Raise PAY, Americans Will Pick PRODUCE

Do a little more research. See what it would do to the price of an apple or a peach if the companies had to pay a higher wage.
And as I said in an earlier comment today (in a different post) I know quite a few undocumented people, close friends, and none, without exception, receive any gov. assistance

Liz:

You want research....curious, do you watch Lou Dobbs? A couple months ago he had an evening poll asking Americans if they would be willing to pay $10.00 more a year for produce if it meant decent wages. Long and the short of it....if we all paid TEN DOLLARS MORE A YEAR, the pay for the average fruit picker could be doubled. Now, the average American family spends $350.00 a year to put produce on their table. So, even if we each paid $20.00 a year, it would TRIPLE the average pay of a fruit picker.

The point here is simple...you are buying into the Pro-Illegal FEAR TACTIC. Further, do some research....wages in the Ag industry have LANQUISHED while profits in said industry have GONE UP.

I'll PAY THAT $20.00 and put AMERICAN CITIZENS to work.

Why? If it's good enough for the people doing the jobs now, it's good enough for the uppity white slackers, right?

It's not about the immigrants taking the jobs at all. It's about the uppity white slackers with a sense of entitlement about how much the sweat of their brow is worth.

If they WANT the jobs, let them work right along side the immigrants in the same conditions for the same pay.

I'm not sure I agree with you or Senobia. Thought provoking and timely article.

Oh, NOW WE ARE UPPITY WHITES....Snobia, you just prove with every post how RACIST and BIGGOTED you are. You are so blinded by your hate of those of us who oppose illegal immigration, that you cannot admit when someone is right.

1. Let's be clear here....even illegals are running from those jobs in those fields for OTHER JOBS in OUR ECONOMY, are STEALING OUR JOBS because they do not want to pick fruits and vegetables for slave wages. The Ag industry has a work shortage for two reasons:

A) The wages they pay are DEPLORABLE
B) The supposed hard working migrants do not want that work at that wage.
(this includes Legal and Illegal.) Even JAckie, who broke the law in doing so
counseled one of her workers to WALK AWAY FROM THE FIELDS into town,
instructed said illegal alien to GO TO THE MALL, find his people, look for another
job....if I recall, said the illegal was now working at Walmart...which means that
illegal she counseled to BREAK THE LAW got themselves a FAKE ID.

If people are paid a fair wage, and there are jobs left over that need to be filled, I am all for bringing NEW PEOPLE into America AS WE NEED THEM, and LEGALLY. With your illegal husband,and his illegal relatives, we already know what you think of American Laws.

It was good enough for the people who held those jobs before the illegals came and took them - who do you think picked those crops before the invasion? They sure as hell didn't pick themselves!

Moggy...you are correct. In fact, what people like JAckie don't want to admit, is that these LARGE AG businesses that open up these large AG FARMS have all but destroyed the Family Farm here in America. To them, it is all about bottom line profits, all about MARKET SHARE here, and around the world. This illegal immigration fight is a FIGHT FOR AMERICA, a FIGHT TO SAVE OUR OWN MIDDLE CLASS. We lose our middle class, WE LOSE AMERICA.

Read Snobia's post, and it is apparent she does not care, but more importantly, it shows she does NOT GET IT....you keep LOWERING OUR WAGES, and we will BE MEXICO, WE WILL BE A THIRD WORLD IMPOVERISHED NATION of the HAVES and THE HAVE NOTS. These illegals WANT TO WORK, and if that means offering themselves at far CHEAPER WAGES, they will do it to get the job...problem is, in doing that, they are LOWERING OUR LIVING STANDARDS AS A NATION.

I often hear the rediculous argument about how illegal aliens take the jobs that americans won't do. BULL! Illegal aliens are also taking the jobs that american DO want and NEED! The company I used to work for was CAUGHT employing illegal aliens at the plant. It happened when I was on vacation. When I got back, I was accused of calling immigration and reporting illegals working at the tortilla factory. I told them, "It wasn't me, but I wish it was!" Many senior people at that factory were fired. People who have been there for as long as 22 years. I was there for 14 years. The union seemed not to even be interested in fighting for the loss of those jobs, either. Afterwards, I decided to do everything I could to help STOP the insanity with illegal immigration. Writing letters to Congress, speaking out against illegal immigration and hell, I may even join the minuteman effort at the border.

No worries we are making machines to take those jobs so how about we just invest in those more and soon no more farm jobs.

I agree with the Author and if say.. Illegals should pick produce or whatever and take those wages back home to Mexico with them, as I know of a couple that did, their wages that were paid in the USA, are worth much higher in Mexico then they are for someone living here. Therefore, they will live better than I am, returning to their own country, you know, lots of them don't actually want to stay here.
The other thing, many of us, including myself have worked crop-picking when younger when those jobs were available to us. Ok, they didn't pay much, but not much is better than nothing and I'd also pay $20.00 more per year for produce to see Americans picking it.
Around here, we all picked tobacco as that's what they "DID" here growing up, and they hired Americans for this, not Illegals. Things aren't changing for the better - and one other thing, look at the plants that are outsourcing in Mexico - who do you think they employ, it's not Americans, that's for sure. The latest is the toymaker, Lego, which happens to be in my state, CT and one other, OH, and all are moving to Mexico and forget about taking any workers, they're getting laid off. So, it won't be Americans making Lego's anymore. If many more companys leave, we won't have to worry at all about Illegal Immigration, our jobs will be there! Good writing!

If you look at the Governmental MOU I put up in another thread, you'll find that the Attorney General's Office, Department of LAbor, and ICE actually agree that these illegals are depressing our wages, are stealing our jobs...the MOU was signed back in 1998.

Porgie et al... You got it ALL right. Prior to the Giant Agri business, family farms (thousands and thousands before they were forced to give up the farm) picked their own crops and if they hired workers to help, they were LEGAL AMERICANS (all of them). I think Snobia is being paid by La Raza or some other group to blog this crap of hers. And another thing, ( I must go back to google to look it up again) agriculture is not the primary occupation of the illegals. If I remember correctly it amounted to only 15% to 20% of the jobs. Most of the others were Food Industry (restaurants) and Building industry who hired the MOST illegals. Jobs in agriculture for LEGALS went the way of the Family Farms.

Carole....you are correct....this is what the Ag Business and people like Jackie do not want us to know. There are around 1.2 million illegals who are PICKING our crops. Two questions then.

1. If only 1.2 million of these illegals flooding across our Southern Border are working in the fields, where are the rest of them? Even the Hispanic Pew Report states that illegals are no longer content staying in the Ag industry, and are opting to expand out into other sectors of our economy, such as construction where they can make a lot more money with far less physical work.

2. If there are 1.2 million migrants in the fields, why is the Ag Business crying about a work shortage? It's simple...they refuse to RAISE THEIR WAGE AND BENEFITS STANDARDS, and because of this, even the illegal aliens are not wanting these jobs.

Jackie for instance talks about some of her clients who are picking tobacco out in the fields...I've worked tobacco, watched it cure, used to go out with the farmer who had the field (who was a friend of the family), and check on the leafs as they hung in the drying barn, lighting small trays of sulfar when the weather got damp to keep the mildew from starting up. That field of tabacco grown on a family farm is gone now. Despite profits going up by amost 400 percent for the BIG PLAYERS since 1990, and increased costs in planting tobacco of around 120 percent, the price a small family farmer is getting for their leafs has only increased by 20 percent in that same time span. This is and example of why 75 percent of the small family farms in America who used to grow tobacco are now out of the business.

Where I live, they are processing seafood. I was paid $5.75 an hour and worked my way up to $6.25. I could go real far on that. I had no choice because in these small towns, the high paying jobs are 50-60 miles away from my house. Driving the luxury "beater" I do, that was always breaking down because I am so priviledged, I have no choice but to work in town. The little bit of extra money I would make would only go to filling my tank. There is no mode of public transportation here either. Guess what! These high paying $6.25 an hr jobs were all taken from us and we were replaced by migrants. I, my friends, and family members all worked 12 hr shifts. Most of the time it was 7 days a week. It was seasonal work, so we weren't entitled to overtime. Now the migrants have moved families here and are working in the boatyards.

One thing that is being overlooked in this whole debate is housing. We're not talking about Juan Sanchez the illegal alien fruit picker, who has a nice house, two car garage, a picket fence and a 401k. Many many migrant farm workers live communally. When and if the average white joe schmoe without a job would even consider living in that manner this whole discussion will change. My other question is, where are the clamouring masses that riot and demand right there on the spot they be hired over the illegal aliens, even if it is for the same pay?

Debbie....sure, all those people I grew up with in farming areas who lived in houses, had their families out in the fields were really illegal aliens in disguise who had lived on thier family farms for generations.

Go check out the United Nations plan for using migration/immigration to redistribute wealth, see what they say about it being a win win for some, and a losing proposition for those in the lower and middle class of the host countries.

Well, your experience is FAR DIFFERENT from mine. I know lots of family farmers who still have the land, but who no longer farm it, turning other jobs to keep the bills paid.

Have a friend in South Eastern Ohio, his family had a small diary herd, 16 cows that they milked twice a day. They sold all their cows back in 1996 and moth balled everything. They still do some haying, but the three sons are now driving heavy equipment.

Debbie....they NEVER did pay someone to milk the cows, never paid people to cut, bail and bring in the hay....it was a family farm. You may not want to face the reality, but BIG AG Business has all but killed family farming in America. One of the ways they have done it, is to use CHEAP Migrant LABOR. America produces far more food than we can eat ourselves, most of farming in America drives CORPORATE PROFITS.

Let's even say we cannot do without Migrant Farm Workers. Depending on which statistics you want to use, and I am going to use the most generous, we have 3.3 million people who harvest and supply our food supply here in America. Of that, 57 percent of that work force are LEGALLY here in America, either citizens, or on some kind of a Visa program. That means we have about 1.3 million...give or take illegal aliens who are working in said industries. Estimates state we now have close to eight million illegal aliens in our work force.........................uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh care to share with me why those other 6.7 million people are being allowed to stay? They are NOT PICKING APPLES, not breaking thier backs picking berries. using the Migrant Worker as the POSTER CHILD for Illegal Aliens is and effective sympathy winner for the Pro-Illegal Side of the debate, but if three quarters of the illegal aliens now working in America ARE NOT PICKING BERRIES, does it really hold water?

Debbie, suddenly, this thread has changed from an ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT issue to an IMMIGRANT issue. Snobia has a penchant for that as well.

Speaking of the price of produce. Many people are talking like the price of produce is PRIMARILY determined by the wages of illegals...WRONG!!! The price of a bunch of celery also contains: planting (by machines) watering, seeding, fertilizer, pest control, packaging, transportation, overhead, distribution costs, profits for the grower, distributor, and the retailer. NOW go figure this out ... The price of this bunch of celery would probably not be much more than 3 to 5 cents per bunch.
The grower can tell you EXACTLY how much of that retail price is directly due to the PICKER........

I'm getting closer to the information I need, the following is not a great example but it does contain good information. This doesn't address my bunch of celery but it does show many of the things involved in the price of farm goods.

The costs of monetary inputs provided by all participants in the production process—farm operators, landlords, and contractors—are included in either operating or asset ownership costs.

Operating costs include the costs for items used in the production process, such as seed, fertilizer, pesticides, fuel, feed, veterinary and medicine, and hired labor.

Asset ownership costs include the annualized cost of maintaining the capital investment (depreciation and interest) in machinery, equipment, and facilities, and costs for property taxes and insurance.

Not included in operating and ownership costs are the opportunity costs for other resources, such as the farmer's labor and land. For example, the time spent by a farmer in the production of a commodity could have been spent producing other commodities or working at an off-farm job. Land has a cost equal to its rental rate, whether the land is actually rented or owned by the farmer. Costs for these resources may affect the business decisions made by some farmers, but many farmers are willing to accept a return to these resources that is less than their opportunity cost in order to remain in farming.

http://www.ers.usda.gov/Amberwaves/September03/Features/ProductionCosts.htm