by Anita D.
Member since:
February 16, 2006

Blame Game - the Foley Folly

October 09, 2006 02:22 PM EDT
views: 127 | comments: 35
The religious right sees itself as the protector of family, children, and morality.  But in the face of the Rep. Foley scandal, the religious right has chosen to attack gays, the "Left," and supporters of "tolerance and diversity," instead of Congressional leaders who had been warned about Foley's harassment of pages for years and chose to put their political interests above the interests of endangered youth. 

The  "Blame" quotes below seem more like posturing and missing the point than addressing system reform.  Can you believe some folks think the answer is to abolish the Page system?  Which to me is nothing more than punishing the victims.  Guess interns and pages are considered the blame rather than the predator or mentors. 


Blame Tolerance and Diversity!
"It's outrageous, it's shocking.  But it shouldn't be totally surprising when we hold up tolerance and diversity as the guidepost for public life this is what you end up getting."
-- Tony Perkins, President, Family Research Council

Blame the Homosexuals!
"But neither party seems likely to address the real issue, which is the link between homosexuality and child sexual abuse."
-- Tony Perkins, President, Family Research Council

Blame the Left!
The Foley revelations are "an attempt to discourage Christian conservative voters and to get some percentage of them to stay home so that the Left can retake the United States Senate and the United States House."
-- Gary Bauer, Chairman, Campaign for Working Families

Blame....Planned Parenthood?
"There is never an acceptable excuse or rationale for the type of deviant behavior former Congressman Mark Foley has admitted to.  Homosexuality is every bit a part of the culture of death as is abortion and contraception.  Not surprisingly, Foley was an ardent supporter of both, representing the interests of Planned Parenthood 64 percent of the time thus far in 2006."
-- Human Life International

Time to include how to know what is harassment (on both sides) and how to handle situations as part of the orientation package.  Also put some teeth into the reporting and follow-up of complaints.

To me the issues are about integrity and responsibility and what to do when these are ignored.


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Comments: 35

Donna M. Oct 9, 2006, 2:29pm EDT
Just heard that our House Speaker admits " He may have been told"....and evidently chose not to think it was serious at the time...I wonder if it was his grandchild that was involved - if he would have paid attention then? What a discusting series of events...
Joe T. Oct 9, 2006, 2:36pm EDT
The blame game never works. Most people see through it.
John Doyle Oct 9, 2006, 2:47pm EDT
The Religious right have been taken for a multiyear sleigh ride. no one likes to admit they were deceived. Personally I think they deserve all the Ha Ha tyen can ger
Ben Simonton Oct 9, 2006, 2:59pm EDT
The Blame Game is a bad one for sure.

As an independent, in reviewing the record on this sort of scandal, there appears to be a HUGE difference between the two parties. The comparison here is stark.

Some Republicans are leading the charge to investigate and take corrective action while Republican Foley resigned quicky because of what his own party would do to him. Some Republicans play the blame game and some defend. But the overall result even in the case of Nixon and others has always been the same.

Democrats, on the other hand, have in the past remained undivided and of one voice. Faced with similar circumstances in the past, they have stonewalled investigations, convinced the media that "it's only sex", defended by calling the whole thing a right wing conspiracy, justified the act by citing what others have supposedly done, sometimes been forced to censure, but NEVER NEVER taking the resignation road and rarely if ever breaking ranks in supporting a fellow Democrat again and again and again.

The result for Republicans is always that the perpetrator disappears while for Democrats the perpetrator almost always retains his position and is sometimes promoted.

Quite a BIG DIFFERENCE and an element which should not be ignored in choosing who gets your vote.

Best regards, Ben
Author "Leading People to be Highly Motivated and Committed"
Sandy (Site Psychic™) Knauer Oct 9, 2006, 3:03pm EDT
What a disgusting crowd you amassed, Anita (in the article, not the thread). I think John makes a good point - no one likes to admit they were deceived - and hope some who aren't ready to openly admit they have been deceived will work hard to make a difference behind the scenes.
Bert B. Oct 9, 2006, 3:09pm EDT
Ben,
Could you give us some examples of Democrats guilty of soliciting sex from pages?
Vicky P. Oct 9, 2006, 4:03pm EDT
Seems when it involves higher ups it's always the lessor person who's to blame.
Mary L. Oct 9, 2006, 5:20pm EDT
One would think that, in this day and age, the elected officials would ensure that a "wholesome environment" was maintained in the political homefront. Throughout history, though, this has not been the case. Yet, we are shocked when it is revealed. Laws passed, some by these same people, ensure that the "wholesome environment" is to be maintained, even in private homes, yet they cannot control their own as they control us. The old saying about absolute power corrupting absolutely still applies, even in this society.
Nathan Schauer Oct 9, 2006, 5:28pm EDT
Foley resigned. I don't call that blaming, I call that accepting responsibility. What did Clinton do? Oh yes, I remember - he blamed the Republicans - and got away with it.
Lets look at the double standard here, if Clinton has sex in the Oval Office while on the phone to the deputy of defense - he is defended and those who reveal his lies are pilloried. Foley has sex - with someone 21 years old - an abuse of power for which he resigns. But, isn't ironic that Demos are so anxious to set the match to the dry twigs under him.
"The result for Republicans is always that the perpetrator disappears"

Like Ronald Reagan, John Poindexter, Ed Meese, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld....

Come on. It's not party specific. It's politics as usual.
外国人 (Waiguoren) the Great Oct 9, 2006, 6:50pm EDT
It's always easier to blame someone else. Didn't you know, that's how things get done in the world.
On that note: I'd like to blame Al Gore for his invention of the internet that led to such disgusting conversations. If it weren't for Mr. Gore, all of this would've been done out in the open.
Ben Simonton Oct 9, 2006, 7:51pm EDT
Bert, I did not mean to limit the comparison to interactions with pages. As you will note, I included Nixon. My point was that Republicans somehow manage to get rid of those who cross the line while Democrats never do so and mostly support these flagrant violators of conventional moral standards. For me as an independent, that is a very big difference.

The only page incident with a Democrat Congressman I know was in 1983 when Democratic Rep. Gerry Studds of Massachusetts was caught in a similar situation. In his case, Studds had sex with a male teenage page back in 1973. Studds did not express contrition and did not resign. Quite the contrary. He rejected Congress' censure of him and continued to represent his district until his retirement in 1996. He was actually promoted by his fellow Democrats to being a full committee Chairman.

You might also consider the case of Barney Frank. In 1989, Rep. Barney Frank, also of Massachusetts, admitted he'd lived with Steve Gobie, a male prostitute who ran a gay sex-for-hire ring out of Frank's apartment. Frank, it was later discovered, used his position to fix 33 parking tickets for Gobie.

What happened to Frank? The House voted 408-18 to reprimand him — a slap on the wrist. Today he's an honored Democratic member of Congress, much in demand as a speaker and "conscience of the party."

Best regards, Ben
Author "Leading People to be Highly Motivated and Committed"
Bert B. Oct 9, 2006, 10:28pm EDT
Geez, Ben, I guess I need to go dig up some dirt on Republicans. Fixing tickets! Horrors. As for who Barney Frank lives with, I guess that's his business. He's an openly gay Congressman, and his constituents don't seem to be bothered by that.
I don't even remember Studds. You got me there. 1973...okay, you win. It's one to one on pages.
As for fixing tickets...I find it really amusing that you would raise that, in view of the massive corruption on the Republican side at the moment. If you are truly an independent, why aren't you aghast at the DeLay mess, at the ethical problems of Bill Frist, of the outright corruption of Randy Cunningham and Bob Ney and there are lots of others. And you say that the Republicans always own up to their problems and quietly resign? The House Leadership fought tooth and nail to keep DeLay in power until they were finally shamed into dumping him...oh, sorry, he resigned of his own "free" will. Uh-huh.
Anita D. Oct 10, 2006, 1:45am EDT
According to Wikipedia "Culture of death" has two distinct meanings:

A term coined by John Paul II used in contemporary political discourse in many countries, including the United States and Poland to describe certain positions, such as abortion, euthanasia, cloning and capital punishment that contrast with what they call the Culture of life.
A term used in Colonial Europe to describe "barbaric" cultures which allegedly glorified or worshiped death. This was then used as a justification for the subjugation and colonization of these cultures.
The phrase "culture of life" is a rhetorical term arising from Roman Catholic doctrine, utilized frequently in United States politics by social conservatives, particularly those in the Republican Party. It is shorthand for a concept that human life, at all stages from conception through to natural death, is sacred. As such, a "culture of life" is opposed to practices seen by its proponents as destructive of human life, such as embryonic stem cell research, abortion, contraception, euthanasia, capital punishment, and war. The culture of life has often been contrasted by politicians and religious figures with a "culture of death". As such, it serves as a code word that appeals to a politician's main demographic without having to mention any of the issues that may cause dissent.


Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_of_death" and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_of_life
Anita D. Oct 10, 2006, 1:49am EDT
Could someone tell me how to fix the text type in my first paragraph .... I thought I had this all in the font Comic Sans Ms 12. But when I pasted it into Gather ... the first paragraph keeps coming up wrong.
Donna M. Oct 10, 2006, 2:38am EDT
Ben - I applaud you on your facts regarding the Democrats and their "trysts" but the thought that comes to mind, the years this activity happened (1983 when Democratic Rep. Gerry Studds of Massachusetts was caught in a similar situation. In his case, Studds had sex with a male teenage page back in 1973. Studds did not express contrition and did not resign. Quite the contrary. He rejected Congress' censure of him and continued to represent his district until his retirement in 1996. He was actually promoted by his fellow Democrats to being a full committee Chairman. AND "You might also consider the case of Barney Frank. In 1989") I feel very strongly that if the Internet and the fact that its harder now to keep this sort of sordid activity quiet because of all the technology, things would not have been handled so quietly...People would have been just as enraged as we are now...so that to me makes a big difference - and I would also want to add - that the fact that both parties, were so what appears to be blaze' about those activities, then there was some bad decisions made...by all parties involved and the news media should have gone after the story....Thank God, its not that easy to sweep this under the rug now...there has to be accountability - period....
Ben Simonton Oct 10, 2006, 9:34am EDT
Bert, you have made my point most perfectly.

That point is that the Republicans can, as you say, be "shamed into dumping him" while Democrats have proven again and again that they will not dump anyone, shamed or not. Democrats appear to be only interested in retaining and supporting their morally reprehensible members.

That is a huge difference for me as an independent trying to figure out who gets my vote.

Best regards, Ben
Author "Leading People to be Highly Motivated and Committed"
Barbara S. Oct 10, 2006, 10:03am EDT
Anita: Interesting article - thanks.

Ben: Methinks you are no Independent. Your choice, of course.
However, it continues to amaze me how some Americans (and you are hardly alone in this) can continue to support and/or make excuses for the current administration, in any way, shape or form. Perhaps it was not your intent to defend the White House in this thread, but it's surely what I read. Maybe my eyes are bad.

By the way, I was a registered Massachusetts voter in 1989, and I can assure you and Donna that we knew all about Barney Frank, with or without the internet.
Sandy (Site Psychic™) Knauer Oct 10, 2006, 11:01am EDT
Ben and friends don't seem to understand the difference between what consenting adults choose to do in their personal lives, and what some adults do to harass unconsenting kids, or to cover up what their friends have done to harass and abuse unconsenting kids. They keep clouding the issue with language that infers the sordidness is in being gay, not in the criminal activity and cover-up.

Ben, if you have had an independent thought in the last fifty years, you sure haven't shared it with us.
Bert B. Oct 10, 2006, 1:32pm EDT
Ben,
I repeat: If Barney Frank fixed some tickets for a friend, that's bad. It is not in the same league with what is going on today in Congress, and if you have an independent hair on your head, you know that. Methinks you have a double standard here, and your "Independent" stance is suspect.
Ben Simonton Oct 10, 2006, 7:12pm EDT
Bert,

You miss my point. So please tell me, what Democrats have resigned from office either before or after their own party told them they had to go?

Barbara,

Please tell me what I said in support of Foley or this administration? I missed it.

Best regards, Ben
Author "Leading People to be Highly Motivated and Committed"
Bert B. Oct 10, 2006, 9:04pm EDT
Ben,
You miss MY point...how come you are obsessed with 30-year old transgressions by Democrats long-since gone...and you only mentioned one...while you apparently ignore the egregious violations of the current bunch in power?
Anita D. Oct 10, 2006, 9:22pm EDT
Check John Armstrong's article for other examples:

Congressional Sex Scandal Club
by John Armstrong
Gather.com article

Congressional Sex Scandal Club There is a history Web site called "Political Graveyard" which has an exhaustive catalog of sexual transgressions by politicians. (politicalgraveyard.com). There . . .

http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.jsp?articleId=281474976812758
Ben Simonton Oct 12, 2006, 9:19am EDT
Bert,

I did not think that you would answer my question.

Looking at past history, I concluded that there was a very large difference in how the two parties respond to egregious actions by their members. Reps either resign or are forced to do so by their cohorts while Dems never resign and remain in place because their cohorts do not force them out.

Was my analysis incorrect? If so, please provide proof.

Best regards, Ben
Author "Leading People to be Highly Motivated and Committed"
Bert B. Oct 12, 2006, 3:32pm EDT
Ben,
I'll answer your question this way. I don't know, and I am not going to research and compile a scorecard of how past transgressions have been dealt with by the two parties. I think it is pretty much irrelevant what happened twenty or thirty years ago. I am concerned about TODAY, right now in Congress. I have asked you several time, where is your sense of outrage about the current wholesale "votes for sale" campaign that is based on the infamious "K Street Project." If you are concerned about Congressional corruption, then you should know that the VAST majority of the Congressmen currently convicted, under investigation or suspected of corruption are Republicans. How do I know this?
Have you heard of Citizens for Responsiblity and Ethics in Washington (CREW)?
They currently have a list of the most corrupt members of Congress.
Their list of the three most corrupt includes Burns, Frist and Santorum...all Republicans. The list of corrupt House members has 17 names...14 of them are Republicans. And finally they list five "Members to Watch." Four Republicans and one Democrat.
So, you can drag your red herring about party differences in dealing with unethical members across this topic as many times as you wish, but the real thing that should concern you is getting rid of the bad guys, and most of them are Republicans. Here is a link to the CREW web site cited above.
Ben Simonton Oct 12, 2006, 7:45pm EDT
Very cleverly done, Bert. Sorry to have bothered you.

Best regards, Ben
Author "Leading People to be Highly Motivated and Committed"
Bert B. Oct 12, 2006, 8:14pm EDT
I wasn't trying to be clever, Ben. I was trying to show you that if you are the Independent you claim to be, then you have your priorities wrong, worrying about past history from thirty years ago. Look, I don't claim that Democrats aren't corrupt too. I am totally disheartened by the Democrats in Congress. They are a spineless bunch, and many of them are no better...and not much different from...their counterparts across the aisle. But...just as the Republicans trumpeted that they were going to "clean house" in 1994, now it is the Democrats turn. Power corrupts, and the Republicans have been in power long enough to become pretty thoroughly corrupted. There has never been a stronger argument for term limits than the events of the past two years.
Kevin Weeks Oct 12, 2006, 9:04pm EDT
Ben,
"As an independent,"

You are such a kidder. And people claim Republicans have no sense of humor.

Kevin -- author of "How to Hire a Programmer".
Bert B. Oct 13, 2006, 12:30pm EDT
Clay,
Nobody ever told me that before! And no, I'm not. But if I were, I would have to kill you for outing me. (grin)
Richard B. Nov 19, 2006, 10:01am EST
The religious right reminds me of a friend I had in Berdo many years ago. He had a wife that could play the guitar and sing. They bought a big tent and went into the revival business down in the bible belt just for the money.
Cynthia C. Nov 26, 2006, 5:56pm EST
Elmer Gantry any one???
Anita D. Dec 5, 2006, 12:10am EST
Politics and scandals go hand in hand ..... but stepping to the podium and doing something to protect minors and those in a subserviant position is a must.

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