ok Folks lets line this up!!!
QUIET in the room. Please Quiet !!!
- Asking or arguing with TJ about his opinions is one thing, attacking a historical fact about his Church is another. He was not there, nore was I but it is the history of my Church also.
- Lauren said "... i am just so offended by some of his comments against women and gays that i can't justify giving him points..."
- Why are you Choosing to be Offended? It is a choice, yours not his. Grow up and choose to be offended or not.
- To all of you who have made mention particularly negative ones about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints nick named "Mormons", if you truly have a desire to understand where we come from ideological/theologically and even historically feel free to ask me, not just assume you know what you truly do not yet know and can't know with out a bit of reading and perhaps discussion with a member of the church. I was a missionary, I would like nothing better then to share what we believe, and why we believe it. Don't use a foolish argument with a 15 year old to Attack a religion with 12,000,000 + million members around the world, it is unjustified and foolish. I would not do it about your "church" or "religion" just because I disagreed with you about your opinion...
- I wish I had been as articulate at age 15. I may not agree with all he says (I say that because I have only read two of his articles) but I am impressed with his ability to form an argument stand up for his opinions and to not denigrate himself or others by getting overly emotional and swearing or spewing rude comments all across the e-verse.
- TJ I reserve judgment on your opinions, I will read and we shall see, but I say Amen Brother to your right and ability to share your opinions.
This has been brought to you by a Conservative, (I was conservative before I was a Mormon) and a Father of 3 with a wonderful wife that has worked outside the home and now does not. She instead has used her creative talents to make all natural soaps and lip balms that she sells on the Internet and has also in a few shops. She works with me raising chickens so that our eggs are free because we sell the extra making enough to pay for the feed etc. She also is helping to raise the rabbits, we will be selling some for food (no-cholesterol meat the only type in the world) and a smaller bread we will sell for pets. She also writes, commiserates and helps others. We both believe in sacrificing for the greater good of our family, not just our wants... like the years we went without gifts to each other so that the children had what they needed, or the other years we went without gifts till February because that was when IRS would make it possible for us to have Christmas ( the kids did get something but no non needed items till February). If this is what is meant my feminist, I guess she would be called one, but she doesn't call herself one mainly because of all the so called ones that seem to Promote infanticide and promote (not protect) Lesbianism and hate for men. (no didn't say this was any of you) but look at the "Now Gang" many of them do act like that... Is my wife life fulfilled, I think so, feel free to ask her, is my life fulfilling, yes because of the wonder and beautiful reality I see in my family. Is my life full of fun, sometimes, but not the kind many have, but I do not miss that. We do not drink alcohol thus no bar's, we do not goto clubs, because that environment is not conducive to being spiritually minded even if we like to dance. I do not go out with the "Guys" at all, my place is with my family, they have a rightful claim on my time, even so called free time. My wife does not go out to parties or shows just with the girls, again our family has a justified claim on her so called "free time". Neither of us regret it, we smile to each other, we work together, we hold hands, and we pray together. We also plan together the three of us, My wife My God and I, all major choices we make in life. I believe in doing the best I can with what I know is right, I tend to vote republican, but I always decide on the people and sometimes they are independent or Democrats. It matters not to me the title of the party, truth and hard work matter to me, and yes ability, because well meaning politicians that do not have ability, are nice friends but not good government.
TJ just like all of us is an American, he has opinions some good some probably bad and some he is still developing. As such he is entitled to his voice, esp as we realize he can not yet vote thus his writing is his only way to have his voice heard at this time. Agree with him or not it is his right, just as it is your right to continue some sort of battle against a 15 year old some how proving what I do not know, only I guess that what he has written seems important even to you.
May the Great Architect (how ever you name her/him/them/etc) bless us all at this time to be patient and kind, not contentious mean and angry.
Emmett
Copyright Nov. 25th 2006 M. Emmett Townsend
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Comments: 25
http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.jsp?articleId=281474976843034
I wish I had that kind of committment for about anything at that age. My life might have had a lot more to show for it.
I will say this about the Mormons since you bring it up my friend. My uncle was a Mormon, stopped attending 'services' one night when he was confronted by an Elder in a bar about 60 miles from home.
My uncle and his 2 sons (the third joined latter), used to play the Honkey-Tonks in N. Fl and S. Ga on weekends. He saw the fact that the Elder was there to criticize him kind of very hypocritical. He never confronted him for his presence or took him to task.
I mention this to say I had exposure to the Book of Mormon and the other writtings. Just could never rectify the final words of the Bible:
Rev 22:18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book,
Rev 22:19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
Rev 22:20 He who testifies to these things says, "Surely I am coming soon." Amen. Come, Lord Jesus!
Rev 22:21 The grace of the Lord Jesus be with all. Amen.
I see no reason for a Morani. I see no need for a NEW Revelation.
That is the extent of arguements EVER with Mormons. After that, i will never disparage the committment to family and others (except of course, the wackos marrying pre-teens). I then remember, Faith without Works is dead. So, it's all between you, Morani, and God in my eyes.
Maybe God does see the reason & the need & just has not seen fit to get your approval for it...!
As for TJ, he is a bright & articulate young man who has some maturing to do but seems to bew doing well along those lines as time & situation permit. Not everything he writes is on tagret but in his eyes it may be & he does ahve the rioght to express his opinions & ideas even if the contradcit or oppose someone else's.
Maybe God does see the reason & the need & just has not seen fit to get your approval for it...!
MY POINT EXACTLY! No other arguements or judgements. You obviously overlooked the end of my statement regarding their committments! As I said quite clearly, it will be up to their Morani, God and them. That's all.
And for the record, TJ has faith and believes. That is alot more than those critizing him can say.
I felt it was important, not for religious reasons, but important still to stand up for this young mans foray into political/social discusion.
Along with that I did feel it important to remind people to seperiate a persons opinions from his church etc. meaning we don't denigrate a persons religious belief just becouse we don't like his opinion.
As for The Lord and Moroni. . . All in good time, indeed all in good time.
But in Deuteronomy, 12:32 ,"What thing soever I command you, observe to do it thau not add thereto, nor deminish from it."
You see G-d and his prophets don't like people editing their writings to change the meanings.
But I have read nothing in the bible that say G-d is not allowed to tell us more or that he was planning on going silent after the asencion of his son even Jesus the Christ.
BUT STOP befor you answer me, if your feeling like arguing, don't bother, emotional arguing is not for spiritual things, I wont continue the discusion if it is like that I would delet the article rather then post or have posted religious arguments, discusion is different.
If you want to argue, wait then discuss, e-mail me if you like. The purpose of this article was not to preach LDS values it is spacific to the situation, and that was not religion.
I am wiling to have religious discusion, but not here on this comment list (at least not more then we already have)
Thank you all for the comments and for taking the time to read the article.
I agree with you totally Emmett.
Our nation would really have a chance if more of our teenagers would latch onto a cause, (a good one), and study and learn more about it. TJ is going to have to learn to listen to what others have to say though. Even if he disagrees, sometimes people can provide a different perspective to the same problem.
Thanks, Emmett, for publicly drawing attention to this. TJ is a fantastic writer to be so young.
Oh I do, I do! But I also like to argue and discuss things.
I'm a little disappointed in this article. It's not really funny, and it's totally off-base. TJ is ALLOWED to post whatever the hell he wants. I would never dispute his right to free speech. As a card-carrying member of the ACLU I would be a huge hypocrite to dispute that. Never once did I say he is not allowed to post. I just happen to be of the opinion that his articles are stupid, ignorant, ill-informed, divisive, functionally retarded, and supported my religious bullcrap. (Note: I don't think I said TJ was stupid. I may have but I don't think I did. What I meant was his article on feminst was the dumbest thing I have ever read onGather. Only a smart person could write something THAT stupid. It was like an exercise in how a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing. This kid who knows next to nothing about feminism posts and article attack feminists. Well, that fine. He's allowed to. ANd I replied to him about a millin times about why he was wrong and finally I had so much to say about it that I started my own article. SUe me.)
and it seems to me like you people are the ones disputing my right to have and share opinions. but i don't care. i will share and post my opinions and ideas as much as i damn well please and you guys can vent your opinions about my opinions and how you think i have an opinion that TJ can't have an opinion when that is just not true.
Gather rules!
p.s. the whole choose not to offended thing is kind of nonsensical. "Hey, Rosa Parks, sure, they make you sit in the back of the bus, but you should just CHOOSE not to be offended.!"
If TJ is going to say that women should stay at home and raise children and feminists don't care about their families, then yeah, i'm gonna reply to that. and you can CHOOOOSE not to be offended by that.
Have a good evening, tooth ache time to lay down for me.
Emmett
I would hope that others on gather could show the same respect for those with a differing view. (But that's even more far fetched than TJ and I agreeing about Planned Parenthood).
lol
Thanks again for reading and the needed edit.
Thank you all for your taking the time to read and comment.