If I were God, Creator of Everything, what would I do about the current mess here on Earth? What would I do about the great danger posed by the confrontation between Islam and the Christian West?
The first thing I would do is to create a large new island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. I would stock it with plenty of food and water, weapons and ammunition.
Then I would look into the heart of every person on the planet, and I would pick out all of those with malice in their hearts toward others who have different thoughts about Me. Particularly, I would seek out the religious leaders who fulminate about the evil nature of those with whom they disagree, and incite hatred and promote war to advance their own power and prestige.
I would pick them up, all of them, and deposit them on the island. And I would tell them, “You have all sworn to attack and kill those who have different faiths. Well, have at it. Oh, and by the way, all your leaders are here with you, and they will lead you into battle.”
For awhile at least, the earth would be free of constant warfare, and people could lead decent, peaceful lives, enjoy the company of friends and family, and the beauty and bounty of this incredible planet that I have provided for them.
Of course, things would not be perfect. Humans, poor pitiful creatures that they are, have a multitude of other problems…greed, selfishness, envy and jealousy, a thirst for power over others, and worst of all, self-righteousness. Because even though the warmongers were gone, there would still be many devout believers in their chosen faith, and they would still be convinced that theirs was the only right one. They would continue to pester and harangue everyone around them and to try to influence the government to impose their beliefs on everyone else. And then, the disagreements would turn in to arguments, and the arguments would turn into fights, and the fights would turn into wars, and we would be right back where we are now, and I would have to do another housecleaning.
(Sigh) I don’t know how long it will take them to realize that what another person thinks about Me is none of their business. But, by getting rid of the lunatics who are trying to destroy everything on the planet, they would have a little time to work on the rest of their problems before the next batch of loonies comes along.
Hmmmm. I better make that a VERY large island.
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Comments: 69
If you were God of the universe you wouldn't do any of those things - you've already proven you don't have human characteristics like compassion, anger, etc. You've left us to cope with disease, hunger, fouling our entire globe. Why would you do anything about those you proposed to put on that island?
Good post.
Gary...You're right, of course. There are more than a few logical problems in this piece. But it was entertaining to write, and, I hope, to read...tongue-in-cheek, with a not-so-subliminal message. If I gnash my teeth, I am just ignored, so I try to inject a little humor.
No doubt, any god who can allow the things that Gary mentions has something else in mind other than complete interference with everything and everyone. Free will being an important underlying attribute, I would say that any God who even ALLOWS those evil-doers you talk about to be in the first place, must be testing THE REST OF US, for our inner qualities.
Because it isn't the quality of suffering, the pain and injustice that defines and characterizes us, it is our response to these conditions that make us who we are.
Daily, we turn our backs on poverty, starvation and injustice, throwing our hands up and either telling God to do His job, or feel unempowered to do it ourselves.
The sooner we realize that the relief of suffering is OUR job, and not God's job, we will certainly be doing His work.
1. Thou shall not be self-righteous.
I think that would solve a multitude of problems in the world.
23 would be a denial of everything most religions espouse...traditional beliefs trump progress
24 is a self-eating watermelon.
If I were God for real, however, I'd just keep my Word.
That's good enough for me!
;)
Soni
I don't see it that way. I think the founders of our country were right about people having "unalienable rights."
On the other hand, a Muslim who says that all Christians are "infidels" because they do not believe in Allah and the literal words of the Koran, and that they should be attacked, and either converted to Islam, subjugated (enslaved) or killed...I think that is a different kettle of fish. And I call that self-righteousness.
Of course, Christians are similarly, if not quite so violently, opposed to different religious viewpoints.
I think all of this is self-righteous bullshit...but I think the efforts to stop infringments of human rights are not.
Call me prejudiced or whatever. It's a bias that I have.
By the way, you might enjoy re-reading the article. I made some changes.
Your writing still has that edge! Stir 'em up!
Good idea Bert, but all the nice folks left...all one hundred of them, would eventually breed into millions, then billions, and create all kinds of whacky religions based on books written by their ancestors, and the cycle would repeat itself as some got rich, and powerful, and greedy....Religion, and greed are the two worst things that exist on this planet, and you will never rid the planet of those things.
Don't give me any crap about how good christians are...they have slaughtered millions in the name of their religion down through the ages! If their is a God, and I kinda doubt it...then he is probably sending a 20 mile diameter asteroid our way in the near future! His dinosaur experiment lasted 100 million years longer than his human experiment, and he wants his next experiment to decend from cockroaches!
Be sure to save a few precious gallons of gas, and a bottle of Jack Daniels, so we can all get in the car in the garage and check out peacefully before the asteroid hits!! ~laugh~
Sorry to take so long responding. I just got back from three weeks in Africa, and I'm still fuzzy from the jet lag.
You definitely will not get any crap from me about good Christians. I have written a lot here on Gather (in both articles and comments) about the horrendous acts committed in the name of religion, particularly Christianity. Religions are, by definition, intolerant, so the religious intolerance of any individual is pretty much in direct proportion to his/her level of religious belief...devoutness. Many Christians are decent, tolerant people. That's because they don't accept the teachings of their religion. Even if they claim to.
The second planet would be for the warmongers. All who want more than their share of the wealth, who take from others, hoard, steal and live for power over all. They would have the same as the peaceful planet, everything they need.
I wonder which world would thrive best. Which world would use up their resources and which world would be the healthiest in mind, body and spirit. Would the warmongers eventually change places with the peaceful, the peaceful become bored and seek ways to create "excitement"? Would those given all they needed so freely decide they wanted more?
Great article, Bert. Thanks for sending me here.. and hope you didn't mind my sharing ideas with you.
Your "thought experiment" is interesting. The question is, do the peaceful folks and the warmongers share, deep down, the same human traits that I listed in the article above?
If so, before long, the two planets would suffer from the same problems...or they would both solve the problems and learn to coexist.
If there are inherent differences in people...some seeking power and wealth, others content with peaceful lives raising their families...then the planets will remain different, and the second one will probably end up a radioactive cinder.
It is especiallly interesting to speculate on the answer...because it may point to the fate of our planet.
I watched an episode on the Science Channel once where college men were conducting an experiment. They divided themselves into Guards and Prisoners. The setting was real, in a jail. I can't remember how long this lasted.. but a few weeks is my best guess. When the experiment first began, all the college guys were of healthy minds, and of good spirit. They actually had to shut the experiment as it became almost dangerous. "The guards" .. given all the power over the "Prisoners" became abusive and intolerable.. their personalities actually began to change. The "Prisoners" became dependent, fearful and angry.
We see it all the time with Preachers who start out with a humble attitude.. very meek, and by the time they've achieved a huge following of worshipers (who actually worship the preacher) His ego is so inflated he becomes a greedy megalomaniac.
We watched this phenomenon between male and female in our country.. In your day, a lot of women were depicted as weak, silly, and someone to poke fun at. ( I've watched all the oldies..and even the strong women, were still weak, frail, and silly minded ). Men were "HE MEN" strong, intelligent and could do anything. They wielded the power over all. Now the roles are reversed. Men are sex objects, weak, silly minded, and someone to be made fun of.
Personally, I think there may be something to the philosophy of reincarnation.. if not through death.. at least while we are still living (in a sense). I think we get to act out most every scenario presented in life on a spiritual level. ( I use the word spiritual for lack of a better definition ) If we steal from an old woman who has nothing, eventually we become the old woman with nothing. If we are kind and giving, it is returned when we least expect it, and probably wonder where it came from. In the reincarnation of death into life .. over and over again.. it's may be possible that if we lived as a tyrant, we return as the victim. (role reversal). Perhaps this is the key to our growth, to experience all of it, and learn to understand it. (even if we don't consciously remember it) These are just thoughts that mill around in my head from time to time. It is actually the thrust behind much of what I do and say..even on Gather. (and I'm quite aware that most do not understand me, due to opinion, with only the ability to view me through their own "eyes")
We are all born to love, hate, fear, want, experience jealousy, envy and indifference. It's through these senses that we must learn. I'm not sure that one life time would do it for most people.
So, I do believe that the two planets would eventually trade places. Warmongers get tired of the carnage and destruction, and the peaceful long for more, which leads them down the path of want, greed, power, and so forth.
just my random thoughts.. ;-)
Certainly, a lot of poor downtrodden people go through life and then die with no apparent reward. Likewise, people like Stalin live long, comfortable lives with no apparent retribution for the atrocities they engineered. Maybe they were/are punished or rewarded in their next lives. It's a comforting thought...if you can believe it.
I think most humans would be devastated if we knew for certain that there is nothing more than birth and death.. nothing before, nothing afterward. No reward, no retribution, or "punishment".
I'm intrigued with the studies being conducted on this. I have read accounts of children who recall a past life, give great details and can be proven true. This gives me cause to think there's something to an afterlife. Wouldn't it be nice if we could come back from the dead and tell all? But I have a feeling everyone would come back with a different experience, or reality.. and we (the living) would still remain confused.
I don't expect or need anything more than that.
But you have pinpointed the reason that religion exists. A lot of people get comfort from the idea that when they die...they don't. Even if they're wrong, it gives them comfort, so that's not so bad. The problem with religion is what this article addresses. For most people, their faith is a personal comfort and that's the end of it.
But for some...it's much more than that. It's an obsession and obsessions can have nasty results.
So...the only other choice is...we non-lunatics have to take control of the affairs of the earth.
and the religious people are saying the same thing about everybody else.
I think the key is finding a way to coexist peacefully, and take care of the lunatics (a word actually used to describe the mentally ill.)
And if we take good look at this new conversation on this thread, we are pretty much describing the concept of heaven and hell.
With regard to lunatics, Richard Dawkins (among others) have described religious faith as a form of insanity. He argues that there is no RATIONAL justification for belief in God or Heaven or Hell...and certainly none for the myths surrounding Jesus...immaculate conception, resurrection, etc. Therefore, it is a form of self-delusion...a mental illness.
At the risk of being accused of self-promotion, I wrote yet another piece called "Religion...or Insanity?" Here is the link.
I wanted to leave my thoughts here before shutting down the computer (which has been running all day, while I've been busy with other matters off line)
Have you ever read the things written by the Sumerians? According to their stories, The Gods (other live beings not originally from earth) created humans by tampering with the DNA of an upright living creature who had already evolved, transplanting the God's genetics resulted in homo sapiens. The demi gods discovered they couldn't live forever, and their lives were much shorter than their parents. Their entire lives revolved around attempting to devise ways to prolong their longevity, thus inbreeding, creating religions to please themselves, and setting themselves up as Gods on earth. The stories of immaculate conception, resurrection, etc.. are not unique to christianity. Those concepts were adopted from myths and ancient religions long before.. as was the story of Noah's Flood on down to The birth of Jesus (Mithra).
Therefore, it is a form of self-delusion...a mental illness. Of which I tend to agree.
I'm off to read the link you provided above.
If I were concerned about ratings, I would definitely not write articles critical of religion. I would only post games and "What is your favorite (fill in the blank)?
But because all is relative, the way I see it (and I am tempted to write a book about it) there is but ONE GOD, the one that I follow, that of the BET (+=-), and therefor according to the understandings and the misunderstandings of the Christian Bible, their God is God from the worldly sense only, NOT the universal sense.
In other words, the Sumerian tablets were the story of this worlds relationship to mere god(s) which "caused" them and subsequent similar peoples to write stories about their relationship with earth humans such that said humans would consider "those beings" as their God for all practical "earth purposes" ... and the intended reason being to cause them to do and act in certain ways, because "they" intended to return ... there being a purpose for it all to which we were not supposed to know of yet.
It has been because of my own experience with a GOD (because GOD is transcendent to God) compared to what I understood GOD to be all about, ultimate truth and unconditional love, that I have decided that the Religious versions of their God, to be lesser, because "He" is too conservative and demanding ... and not at all very nice much of the time ... at least based upon His followers thoughts, words, and actions, at least it would sure seem to be so.
Of course Jesus was one to also recognize that, and attempted to turn the perception around in referring to His Father as the ONE GOD ... but the folks here on earth couldn't get that "Old Testament" story out of their minds sufficiently to understand the merits of His transcendent understanding ... typically, they worshipped Him as a God also, even though he was but a man at the time, now a god, and only sought to tell the truth, not to be worshipped.
IMnsHO.
But one could only come up with these perceptions of mine had they been open enough to allow themselves the potentials ... and something the "boxed in" Religious folks will never allow themselves the freedom to do because their Religious dogma denies them that freedom.
IMnsHO.
but when you say things like this;
But one could only come up with these perceptions of mine had they been open enough to allow themselves the potentials ..
it makes my skin crawl. My immediate question is "who the *expletive* do you think you are, that you are so much more "open" than any other human being on this earth? When I read your stuff, it seems like dogma to me.. only it's yours explicitly.
It always amazed me how people can be so preachy AS IF they've cornered the market on God, Gods and gods and the state of mankind.
Saying IMnsHO doesn't even excuse or soften the egocentricity of your statements.
I always get a kick out of the big egos that claim that I am one of them only worse ... let's you and I speak more here about this with specifics and see if we can get to the bottom of it ...
That is the most judgmental, ego driven, holier than thou, SELF RIGHTEOUS statement you've ever made to me, Jerry.
and others such as yourself evidently do not
Who the fuck ARE you, Jerry? God's advocate? You've been to the nether world? To Heaven and back? To hell and back? Spoken with the angels? Seen the gods, G*d and Gods? Been dead and lived to tell about it? Have you had contact with the ETs? Maybe you were abducted and they gave you all this knowledge that makes you superior to all others in understanding?
pffft! You may think you have a clue.. but in reality, maybe you need to see a shrink.
I don't think that, Jerry..and never alluded to any such thing. I have a problem with your thinking you have a relationship with GOD higher than anyone else. Jim Jones thought he had a special relationship with GOD too.. then he drank the kool aid. Hopefully you don't have followers, Jerry. I'd hate to see your head become any more swollen than it already is.
My head is not swollen in the slightest, that is only an ego concept, not applicable in this case on my end. I will NOT "pretend" to be humble though, as the orthodox perception is "supposed" to require of a spiritual person, that is just another misperception as to what those such as Jesus were "supposedly" like, meant to keep everyone meekly in their place under the "authorised" church leaders.
I would never seek followers, I am completely against such, I would hope be a teacher creating more teachers though, but most people with overactive egos reject all such because they either think they already know it all, or they will not allow themselves to think that another could be better than themselves at something, so they would rather suck all that try back down to their level ... like the religious that claim all are sinners, that none can know God better than them and that any that claim to have something to pass on to folks from God are but false prophets ...
Debra, with your apparent frame of mind about me, I would never expect you to read my freely downloadable book, but I would think that if you did, you would sure change your tune, because the perception you now hold is not accurate ... period. (I left off the IMnsHO just for you).
the thing is Jerry, you come very close to preaching, rather than state what you believe. I can accept what you believe for YOU, and can even respect that.. but I won't be force fed your beliefs as if I should take the time to adopt them. I have my own ways and beliefs, and ponder the same things you do. You hold no higher morals, higher god, higher spirituality, or knowledge above mine. No one does and I don't play follow the leader.
You take a very ignorant step in the wrong direction with statements such as you have posted above in your previous comments. It's not a matter of whether or not I understand it. You don't know if I do or not..and when you make assumptions, you make an ass out of yourself. Don't "talk AT me", I will never listen to you.
It makes YOU appear to be the opposite of what you preach to others about ego, superiority and self righteousness. Concentrate on how you're projecting your beliefs onto others. You don't have that right.
You don't know me or what I believe or what I don't believe, I'm not a fool who feels the need to share it. It belongs to me, and it's very personal. My actions in my life do all the speaking for me, as contrary as I may seem to most on the internet, "thar's a whole nuther world outside of that screen!!" I will not read your books..simply because I'm really not interested in them. I've looked at them in the past. You are another one in a million with thoughts and ideas to share. You may be unique in your own rite, and you may be right about a lot of things. I get real turned off by those trying to sell me something.. even if it's "for free".
Usually when someone harps on one single thing, such as "egos" in your case, it is the very thing they need to concentrate on and apply to themselves. I'm sure you can't see it, and when others do, you point your finger at them and make unfounded accusations. Your mission in life is to work on self.. not work on my last nerve.
I have a message that I deem to be from the realm of GOD at some level or other and I have been told by that source to tell others, probably not unlike Jesus was also advised. But in a society that has been brainwashed by institutionalized religion, there is another whole perception about such things, one in great error I might add and the concept I propose requires absolutely nothing of anyone other than seeking ultimate truth ... anybody that would have a problem with that surely has a very serious problem, especially those that take the message personally when it was never intended be be so.
All of the things that you say about my supposed ego are fully understandable to me as I have already told you, that and how egos commonly get upset by seemingly "competing" egos, I accept that and do what I do because I know it to be the only way that I can in order to be true to myself and others.
I serve my "mission" as best that I am able and always seek ways to do it better, but all in all, I could care less if some get upset because I am only really seeking the relatively few that are ready and I know that they exist out there in the world someplace, I myself was one of them once and I very much appreciated it when I found the information I sought from experienced people, I only hope to help other such beings. Any that want can ignore me to their hearts content, but those that challenge me as you have here after I commented simply on the comment of yours mentioning the Sumerians without malice, they will hear back from me.
The reason I come on like I do also is because conflict and contention get people interested and creates a larger crowd of readers then the typical Gather point whoring of simple one-liner "game" activity and the like, typical things so many people frivolously spend their time doing rather than getting into the deeper philosophy of what makes this world tick ... I would rather spend my time and effort at making a difference with the intention of helping this world without hurting it ... but if egos feel hurt then I will help them further attempt to come to realize just what an ego is all about, maybe a seed will get planted that will eventually grow to the point that they can transcend that ego.
In a nutshell, to each their own, there is something for everybody ...
I left religion years ago, Jerry. Do you not believe that Spirit works with all of mankind? You may deem yourself a messenger, but you are not the message. You are as human as the next guy, equipped with ego. My message to you is, "tend to your own, first and foremost". Others will follow by example. By all means keep putting your words out there. My problem with you comes when you step over the line and allude to being the know all. You aren't. You are only an interpreter of your own dreams.
I have never claimed to "be" the message, on the contrary, I have also mentioned that is a major problem with religion, "they" worship the messenger rather than his message.
I am every bit as human as the next guy with an ego, only I am aware of the fullness of it and then some. The then some is what I promote and those who know it not yet, really have no basis to criticise it, other than by their ego "feelings".
My "awakening" was no mere dream and the more folks want to deny the validity of what I say it was the less chance of them ever experiencing it, their loss, but it in no way takes anything away from me.
What I claim to know of is my truth and how that relates to the truth of GOD as I interpret that, then also as it relates to God and gods ... you shouldn't really put down what you do not know about, learn first, then discuss on the issues.
I "was" going to appease your ego and let you have the last word until I decided to honour your asking of a question of me ... :-)
Jerry,
With all due respect...
I was going to stay out of this, but I need to make one comment.
You say it correctly above. It is YOUR truth. It may not be truth for anybody else.
I think that is what Debra is trying to say. She objects to your evangelizing.
I know your motives are sincere, but I am often troubled by the "preachiness" of your remarks too.
If I could offer a little well-meant advice: Take a little "heat" off your preachings. My guess is that you will find people more receptive.
But if one looked up that word they would find that what I am doing is anti-evangelizing ... a bit of a difference I believe. The problem is that evangelicals have so turned so many people off to the idea of a God even, that they put up a wall against any kind of God.
What I offer in concept could make any atheist happy I would think, IF they could take the time to understand it and not dismiss it as just more religious BS ... it has nothing to do with religious concepts, for sure requires absolutely nothing from anybody other than the seeking of truth ...
Sure it is not every-one's truth ... yet ... as far as they know now ... but it may well be their real truth and they just don't yet know about it.
So the way I look at it all, is that we are really headed for some kind of showdown here on earth, like a cosmic season associated with the time period near 2012 ... I have studied just far too much ancient information that indicates such to me and all of my spiritual experience backs that up 100% (figure of speech, could be a bit less) ... point being, time is of the essence, both in world time and my own advanced age ... I know what I am doing, I know how a lot of people take it, but that is just "my" way, and as I recently said, I have to be honest and truthful about that, realizing that a lot of people will get ticked off and reject both me and the message ... can't be helped without compromising the truth of it all.
The world is overrun with people handing out messages of one kind or another of spirituality or religion and most of them demand so much from people ... mine does not ... but then for those that believe that with no pain there is no gain ... they can accept Christianity from the evangelicals if they want to believe that line.
To you Bert I will apologise for the preachiness ... but that can be solved by not taking it personally ... if possible. Just because I believe in GOD, does not make me a theist as is commonly defined ... I do not see GOD as a "creator" or a "supreme ruler" ... that is why I often mention panentheism as being closer to what I believe ...
But the major difference between myself and most evangelizers, including their "authorized" leaders, is that I have had personal experience far more transcendent than theirs ... that is just truth and fact as far as I am concerned ... and I will be damned, in more ways than one, if I do not tell my truth ... so my truth is most often used against, in the "preachy" manner you mention, those who insist that they are closer to God than I am when I can tell by my experience, intelligence and whatever wisdom I may have, that they are wrong, that they are coming from a dualistic ego position because everything they say and do proves it to me ... and I know so well what egos are all about and the normal egos know nothing of transcendence ...
So in a nutshell, I am not out to play a role and impress people into liking me ... the madder and the more pissed off some get the more I might prod them because I believe I know something that can actually help them even though they think not ... I am just that confident about it all that I would give my very life for the cause, it is NOT an ego thing with me, it is a spiritual mission ... but unlike say a Muslim terrorist, I am not out to hurt anyone, on the contrary.
I know I am rambling here and uncoordinated around the issues and skipping around and repeating myself ... but I am trying so hard to have it make sense to you without offending you ... actually I am not worrying about offending you all that much because I think that you understand just enough to not get offended.
But when it comes to some religious person that I feel is coming on from an ego position telling me I am just another ego less deserving than their own when it come to knowing about these subjects, then I really could care less if they get offended, it just goes with the territory, it is the nature of the beast ... I know that I am doing my own best and that I am doing it with the blessing of one that matters more to me than a bunch of egos ...
I will end with that for now ... though as you know, I could go on and on and on ... and I will here on Gather before I get done ... which could very well happen real soon if and when I determine that there is no one at all that is interested ... but every now and then I find that there are some few who are ... and that makes all of this worth it.
The "heat" comes from the frustration of having such a great and harmless message that could so make such a huge difference to this world that so many complain about yet they seem to care less about really finding out how simple it would be to cure all of it's ills and make every one extremely happy ... GEESH !!! (as they say) :-)
PS ... I have also found that the more heat and controversy in the threads on these subjects, the longer they last before they die and the more viewers (readers) tune in ... so the more exposure any message gets overall ... just another reason I keep the heat on. I think it works ... and the person I may have the most conflict with here will most likely better remember the issue and eventually benefit from it, even when trying hard to deny, the truth just hangs around that way and their own intuition will eventually convince them of it. IMnsHO.
Beats the hell outta me. No doubt atheists are thrilled at the idea too.
Have you forgotten the huge number of times we've discussed this very matter, and I've tried to explain to you that even if you yourself are in the "divine" condition you claim, your message is being heard by just plain folks? You repeating much rhetoric about higher this and deeper that, has no meaning; No one knows what is higher or deeper than what they themselves feel is high and deep.
If you would simply reason this though, one damn time, it would dawn on you that people simply believing what you're telling them they ought to believe, will turn them into egocentric reactionaries. There's simply no justification for the notion that folks already inclined toward self righteousness will not be driven even deeper into that hole by your preaching. You offer no safeguards or cautions of any kind.
But just one more time I will repeat, that what I ask of people, is to seek the very highest truths withIN and people who do not understand that, or who are unwilling to do just that, are beyond help anyway and whatever they then do will result in other lessons for them. By their "fruit" they shall be known, and in the greater picture there are no accidents, so karma will insure that innocents are not adversely affected by folks who are less than honest or able to understand the truth.
How can one not take what you direct at them as personal? You make unfounded accusations and are condescending.. as if you are talking down to others.. that takes a HUGE EGO to do that, Jerry! You most certainly wouldn't get away with it talking to me face to face! You would talk to me with respect, or you wouldn't talk to me at all. You've got a lot of nerve judging people the way you do.. and I'm not just referring to pointing out what bothers you about someone .. I'm referring to the fact that you think you are speaking from superior position, and REFUSE to acknowledge your own egotistic arrogance. You don't know anything other than what your own brain and life's experiences allow you to know.
But in another you address me with PERSONAL, as IF you know me or what I know. "learn first, then discuss on the issues." That comments makes me want to tell you to go F*** yourself, Jerry! What makes me laugh is that when I read some of your stuff, I shake my head in disbelief of your arrogance.
Spoken like a true PREACHER, Jerry!
But just one more time I will repeat, that what I ask of people, is to seek the very highest truths withIN and people who do not understand that, or who are unwilling to do just that, are beyond help anyway and whatever they then do will result in other lessons for them. By their "fruit" they shall be known, and in the greater picture there are no accidents, so karma will insure that innocents are not adversely affected by folks who are less than honest or able to understand the truth.
I left the CHURCH, PREACHING AND RELIGION a long time ago. Why should I listen to YOU?
You're no better in your approach and pointing the crooked finger at everybody else.
That's the one thing you and John have most in common. In real life, the two of you would probably be the best of friends!
Well, I'm done with this thread. Jerry, you want every one else to see things the way you see them, but you refuse to see anything through anyone else's perspective. Your own flaws have been pointed out to you.. and many others see it. Change your own ways before attempting to ask others to change theirs.
What Debra said. (mostly ; )
" . . . what I ask of people, is to seek the very highest truths withIN"
This is to me utterly without meaning. Truths are not arranged along a vertical plane in my head. You might just as well tell me to seek the prettiest, or warmest, or chunkiest truths. And how I could possibly seek truths anywhere but within, is a complete mystery to me. It's not as if one could go to the store and but a pack of truths, they exist exclusively "withIN".
If what you are saying, is nothing more really than that folks ought to go with what seems the best understanding they have . . . well, I got news; That's what every human being that ever walked the Earth has done. Nobody seeks less than the "highest truth", it makes no sense at all.
Drop the Special linGO, and you're not really asking much of anything.
YES !!! By YOUR standards ... I, am the height of egocentricity ... absolutely !!! I realize that and that is what I am trying to tell everyone ... the normal ego can only judge from it's own standards, the ego, the self (as in smaller self) ... that is a fact and truth no matter how you cut it. This is an ego controlled world with ego followers, you are all what makes up the normal world social condition ... for the most part ... but naturally there are exceptions ... there always are.
I just happen to be one of them ... but you will never allow an understanding of that as long as your ego insists upon it's own perfection and you are happy with your condition in life and how the world is acting around you ... no, not until you begin to open for something better will you begin to look for it ...
Many secular people are content with their own views, no problem (unless that creates them), others have found what they want in religions, no problem (unless that creates them), and still others have become atheists, again, no problem (unless that creates them).
Yes, your personal truth will be found withIN yourself ... but when that self is the ego, and there is nothing higher that you will trust as much, then you are limited. The ego is all alone primarily, that is the nature of the ego, disconnected from other(s), an island unto itself ... except for secondary relationships of convenience sometimes considered necessity to other(s) ... which may be a mate and/or for religious folks an idea of God ...
But without exception, the ego standard will never have a real concern for the totality of all of creation, it will ever be selfish to some degree. That degree shows up beyond the self in my family first and in my religion first ... and on down the line of associations. Always there will be a line drawn where allegiance will terminate and the other will become an enemy to be feared, resisted, fought, or even killed ... because all that is most valuable is the ego and it's realm. That is normal human nature !
When the ego seeks truth, even within, it will be highly affected by what it remembers from the information previously received from without, from others over it's lifetime ... from other egos ... and all egos have a selfish agenda ... such information then is but the Blind leading the blind when you get right down to it.
Now readers are reading this and saying "no way" ... that nothing is that cut and dried ... and they are right. Yes, we all have an INtuition, a 6th sense that deals in subjective matters more associated with the mind, an ephemeral thing that the ego thinks is found only within it's brain, a physicality centered in the individuals head, the very center of all prioritized reality.
But no ... the mind is an energy of intelligence interconnected throughout all of creation, it is of the spirit of GOD and available to all that would realize and use it ... it is in no way limited to the ego and it's brain ... the brain is but a tool of the ego physical body, the hardware of the computer ... the mind is the intelligence that programs the hardware.
The mind then is the very Soul, the higher Self, the Spiritual aspect INside of each of us related to GOD, that which transcends the ego self ... that which the ego self must come to cooperate with, to actually love and trust as the very most important thing in all of creation ... because that is the very closest that one will ever come to GOD during their lifetime here on earth ... and such a relationship will also determine your eternity !!!
That is the message I offer, as simple and straight forward as it gets, it will be found to consist of unconditional love as the very truth that will set you forever free ... it transcends the ego ... yet the ego is allowed to continue on in cooperation with the totality of GOD's creation offering it's services for the betterment of all, for the total, with no favourites.
Now what is so hard to understand about that ??? ... probably everything if the ego wants to stay in charge. But all have that INtuition whether they acknowledge, realize, or trust ... or not ... it still affects everything we do and think as the small little voice inside of us, what some call their conscience, it is there ... all we need do is cultivate it and seek to trust it's truth.
I have had the experience that I say and I know of what I speak ... any that have done likewise will be in agreement because it is commonly called the "perennial philosophy" that transcends ego normality and is at the core and essence of the beginnings of all viable religions and spiritualities ... it is natural, generic and personal in it's highest essence, it is the highest truth available to mankind ... bar none ... period !!!
No apology is necessary.
Anyway, I sure enjoyed the theme of your article here ... and I must say it must have took hold of me subliminally because I recently, without even remembering the above, posted a comment of my own that amounted to much the very same thing ... and I was roundly castigated by some overly righteous Christians ... much as anticipated here in your own article. Some things just never change. The need for "our plan" gets greater every day.