be the state of Oklahoma, resulting in the deaths of an estimated 4,000 of the 15,000 Cherokees affected. I am sure your grandmother mourned for her way of life and mourned for family members who lost theirs.

"What makes the United States different than most third world Nations. Have you ever lived in a Third World Nation?"

No, I have never lived in a "Third World Nation." At least not outside of the United States.
Life in the Pine Ridge Reservation is very poor, probably easily comparable to the least developed countries of the Third World. Unemployment on the Reservation hovers around 85% and 97% live below the Federal poverty level. Average annual family income is $3,800. Adolescent suicide is four times the national average. Many of the families have no electricity, telephone, running water, or sewer. Many families use wood stoves to heat their homes. The population on Pine Ridge has among the shortest life expectancies of any group in the Western Hemisphere: approximately 47 years for males and in the low 50's for females. The infant mortality rate is five times the United States national average.

The United States is different than Third World Countries because we have the people who have, and the people who have not. The United States has many advantages to offer, but a stable, affordable health care system is not one of them. The phrase health care crisis is perhaps too mild. Costs are skyrocketing, lawsuits proliferating. Significant portions of the population can no longer afford adequate health insurance. As a result, to get good health care in the United States you have to know what you're doing. You just can't afford not to be fully informed, since health care is the one area where the American system can do you the most damage.


"I want to ask you how a Country becomes so corrupt as to not see that its inhabitents dont have Pottable running water, Sewer Systems, Medical Needs."

A recent study by Harvard University researchers found that the average out-of-pocket medical debt for those who filed for bankruptcy was $12,000. The study noted that 68 percent of those who filed for bankruptcy had health insurance. In addition, the study found that 50 percent of all bankruptcy filings were partly the result of medical expenses. Every 30 seconds in the United States someone files for bankruptcy in the aftermath of a serious health problem.

There are pockets in the U.S.A. where children go to bed hungry, people can't afford to heat their homes and people die because they can't afford health care. So I don't need to leave America to see poverty, it is here, if you look for it. I am talking about American Citizens and why don't we protect our own citizens? Does anyone in his right mind believe that the $9 billion in humanitarian aid we'll send overseas next year will get to the sick people?

"Its easy to set in this Country and Form opinions (Your God Given Right)."

The truth is God has nothing to do with the rights' you or I have. The Forefathers did, our Ancestors who fought in every war here and overseas.

You see I am proud to be an American as well as an American Indian. I am also very aware that we are all related, brothers in the eyes of God. None better than the others, I doubt God cares about borders on this Mother Earth.

I love my Country but that doesn't mean there is nothing wrong with it. Some things will have to happen in health care, immigration, etc . . .

What bothers me the most is the prejudice and racism that I see going on here. The likes that I haven't seen since the late 60's. This prejudice goes beyond illegals and affects legal immigrants and generations of people whose great-grandparent immigrated years ago. These people are not at fault that our government doesn't enforce our immigration law. If people have to place blame then it needs to be placed where it belongs, our government.